The woman should come out and tell us when they want sex

[GoodMan32]

That is your opinion. Escortcelling is an incel who uses escorts. If you go on any incel site or incel definition page, they will still call an incel who visits prostitutes an escortcel or higher-tiered incel:

https://incels.wiki/w/Escortcel

This defined on the incel dictionary as a coping strategy for incels who are unable to obtain sex. It is a cope.

However, that being said, in @GoodMan32 case, he is not actually escortcelling in his case. He is actually MGTOW. I'm 100% convinced he is MGTOW. According to the MGTOW ideals, you are choosing an escort over a civvie because of civvies are presenting themselves as too difficult to deal with, you can't be bothered with the drama of dating, and rather pay for play than have to deal with the bs of women and their fluctuations and play on patience, not to mention the legal risk if you deal with a crazy women that gives a false rape charge, ends up getting pregant and lied about being on birth control/(offers a condom with holes in it you can't see), or if you refuse to have sex with her makes up a false rape charge anyway and you still end up in jail, etc....

If I saw women as a liability to my life rather than an asset and was only interested in momentary carnal pleasure to keep my sanity, then I'd be MGTOW too. I think perhaps @GoodMan32 has made some calculations and prefers to deal with escort rather than civvies for the aforementioned reasons.

Yeah, since I've managed to get laid by civvies before (even if I have a harder time than a lot of guys), escortcel might not be 100% accurate to describe me. I largely fit the profile of MGTOW (for the reasons you listed).

That being said, I'm still down to get laid by civvies if there were shortcuts to get a civvie romp. The amount of time and effort (as well as uncertainty) when it comes to getting laid by a civvie are the main reasons I utilize escorts.

 

[GoodMan32]

You are not an truecel incel because you had sex with civvie women in the past. As you've declared in these public threads, you remember the last encounter with a civvie back in 2021. You remember it nicely because it stands out compared to the more mediocre experiences from the pros that can't match that TYPE of energy, and fact of being genuinely desired, from the civvie otherwise every escort encounter would be a blast like that civvie right? You want advice to get that experience again with another woman because you know its a different experience. One is the real deal, the other is medicating yourself with a woman.

You're on the right track.

One thing I should point out: As for the civvie lay I had in 2021, the sex itself was lackluster. I've definitely had better sex with escorts.

The one thing I got from the civvie that I don't get from escorts, however: Genuine desire.

The reasons the 2021 civvie lay was lackluster were beyond either of our control. Under the right circumstances, the civvie lay would have been awesome. If I say any more on the public thread, I could potentially out myself. I can elaborate on DM.

I'd love to get another civvie lay for the genuine desire.

 

[corrector]

You're on the right track.

One thing I should point out: As for the civvie lay I had in 2021, the sex itself was lackluster. I've definitely had better sex with escorts.

The one thing I got from the civvie that I don't get from escorts, however: Genuine desire.

The reasons the 2021 civvie lay was lackluster were beyond either of our control. Under the right circumstances, the civvie lay would have been awesome. If I say any more on the public thread, I could potentially out myself. I can elaborate on DM.

I'd love to get another civvie lay for the genuine desire.

Even on a level of mental fantasy and fapping, directing at a civvie is usually more exciting, would more likely result in lock-jaw and is way more spirited / alive than a mental fantasy directed at an escort. Even on a mental level, there is a vast difference of experience dealing with a lady in your imagination that (could) want you compared to one where you (could) pay for an escort. Your feedback confirms that these mental fantasy projections actually have some truth to it.

 

[GoodMan32]

Are you on the ADD spectrum? There is nothing in life that works that way, there is no list of items you can go through (when dealing with a biological system) and just have it succeed, that is not how life works. You use trials and errors to modify your approaches. Hundreds of them, over time.

What you can get here is general ideas on how different men would approach a given situation, you have to be capable of extrapolation and come up with your own test scripts.

If you meant to say ASD spectrum, yeah, I am.

 

[GoodMan32]

Using prostitutes is bad for men, period.

1. makes you think you deserve a better looking woman than you actually do.
2. Makes you a crappy sexual partner, because she’s going to ooo and aaa to get you off. Hell I’d bet you think you’ve made a pro have an orgasm - not. And you will suck in bed - and i guarantee you do.
3. Pros are into customer service it’s how they make money. Everything about them is fake.
4. No she doesn’t “like” you you’re a John, you idiot.
5. WAKE THE FACK UP!

What the fack is up with you people? Any of this shiite is common sense why the fck do we have to tell you about it?

Jesus Christ on a god damned Stick!

As for looks, a lot of the escorts I've been with look worse than me. I'm a good-looking guy. Looks aren't my problem.

I'm not the type of guy to only pick supermodel escorts either.

As for your point about being bad in bed if you rely on escorts, you have a point. Escorts are all about getting the guy off. There's no focus on her pleasure whatsoever.

Still, if escorts are the only/easiest way for a guy to get laid (and/or if the guy simply doesn't want a girlfriend/wife), it's human nature he'll utilize escorts. If anything, the fact escorts are focused on the guy's pleasure makes escorts better in a way (from the guy's perspective).

I know escorts are fake. I know an escort isn't truly into me. If all I care about is getting my rocks off, why should any of this matter?

 

[Pierce Manhammer]

I know escorts are fake. I know an escort isn't truly into me. If all I care about is getting my rocks off, why should any of this matter?

A large part of my interest and motivation in sex is getting a woman I find attractive to lose her mind for me, like just rock her like no one has. It’s my fetish. Most men would read the above and think about rough sex to achieve it, and while sometimes it can, that’s not the point. I strive for the mind fck where she just cannot stop talking about what she has experienced with me. Total surrender.

Now, although I’ve never utilized a sex worker I realize this is her job, her O’s will be fake, she knows that if she does this or that, that it’ll get a guy off 99% of the time, she’s an actress. It will, with enough repetition rewire a man’s brain to think that what he provided her actually was pleasurable to her, therefore making him a crappy lover.

I want to kiss for hours, skin on skin contact, to see that dewy look in her eyes as she recovers from whole body convulsions you gave her. It’s príceless, and tells me I’m on the track I want to be on.

If you’re from the school of “her orgasm is her job, I’m just going to bang and nut”, this makes no sense to you.

If you’re bang/nut guy then pros aren’t going to change much for you no matter how many you utilize. So anyway it is a matter of what a man wants from a sexual encounter.

I am not claiming that what I want and do is the right way to do it, it’s what’s right FOR ME. I’m simply expressing my proclivities here.

 

[pipeman84]

I strive for the mind fck where she just cannot stop talking about what she has experienced with me. Total surrender.

Now, although I’ve never utilized a sex worker I realize this is her job, her O’s will be fake, she knows that if she does this or that, that it’ll get a guy off 99% of the time, she’s an actress. It will, with enough repetition rewire a man’s brain to think that what he provided her actually was pleasurable to her, therefore making him a crappy lover.

I want to kiss for hours, skin on skin contact, to see that dewy look in her eyes as she recovers from whole body convulsions you gave her. It’s príceless, and tells me I’m on the track I want to be on.

That's true if she's a virgin or very low notch count girl, otherwise it's fantasy. You're kissing her for hours in places other guys dropped their load, while she acted just as excited as she acts with you now.
You think that 35+yrs old who's lost count of the dyck she's had in her is not an actress? LOL
Just as with escorts, it's a matter of degree ... an escort would have to employ a lot of acting with an obese, hairy 60yrs old guy (and some manage to pull it off very well, check out the porn done by Woodman) but very little with a fit, good looking man she happens to vibe with.

 

[Smooth_texter]

It would make a lot more sense (for both parties) if the woman would come out and tell us when they want sex. I can explain.

A lot of guys are reluctant to propose sex too soon (as we don't want to potentially scare her away). We're forced to read her clues of whether she wants sex.

Here's the problem, however: Guys aren't mind readers. I have no doubt there have been many cases where a woman wants sex from a guy, but ends up not getting sex from him (because he isn't 100% sure whether he should propose sex).

The solution? The woman should propose sex. Hardly any men will say no. The woman ends up getting the romp she wants. The guy isn't forced to rely on reading clues. Win-win for both parties.

Hi Goodman32.

There are women who communicate this directly, but usually they are either female players or have a high notch count (or both). And the experience with them isn't great (sex with them feels like you have been with a s*x worker).

2-3 months ago, a woman literally told me that she was looking for sex, not complicated relationships, on our second chat on OLD (even specifying exactly what she likes to do in oral and things like that). She wanted to see me directly to f*ck on the first date at my place. And I hadn't seen that before, even on OLD.

 

[corrector]

As for looks, a lot of the escorts I've been with look worse than me. I'm a good-looking guy. Looks aren't my problem.

If an escort looks worst, it's usually from a sickly perspective (ie if she's into drugs, the fact her lifestyle would lend herself to looking a certain way and how she got there, etc...) while you look healthier as opposted to objective looks. If she wasn't worn down by that lifestyle/occupation, she'd probably look 2-3 points higher.

 

[corrector]

an escort would have to employ a lot of acting with an obese, hairy 60yrs old guy

She would be earning her money rather than taking advantage of a desperate and unlucky guy. The OP's case sounds unfortunate because, by his own admission, he is good-looking (ie upper-tier normie looks?), so he looks like in the later category. Whereas, I'd more likely be in the first category and get better value for my money (hypothetically, of course).

 

[FlirtLife]

It's a fact her leftovers would have spoiled if they didn't go straight into a fridge. Had I only mentioned the rooftop (and not said anything about the leftovers), I guarantee she would have said she had to get her leftovers home before they spoil. When I mentioned my fridge, I was rebutting her would-be excuse pre-emptively.

Look at what you consider important - the leftovers. Not her, not romance, not the mood. That's a problem - she realized your romantic sentence was fake when you immediately changed the subject to leftovers. One moment you say something romantic, the next you bring up leftovers.

I suspect you're going to have to "come clean" with the women you date about being on the spectrum. If you try and build up your dating script one sentence at a time, how many hundreds of dates will you need to get it right? You'll be stuck in the movie Groundhog Day.

As an aside, "ASD" has two different meanings in this thread:
Autism Spectrum Disorder
Anti-Slut Defense

 

[Pierce Manhammer]

You keep telling yourself that bro. Some of you just crack me the fck up.

Enjoy being you.

Someone must have really hurt you bad at some point, I’m sorry.

p.s. you don’t need to justify your experience or existence to me bruv, do your prostitute thing if it works for you.

That's true if she's a virgin or very low notch count girl, otherwise it's fantasy. You're kissing her for hours in places other guys dropped their load, while she acted just as excited as she acts with you now.
You think that 35+yrs old who's lost count of the dyck she's had in her is not an actress? LOL
Just as with escorts, it's a matter of degree ... an escort would have to employ a lot of acting with an obese, hairy 60yrs old guy (and some manage to pull it off very well, check out the porn done by Woodman) but very little with a fit, good looking man she happens to vibe with.

 

[GoodMan32]

If an escort looks worst, it's usually from a sickly perspective (ie if she's into drugs, the fact her lifestyle would lend herself to looking a certain way and how she got there, etc...) while you look healthier as opposted to objective looks. If she wasn't worn down by that lifestyle/occupation, she'd probably look 2-3 points higher.

With some escorts, it's drugs, no doubt (to explain why they don't look as good as me).

That being said, a lot of escorts I've been with are way older than me (and the aging process is why they look worse than me, with or without drugs). I've paid a woman in her 60s for sex. Yeah, you heard that right, a good-looking guy in his 30s has paid a woman in her 60s for sex.

 

[GoodMan32]

A large part of my interest and motivation in sex is getting a woman I find attractive to lose her mind for me, like just rock her like no one has. It’s my fetish. Most men would read the above and think about rough sex to achieve it, and while sometimes it can, that’s not the point. I strive for the mind fck where she just cannot stop talking about what she has experienced with me. Total surrender.

Now, although I’ve never utilized a sex worker I realize this is her job, her O’s will be fake, she knows that if she does this or that, that it’ll get a guy off 99% of the time, she’s an actress. It will, with enough repetition rewire a man’s brain to think that what he provided her actually was pleasurable to her, therefore making him a crappy lover.

I want to kiss for hours, skin on skin contact, to see that dewy look in her eyes as she recovers from whole body convulsions you gave her. It’s príceless, and tells me I’m on the track I want to be on.

If you’re from the school of “her orgasm is her job, I’m just going to bang and nut”, this makes no sense to you.

If you’re bang/nut guy then pros aren’t going to change much for you no matter how many you utilize. So anyway it is a matter of what a man wants from a sexual encounter.

I am not claiming that what I want and do is the right way to do it, it’s what’s right FOR ME. I’m simply expressing my proclivities here.

I would totally like a woman to be smitten by me (and for both of us to love the sex). In the absence of a smitten woman, however, I'm willing to utilize escorts to achieve my own needs.

 

[GoodMan32]

That's true if she's a virgin or very low notch count girl, otherwise it's fantasy. You're kissing her for hours in places other guys dropped their load, while she acted just as excited as she acts with you now.
You think that 35+yrs old who's lost count of the dyck she's had in her is not an actress? LOL
Just as with escorts, it's a matter of degree ... an escort would have to employ a lot of acting with an obese, hairy 60yrs old guy (and some manage to pull it off very well, check out the porn done by Woodman) but very little with a fit, good looking man she happens to vibe with.

You make a good point. While I'm fully aware escorts are only with me for money, I sometimes wonder if my good looks at least make the session more enjoyable for her than some other sessions (where she's with an older, uglier guy)

 

[GoodMan32]

She would be earning her money rather than taking advantage of a desperate and unlucky guy. The OP's case sounds unfortunate because, by his own admission, he is good-looking (ie upper-tier normie looks?), so he looks like in the later category. Whereas, I'd more likely be in the first category and get better value for my money (hypothetically, of course).

I've been told I'm an 8 and a half out of 10 on the looks scale.

In my experience, when I've chatted with girls on dating sites, they're initially intrigued by my looks. Then in many cases, they quickly end up losing interest because of my social awkwardness.

 

[Pierce Manhammer]

Do what works for you man.Own it.

I would totally like a woman to be smitten by me (and for both of us to love the sex). In the absence of a smitten woman, however, I'm willing to utilize escorts to achieve my own needs.

 

[Pierce Manhammer]

It’s her job to make you feel that way, never lose sight of that.

In retrospect, it’s also a non-prostitute’s imperative that wants you in her life to make you feel that way. Yet somehow it’s different.

I sometimes wonder if my good looks at least make the session more enjoyable for her than some other sessions (where she's with an older, uglier guy)

 

[GoodMan32]

Look at what you consider important - the leftovers. Not her, not romance, not the mood. That's a problem - she realized your romantic sentence was fake when you immediately changed the subject to leftovers. One moment you say something romantic, the next you bring up leftovers.

I suspect you're going to have to "come clean" with the women you date about being on the spectrum. If you try and build up your dating script one sentence at a time, how many hundreds of dates will you need to get it right? You'll be stuck in the movie Groundhog Day.

As an aside, "ASD" has two different meanings in this thread:
Autism Spectrum Disorder
Anti-Slut Defense

Maybe it's the Scottish genetics in me. Scots are known for being frugal. The Scot in me couldn't stand the thought of the leftovers she had already paid for spoiling.

I have gotten laid for free before. I feel like coming clean about being on the spectrum would hurt more than help. Yeah, some women might be more understanding of my transgressions if they know I'm on the spectrum. Most women, however, would run once they heard I'm on the spectrum.

Also, since I'm able to pass for neurotypical, I'd rather not have word get out that I'm on the spectrum. As it is, people probably think I'm neurotypical but slightly strange. To me, that's better than being known as the guy on the spectrum.

 

[pipeman84]

Someone must have really hurt you bad at some point, I’m sorry.

p.s. you don’t need to justify your experience or existence to me bruv, do your prostitute thing if it works for you.

None of the above. I'm all about being authentic and having self-awareness. I think everyone should do whatever he or she feels like (within legal limits), but let's not fool ourselves or others in the process.

Some guys marry pornstars, do you realize the lack of self awareness present in such cases? There's the chick sucking and fvcking all sorts of guys on camera from the tall muscular black dude with an 8 inch dyck to some fat hairy dude with a belly and tiny c0ck and from all appearances she fully enjoys the experience.
But the poor sap who marries her really believes her when she says that all of that is acting, but what happens in their bedroom is the real deal.