What the blackpill gets wrong. Hypergamy isnt as bad as we think.

[bat soup]

For that person being a male, you'd think you wouldn't have to explain this..

Today's society teaches us to deny who we are and to pretend that this is not the case. We're supposed to believe that men and women are equal.
"Women like sex just as much as men do" they say.
Then you go on Tinder and the ratio is 1000:1

 

[SW15]

I believe women do care about free dinners, otherwise they wouldn't exploit men like they do. The only solution is to get rid of the internet, and social media/dating sites. Since this is not going to happen, lower tier men are going to remain desperate due to the inflated delusion of modern women. Legalized prostitution will certainly have a positive effect, as guys that go that route will not be simps/orbiters for women any longer. Lowering the delusion of women.

I think women enjoy receiving the free drinks and dinners. It's pusssy privilege. Women get to have a career and make their money yet not have to pay any early stage dating fees because of some outdated norm. Additionally, "who asks, pays" favors them too. Men ask because men have a stronger sex drive.

Some women will claim that the free drink(s) or dinner isn't worth it if they have a bad time on the date. I can see their point on that. I've been to events where I got a free meal and nothing else out of it. I considered some of those events wasted time. Women do have to go through the effort of putting on makeup, getting dressed, etc.

If a man elects not to pay on a first date, he runs the risk of a woman classifying him as cheap. She might choose not to see him again because hordes of thirsty men will be glad to pay for a first date. When a man does pay on a first date, he runs the risk of a "one date, no sex, no second date" interaction in which he gets soaked for a freebie with nothing in return.

 

[derby1]

A more realistic solution might be legalized/decriminalized prostitution crashing the value of sex.

its legal in the UK, and has done nothing to the solipsism of women

 

[DonJuanjr]

If a man elects not to pay on a first date, he runs the risk of a woman classifying him as cheap. She might choose not to see him again because hordes of thirsty men will be glad to pay for a first date. When a man does pay on a first date, he runs the risk of a "one date, no sex, no second date" interaction in which he gets soaked for a freebie with nothing in return.

This is why one needs to get enough experience to suss out chicks that aren't into them. Then they can play the "Look, I don't think we're vibing, so I'm gonna pay for my half of the bill and leave" card. May only work in larger population areas though as word could spread quick of being a "bad date".

 

[Serenity]

So if I mug you of your money, the problem is you allowing me to do it with ease as opposed to me wanting free(unearned) money?

Deception and violence are two very different concepts.

Not to the extent, that it changes female behavior as a whole. Like it currently does

The problem isn't the women. If you're having trouble with them you should take a good hard look at yourself first.

Yes, yes.... Men's need for sexual intimacy is a problem...

The need for it has always been a weakness, this is a long standing and well established truth on this forum. Why is that all of a sudden controversial now?

 

[DoubleBarrel]

It’s just transactional sex and most men think they have to buy sex from women with dinner or other means of trade. Men are primarily traders and like to trade things. Men apply this to sex too.

It’s not the “free dinner” that makes transactional guys angry. It’s the covert contract “I buy you dinner, you give me sex.” She is meant to know that the dinner is not free. So he gets very passive aggressive about it.

Women see right through it and they hate it. So they eat the food and laugh at the transactional man who doesn’t understand Game.

Despite the propaganda we are fed, women actually hate selling themselves for sex. This is why transactional sex really turns women off. They see sex as magical and priceless, whereas men see sex as a store of value that we can trade for.

Pan, why do you think most men don't understand that the secret to creating connections with women (people) is to take a sincere interest in what's most important to them, and sharing what's most important to us with them? How is a bond created? Isn't it when we know them and they know us, and isn't the aforementioned how that happens?

 

[DonJuanjr]

Deception and violence are two very different concepts.

Both are examples of opportunistic taking.

The problem isn't the women. If you're having trouble with them you should take a good hard look at yourself first.

There's tons of dudes on here who have noticed "women getting worse" the last decade.... Guys who aren't "having trouble" with them, but still notice the decline in female behavior. How do you explain that? Let me guess, what ever your answer is, it's going to be the man's deficiency somehow right?

The need for it has always been a weakness, this is a long standing and well established truth on this forum. Why is that all of a sudden controversial now?

Maybe it's always been controversial since men aren't robots....

 

[SW15]

This is why one needs to get enough experience to suss out chicks that aren't into them. Then they can play the "Look, I don't think we're vibing, so I'm gonna pay for my half of the bill and leave" card. May only work in larger population areas though as word could spread quick of being a "bad date".

I like this idea. I have not done well over the years with this. I've been soaked for too many free drinks and even some free dinners many years ago. I have viewed those "one date, no sex, no second date" interactions as hurtful in the times when I have interest in having a second date with a woman that I did not have sex with on the first date.

One way to reduce the quantity of failed dates in which the man gets soaked for freebies with nothing in return is not to use swipe apps. Almost any man is likely to go on fewer dates if he's approaching in person and arranging all dates in person. Dating websites and dating apps have been the #1 cause of garbage quality dates for the last 20 years.

The hope from arranging dates through only initial in-person interactions is that there would be higher quality and fewer "one date, no sex, no second date" interactions where you wanted to see the woman.

It’s just transactional sex and most men think they have to buy sex from women with dinner or other means of trade. Men are primarily traders and like to trade things. Men apply this to sex too.

It’s not the “free dinner” that makes transactional guys angry. It’s the covert contract “I buy you dinner, you give me sex.” She is meant to know that the dinner is not free. So he gets very passive aggressive about it.

Women see right through it and they hate it. So they eat the food and laugh at the transactional man who doesn’t understand Game.

Despite the propaganda we are fed, women actually hate selling themselves for sex. This is why transactional sex really turns women off. They see sex as magical and priceless, whereas men see sex as a store of value that we can trade for.

This is interesting. How can men move on from the transactional model of sex? I have said that all men pay for sex, whether directly or indirectly. I think most men only get sex in a transactional fashion, whether directly or indirectly. Even my last quote above speaks to the transactional sex model.

The issue is that the rug has been pulled out from under most men (in the Provider category) and they don’t realise it. They are operating on an old, outdated transactional model that doesn’t work in 2022 where women don’t need male material providers anymore (it’s not life or death like it used to be).

In Western nations, women can either fully support themselves or can rely upon government handouts for support.

As a 39 year old man, it is most likely at this point that I would be dating 30+ year old childless women with a bachelor's degree. Those women are all capable of supporting themselves. It's possible I make more than a good portion of them but there aren't going to be cases where my income is 3x their incomes, which is what I think women need these days to be impressed by a man's income. I think this does go back to my question above.

 

[thelambofdeth]

Yes girls prefer the top 20% of guys

But so does every guy? even if we are subhuman?

The only reason they are allowed to only date top 20% is because most guys main dating strategy is tinder

Which in Aus is 15 guys to 1 girl

Of coruse theyre gonna have the choice and hundreds of matches and only swipe on the odd guy that they like

And the fact most girls can fraud with makeup to HTB etc...

If dating apps were equal gender ratio and girls werent frauding things would be a lot more equal

And even when girls can get a top 10% guy. most would happily settle for a lot less because they want a stable LTR. as long as they still feel some sort of attraction to the guy.

So the solution is

To fraud like how girls fraud with makeup. but with our looksmaxxing softmaxxing and hardmaxxing techniques

And dont use tinder.

Much easier said than done. As someone who's essentially lookmaxx'd as much as you can sans plastic surgery, it's still moot unless you have a very viable social circle and you're extroverted. The hypergamy issue isn't that women somehow just lower their standards and more types of guys are allowed into their pool, they just go after more Chads. So their numbers are bolstered, and the same average guys that don't get chit...still don't get chit. It only benefits women and the guys that are already doing well.

 

[SW15]

You ask what can be done about it? As in, what can be done about men operating on a transactional model in a world where women don’t need it?

I meant more from the standpoint of how can the individual male shift from a transactional viewpoint of sex to a non-transactional viewpoint of sex.

That’s the first thing - bring back fat shaming.

Return of Kings did this in 2013. Return of Kings ultimately failed though.

returnofkings.com - contact with domain owner | Epik.com

Contact with an owner of returnofkings.com domain name.

www.returnofkings.com

 

[DonJuanjr]

You ask what can be done about it? As in, what can be done about men operating on a transactional model in a world where women don’t need it?

I’ve written a large number of times that this issue is entirely legal. The governments and Alphas have progressively written laws and created legislation that make your average Beta male irrelevant (unable to provide, working on an outdated model, unsuccessful with women, a figure of fun and mockery).

So, recognising the issue at hand is the first step. Your leaders have massively betrayed you through legislation they have created. But the civilians have been asleep and haven’t been diligently holding their leaders to account, which is a civilian’s duty. .

This is all by design. It’s a form of eugenics.

Since no one is willing to be a sacrifical lamb, nothing is going to change through legislation... So the only thing then is to just pay for your half of the bill when you see that it's going no where.

 

[HaleyBaron]

This is interesting. How can men move on from the transactional model of sex? I have said that all men pay for sex, whether directly or indirectly. I think most men only get sex in a transactional fashion, whether directly or indirectly. Even my last quote above speaks to the transactional sex model.

It's really simple. The age of Shakespeare has returned. Men need to wow women the way actors, musicians, and other entertainers have. This is not easy, which is why it's still a ripe and easy field for talented men. Aka being into some kind of artistry. I'm in a hobby that lets me do that and as a result, I have women around me. I don't tell them how much money I make or other things that does not matter: I just show my skill and suddenly they are interested in me. My looks help, too, but having social skills, art skills, and fitness pushes me above other men.

 

[thelambofdeth]

Guys are out-competing each other for fatties and Asian women now (both taboo less than 20 years ago). The thirst continues unabated as men will simply just continue to drop their standards. It’s going to get worse as male desperation continues to heighten.

The solution is not to “looksmaxx” with all the other chodes competing for fat slime. The solution is intellectual and centred around thirst-control. Every time a fat woman gets laid, gets a job, gets noticed…it encourages her to be fat. That’s the first thing - bring back fat shaming.

We've gotten to the point men continually give their paycheck to women they'll literally never meet...let alone what men are willing to do to fat, ugly, etc women IRL they actually have a shot with. Thirst control isn't a solution bc there's an entire epidemic of simps. For every one man that has standards or respect or rightfully fat shames, there are literally thousands of dudes that go around giving women unwarranted validation and bolstered confidence. That's why no matter how fat, ugly, average, or whatever tier of woman there is, they'll all be over-confident and have a bloated ego and standards they haven't earned.

 

[DonJuanjr]

No one has to be a sacrificial lamb. People just have to know what’s happened. It’s lack of information and education. Once everyone knows that we are living in a giant eugenics experiment then it stops working. You can’t actually simp anymore after knowing this. It becomes impossible. So the whole thing collapses without the simping. It’s up to the common man.

This eugenics experiment only works if people aren’t aware of it. That’s the game here.

How many people know that modern feminism was entirely a Rockefeller/Rothschild funded, freemasonic male run initiative? Not many.

So then guys are just supposed to go celibate, or through very long droughts not playing to the "pay for the entire bill, because guys have to ask women out on dates, and whoever invites, pays" societal model? While it takes years, even decades for this awareness to take place, to even see any change in the societal model.

Do you think women would support feminism if they knew that it was designed specifically and explicitly as a depopulation agenda?

Maybe, if society deemed it acceptable? They go with the societal flow after all regardless of morality, with them being amoral...

 

[DonJuanjr]

Try to understand that Women don’t get turned on about portions or dinner or who pays.

It may not create attraction, but does it kill it? According to @catsmeow and @BeExcellent it's not a good look for a guy, and can potentially make them lose attraction towards him.

And, in my vast experience, taking women out for anything more than a coffee or a few drinks prior to sex is counter productive.

This is still transactional as @SW15 suggested.

 

[DonJuanjr]

Do not take dating advice from women. Women will never tell you what turns them on. It gives you way too much power over her.

When I posed that question to them, I framed it under "how does it make you feel" so they answered under the emotional context, to avoid the subconscious pro-feminine imperative answer. Not under the frame of asking for advice.

 

[DonJuanjr]

Regarding “transactional” and what it means, you can reduce it all you want. You can say “it’s still transactional because you’re spending time on her”

I was just circling back to @SW15 's question for you, that everything is transactional... Good for you to clarify your definition.

 

[MatureDJ]

It’s very difficult to cold approach during the day & generate prospects from it.

 

[MatureDJ]

You used to be able to directly buy women off of their fathers for a certain price.

 

[SW15]

Women only care about feelz.

I agree.

in my vast experience, taking women out for anything more than a coffee or a few drinks prior to sex is counter productive. You want it to be about you and her and the seduction. If she’s not seduced you move on. I’ve had to move on many, many, many times. Endless times.

I mainly do drinks dates early stages but even that sets up the transactional expectations. It stinks to get ghosted after a drinks date not resulting in sex.