She LJBF me, I told her otherwise..

[ProtoMan1]

So you don't think that a guy can get this same reaction if he remains friends... but really MOVES ON?

"handing her your balls" does not = accepting offer of friendship. DOES sound like FEAR and insecurity.

OH also by the way, most chicks who aren't interested in you... aren't going to CARE like you think they will if you decide not to be their friend. It really is not as serious as you hope it is. LMAO!

The real issue here are the AFC's of this thread who know they have no self control or self respect, and will doggedly lust after any woman they are near. And that is why they cannot concieve of "friendship" with a woman.

The issue is that, why would a guy be friends with a girl that just rejected him? Call it whatever, LJBF, I'm not interested in dating you but I want to be your friend, etc.

It makes no sense for the guy to be friends with the girl if he was interested in her and she isn't. Why?

The guy should move on, cut contact with her and focus on new girls. Basically it's the other girls loss.

Having female friends is fine, but being interested in one romantically is not being the same as friends with her.

 

[Jeffst1980]

Keeping in mind the old maxim about arguing on the internet...

Iqqi is right.
Just move on--you don't need to inform her that you can't be friends with her b/c she won't sleep with you!!! Do you honestly think that's going to raise her interest level?!

Verbally telling her your "terms" is not something a man with options would do. A man with options will just move on, because he truly doesn't care enough to "set this chick straight" and thus incite further drama. There's no way to do that and NOT appear to have a wounded ego. Just say "ok" with a knowing smile and then disappear...knowing that it's her loss.

 

[KontrollerX]

Its not about setting a chick straight its about answering her goddamned question of why you are not interacting with her anymore and doing so in a relaxed comfortable with yourself and your life manner.

Its not giving her an ultimatum, its not getting in her face about it, it is a response to an inquiry from her.

Nothing more.

Nothing less.

And if you don't answer the question she will assume you are an angry AFC and she is so great because she drove you to be so mad.

Even if you are not mad at all this is what she will think.

Period, end of story.

BTW, DJDamage great post.

 

[Omen]

I'm kind of in this rut as well. I was about to ask about this until I read this thread.

The girl I really like just wont come around. And she has a boyfriend as well, so that's part of it I think.

But I work with her, and saw her Monday, and she asked about something and then goes... You seem mad at me. Then later she asked why I was being a jerk or apprehensive.

She goes...What's wrong? I said nothing, and she goes just tell me. Yes or No. I was like NO, NOTHING'S WRONG. Then she goes... I can tell when your lying, and walked off.

Today she said hi at work and I said hi, and went about my business. She said some dumb comment and then I fired back with a comment too, and then I hear....Someone switched a flip in your head or something, cause your being mean to me. Why are you being so rude? I asked how I was being rude, and then she goes... I thought we were friends and then walked away.

At that moment I wanted to say something about the "friend" deal, but instead I just stood there as she walked away.

My problem is that this girl thinks that if I dont talk to her and carry on a conversation with her, text her, compliment something about her, or do something nice or what not that i'm being an ass, or douchebag, or jerk.

I want to tell her... Why is it that I can not talk to 5 other people at work in a given night, and they dont call me names like you do? Why is it that you think that if I dont tell you to have a goodnight, that i'm an ass?

It's like if I dont cater to her, then i'm a jerk, and then she throws all of this at me like i'm the bad guy.

I dont owe her anything, I dont cater to her, and I dont have to say hi all the time and carry on a conversation with her.

I mean we'd text back a forth a handful of times in a day weeks ago, and I haven't said anything in almost a week, and now i'm rude. She didnt say that, but I know she is thinking that. Lat time I checked I didnt have to text her if I dont want too.

And I wasn't after this one to just fvck her. I wanted to have a relationship with her, and that didnt happen.

When she says the friends thing, it's not like we hang out, but I do see her at work, and yeah it sucks cause I really have feelings for this girl, but one thing I wont let her do, is try and make it seem like i'm the BAD GUY cause she isn't getting what she wants.

The trap guys fall into I think, is ok.... Let's be friends, even though they sure as hell dont want to be, but they do it thinking that if they are nice and show they can be friends, and be like they were when they liked her, that it will eventually work out. This is murder to one self, and i'm not one to do that to me, cause i've learned in the past what happens. YOU GET USED.

Anyway, i'm sure i'll either get a text from her one day, or hear from her at work that i'm rude to her, or mean to her.

And why? Cause she feels that if I dont jump when she says so, that I am rude. He hasn't complimented me in over a week, or texted me, or chatted it up with me. What an ass hole.

For some reason too, if I had a bad day or in a bad mood, she ALWAYS thinks it's about or because of her. My dog could have died, and I dont want to talk much in a day, but i'd hear... Why are you mad at me out of the blue.

So when ever I am not all cheery, according to her, I am mad at her.

My job is NOT to please her, and make her happy, and if she thinks that's the case, then she'll be my girlfriend. If not, too bad. I have other women to worry about.

I just hate when they turn it on you, and make you the bad guy for no damn reason.

 

[iqqi]

Its not giving her an ultimatum, its not getting in her face about it, it is a response to an inquiry from her.

Nothing more.

Nothing less.

LMAO! WHAT inquiry from her, is that?

When a chick rejects you, then says, "lets just be friends" or "I just want to be friends"... how is that an inquiry? YOU make it an inquiry when you respond with the bitter wounded "NO I don't WANT to be your friend."

(Might as well stomp your foot and pout too).

Then of course any normal human is going to say "why not?"

Because your behaviour is bizarre.

But then you get your great chance to "explain why". And hope that she cares. Which she really won't.

 

[KontrollerX]

Inquiry example...

*Whiny voice*

"Why don't you ever talk to meeeeee anymoreeeeee?!!!!!"

DJ: I've got nothing against you, I just don't keep female friends, its not how I live my life, I've got guy friends but women for me are for hooking up with and thats it".

Thats all the guy has to say and he can walk away with pride.

The chick if she is a particularly huge narcissistic self important idiot will scream all sorts of shaming insults at a man like this for having the audicity to have both self confidence to speak his mind to her and the courage to live his life how he wants but what will also happen is her little ego will be wounded for then not being able to view herself as being special enough to him for him to allow her to place him snugly in the friend box and she being like most women in today's world will eventually calm down enough to think up a plan to try and get this man back and reclaim her lost validation at a future date.

I think you have done this more than a few times iqqi.

Which is why you are flipping out over this advice now.

You've been the chick whose had the guy assert himself to you and you've played little games to try and get him back but he saw right through you didn't he?

 

[ketostix]

KX I agree with you. I don't see why some of these guys can't get what we're saying. And the fact that iqqii is in disagreement just proves we are right. If a woman LJBF's in a situation where you both were on the road toward intimacy then she has rejected you with a punk move. You only have two choice that make sense. 1) Tell her you aren't interested in being just friends. Or if the situation is conducive to it, tell her 2)"What do you mean just be friend ..I thought we were. That's all I was wanting with you anyway." Then disappear. 2) is not the same thing as agreeing to her LJBF. You're actually denying you were really interested in her. But if instead of 1) or 2) you agree to her LJBF's rejection line and to be friends, it is admitting you wanted more and are willing to be a lap dog whether you disappear or not.

 

[PrinceBeavis]

2)"What do you mean just be friend ..I thought we were. That's all I was wanting with you anyway." Then disappear.

The way I would and have put that was more like, "Friends? That what I wanted to begin with, but "JUST" friends? ...never."

 

[iqqi]

LMAO. Whew, you cats are funny.

DJ: I've got nothing against you, I just don't keep female friends, its not how I live my life, I've got guy friends but women for me are for hooking up with and thats it".

That is probably the funniest thing I've ever heard. You SAY that? Really smooth, hombre. For the record, no I've never worried about some guy that I rejected who didn't want to be friends with me.

I think I've said enough in this thread, good luck DJ's in training, I wish you thee best. Life, love, and lots of friendships. If that means anything to you.

 

[ThunderMaverick]

DJ: I've got nothing against you, I just don't keep female friends, its not how I live my life, I've got guy friends but women for me are for hooking up with and thats it".

I actually said that to a woman last December. I wasn't butt-hurt she rejected me. (we banged but there was another man who dumped her and she wanted to get back him. He was still in the picture.) and she straight up told me "I don't see anything past a friendship."

Ironic you say "smooth hombre" you little brat, because you actually think he cares about what she thinks of him AFTER he lays down the rules he sets for himself. If a woman LJBFs you and you tell her what you're about, chances are she's not going to say "OH OK! LET'S F*CK. WE'LL DO IT YOUR WAY!" I don't think that's ever happened. You're telling a woman what lifestyle you live and anything other than that would be a waste of time.

I said "sorry, I usually don't have female friends. I usually get involved romantically" (We weren't friends first mind you. Maybe that would be a different story and she'd be worth hanging around with if she were friendship material.) She was shocked to say the least. She looked hurt, and I felt bad. Maybe she did want a friendship. Maybe not. Maybe she wanted validation.

The POINT, Iqqi, is that it's not about what SHE wants. It's about ME and what I can get out of the relationship between me and a female. I loooove sex. I love being physical with the opposite sex. I love cuddling and wrestling and bla bla bla. You take that out of the equation and for ME PERSONALLY it wouldn't satisfy me.

I haven't met a woman YET who was worthy of just friendship. I personally wouldn't be satisfied with it.

You're making the mistake (you make a lot of mistakes ) of comparing what drives a male as opposed to what drives a female. I don't WANT just a friendship with someone who I look at romantically. I could eat a bag of ruffles potato chips without ranch dressing, BUT I DON'T WANT TO. I love scooping the ranch out of the jar with those crisp, salty ridged chips. It has nothing to do with me being insecure or butt-hurt. Maybe to a lot of men it is. Maybe they're doing it because they want to hurt the woman. It's possible.

What I did by rejecting her LJBF offer wasn't meant to hurt her, but to tell her what rules I play by. This is the way I live my life and I don't feel bad for it. She wasn't worth the friendship to me. We didn't operate on that level. (to me, anyways)

Point is, gentlemen is that you be friends with a woman because you want to be friends with her. Don't be friends with her out of obligation. You'll either waste your time or end up hurting yourself.

We're me. We love to f*ck women. *beats chest like Donkey Kong*

 

[iqqi]

Ironic you say "smooth hombre" you little brat, because you actually think he cares about what she thinks of him AFTER he lays down the rules he sets for himself.

Since it is YOU, I will respond.

All of his posts are about WHAT THE CHICK THINKS. He is "telling her off" so she won't think he is a chump who will be her validation slave. He WON'T be friends with her because she might think he is a chump who will be her validation slave.

My point is, if you don't want to be friends with a chick, GREAT. But the whole "I don't want to be your friend if we aren't fvcking" is just So not Suave. I guess it IS up to you if you want to look like a chump who is scorned because he can't get the pvssy... and is desperate to make sure she doesn't think you will be her validation slave.

 

[My Name is Somebody]

I actually said that to a woman last December. I wasn't butt-hurt she rejected me. (we banged but there was another man who dumped her and she wanted to get back him. He was still in the picture.) and she straight up told me "I don't see anything past a friendship."

*

Interesting point. How much does this "LJBF" game change when you have already banged her and then she breaks out the LJBF line?

I can't remember the last time I have cared about a girlsl "LJBF" line before we had any sex. If it's after the sex that's when it tends to sting.

If it's before any action, who cares and why care? I can find a friend in my dog I don't need a woman for that.

 

[ThunderMaverick]

Since it is YOU, I will respond.

You sure know how to make an AFC feel special.:woo:

My point is, if you don't want to be friends with a chick, GREAT. But the whole "I don't want to be your friend if we aren't fvcking" is just So not Suave. I guess it IS up to you if you want to look like a chump who is scorned because he can't get the pvssy... and is desperate to make sure she doesn't think you will be her validation slave.

Yeah I looked like a chump. That's why she kept calling me.

And will you stop twisting how a person might come off from the aftermath of a LJBF rejection!? It's annoying.

It wasn't due to hate or scorn. I was a LITTLE hurt by it (I mean I'm like "was I THAT horrible in bed?! lulz) but I was over it an hour later at dinner. I actually laughed about the whole rejection thing to my friends.

The point is is that I KNOW why I did it. I don't care about a girl thinking that me laying down what I'm about is an AFC move. It's not her place to say how and I can and can't live my life and who I decide to invite into it. She didn't meet the requirements and that was that. It's no ones fault. Not mine, not hers. I'm not mad at her for LJBF me. Not at all. I'm sure she's doing great. I'm not even an afterthought. I have no problem with that. I didn't think about her either until this topic came up.

Anyways Iqqi, why should I care how you falsely see me?

 

[WesCottII]

Anyone who punishes a chick who isn't attracted to you for whatever reason, with "no contact" and Next, is an insecure AFC.

If you were just looking to F, then she probably isn't losing anything by you "cutting her off" anyways.

And if she really was cool and that was why you were attracted to her, and she thought the same about you but just didn't want a relationship with you, then you just lost a potential good friend for an insecure lame AFC reason.

Early in the responses, I know, but I wanted to respond to this.

Your points are valid, from the veiwpoint of a woman. . . Here's the deal. Anytime you get rejected by a woman, who you like alot, you CAN'T just see her as a friend, it doesn't happen. You can't just switch that wanting to f*ck feeling off, and being around her is just punishing yourself, and is condusive to tricking you into "having another go".

It's like RT said, anytime you stick around, you're trying to "convince" her into being intimate, and it just doesn't fly.

 

[iqqi]

I understand Wescott, but you don't have to be rude about getting rejected. And it isn't just from "the viewpoint of a woman". If it was me, I wouldn't let them see me sweat. Just be friends? Great idea!

And TM... nothing I said was about you specifically, at all. Your whole story is a personal experience that doesn't really illustrate what I was saying, so it doesn't go against what I was saying. Why are you taking it so literally personal? I have said earlier in the thread, that if it was someone you were already more than friends with, then it is different. Also, sometimes chicks use LJBF to gauge your interest level or as a sh!t test after you've been intimate somewhat. So totally different scenario, that I'd call "dumped" not "ljbf'd".

 

[3 Hour Special]

Just be friends? Great idea!

That's my line babe. I've been pushing it for quite some time. Glad to see it worked on you.

But seriously, the one time I have used that line it worked and she replied "we can still hang out as friends". And then I tapped it again but I was a 3 pump chump and that was the last time she "hanged out" with me.

Never again. I'd rather have a numb d!ck and not feel a thing than be a 3 pump chump.

 

[3 Hour Special]

I understand this much better now I think. So basically, you really do say ok when they ask to be friends, but three weeks later when they ask why you aren't fawning over them and hanging out with them anymore , you give the reply with something to the effect that you don't play "friends" with girls?

Ofcourse you don't tell them that. You tell them you have been busy.

 

[Sir-M]

My point is, if you don't want to be friends with a chick, GREAT. But the whole "I don't want to be your friend if we aren't fvcking" is just So not Suave. I guess it IS up to you if you want to look like a chump who is scorned because he can't get the pvssy... and is desperate to make sure she doesn't think you will be her validation slave.

Ok well i think not wanting to be friends cause she will not fvck you is an AFC move.. but in my opinion LJBF is also a very AFC move from a girl.. just like alll other excuses that girls give to get away from relationships.. eg.. im goin through something terrible right now and i need to be alone and sort this stuff alone, lets take a lil break.

oh c'mon now.. then you fret when i turn down your friendship request?? LJBF is like stabbing him and then offering to nurse his wounds.. girls run away from the responsibility of breaking up.. thats why you wanna throw the ball back into the mans court... grow some balls will ya.. ( Oops that will never happen)....

But Iqqi. i have a question for you.. whats with girls and friendship???...i have turned down enough girls in my lifetime.. a few of them actually requested to be friends...

Girl - Hey M, i think i like you and all i wanna get to know you better blah blah
Me - Hey listen this is not goin to work out, lets not start. sorry
Girl - Well i really think you are cool, i'd hate to lose you can we just be friends
Me - SURE..

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

Most guys get a LJBF rejection because of a process. These are the "friends first" mindset guys; the guys who put far too much emphasis on a solitary woman and wait her out until the perfect moment to attempt to escalate to intimacy, at which point her most comfortable rejection is to LJBF. This is made all the more easy for her because of the process the guy used to get to that point.

Most guys (not all) who get to the point of a LJBF rejection come to it because they fall in line with a Sniper mentality. They wait for their one target, constantly attempting to prove their merit in doing so - meaning they emphasize a comfort level and try to be friends before lovers. In essence they believe that desexualizing themselves will make them more attractive (by virtue of not being like "other guys") because they've bought into the idea that a woman must be comfortable with them first before they initiate intimacy. Once the AFC gets to a point where he's mustered enough courage to initiate, and he feels she 'should' be comfortable enough to appreciate him as BF material, the Sniper takes his shot.

The problem with this process is that it bypasses essential stages of attraction and the necessary discomfort and sexual tension necessary for intimacy and proceeds directly to a warm familiar, comfortable, rapport the exact opposite of arousal. If you think about this in terms of sex, this is the stage right after climax when she wants to cuddle, spoon and be wrapped up in her nice, secure oxytocin induced comfort. This the opposite of the testosterone fueled, sweaty, anxious and uncomfortable stage of arousal and intercourse before that release. So in terms of "friendship" and the Sniper mentality, you've skipped arousal and gone straight to comfort. You're perceived as a stuffed animal she can hug and then put back on the bed. Thus, when that previously platonic stuffed animal uncharacteristically gets a hard-on and says "I think we ought to be intimate" her reaction is to think that everything you've done for her up to that point has been a grand ruse. My God, all you wanted was sex this whole time?

Her most predictable response is then the LJBF rejection. The field has already been tilled by you, it's only one, very easy step for her to stay in that suspended comfort - "lets still be friends". And then the cycle repeats. The AFC believes the LJBF is a genuine offer (not a rejection) and then falls back into the Sniper mentality. He mustn't have been convincing enough to prove his worth to her and therefore returns to further proving himself as the perfect BF until he once again presses his intent of intimacy after another period. All this goes on apace until she becomes intimate with a BF and/or he acquires a new target after realizing his efforts with the LJBF girl aren't bearing fruit.

The problem with the "advice" IQQI offers here is that she would cast doubt on whether a LJBF rejection is in fact a rejection and not a genuine offer of friendship. To which I'll say that the only reason this is such a common issue among men & women for so long is because it's been repeated so regularly and the outcome so predictable as a rejection. A woman's behavior is always the only gauge of her intent, and thus when a rejection like LJBF has been so consistently met with the same outcome and behavior (as evidenced by thousands of identical stories on SS alone) it's only prudent for a Man to behave in kind.

A man's default response should always be to excuse him from the LJBF situation. The reason for this is because it serves his best interest whether she is testing him or is rejecting him. If he is confident enough in himself to walk away from the sexually tense environment, he proves himself as decisive enough to put himself above being 'played' like this. Ergo, he leaves her with the impression that he is the PRIZE, possibly has contacts with better prospective women and is confident enough to take away his attentions from her and thus passes her sh!t test while placing the responsibility of a re-connection on her (where it should be anyway). If she has in fact had a change of heart (her prerogative, remember?) and is using the LJBF as a means to reject him, he still benefits from all of the above and plants the 'seed of doubt' in her about her initial estimation of his acceptability for her intimacy. And even if she is truly not interested in the guy, he walks away on his feet and not his knees, by playing "friend" with her and wasting still more time that could be far better spent with more productive prospects.

It is really one of the few win-win situations for a guy to make a wholesale withdrawal of his attentions when he is confronted with an LJBF. Women know all too well how an LJBF places social pressure on a guy to accept what basically amounts to an ultimatum of negative social proof, and that's a hell of a sh!t test no matter what her real intent is. If the guy turns down her offer of friendship, he's the d!ickhed, not her. But the guy that can do what common sense and gut instinct points out to him will be the one to succeed, with her, other women and himself.

Human being's natural inclination is to avoid confrontation. When a man makes an approach to intimacy with a woman this becomes confrontational. If she is unsure of a man's sexual acceptability for her intimacy she must resort to psycho-social, learned behaviors to diffuse this confrontation. Preferably these techniques should be reinforced beforehand and proven to diffuse just such a confrontation, thus the LJBF response is acted out through generations of women across many different cultures - quite simply it works more often than not. You can also apply this to women who not-so-nonchalantly weave into their conversation that they have a boyfriend in an early effort to diffuse a potential suitor's interests. It's basically a proactive LJBF rejection.

It's the guy who is unwilling to accept these conventions that makes the most lasting impressions of confidence with women. It goes against what our common human heritage dictates for us - avoid conflict, don't make waves, be her friend, etc. By not accepting a LJBF you emphatically make known that you are good at confrontation, you have an understanding of her motives and you're confident enough in yourself to make it known. Not only does this impress her with potential for security provision it also implies future confidence. The problem for most guys is enacting this and making it a default behavior when our biology would have us move away from conflict rather than engage in an unacceptable social dynamic that is subtly damaging to his own interests.

 

[WesCottII]

I understand Wescott, but you don't have to be rude about getting rejected. And it isn't just from "the viewpoint of a woman". If it was me, I wouldn't let them see me sweat. Just be friends? Great idea!

Yeah, fair do's, I never said anything about being rude, and I agree that giving an ultimatum "it's lovers or NOTHING. I want more", is never going to fly.

The problem for me comes in the fact, I just don't WANT to be friends with her. It's been a long time since I've had that rejection, because now I don't go in as a friend, but when I did, I was reluctant to persue any sort of interaction with her, because frankly is was torture. Watching (not literally) her sleep with other guys, and then coming to tell you about it? Who wants that? It's like being second place in the olympics, you've still not got the prize, even if you've. . .got a prize.

So my answer, would be "yeah, thats a great idea, maybe you can hook me up with some of your mates", and THEN cease contact.