The myth of the single woman

[jophil28]

I'm not saying it was your intent Jophil but this totally illustrates my point how titles like single, engaged, married, seperated, etc only mean as much as the girl's integrity.

What is that old saying in the legal profession ?

"A contract is only as good as the individual willingness of the signatories to abide by it. "

 

[STR8UP]

Curiously, Sandy swears up and down that she ADORED her husband David and was addicted to him- she refered to him as .. "he was my God " but she still ran around inside of her marriage to David with her old B/f - so much for the belief that HIGH IL will prevent a woman cheating.

It is not about Interest Level -it is about INTEGRITY as Keto points out.
Just because a woman is "addicted " to you, or has sky high IL does not eliminate her desire or her willingness to cheat . She cheats because she has defective personal principles and values.
She likely will not cheat in the first few months when all her emotional needs are being "supplied" by you, but eventually her old demons push her to resume deeply established behavior and she cheats simply because she is an habitual cheater .

The key to understanding Sandy's future treatment of Ray lies in her past behavior with David.

Good post, but I would say that it's not about one of the other....it's about BOTH.

A woman with low integrity might cheat on a man she has high interest in, but at the same time a woman with "highER" integrity will be more tempted to cheat the lower her interest level. Notice I say "highER', because it's the same as "quality"....it's never one of the other it's always somewhere in between.

Low intergrity + low interest = forget about it

Low integrity + high interest = ticking time bomb

High integrity + low interest = better hope she doesn't get too bored

High integrity + high interest = the only kind of woman to be in a relationship with

Too bad integrity level isn't as easy to determine as interest level.

 

[iqqi]

Certain posters don't really seem to be talking about integrity imo. More like if a woman lacks it, why should a man have it?

It isn't about what someone else (a woman in this case) does or doesn't do. It's about what YOU choose to do. REGARDLESS of someone else's lack of integrity.

 

[jophil28]

Too bad integrity level isn't as easy to determine as interest level.

Exactly right - and women RARELY change their behavior patterns ( because they are 'perfect' and have no need to change...!)
However, if we delve into a woman's past actions in her relationships we can unearth her SOP and thereby determine how she will act in the present - no INTEGRITY in the past will usually mean NO integrity in the present and future.
The only problem with this is that women lie about their past and always portray themselves as a "victim" of some bad man (who was also good enough to marry and be the father of her children). Her REAL past will eventually emerge in conversation if we persist in asking the pointy questions..

 

[jophil28]

I would still like to hear what you guys would say to RAY about SAndy if he was your best buddy and wanted your blunt opinion.?

 

[STR8UP]

I would still like to hear what you guys would say to RAY about SAndy if he was your best buddy and wanted your blunt opinion.?

Ditch the b!tch?

I doubt most guys would listen tho

 

[ketostix]

Good post, but I would say that it's not about one of the other....it's about BOTH.

A woman with low integrity might cheat on a man she has high interest in, but at the same time a woman with "highER" integrity will be more tempted to cheat the lower her interest level. Notice I say "highER', because it's the same as "quality"....it's never one of the other it's always somewhere in between.

Low intergrity + low interest = forget about it

Low integrity + high interest = ticking time bomb

High integrity + low interest = better hope she doesn't get too bored

High integrity + high interest = the only kind of woman to be in a relationship with

Too bad integrity level isn't as easy to determine as interest level.

This is solid gold. I will say though that integrity and interest aren't always mutual exclusive, i.e., as her interest goes up so does her integrity and vice versa. But the point remains, girls who's integrity is too dependent on their interest level are not relationship material. This Sandy chick is simply one of those low integrity regardless of interest and is never relationship material. And you're right Str8, it's easier to tell IL than it is integrity and partly becaue IL masks integrity. It's also not only easier to tell IL it's easier to raise IL. But as jophil said you can't raise integrity level.

 

[guru1000]

Good post, but I would say that it's not about one of the other....it's about BOTH.

A woman with low integrity might cheat on a man she has high interest in, but at the same time a woman with "highER" integrity will be more tempted to cheat the lower her interest level. Notice I say "highER', because it's the same as "quality"....it's never one of the other it's always somewhere in between.

Low intergrity + low interest = forget about it

Low integrity + high interest = ticking time bomb

High integrity + low interest = better hope she doesn't get too bored

High integrity + high interest = the only kind of woman to be in a relationship with

Too bad integrity level isn't as easy to determine as interest level.

Finally, some GOLD here.

Ill give you a solid statistic based on my SPINNING.

Out of let's say the past 30 women, I have found 2 with very HIGH INTEGRITY, 2 with MEDIUM and the remaining LOW.

I think the above is a fair statistic based on what I experienced.

So if 1/15 is QUALITY, that leaves 93% of the women out of the equation.

To go furthur, mix in a HOT GIRL (8-10 in looks) with QUALITY and now it becomes even a smaller statistic.

I can understand why some MEN make ABSOLUTES in regard to women with LOW INTEGRITY.

I do not agree with it but can certainly understand it.

 

[Latinoman]

Curiously, Sandy swears up and down that she ADORED her husband David and was addicted to him- she refered to him as .. "he was my God " but she still ran around inside of her marriage to David with her old B/f - so much for the belief that HIGH IL will prevent a woman cheating.

It is not about Interest Level -it is about INTEGRITY as Keto points out.
Just because a woman is "addicted " to you, or has sky high IL does not eliminate her desire or her willingness to cheat . She cheats because she has defective personal principles and values.
She likely will not cheat in the first few months when all her emotional needs are being "supplied" by you, but eventually her old demons push her to resume deeply established behavior and she cheats simply because she is an habitual cheater .

The key to understanding Sandy's future treatment of Ray lies in her past behavior with David.

I agree with you 100%. She is now 40...so she is "smarter" when it comes to "baiting" a man. She will we do whatever to make Ray think she has either changed or is different. But the fact is...it is almost impossible for a person to change their values and morals. And her values and morals dictate her integrity. Of which she has none.

I would tell you this...I won't be surprised if she shows "change". And as soon as things don't go her way...she reverts to past shoddy behavior.

It is what I call the "hibernation" stages. Her "lack of integrity" will go into a hibernation stage and will be awaken once things don't go her way or once her temperament is put into test.

That woman is not worth of a relationship.

 

[Latinoman]

Good post, but I would say that it's not about one of the other....it's about BOTH.

A woman with low integrity might cheat on a man she has high interest in, but at the same time a woman with "highER" integrity will be more tempted to cheat the lower her interest level. Notice I say "highER', because it's the same as "quality"....it's never one of the other it's always somewhere in between.

AND

High integrity + low interest = better hope she doesn't get too bored

I strongly disagree with those two portions of your quote (the other portion are fine).

"High" integrity? "Low" integrity? Dude...a person either have integrity or does not have integrity. There is not such thing as "high" or "low" integrity. And a person with integrity will NEVER cheat regardless of how low her interest level is. Instead, she will probably dump you if she perceives there is somebody better. Dumping a man does not translate into being a cheater.

If she marries you...she will work hard in the marriage...if things don't change...she will divorce you. But she will not cheat.

 

[jophil28]

Update - Ray called me and asked me to get a bite with him- he sounded pissed so we got some Subway and talked in the carpark.

The story is this -
Sandy called him late yesterday afternoon and invited him to come over to her place to "have sex in her big bed"..This is the same bed that she shared with her ExH ( her second ExH ) who now sleeps down the hall in the same house. However he has left on a trip to a rural area for the next week.
Ray arrived about 5pm and they proceed to get it on for an hour at which time she climbed out of the bed and headed for the bathroom . Her cell rang on the nightstand and she picked up and walked out of the bedroom talking to the caller and down the hall and then returned ten minutes later. Ray said to me that his spideys were tapdancing in his gut.
They went out for dinner and he casually asked her about the phone call. SHe said it was a guy who she worked with, and he had invited her out for some coffee and she said that she would meet him the next night after work. BUT, "'He is just a friend " .

What do I tell him ? Is this even close to being OK in light of the fact that Sandy has demanded that RAY not date any other women .
Thoughts ? Comments ? WTF is this woman all about ?

 

[guru1000]

I strongly disagree with those two portions of your quote (the other portion are fine).

"High" integrity? "Low" integrity? Dude...a person either have integrity or does not have integrity. There is not such thing as "high" or "low" integrity. And a person with integrity will NEVER cheat regardless of how low her interest level is. Instead, she will probably dump you if she perceives there is somebody better. Dumping a man does not translate into being a cheater.

If she marries you...she will work hard in the marriage...if things don't change...she will divorce you. But she will not cheat.

I think STR*UP has confused INTEGRITY with QUALITY.

So when he says INTEGRITY he REFERS to QUALITY.

Where as a person may be a PRINCE, an average guy or white trash will have sliding scales of his qualitative nature.

STR*UP saying there is no such thing as QUALITY and then admits to a sliding scale of INTEGRITY shows he truly believes in QUALITY. He says this,

A woman with low integrity might cheat on a man she has high interest in, but at the same time a woman with "highER" integrity will be more tempted to cheat the lower her interest level. Notice I say "highER', because it's the same as "quality"....it's never one of the other it's always somewhere in between.

Now that he BELIEVES in QUALITY. We can go furthur to discuss INTEGRITY.

But for the record,

Integrity- Steadfast adherence to a strict moral or ethical code.

Quality - Degree or grade of excellence

Quality showing DEGREES or GRADES allows us to properly RATE a girl (1-10) as we do her looks.

Integrity showing ADHERENCE which is either YAY or NAY. You either have or have not.

Once we can all understand the difference between Quality, LOOKS (sliding scale) and Integrity, RULES (Break them or not) , we will all share the same perspectives.

For the record, I agree with you. I come to realize that discussion with some is like beating a dead horse. So I would RATHER speak to them in their language so the point is not FRIVOLOUSLY made.

 

[STR8UP]

"High" integrity? "Low" integrity? Dude...a person either have integrity or does not have integrity. There is not such thing as "high" or "low" integrity. And a person with integrity will NEVER cheat regardless of how low her interest level is. Instead, she will probably dump you if she perceives there is somebody better. Dumping a man does not translate into being a cheater.

If she marries you...she will work hard in the marriage...if things don't change...she will divorce you. But she will not cheat.

I guess I need to spell it out every time I say it.

When I say "High", what I actually mean is "HighER", because as with "quality", IT IS A SLIDING SCALE, and we ALL pretty much fall somewhere in the middle, and our CIRCUMSTANCES often dictate WHERE we fall on that scale at any given time.

So good luck on your hunt for someone who has ABSOLUTE integrity, or is ABSOLUTE quality, cause they don't exist in me, you, or any of the women you date, regardless of how much you fantasize about it.

You guys really sound like women when you talk like this, whether you realize it or not.

 

[Latinoman]

I guess I need to spell it out every time I say it.

When I say "High", what I actually mean is "HighER", because as with "quality", IT IS A SLIDING SCALE, and we ALL pretty much fall somewhere in the middle, and our CIRCUMSTANCES often dictate WHERE we fall on that scale at any given time.

So good luck on your hunt for someone who has ABSOLUTE integrity, or is ABSOLUTE quality, cause they don't exist in me, you, or any of the women you date, regardless of how much you fantasize about it.

You guys really sound like women when you talk like this, whether you realize it or not.

For such a self-proclaimed "deep thinker" you certaintly know very little. For Christ sake, this is your native language too.

Read the following quote (by Guru) as it has the answer:

Integrity- Steadfast adherence to a strict moral or ethical code.

Quality - Degree or grade of excellence

Quality showing DEGREES or GRADES allows us to properly RATE a girl (1-10) as we do her looks.

Integrity showing ADHERENCE which is either YAY or NAY. You either have or have not.

Once we can all understand the difference between Quality, LOOKS (sliding scale) and Integrity, RULES (Break them or not) , we will all share the same perspectives.

 

[Latinoman]

So good luck on your hunt for someone who has ABSOLUTE integrity, or is ABSOLUTE quality, cause they don't exist in me, you, or any of the women you date, regardless of how much you fantasize about it.

And for the record...every woman I have been involved in a serious committed relationship and to which I have introduced to my children are women with integrity.

All of them are women with enough positive characteristics as to be considered a woman of 'quality'. Perhaps not a 10 in a 1-10 range as I would probably marry a woman that is a 10 in the quality aspects (if I happen to also find her sexy)...but quality enough as to publicly be with her and introduce her to my children.

I don't fantasize. I don't fish in still-water ponds full of garbage where most of the fish that bites are cat-fish and the type of fish that eat garbage. I fish where the stream is full of salmon and tuna.

But I understand that we have different life experiences. You see? I used to be near still-water ponds. And I realized that in order to better my life was to work on myself so I could be near a nice stream of water. Yeah, I was married...but you see? This is also applicable to the people I associate with (friends, aquantances, etc.) and I wanted all of them to come from a nice stream of water. Clean water.

I don't believe in fantasies...I believe in MYSELF.

 

[guru1000]

When I say "High", what I actually mean is "HighER", because as with "quality", IT IS A SLIDING SCALE, and we ALL pretty much fall somewhere in the middle, and our CIRCUMSTANCES often dictate WHERE we fall on that scale at any given time.

"Circumstances" is again EXCUSING your behavior. This is the "NATURE MADE ME DO IT" mentality. You have CHOICE and CONVICTION that COULD win over CIRCUMSTANCE every time.

Instead, you CHOOSE to deny RESPONSIBILITY for your CHOICE and state CIRCUMSTANCE dictates whether or not you have INTEGRITY.

Now who sounds like the woman?

So good luck on your hunt for someone who has ABSOLUTE integrity, or is ABSOLUTE quality, cause they don't exist in me, you, or any of the women you date, regardless of how much you fantasize about it.

There are rarely ABSOLUTES of anything. Even an HB10 has flaws. You just do a COMPARISON of her to what you have experienced or seen and then determine accordingly what you rate her.

That being said, because you have been with many LOW QUALITY women, you will definitely recognize a HIGH QUALITY one when she comes along.

Hopefully.

You guys really sound like women when you talk like this, whether you realize it or not.

"NATURE MADE ME DO IT".

Who sounds like the woman?

LOL

 

[Señor Fingers]

we ALL pretty much fall somewhere in the middle, and our CIRCUMSTANCES often dictate WHERE we fall on that scale at any given time.

I beg to differ.

Your sense of honor is determined by how well you hold up during the most trying circumstances. If your values are weakened by things that happen around you, then there is not much integrity to speak of here.

To a certain degree I feel what you are saying though. None of us is perfect and nobody is really justified in pointing fingers.

I've certainly bent a lot of my own rules, but can say with pride that there are certain lines I simply do not cross. For example, I have NEVER cheated on any girl I've been with. Even if we were together for only a couple of months and I met someone else, I always kept things out in the open.

In my world, cheating is an act of weakness and anyone who partakes does not make it into my inner circle. I don't think they are bad people, or low quality.. we just hold different values and it makes us incompatible, so I play it smart and just keep it moving. It's a big world out there!

Ultimately, we can sit here and ping-pong on the semantics of words like "quality" and "loyalty", but in the end all that we are searching for is someone who speaks our language and abides by our code of honor, someone from our "tribe" who we can relate to and trust intrinsically.

This is common sense here, but it becomes complicated when we fail to apply or abide by our own standards.

 

[STR8UP]

And so we go round and round....

Yes, by the true definition of integrity it is an absolute term.

Google the word, and you will see that the meaning is basically to "stick to your principals".

So, at any given time a person can have "integrity" based upon their own PERSONAL values. But values can change.

Ohhhhh.....SNAP!

That means that integrity is NOT absolute, because the underlying values are "subject to change without notice".

I've met people who I believed to have have "integrity". But do you think for ONE SECOND that they are perfect angels? Have they NEVER been swayed to bend?

To think otherwise would be ignorant.

 

[STR8UP]

To a certain degree I feel what you are saying though. None of us is perfect and nobody is really justified in pointing fingers.

But according to the others, you either HAVE integrity, or you don't.

They want to talk in absolutes, to put everything into a neat little category that they can digest and rationalize that they have made the "right" decision to be with a given woman at a given time, and that no woman has ever cheated on them, blah, blah.

Simply acknowledging the fat that "nobody is perfect" should be enough to put this idea to bed, but I'm sure they will find some way to say BUT, BUT! and keep this silly idea that you can lump people into one of two categories alive.

I've certainly bent a lot of my own rules, but can say with pride that there are certain lines I simply do not cross. For example, I have NEVER cheated on any girl I've been with. Even if we were together for only a couple of months and I met someone else, I always kept things out in the open.

In my world, cheating is an act of weakness and anyone who partakes does not make it into my inner circle. I don't think they are bad people, or low quality.. we just hold different values and it makes us incompatible, so I play it smart and just keep it moving. It's a big world out there!

Ditto.

Ultimately, we can sit here and ping-pong on the semantics of words like "quality" and "loyalty", but in the end all that we are searching for is someone who speaks our language and abides by our code of honor, someone from our "tribe" who we can relate to and trust intrinsically.

I think we are generally in agreement as to the definition of words. All I have to do is wiki or google a word and the meaning is pretty clear. That's not the problem here.

 

[Señor Fingers]

So, at any given time a person can have "integrity" based upon their own PERSONAL values. But values can change.

Yeah but as long as they stick to those values, then they have their honor.

The problem a lot of folks are having here is in defining where these imaginary lines are.. thats just a waste of time and bandwidth cause we will never agree on that one!

To break it down to bare essentials, it is not so much the act itself, as the intent and energy behind it that defines our integrity.