PART 1 - I guess I'm dating a chick with BPD, please help if you have experience

[Warrior74]

Fly you fool. Stop posting and get the hell out of there.

 

[AlexDP]

Keep in mind though that, even if there are tools to make life with a borderline bearable, there are virtually no succes stories. I don't think there many happy couples with borderlines in them. Besides, it's like having a relationship with a child. Before you do any of this, before you decide if you're going to continue things with her, ask yourself what the real reason is you want to be with this woman: it is very unlikely that you love her.

 

[sexysuave]

Thanks, that sounds like a good way of approaching the situation. I will definitely say that to her.

Side note again, she has told me a million times taht she HATES being told what to do. She says her parents just drove her crazy whenever they would try to tell her what to do and a couple of times she took me off guard by saying "dont' tell me what to do" for some totally simple crap that I didn't even think about .. can't remember the exact examples, but it could be something like "hey, don't forget to call your mom".. her answer: "dont' tell me what to do".. .me "huh???? what are yo utalking about"... this only happend a couple of times, but I thought it was pretty weird at the time. There were plenty of times when I asked her to do something, and she willingly did it, but a couple of times kinda took me off guard for something much simpler than other things she has done for me. Go figure

 

[AlexDP]

Thanks, that sounds like a good way of approaching the situation. I will definitely say that to her.

Side note again, she has told me a million times taht she HATES being told what to do. She says her parents just drove her crazy whenever they would try to tell her what to do and a couple of times she took me off guard by saying "dont' tell me what to do" for some totally simple crap that I didn't even think about .. can't remember the exact examples, but it could be something like "hey, don't forget to call your mom".. her answer: "dont' tell me what to do".. .me "huh???? what are yo utalking about"... this only happend a couple of times, but I thought it was pretty weird at the time. There were plenty of times when I asked her to do something, and she willingly did it, but a couple of times kinda took me off guard for something much simpler than other things she has done for me. Go figure

She will often perceive things as pressure when they are obviously not intended that way. I told my BPD ex I thought she looked great without make up and she took it as me telling her that she dressed like a skank and that I "always" told her what to wear.

They cannot handle love and intimacy. Stuff like 'I miss you', 'I love you' will often be interpreted as pressuring her. Telling her you miss her for example feels like a demand. It feels as if she's doing something wrong by not being with you and you're ordering her to come to you.

Again, there are certain skills you can use, but I would still advise against the relationship. If you do go through with it, always be prepared to walk away. And see how she reponds if you try to apply SET. But as I said before.. there are virtually no succes stories.

 

[Johnnyventana]

AlexDP, you know your bpd shyte! Sexysuave I would listen to him. He may be the new KontrollerX. And think about that SS. AlexDP knows BPDs this well, and yet he isn't with his anymore. I think that says a lot. It says even if you KNOW, they will still find a way to fk it up. They need drama to feel something. And they feel pressure from a slight breeze.

 

[49au]

Interesting thread. I'm still trying to determine if my ex has a mild case of BPD, or if her severe insecurity (sometimes bordering on paranoia), clinginess, and fear of abandonment was simply based on the fact that she got into a relationship with me only a few months after being rejected by a guy she was in love with and wanted to marry. It could go either way.

 

[bigneil]

Could it be that all women have BPD?

 

[HeMan]

seriously RUN RUN RUN!!!!!!!!!!!

my ex BDP trashed my office and now hanging out with one of my ex close mates. she admitted she using him to get revenge on me for abandoning her

its a horror story

if u feel she has issues get out now! otherwise she will destroy you emotionally

 

[st_99]

Well, you say that you've had tons of women and you can get them fairly easily, yet you're "in love" with some phsyco b*tch. I mean, have all these girls been like 300 pounds?? This just isn't adding up.

 

[sexysuave]

Thanks again AlexDP, you're comments have been great. Yes, she does misinterpret things sometimes, but she does love hearing "I love you" quite often, and to know that I miss her. Often she would call me just to tell me she loves me and misses me and just wants to hear my voice and that "I love her". Of course, like most other things, at first I thought this was just cute and that this chick is just really THAT into me lol. Now, after reading all this stuff about BPD, I see the real origins of this.

I did talk to her about the therapist thing and used the similar line to what you wrote. She went along with it and says that she will see him and get her new perscription.

Johny, yes, I can see that AlexDP seems to know a WHOLE LOT about this. How long were you with you BPD chick Alex? At what point did you realize she was BPD? Had I known this earlier, or ANYTHING about this at all, things would have been a lot different. Hell, they're already a lot different. I have no fear now whatsoever of losing this "great" chick, who pretty much sold her self to be my soulmate early on. If she pulls one of those "I'm not good enough for you" deals again, I'm outta there.

HeMan, thanks for the advice! Yeah, I do feel she has some issues now, and now I know a whole lot more about them. I"m not gonna call it quits right this instant, I will give it another chance, but at this point there is no part of me that's gonna hold me back if sh*t hits the fan again. I'm CERTAIN of that. She says she will see the therapis and go back on her meds, so we shall see what happens, but from now on (and really even before this, but especially now knowing all this), I am ALWAYS ready to walk away. Even before this, I've never been the one to try to hold someone back who really doesn't wanna be with me, so it won't be too huge of an issue for me.

st_99, not sure what you want me to tell you bro?? No, I dont' go for overweight chicks lol, no 300 pounders, and YES, I've been with TONS and TONS of different chicks, usually short term f**k relationships, one night stands, friends with benefits who pretty much only meet up to screw. I've had a 6 year relatinoship before that (honestly, my chick of 6 years is even hotter than my current BPD girl, but BPD girl still made me feel more loved with everything she did and said), and prior to that a couple of short term relationships and more running game, pick up artist stuff, getting just a bunch of different girls. I have no "approach anxiety" at all, as a matter of fact, it is tougher for me NOT to approach a hot girl or a group of people where hot chicks are present. When I'm in a relationship, I literally have to tell my self, "dont' do it dude, just keep walking". I even had guys that used to ask me all sorts of questions on picking up girls and kept wanting me to write a book. I had buddies taht I used to take with me and just have them practice running game, It was like a drug to me, still is whenever I'm single. I didn't really have too much emotional connection to these girls, nor did I see them long enough or often enough to develop that connection. I'm not saying this to brag, just giving some history. Did you not read my entire post, I know it was long? This girl won me over initially by appearing very normal, just very into me. She didn't have "phsyco b**ch" written on her forehead or anything man!! I said that this girl actually sold her self to me as my soulmate!! It's not like this is some wack job that I immediately fell "in love" with. I didn't know ANYTHING about BPD, and this girl did all the right things in the first few months. Yes, maybe it was "too good to be true", but hell I wanted to believe it, I'm confident and conceited enough to believe it I guess, I guess after losing hope in ever really being interested in LTR and marriage again, I thought finally found someome so compatible, so into me, so IN LOVE with me and so freaking great in every way that I just had no choice but to believe it and find out. If you've never been in LTR with a BPD, then you probably won't understand, as I wouldn't understand either until now. This girl made me feel a connection that I haven't felt since my ex of 6 years, and then she went even beyond that. She really knew (and still does at times) what she was doing and she is a VERY high functioning BPD. She has a great circle of friends, college educated, good job, seemingly a very normal family with parents who have been together for over 30 years and sibblings in (seemingly) succesful marriages, she is hot as hell, turns me on like few chicks ever have, and the sex is just down right mind boggling. I literally NEVER get tired of it. So no dude, I fell "in love" while thinking I have me not only a "normal" chick, but a damn good "catch", I thought I "struck gold". She was a little more jealous and paranoid than some other chicks, but like I said, I thought she was just THAT into me and that eventually it would ease up as she gets to know me better and we spend more time. I did not KNOW, that this was a "phsyco bi**h" as you say. And NOW that I finally do, I can't just IMMEDIATELY fall outta love with her! Yes, I know long term it's probably best not to be with her. No, I will NOT have an issue with her leaving me if it comes down to that and will NOT hold her back. Hell, I didn't even hold her back the couple of times she threw a fit, I simply said, "If you don't wanna be with me, don't be with me" and I told her from very beginning, I will NEVER EVER EVER hold ANYONE back. If my parents say they don't want me in their life, hell, I wouldn't stop them either. So no, I'm honestly not too worried about that. I know for a fact that I can walk away if it comes to that and NEVER look back again. I was with a girl (drop dead stunning, hotter than my current chick) for 6 years, and she called me tons and tons, trying to get back, trying to meet up, I never fell for it once. Your post was just kinda pointless, I didn't come here to talk about dating 300 pounders, I wanted people "with experience on BPD" chicks, to comment on it. I specified that in the title of the thread. I do not want opinion from people who don't have experience with an LTR with a BPD. Simply put, if you haven't been in an LTR with a BPD, you just don't understand. Don't mean to be rude, not to you or anyone else on here, but I'm just looking for comments on people that have actual experience, and I think I've gotten that so far and even had some people send me PM with their number and talk to me about this, as they had or currently have a relationship with BPD. So thanks everyone, really, it feels pretty damn good having a support system, (females always have their support systems and all their girlfriends to spill their guts to and help get over breakups, guys usually just keep it all in as they're embarassed to talk about it, so this forum helps!)

Thanks again everyone, and if anyone wants to add anything (if you have experience), feel free

 

[AlexDP]

Thanks again AlexDP, you're comments have been great. Yes, she does misinterpret things sometimes, but she does love hearing "I love you" quite often, and to know that I miss her. Often she would call me just to tell me she loves me and misses me and just wants to hear my voice and that "I love her". Of course, like most other things, at first I thought this was just cute and that this chick is just really THAT into me lol. Now, after reading all this stuff about BPD, I see the real origins of this.

I did talk to her about the therapist thing and used the similar line to what you wrote. She went along with it and says that she will see him and get her new perscription.

Johny, yes, I can see that AlexDP seems to know a WHOLE LOT about this. How long were you with you BPD chick Alex? At what point did you realize she was BPD? Had I known this earlier, or ANYTHING about this at all, things would have been a lot different. Hell, they're already a lot different. I have no fear now whatsoever of losing this "great" chick, who pretty much sold her self to be my soulmate early on. If she pulls one of those "I'm not good enough for you" deals again, I'm outta there.

Thanks to the both of you. When I encounter a problem in life, I try to know everything about it in order to understand it. It's how I fixed my own chronic knee issues as well. I didn't agree with the specialist who was treating me and studied it myself.

I was with my BPD ex for only seven months, however I had a friend in high school who had BPD as well. I knew her for four years. With my ex I realised after four months. This late because she was a silent borderline and I hadn't studied all the details about it yet. One of the things that would have me notice it instantly now is the look in her eyes. Most borderlines have that empty, sad look. It's difficult to describe, but it is very characteristic. In my ex's case I noticed because compliments were interpreted the wrong way every single time, but more importantly, because she began to dissociate a lot. Usually when the dissociating starts, you're fvcked.

It ended because I put up some very firm boundaries. She was flirting with guys on facebook, when I had to study she demanded that I be with her all the time and she was mad constantly. Even though I thought I loved her, I started to say no. In the end she left, because she found someone who looked exactly like me (yeah, sometimes they search for your doppelganger) and who was willing to kiss her ass.

I'll tell you this though, when it ends, it's going to hurt. 9 months isn't that long in a normal relationship, but it is in a BPD relationship. That is because BPD is an attachment disorder. Your girlfriend is dependent on people. Apart from your own personality issues (which, and this is by no means meant as an insult, will be there - otherwise you don't get involved with a BPD and it means that this relationship will change you for the better) BPD's tend to enmesh with others. Because they have no sense of self, they borrow yours. Gradually they dump their emotional pain onto you. When it ends, the BPD will feel shame and guilt. However she cannot experience this, so she must paint you black and dump those emotions onto you. In turn this means that you, already weakened because you're starting to lose your sense of self, will have to deal with some very heavy stuff.

Your borderline seems to be the quiet type. I've noticed that these are usually the ones who leave the relationship themselves. You see, a BPD cannot face abandonment. That is why if you dump her, she will stalk you or try to get at you by having sex with your best friend. If she perceives that you are going to dump her however, she might beat you to it. And it will be cold. In my case my ex sent me a text she never wished to see me again and started a huge smear campaign. This 4 hours or so after telling me she needed me and wanted to be with me forever. Next thing you know she was telling everyone I was a rapist and a stalker. At first I tried to fight back, but it is useless. Besides, people are smarter than they look. Most healthy people see a borderline for what it is: an extreme AW.

I have to say though that I have talked to several people whose lives were simply destroyed by borderlines. I had a lot going for me when things ended and I always knew I was going to bounce back from this. But it's different for people who have been in a BPD relationship for years. Because of the constant abandonment fears the BPD will try to isolate you from other friends and potential lovers. She will put you down, take away your self esteem. You'll end up doing anything to please her and become completely codependent. You will lose sight of who you are. The only personality type who would be somewhat capable to have a "succesful" relationship with a borderline is a sociopath, because he outmanipulates her and because he has no emotions she can toy with.

EDIT: I forgot to add, no, you did not fall in love with a blatant lunatic. However there's a reason she did everything right and instantly looked like your soulmate. That reason is that she is so good at feeling what makes you to tick that she can connect very fast. Also, you liked the adoration . But let's be honest, even if you liked the adoration and thought she might be your soulmate, you knew "something" was off. You couldn't put your finger on it, but for a while now you've been thinking: when is this going to go all wrong? I'm glad she's going to the therapist and take her pills. How did you go about asking her to do so?

 

[sexysuave]

You fixed your knee issues by figuring things out that even a specialist didn’t know?? That’s pretty damn amazing/crazy!! Congrats! How much did you have to research to figure that out? And what did the specialist say later, if you even went back to inform him/her, that is?

And dude!!!! YES!!! This “Most borderlines have that empty, sad look. It's difficult to describe, but it is very characteristic” is VERY VERY correct!!! I thought about this the entire weekend (obviously). And noticed it A LOT. Now, she did have a car accident on Thursday, so I was just mainly spending a lot of time at her place as she was in pain and we couldn’t do much else, so not sure if this all magnified that look, but I saw that look OFTEN over the last 4 days or so. Pretty much, since I found out that BPD existed and read about how they feel “empty inside” I’ve been sort of keeping an eye on it. So once again, I’m probably paying attention to EVERY little detail now, so I’m noticing more, but that look is definitely there for now. I’ll see if it becomes less obvious once her car accident pain and trauma is gone. I don’t remember noticing it as often in the past, but I wasn’t really looking for it. Once or twice this weekend when I noticed she had that blank, empty look, I asked her “are you ok”, and she goes “yeah, why”. I’m like “just making sure,, what are you thinking about” and she kinda laughs, and shrugs her shoulders, and says “nothing really”. And I just kinda laughed back and said “haha, ok sparky”.

This morning she was texing me (she was on her way to work) and saying she is freaked out big time driving. She hasn’t drove since her accident on Thursday morning (she got rear ended by a Ford pickup). There was a truck behind her on the highway and it freaked her out just now. Also, during the weekend when I took her around a few times, she would get freaked out for a second whenever someone in front of us (even up to a 100 feet in front of us) turned left. During her accident, a couple of cars ahead of her someone was making a left turn, cause traffic to slightly slow down, and this pickup wasn’t’ paying attention and just ran into her. This one time the car had to have been at least a 100 feet in front of us, and she stopped my conversation and screamed “BABE!!” and I’m like “what??” and she calmed down and said “nothing, sorry”… I looked around and saw nothing (other then the car 100 feet in front making a left turn) I said “what is it, it’s not that car WAYYY out there is it”, and she is like “yeah, I’m sorry”.. So not sure how long it’s gonna take her to get over this car accident now.

But yeah, back to that “look”. You really can’t explain the look until you see it and know what you’re looking for, which is what I noticed a lot this weekend. And then sometimes she will tell me how much she loves me and that I “just don’t understand how much in love with me she is” while she just seemed kinda out of it, so it’s not a good feeling seeing her tell me these things while physically her wibe seems like “I’m in a whole different universe right now” lol. I’ll see if this changes as she slowly gets over her car accident (hopefully she does get over it, no clue).

“because she began to dissociate a lot. Usually when the dissociating starts, you're fvcked.” Ok, so what exactly did you mean here? Can you give me some examples of her dissociating? From you? From her self (what you used to think was her)? I feel as this is an important topic and want to make sure that I’m clear on exactly what you’re trying to say here. What was she dissociating from? Please elaborate. Thanks bud.

I’m also a little curios to how she can “feel” shame and guilt, but not be able to experience it? If she feels it, if she not experiencing it, by definition?

And you are, once again, absolutely correct that 9 months, while not long in normal relationships, does indeed to seem MUCH more intense with a BPD. And I’m sorry about how your breakup unfolded. Sounds pretty damn ugly!! I doubt that she would do something that extreme to me, as I haven’t heard any horror stories about her ex boyfriends, other than they “cheated on her and lied to her”. So hopefully if I end up having a story about me, it won’t be any worse that that lol, but I guess one never knows.

You said “I have to say though that I have talked to several people whose lives were simply destroyed by borderlines.”. This is VERY VERY interesting, and brings up some of the comments she has casually brought up in the past. She has always talked about how she was mistreated and “treated like crap” in the past, but at one point, while she was professing her love to me and how she wants to be with me forever, and have my kids, and be a happy family until we die, she also kinda added in “I’m done with games and breaking hearts, all that is in the past, I just wanna be happy with you”. Which at the time was one of those bad feelings (red flags) that I just wanted to ignore (and did for the most part). But to my self I thought “how the hell are you DONE with “games” and “breaking hearts” if you said YOU were the one who got cheated on and mistreated and treated like crap or what not”. So that was a bit odd to me at the time and I should have questioned it but I didn’t. Another interesting thing was when she was telling me a story about one of her first boyfriends from I guess late high school or early college, they were on and off for a while I guess a year or year and a half or so, (she had 2 other LTRs after him, before meeting me). She said that he saw her at her birthday party at some club and told one of his friends “this girl ruined my life”. And one her close girlfriends was dating his friend so she was there and heard this and told my girl what he said. And when she told me this story she was like “I guess the poor guy was really hurt over everything”. I obviously didn’t think much of this at the time at all, hell, I even questioned how much of it was true lol, sounded like she was just perhaps trying to demonstrate higher value that she is important or something. Now, knowing all this, I’m thinking that the guy probably did mean it when he said “this girl ruined my life”. LOL. Geez, the more I think back, the more of these little hints I realized I missed or just didn’t really know better about them.

“But let's be honest, even if you liked the adoration and thought she might be your soulmate, you knew "something" was off. You couldn't put your finger on it, but for a while now you've been thinking: when is this going to go all wrong? I'm glad she's going to the therapist and take her pills. How did you go about asking her to do so?”

Ok, dude, once again, the above paragraph is VERY VERY true. You seem to know almost everything on the subject and things you are saying are just hitting me right in the face. Yes, you are correct, even though she was projecting that she could be my soulmate, DEEP down,, VERY DEEP down, I had this feeling of “something” being off. Hell, I was visiting my parents (they live in a different state) a few months into the relationship, and was there for a week. Of course, she was freaking out while I was there, begging me not to do anything stupid, saying she misses me, but something about it was just a little off. And here is a kicker, when I was leaving and my parents took me to the airport, while I was saying my good buys my mom says “are you ok, is everything alright with you”? I was like “yeah mom, why”. And she says “I dunno, you’ve just seemed a little more quiet this time around, and like something was bothering you”. (obviously the thing with my BPD was bothering me, since she was kinda being weird that I was away, I didn’t know about all these deep rooted abandonment issues and she just seemed more distant, so I was obviously worried that I was losing my potential “soulmate” at the time. Honestly, our relationship got a lot BETTER after about 4 months or so, that’s when we got really comfortable with each other and that feeling of “something” being off kinda went away for the most part. I actually felt very very good and was very comfortable in the relationship. We had some arguments here and there, but like I said, there was a stretch of 4 or 5 months where she did not have any of her big freak out episodes where she thought about leaving because I was “too good” and she was “not worthy”. Up until last week. And just like you, that same morning she was telling me how she is so insanely in love with me and cannot wait to marry me and have a family with me. And that same night, BAM. That’s when I sort of thought, ok, that just CAN NOT be normal. You can’t feel that way in the morning, and then at night do a 180 without me even doing anything wrong at all! So I did research, and stumbled across some BPD site, and BLAM, smacked me right in the face.)

 

[sexysuave]

The thing about therapist came last night when she was lying in my bed after yet another awesome intimate session. Oh, and the thing is, since her accident and the fight the night before, we haven’t done it for almost a week now. And I have noticed that she gets on an extreme high during and after intimate sessions. I mean we both love it, and she would be at some great highs for hours afterwards, complimenting me on how good it was and just feeling good about everything in general. So I make it a point to always rock her world (really, my goal with any girl is always to be the best lover she’s ever had). There were a few times when we went at it so good that she started crying because of having “back to back” orgasms one right after another, which she says she never experienced before. Well last night afterwards we were laying in bed and somehow the subject of being happy came up. She asked if I’m happy with her and I said “yes, for the most part, until you fre**ing lose it for no apparent reason, I really wish you work on that as I would like to have a stable relationship and not worry about that my girl is gonna hit the bricks anytime she gets really freaked out about something and I’m not even at any fault.” She said “yeah, I know, I’m sorry”. Then I asked her “are you happy” and she said “yes”. I looked at her right in the eyes and said “could you be happier” and she hesitated and said “well, yeah, if I wasn’t ‘crazy time’”. (sort of a breakthrough here, she’s pretty much admitting she is somewhat crazy lol) I just gave her a kiss on the forehead and said “I really feel like you should go see your doctor again, and get your new prescription”. She said “yea”. I said “I know it sounds silly and all, but I think it’s for the best. I really feel like he is trying to help you out. Don’t let it upset you too much if he tells you some things you may not want to hear. He is only trying to help and the only way to benefit from that is to accept the help. There is no benefit in him trying to deceive you.” She was still mostly quiet and shook her head and said “ok, I’ll do it.” Now, whether she follows through remains to be seen. I hope I don’t have to “remind her” and that she just takes care of it and lets me know when her appointment is. I’ll give it a week and see if she says anything.

So thanks for all your help thus far. Also, one question has been running through my mind today. I’ve read its mainly “very very hot” chicks that suffer from BPD. Well, you’ve done more research that I have, so why is this? If these symptoms are based on possible traumas early in life, how come the average chicks or even ugly chicks don’t develop BPD? Why is it that only the really hot ones get it? Or maybe the average or uglys have it also but it’s less reported? Perhaps because not too many guys are into ‘em anyway?? I’m just really curious on this; so let me know if you have any ideas on that.

 

[AlexDP]

And dude!!!! YES!!! This “Most borderlines have that empty, sad look. It's difficult to describe, but it is very characteristic” is VERY VERY correct!!! I thought about this the entire weekend (obviously). And noticed it A LOT. Now, she did have a car accident on Thursday, so I was just mainly spending a lot of time at her place as she was in pain and we couldn’t do much else, so not sure if this all magnified that look, but I saw that look OFTEN over the last 4 days or so. Pretty much, since I found out that BPD existed and read about how they feel “empty inside” I’ve been sort of keeping an eye on it. So once again, I’m probably paying attention to EVERY little detail now, so I’m noticing more, but that look is definitely there for now. I’ll see if it becomes less obvious once her car accident pain and trauma is gone. I don’t remember noticing it as often in the past, but I wasn’t really looking for it. Once or twice this weekend when I noticed she had that blank, empty look, I asked her “are you ok”, and she goes “yeah, why”. I’m like “just making sure,, what are you thinking about” and she kinda laughs, and shrugs her shoulders, and says “nothing really”. And I just kinda laughed back and said “haha, ok sparky”.

I think what you're describing here is her dissociating. You see, there's a difference. Borderlines tend to have an empty, sad look all the time (or in my ex's case a look filled with anxiety and fear), but that look sort of changes into a sad stare when they dissociate. Dissociating is her leaving the situation on an emotional, psychological level. It's as if she's not really present. And she's not.

This morning she was texing me (she was on her way to work) and saying she is freaked out big time driving. She hasn’t drove since her accident on Thursday morning (she got rear ended by a Ford pickup).

How serious was the accident?

But yeah, back to that “look”. You really can’t explain the look until you see it and know what you’re looking for, which is what I noticed a lot this weekend. And then sometimes she will tell me how much she loves me and that I “just don’t understand how much in love with me she is” while she just seemed kinda out of it, so it’s not a good feeling seeing her tell me these things while physically her wibe seems like “I’m in a whole different universe right now” lol.

That vibe, that's dissociating. She's telling you she loves you, but she's not really telling you. At that point she hardly has a clue who you are. When she dissociates her universe is no longer your universe. This is when you are no longer you. It is dangerous, because it usually happens more towards the end of a relationship. It means your role is changing. You used to be the knight in shining armour, now you're becoming the persecutor. In therapy they teach borderlines to stop dissociating by making them more aware of their surroundings. For example they have to touch stuff and describe what it feels like. This helps them be more in the moment.

I’m also a little curios to how she can “feel” shame and guilt, but not be able to experience it? If she feels it, if she not experiencing it, by definition?

She feels it, but represses it. She cannot handle those emotions, so she puts them onto you. She pushes them away.

You said “I have to say though that I have talked to several people whose lives were simply destroyed by borderlines.”. This is VERY VERY interesting, and brings up some of the comments she has casually brought up in the past. She has always talked about how she was mistreated and “treated like crap” in the past, but at one point, while she was professing her love to me and how she wants to be with me forever, and have my kids, and be a happy family until we die, she also kinda added in “I’m done with games and breaking hearts, all that is in the past, I just wanna be happy with you”. Which at the time was one of those bad feelings (red flags) that I just wanted to ignore (and did for the most part). But to my self I thought “how the hell are you DONE with “games” and “breaking hearts” if you said YOU were the one who got cheated on and mistreated and treated like crap or what not”. So that was a bit odd to me at the time and I should have questioned it but I didn’t. Another interesting thing was when she was telling me a story about one of her first boyfriends from I guess late high school or early college, they were on and off for a while I guess a year or year and a half or so, (she had 2 other LTRs after him, before meeting me). She said that he saw her at her birthday party at some club and told one of his friends “this girl ruined my life”. And one her close girlfriends was dating his friend so she was there and heard this and told my girl what he said.

Look. Chances are she was never cheated on. She's a borderline. It's highly unlikely that what she tells is true. She may believe it herself, but it's probably a lie. Borderlines always think their boyfriends cheat on them. They feel something, so it must be true. That's how they think. And yes. She plays games, yes she breaks harts. She breaks harts, because she thinks they hurt her. They didn't intend to. But it felt that way for her and now they must be punished. But you're different, right? It has never felt as good as it feels with you. You're the one she says. She also said that to her ex. And the guy before him. And the guy before him.

PS. and I will put this in capital letters so you do not miss it: YOUR MOTHER ASKED IF YOU WERE OKAY. YOU'RE CHANGING. YOUR EMOTIONS ARE STARTING TO DEPEND ON THE BORDERLINE. YOU'RE NOT YOUR USUAL SELF.

Why that is? Enmeshment. Whatever you do with this relationship, you need to start detaching or it will hurt you a great deal. Compare who you are now to who you were 9 months ago. Are you still the same person? Or do you feel empty when your girlfriend is not around? Do sports interest you as much as they did before your girlfriend?

 

[AlexDP]

The thing about therapist came last night when she was lying in my bed after yet another awesome intimate session. Oh, and the thing is, since her accident and the fight the night before, we haven’t done it for almost a week now. And I have noticed that she gets on an extreme high during and after intimate sessions. I mean we both love it, and she would be at some great highs for hours afterwards, complimenting me on how good it was and just feeling good about everything in general. So I make it a point to always rock her world (really, my goal with any girl is always to be the best lover she’s ever had). There were a few times when we went at it so good that she started crying because of having “back to back” orgasms one right after another, which she says she never experienced before. Well last night afterwards we were laying in bed and somehow the subject of being happy came up. She asked if I’m happy with her and I said “yes, for the most part, until you fre**ing lose it for no apparent reason, I really wish you work on that as I would like to have a stable relationship and not worry about that my girl is gonna hit the bricks anytime she gets really freaked out about something and I’m not even at any fault.” She said “yeah, I know, I’m sorry”. Then I asked her “are you happy” and she said “yes”. I looked at her right in the eyes and said “could you be happier” and she hesitated and said “well, yeah, if I wasn’t ‘crazy time’”. (sort of a breakthrough here, she’s pretty much admitting she is somewhat crazy lol) I just gave her a kiss on the forehead and said “I really feel like you should go see your doctor again, and get your new prescription”. She said “yea”. I said “I know it sounds silly and all, but I think it’s for the best. I really feel like he is trying to help you out. Don’t let it upset you too much if he tells you some things you may not want to hear. He is only trying to help and the only way to benefit from that is to accept the help. There is no benefit in him trying to deceive you.” She was still mostly quiet and shook her head and said “ok, I’ll do it.” Now, whether she follows through remains to be seen. I hope I don’t have to “remind her” and that she just takes care of it and lets me know when her appointment is. I’ll give it a week and see if she says anything.

You see what happened there? You're slowly becoming a parent. She's slowly degenerating into your child. For what it's worth you did okay. But like I said, it probably won't be enough in the long run. As for the sex.. I hate to break it to you, but no, you can't know if you're the best she's ever had. She says that to everyone. It's likely she's the best you've ever had though.

So thanks for all your help thus far. Also, one question has been running through my mind today. I’ve read its mainly “very very hot” chicks that suffer from BPD. Well, you’ve done more research that I have, so why is this? If these symptoms are based on possible traumas early in life, how come the average chicks or even ugly chicks don’t develop BPD? Why is it that only the really hot ones get it? Or maybe the average or uglys have it also but it’s less reported? Perhaps because not too many guys are into ‘em anyway?? I’m just really curious on this; so let me know if you have any ideas on that.

Borderlines have virtually no self esteem. As they have no sense of self and don't think anyone could ever love them for who they are, they strive to be as goodlooking as they can possibly be. Yes, being hot is an acquired characteristic in their case. It is also why they start learning how to be charming at a very young age. Appearance is all she's got, she has to put a lot of effort into that. Now don't get me wrong: your girlfriend is probably also fun to be around. But at the same time you don't really know what to say to her. It's as if she doesn't have any core values. Half the time you're explaining things to her and she soaks it up like a sponge. But her values in reality are your values. There probably have been times you were sitting next to her wondering what to say.

 

[AlexDP]

Well last night afterwards we were laying in bed and somehow the subject of being happy came up. She asked if I’m happy with her and I said “yes, for the most part, until you fre**ing lose it for no apparent reason, I really wish you work on that as I would like to have a stable relationship and not worry about that my girl is gonna hit the bricks anytime she gets really freaked out about something and I’m not even at any fault.” She said “yeah, I know, I’m sorry”. Then I asked her “are you happy” and she said “yes”. I looked at her right in the eyes and said “could you be happier” and she hesitated and said “well, yeah, if I wasn’t ‘crazy time’”.

This is the sad part. Borderlines aren't bat**** crazy. Their disorder is fairly understandable. What they do makes sense. That is, not like your or my actions would make sense, but when you think things through, you can understand it. Borderlines are emotional children, but most of them are far from stupid. They do sense something is wrong with them. They're just not capable of realizing what it is. What she said right there? Well, there's going to be a moment in your life you'll think back about that and start to cry. Because you'll realize how miserable she really is. She had a moment of clarity. And it made her feel bad about herself. For an instant she realised she and everyone around her would be happier if she changed. Of course she'll never do it. And tomorrow she will not remember ever having said that she was crazy - YOU are the crazy one by then.

 

[bigneil]

True AlexDP. Only a really hot girl could act so mean and crazy while having a man stick around long enough to learn what BPD is.

The reason men fall so hard for them is because these women come on much stronger than most (the idealization phase when you are seen as perfect to them). First they are manic (unusually happy) then they are depressed (unusually sad) - the devaluation phase when you are demonized.

The reason it feels hard to replace them is because you are remembering what it was like to meet this unusually happy person who seemed to adore you from day 1, and normal girls don't act that way that quickly.

The contrast you feel between how strong she came on at first, to how coldly and quickly she abandoned you after, is about as strong as one girl can achieve. She goes from being the hottest girl you ever had to the coldest girl you ever had, overnight. If you loved her, you will go from being as happy as can be to as sad as can be - in the blink of an eye. She will delight in seeing this and will remind you how weak you are.

 

[AlexDP]

True AlexDP. Only a really hot girl could act so mean and crazy while having a man stick around long enough to learn what BPD is.

The reason men fall so hard for them is because these women come on much stronger than most (the idealization phase when you are seen as perfect to them). First they are manic (unusually happy) then they are depressed (unusually sad) - the devaluation phase when you are demonized.

The reason it feels hard to replace them is because you are remembering what it was like to meet this unusually happy person who seemed to adore you from day 1, and normal girls don't act that way that quickly.

The contrast you feel between how strong she came on at first, to how coldly and quickly she abandoned you after, is about as strong as one girl can achieve. She goes from being the hottest girl you ever had to the coldest girl you ever had, overnight. If you loved her, you will go from being as happy as can be to as sad as can be - in the blink of an eye. She will delight in seeing this and will remind you how weak you are.

As with anything BPD related it is an illusion though. You only think your happiness depends on this person. After a couple of weeks you slowly start to regain your lost (more like stolen) self. After a few months you start to think about what it was you really liked about your borderline ex as a person. And you will realise it is almost nothing. You liked her, because you needed her the way she needed you.

You see.. if you're a narcissist, your self esteem isn't all that high. People think it is, but it isn't. It's a coping mechanism. Really, you're thinking you don't deserve true love. That is why you distance yourself from healthy girls who truly love you. On a very deep emotional level you know the borderline cannot love you for who you are. The borderline might be able to mirror you, but she doesn't see you for who you are, she does not love you and this is what attracts you in her.

When you recover from the borderline relationship and start doing some introspection however, you will feel that the borderline actually cured you from your self esteem issues. That is, if you're rational enough to start detaching. In a weird way it's an experience you have to go through in order to truly understand you deserve better. Do keep in mind, SS, that I'm saying all of this while not knowing you personally. It's just how it usually goes. I do know though that no one "happens to get involved with a BPD". It's not fate. It's because you're attracted to each other. And the reason for that attraction is self esteem issues.

You look like you're an altruistic narcissist, SS. IMHO this means that the devaluation will hit you particularly hard. You see.. you take great delight in the fact that you're her hero. You're fixing her, you understand her. You're solving the enigma. Here is a man who can help her. And it is what you want to do. It is what I wanted to do. I was only with her for 7 months, but I did a lot for that girl. So when she suddenly starts calling you the monster, the stalker, the rapist, the abusive ex.. that hits hard. But if you get over it, and most do, you will become a rock emotionally. It's odd to say, but it has done wonders for both my professional and my love life.

 

[st_99]

st_99, not sure what you want me to tell you bro??

I hear ya man, same thing happened to me. Had this girl that was seemingly off the charts in terms of a connection. I actually think she was HPD (histrionic). She wasn't even a 10 or anything in looks, but she had a great personality, she was fun, pushed all the right buttons, said all the right things and had me infatuated. I ignored all the red flags and the story didn't end well, or at least not how I pictured. Was it all lies? No empathy on her part? Maybe she is just REALLY good at what she does. Probably all of the above. Time takes care of everything though and I already know how the story plays out. Something like this... you meet someone else a while from now, you like them, you think back and say "thank god I didn't end up with that girl I was so obsessed over" "boy was I dumb"

 

[jdomingos76]

My friend, about 5 years ago I started to date a BPD (at that time I didn't know nothing about BPD). About 8 months on the relationship, I started to observe some strange behavior on her, and in the middle of great drama, I broke with her. But in a moment of weakness, on the same day, I call her and we started again.

We bought a house, married, and had two girls (twins, now aged two). I was always a dedicated husband and father.

Forward to the present. I'm now separated, she simply went crazy and paranoiac, and left the house. The girls are living with grand fathers. And although I got my freedom back, she keeps trying to hurt me using every weapon she can, even the girls.

I wish now I didn't had that moment of weakness years ago.