On Becoming A Successful Man...

[sexual_intellectual]

@ Wyldfire:

first of all - your original post:

Recently there has been a lot of debate here about whether or not overall self-improvement should be the goal of those who come here for help. There is a faction who insist it's all about being successful with women and there really is no other purpose. To these guys...you get a Wyld bonk on the head...you are WRONG!

Let's take a moment and look at nature. Men need to fulfill certain aspects of their life to feel like a complete, worthy man. I refer to these things as "The 3 P's". Men define their worth as a man based on their ability to Procreate, Provide and Protect. Likewise, women are instinctively attracted to men who emit confidence in their ability to meet her ingrained desire to have children, be taken care of and to feel safe. It is all interconnected.

Now let's think about confidence for just a minute. Have you EVER met a man who demonstrates the ability to Procreate, Provide and Protect well who was not also confident, self-assured? Probably not...and although I'm sure a few exist, it's something you seldom, if ever see.

If you want to not just go through live faking it then you NEED to work on improving yourself as a whole. Although ignoring your subconscious need to be able to Provide and Protect won't stop you from getting dates, it WILL prevent you from truly being confident as a whole man which will ultimately lead to problems when you meet someone you don't want to lose.

The path to becoming a truly successful man requires you to address the following:

1) Sexual prowess
2) Physical, emotional and mental strength and endurance
3) Education/Career goals and financial responsibility

If every guy on this site would strive to feel successful in ALL of these areas they would become naturally confident. For those who really struggle with women, and don't seem to be getting anywhere...you need to take an honest look at the other areas and focus more attention there. Why? Because men who have the other stuff together find it MUCH easier to deal with women. Success with women is a natural by product of attaining a sense of success in the other areas.

"I think many of you are missing the obvious in my original post. "Procreate" is being addressed by this site and all those things you mentioned learning about."

OK Wyldfire, call me stupid if you wanna - but that's you're post above, please show me exactly where you mentioned learning about about a women's manipulative ways and how to circumvent them?? When you expanded on Procreation, you've called it sexual prowess. I'm talking about KNOWING THE GAME. If thats included in #1 - "Procreation" AKA "Sexual Prowess" - I still have a problem with your post because you're underplaying it by not mentioning it explicitly.

For me, as I've previously said, this has been THE MAJOR lesson I learnt from sosuave. Without it, I could be a tiger between the sheets; physically, emotionally and mentally strong; educated, rich, intelligent and basically God's gift to womankind, but I'd still be very easy for a woman who knew what she was doing to manipulate. Game isn't everything, but for most guys who have little success with women, its the most common problem, deserving of more emphasis than you've given it!

I mean, I've wanted to and consistently taken steps towards improving myself a long time before I ever discovered sosuave. Most guys I know are like this - we're not happy with where we are, we know what our passions are, and either run with them, or have a good reason not to. Don't get me wrong, I love Pook's posts, but they're still just words on a screen written by someone I don't know. If my inspiration to improve myself was rooted in sosuave.com, I'd be a hopeless case! Fortunately, I have friends, competitors and goals in my everyday life that provide me with that drive.

"Nowhere in my original post do I tell anyone not to improve their interactions with women...that is one of the 3 things I said he needs to work on..."Procreation". I simply said that it is easier to do that when you feel confident and secure in the other areas."

That brings me to my other issue - what about guys who have confidence issues for no good reason? ie, they've got everything going for them but are still like putty around a beautiful lady. Here's the deal. Another very important lesson I've taken from this site, is that there's absolutely no point in being nervous around a woman I'm into. Not because I've improved myself, there really wasn't much wrong with me at the start! Instead I've learnt not to worship beauty from afar since those who do are destined never to hold her in their arms.

Most guys who come to sosuave, already know they should constantly strive to improve themselves. What they don't know is how to deal with women that play games. Their lack of confidence is often irrational, rather than based in their lowly status.

Your advice doesn't help these guys!

 

[*29*]

Some guys feel insulted being told how to be a successful man by a woman. After all, most posts assert male dominance. And men don't need advice from women, after all....we're men....right?

We don't need to stop and ask for directions...we are the directions.

Goodness Gracious. Quit aruging. Move on.

How's the weather?

 

[Virtú]

I see a lot of the same unspoken questions being asked, the same "methods" being investigated over and over again.

Which works fastest/easiest?
What should I regurgitate when the time comes?
How little do I need to attract and seduce women?
And the mother of them all: what should I focus on to the exclusion of all else?

IMO, these are all the wrong questions.

To all who want a magic bullet, I say "Give up", as there are no magic bullets. To all who want tricks, I say "Give up", as there are no tricks.

Here is a short list of the 4 main categories of things that a man can possess that attract, seduce, and keep women ... in no particular order.

Looks (face, hair, muscles, clothes, etc.)

Substance (intelligence/knowledge, integrity, love of life, etc.)

Inner game (confidence, masculinity, raw lust, etc.)

Outer game (attitude, behavior, C+F, kino, etc.)

IMO, the only question worth asking here is "How?"
"How can I get these things?" and "How can I become these things?"

Rather than picking and choosing, and arguing about which to pick or choose, let us put an end to the debate once and for all ... by saying that a man needs all of the above. It may not be true, but who the Hell cares?

You don't settle for less with a woman, so why would she settle for less with you, and most important of all ... why would you settle for less with yourself?

 

[Wyldfire]

You still said that men should focus on pleasing women...

I said no such thing. Kindly quote where I said "men should focus on pleasing women".

It is good for a man to love a woman and care for her, but he shouldn't grow up thinking that his only purpose in life is pleasing women to the fullest extent. That is what the AFC does.

Apparently you have a reading comprehension problem, because the entire point of my original post is that men should focus on improving the things that make HIM feel more like a man. Being more attractive to women is just a byproduct of bettering himself to make HIM feel better about himself and more confident. The whole post is about what a man must feel secure about in order for HIM to place a higher VALUE on HIMSELF as a MAN.


Your entire post has to be totally disregarded because you keep arguing against an opinion I never even expressed. You guys need to just forget that I'm a woman and just read what I post in the same way you would any other posts here.

 

[SheepSter]

I think it's great that a woman is giving advice on how to improve with women. And yes, improving in life is an important part, because it gives you natural confidence. And with that natural gained confidence succes can and will grow.

However reading this:

Men define their worth as a man based on their ability to Procreate, Provide and Protect

Gave me the urge to correct this simplification. These three terms are far to basic to describe a man's worth. When advice is given, the goal should be that the audience can fully comprehend it, therefor implications should be avoided. A real man is honorable, honest, in some ways humble, calm under pressure, has fortitude and endurance, is passionate but is able to control and restrain his passions, is generous, has a sense of responsibility, is friendly, has leadership qualities, is loyal, is decisive, has a sense of purpose, takes immediate action to do what is right, but above all he has courage. Man’s main task in life is to give birth to himself, to become what he potentially is. The most important product of his effort is his own personality. The true man wants two things: danger and play. For that reason he wants woman, as the most dangerous plaything.

A great book on the topic is "How to be a man" by Birmingham and Flinthard

Here's an extract:

How to Join the French Foreign Legion

Notice we specify 'French', rather than simply 'Foreign Legion'. You see, the Spanish have a Foreign Legion too, and it's a lot easier to get into. On the other hand, it's also an awful lot nastier, by all accounts, so if you really feel you've made all the errors you can make in a civilised country, definitely try the French first.

The place you're looking for is called Fort de Nogent, which is the major recruiting office for the Legionne Etrangere. It's in Paris.

Borrow the money for a ticket to Paris from someone you don't like very much. Buy the ticket. Make it a first class ticket, because you might as well enjoy what life remains to you.

Throw a large party. Get savagely drunk. Dispose of everything you own in an orgy of gambling and excess. Offer your real opinions to everyone you've ever despised. Make serious, unmistakeable attempts to bed every woman who's ever caught your eye.

In the morning, you should have created enough havoc and damage that there will be no choice for you but to get aboard that Paris-bound flight. Get drunk again on the flight. You can do that for free in First Class.

In Paris, book yourself into one of those totally decadent hotels with a price tag like the GNP of a small African nation. You're not going to pay the bill, so why worry about it? Try the Ritz. Take in a night of uttermost indulgence. If you can find a firm which supplies... dancing partners and is prepared to bill your hotel room, so much the better.

Next day, you front at Fort de Nogent. Enlist under an assumed name. It's perfectly legit from their viewpoint, and it's enormous fun. One tip: don't go with "Beau Geste".

And that's it. Your life is now in someone else's hands. Brutal, vicious hands. Hands which will gladly hunt you down like a dog and kill you if you so much as attempt to desert. But look on the bright side: if you make it through your stint, you wind up with French citizenship, complete with rights to be rude to everyone in sight, live on wine, cheese, bread and garlic, and to bomb Greenpeace back into the stone age.

 

[Wyldfire]

Originally posted by prosemont
As a matter of fact, this is all a huge rehashing and a regurge of Pook's stuff.

Carry on.

Not quite. Pook and I had several in depth conversations about nature, men, women, feminism and the like. Essentially, our views are very much alike and he and I almost always agreed with each other. There were a couple of areas we had similar beliefs on, but still somewhat different.

I don't recall Pook going into depth about how men assess their "value as a man" to themselves or make the connection between the 3 P's and many of the beliefs held by men in general. I could be wrong, but as far as I recall, he sort of went in a different direction than where I'm attempting to go. So, similar, yes...the same, no.

 

[Wyldfire]

sexual intellectual...

For the love of Christ... "Sexual Prowess" includes EVERY aspect of being satisfied in your individual ability to succeed with women. It involves different things to different men because each man has a bit of a unique take on what "procreating, providing and protecting" entails. Going into specific details is pointless, foolish and a waste of time because of that.

There is absolutely nothing in my first post that warrants all the arguing over semantics you (and some others) are hell bent on doing.

 

[Scought]

Huh

Im stuck on rule number one. While i agree sexual prowess helps pump a mans ego, I dont understand what that means to a woman.
Specifically, if you are dating a man and enjoy everything about him, but he isnt a 'prowess' is he worthless?
What do you consider prowess?
A number of partners?
His Penis size?
The entire sexual experience, i.e. Foreplay, sex, afterplay?
What makes a man a prowess?

IF he has a 2 inch penis but is an amazing man in other aspects of sex are you displeased?
Conversly, if he has a 12 inch penis but doesnt do anything but slam you, is that prowess, are you pleased with that?

Please elaborate as to what prowess means to a woman.

To me, and I may be different, I enjoy sex when its with somoene I enjoy. I dont just enjoy the act just cause.
Please expand a bit further on this particular topic.

 

[Wyldfire]

Re: Huh

Originally posted by Scought
Im stuck on rule number one. While i agree sexual prowess helps pump a mans ego, I dont understand what that means to a woman.
Specifically, if you are dating a man and enjoy everything about him, but he isnt a 'prowess' is he worthless?
What do you consider prowess?
A number of partners?
His Penis size?
The entire sexual experience, i.e. Foreplay, sex, afterplay?
What makes a man a prowess?

IF he has a 2 inch penis but is an amazing man in other aspects of sex are you displeased?
Conversly, if he has a 12 inch penis but doesnt do anything but slam you, is that prowess, are you pleased with that?

Please elaborate as to what prowess means to a woman.

To me, and I may be different, I enjoy sex when its with somoene I enjoy. I dont just enjoy the act just cause.
Please expand a bit further on this particular topic.

It really doesn't matter what the woman considers to be prowess. This is about whether or not YOU feel confident in your sexual prowess. You look at what you consider to be important, improve in all ways you can...to YOUR own satisfaction. The result is that you, as a man, feel good about yourself in that area of your life and you're confident as a result. It's being comfortable and confident in your own skin that comes from the result of being the best you can be in your OWN eyes that is attractive.

 

[00Kevin]

I think most people here agree that the first point made (Strive for Sexual Prowess) is a bad one.

 

[Wyldfire]

Originally posted by 00Kevin
I think most people here agree that the first point made (Strive for Sexual Prowess) is a bad one.

Actually, you couldn't be more wrong. Anyone who comes here looking to do better with women are striving to improve their sexual prowess. But hey...if your goal is to project an asexual image, all the more power to ya.

 

[sexual_intellectual]

Originally posted by Wyldfire
sexual intellectual...

For the love of Christ... "Sexual Prowess" includes EVERY aspect of being satisfied in your individual ability to succeed with women. It involves different things to different men because each man has a bit of a unique take on what "procreating, providing and protecting" entails. Going into specific details is pointless, foolish and a waste of time because of that.

There is absolutely nothing in my first post that warrants all the arguing over semantics you (and some others) are hell bent on doing.

Wldfire... I generally reserve semantic arguments for my dates My problem is with your emphasis and the message your post seems to communicate as I read it.

I'll try this from another angle.

You don't know **** about me - I don't know **** about you. For all I know, you're a geeky pimple-faced teenage boy, and pook's an unemployed, broke, down-on-his-luck college lecturer.

So there seems to me to be little point in preaching self-improvement at me, or worse, looking down on me if I don't pay the doctrine enough lip-service?

What is wrong with coming to this site as a guy, with the sole intention of getting good with women? I don't argue that this site is wrong to talk about self-improvement. I just don't see how you can be so adamant that self-improvement MUST be the goal of those who visit this site. Like I posted before - there are definately other, more inspiring places to go for that kind of encouragement.

 

[Wyldfire]

Originally posted by sexual_intellectual
Wldfire... I generally reserve semantic arguments for my dates My problem is with your emphasis and the message your post seems to communicate as I read it.

I'll try this from another angle.

You don't know **** about me - I don't know **** about you. For all I know, you're a geeky pimple-faced teenage boy, and pook's an unemployed, broke, down-on-his-luck college lecturer.

So there seems to me to be little point in preaching self-improvement at me, or worse, looking down on me if I don't pay the doctrine enough lip-service?

What is wrong with coming to this site as a guy, with the sole intention of getting good with women? I don't argue that this site is wrong to talk about self-improvement. I just don't see how you can be so adamant that self-improvement MUST be the goal of those who visit this site. Like I posted before - there are definately other, more inspiring places to go for that kind of encouragement.

You're arguing over nothing and at this point I'm incredibly bored with you...

 

[sexual_intellectual]

Wyldfire - your original post patronises guys who come here to get good with women and already know about self-improvement. If you can't see that, fair enough, but I won't have you saying I'm arguing over nothing.

Bottom line - I'm gonna keep coming to this board, and my ONLY purpose for coming here is to get better at getting women. Preach self-improvement all you like - I'm not listening. Like Tech says: "I refuse to be concerned with condescending advice, cos I'm the only mother****** that can change my life."

See ya!

 

[Wyldfire]

Originally posted by sexual_intellectual
Wyldfire - your original post patronises guys who come here to get good with women and already know about self-improvement. If you can't see that, fair enough, but I won't have you saying I'm arguing over nothing.

Bottom line - I'm gonna keep coming to this board, and my ONLY purpose for coming here is to get better at getting women. Preach self-improvement all you like - I'm not listening. Like Tech says: "I refuse to be concerned with condescending advice, cos I'm the only mother****** that can change my life."

See ya!

The original post doesn't patronize anyone.

 

[*29*]

Why would I take advice from someone with 361 posts?

 

[AlwaysExcel]

Originally posted by Wyldfire
You're missing a very important connection. You mention "richer, better looking, smarter and more buff". All of those thoughts and feelings have more to do with how a man defines HIMSELF than anything else. If a guy feels he doesn't measure up financially, intellectually, physically or sexually to other men it makes him insecure. When you are insecure you emit a certain "aura" of negativity that makes you unappealing.

For those who already truly feel successful in all other areas of life, but still can't seem to attract women...it's more often than not a case of attitude. It could also be fear and intimidation. Yes, these guys have to focus on becoming more successful with women and they MUST have the right kind of attitude to do so. However, there are lots of guys who don't feel good about all the things I listed and how they measure up. For these guys...it's ten times harder than for those guys who do feel good about themselves in other areas. And for those screw ups who still attract women when they are broke, out of shape, etc...the difference between them and the guys who come here is that they don't care how they measure up. That works for awhile...but ultimately, those guys are the ones who end up alone and bitter when they get older because "not giving a sh*t" doesn't serve you well beyond your youth.

Wyldfire, why do you say that "not giving a sh*t" doesn't serve you well beyond your youth?? I understand you as saying that the 3Ps are something that most men feel they should master and when they don't have these mastered, they are not confident with women. The point of mastering them is to become confident. So if a guy is confident without the 3Ps, does not care about them, and has success without mastering them, then why will the "not giving a sh*t" attitude ruin him later?? If confidence is the point, and he has confidence, why will he fail later in life??

 

[Don Juanabbe]

Guys, I implore you to stop reading this thread, it's confusing alot of people and unfortunately, whilst wyldfire makes some excellent points, it is being muddled up by female doublespeak. Not only that, it's nothing we don't already know. Stay the course. Don't get confused by this.

Alot of the dudes on here are in their early twenties and are learning the stuff to equip themselves for the dating world.

No one has said they shouldn't give a sh*t, just not to give a sh*t as much. People end up old and lonely, not because of this, but because they stop growing. Every man in his life will come to a point where he puts the DJ lifestyle to bed, and by that point, he will be man enough, and wise enough to know when he has reached that point, and these late teens and twentysomethings shouldn't be worried about that right now, and shouldn't be having chicks come on here and fearmongering about that sh*t.

The sh*t in this thread is all stuff we already know that has just been chewed up, regurgitated and fouled up by irrationial female interpretations.

Wyldfire - stop 'Oprafying' everything.

This site is also about deprogramming men - shifting them away from feminazi type propaganda, and I've seen a fair amount of that spewed out of your posts in this thread deeming it worthless.

Move along.

Also, by harping on a man needing to be buff, rich, smart etc. blah blah to the nth degree (barf) you are inherently assuming that every woman on the planet has some sort of inherent entitlement to this.

But guess what? Most women aren't entitled to a man like that, simply because she has a sn*tch.

In fact, the majority of women can't live up to a man like that. That is why the feminist movement started to grow, and I'd hazard a guess as to why you are on this site spouting your female bollocks.

How about a woman ensuring she has those qualities? Because I'll tell you one thing - there is a substantial segment of the female population that will never, ever find a man with all of those ideal qualities - they think they should, and this is where the WOMAN becomes spoiled and bitter because she can't get it.

This is a site about men finding WOMEN, not spoiled hors. Weeding out all the garbage for the gem.

Spoiled goldigging hors are for f*cking and ch*cking, and nothing else.

A woman who is after your money isn't worth anything more.

 

[Don Juanabbe]

Originally posted by Wyldfire
You're arguing over nothing and at this point I'm incredibly bored with you...

You really are a c*nt.

 

[Don Juanabbe]

Originally posted by AlwaysExcel
Wyldfire, why do you say that "not giving a sh*t" doesn't serve you well beyond your youth?? I understand you as saying that the 3Ps are something that most men feel they should master and when they don't have these mastered, they are not confident with women. The point of mastering them is to become confident. So if a guy is confident without the 3Ps, does not care about them, and has success without mastering them, then why will the "not giving a sh*t" attitude ruin him later?? If confidence is the point, and he has confidence, why will he fail later in life??

Don't listen to her, she's either fearmongering, trying to confuse all the young 'uns on here, or she simply has no f*cking clue what she's on about.