Jayer said:
Ok so first off regarding ONS with decent looking women, I'm sorry but they are just not prevalent in society. Even girls that have few morals.... those few societal morals, CB friends, and logistics alone make it very unlikely to happen. I'm not saying its impossible as there are some real slutty girls out there... but you'd have to be very lucky and have a lot of external factors that are out of control happen in your favor. Still any girl like that I'd feel sick after doing.... and honestly thats not what seduction is about.... its about getting the girl you want
Sounds like a healthy attitude. ONS's happen pretty often, but I have never had any.
Now I do agree with your sales chart in correlation to seduction in that you do want to capitalize on the high points... but for me its more like number close, date, kiss, then maybe working its way to sex.....
Sales chart? Isn't that a sine wave?
I honestly am able to number close and then use c&f to get the date but for some reason I seem to fall short after this..... I have hit a plateau that I need to learn how I can escalate from.
C&F is crap. Using CF is probably a part of your plateau. I highly recommend against it. Focus on being funny, or interesting or something. Avoid being insulting, stop telling women off until they really do something that deserves it.
Even if a chick does something that requires you to set limits, doesn't mean you shouldn't do so respectfully and maturely.
I think BB's biggest point - and I'm not sure you're catching this - is that one reason you're hitting a plateau is that you're burning bridges when they're at the low point of the wave. If, instead of burning the bridge, you just wait, she'll come around.
One time a chick wasn't interested, wasn't making time. I said ok, and I waited six months then called her again. We went out six times - but she had a bf and I didn't feel comfortable with that.
Lets take this last girl I told off for example... I met her... she told me she was seeing someone but I used c&f to over come it... got the digits... and was good on the phone by listening to her and being upbeat.. she never mentioned the BF again and always responded to my texts... albeit capriciously.....
That's cool. Good job. Just a thought, I would keep mentioning the boyfriend. You want her to be able to talk openly to you about it. Once it's off the table, that's when she starts flaking.
Now after we met up again she stopped responding to my texts and emails (at least till I used c&f again) and when I basically called her out on it
Stop doing that. Maybe I'm just misunderstanding from the context - what did you say?
she gave me the its me not you speech, mentioned how she isn't ready to date and was seeing someone blah blah.... I basically told her off hoping to at least get a truthful answer about what turned her off about me when we met... but she only got angry did the spin around... and never told me and flaked....
Of course she got angry man. She told you the truth, that she's seeing someone, and you didn't believe her. You were so convinced there is something wrong with you - there's not. I think a good exercise for you is this: anytime you have a setback in dating, come up with three ways it could have little to nothing to do with you.
When she said "it's not you" I think that's what she meant.
I only want to know so that I can learn and improve... but again I'm still stuck at this plateau clueless as to whats happening
Any advice based on this response?
Jayer, you rock man. And I appreciate your honesty. I think that the plateau is that you have so many negative beliefs about dating that part of you just says "stop, this is too much." Honestly, from what you're saying and how personally you take these things, I think that if you got into something more serious right now it would not be good for you. It would kind of tear you apart and traumatize you. For whatever reasons, you do not seem to have a healthy frame of mind that it takes to have positive experiences in dating. You're obviously very personable, obviously an attractive and likeable person.
I don't think women have a problem with you. Women seem to like you a lot. Look at your phone number percentage, that is actually way too good. I think you need to gain some weight and stop using that irresistible charm all the time
But seriously, I think part of you is pulling the brakes/instructing you to burn bridges - for your own benefit. If that's what part of you wants, I think you should take that very seriously.
That said, there is nothing wrong with continuing to meet women. It sounds like you're having fun. As long as you keep taking baby steps, you are going to get there. You are closer - and farther away - than you think. But you'll get there.
Another thing - you seem extremely self-conscious. I know from most of my reactions with people, I am thinking a lot about how do people perceive me, am I doing the right thing, am I acting like a Don Juan, am I using C&F, am I looking fat, am I dressed right. There comes a point in your development, where you just need to let go, to let the focus of your mind rest outside yourself. Focus on the interaction, on honesty. Honesty is key because the second you feel deceitful, it pulls you back into narcissism and pulls your attention away from the interaction.
It just doesn't sound like you're letting go and actually appreciating each conversation and interaction and kiss and phone call for itself. You want each thing to mean success or redemption when really, it is just a conversation with some girl.
Maybe I'm just using you as my mirror, but I see some of that in you. So if I'm wrong about you, just let me know. I know it's in me (my latest work on myself
). One thing about me, I am not very self-conscious in normal interactions. But the second it is sexual, I'm like how do I look, am I acting suave, how's my breath etc etc. I have not at all learned to just clear my mind and live.
It is not far from meditation. That's a great solution. If you want to break this plateau, meditate. Because all enjoyable things are like meditations, in that they are free of thought. You just do.
Practice just doing by meditating - this is another reason people recommend martial arts. I'm a chess player, so I know that I want all my interactions to be as well planned. But you know how well chess-players get women right...
Izza
