Is it true very few men in the world are "naturals" with women? It's like these guys, men, never had to learn "game", it was always second nature

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

What do you think? it seems a lot of dating coaches or pick up artists, seduction guru's, make it out to be that guys, men, are supposed or meant to have mentors or mentors in all of this.

 

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

This happens a lot. It's become more common in both the Millennial and Gen Z generations. This wasn't that common for Gen X, Boomers, Silents, and the GI Generation.



Yes, a man's childhood experiences will affect his social skills and his ability to seduce women and/or form extended relationships with them.





Two of my friends have notch counts in the triple digits. Neither one has spent time reading seduction manuals or watching YouTube content surrounding seduction.

another powerful statement i read from someone, who used to be in the dating/seduction industry, said:


"Do you think
centuries
ago
, generations
ago
, guys, men, needed a dating coach or pick up artist, for help in order to learn to know how to meet, talk to and interact, and attract women? Oh Hell No, this need for assistance and help has only emerged very recently"

 

[Manure Spherian]

You think he is right, correct?

I’m not sure who you are addressing.

But I’ll take a stab at it based on my experience growing up. The men who were so-called naturals likely did not learn anything special from older men. They had characteristics that made women lust over them.

Rich families
Violent streaks
Criminality
Gang membership
Good looks
Subculture involvement (eg, graffiti, rave, underground music)
Extreme popularity and social dominance
Thrill seeking

"Do you think
centuries
ago
, generations
ago
, guys, men, needed a dating coach or pick up artist, for help in order to learn to know how to meet, talk to and interact, and attract women? Oh Hell No, this need for assistance and help has only emerged very recently"

A misleading take. Men in the past had matchmaking, arranged or semi-arranged marriage, and social environments and institutions that made finding mates easy for ordinary men. They also had laws and social norms that kept female anti-social behavior in check.

Men in the past also weren’t expected to:
1. Be a clown or comedian.
2.Get the female psyche,” as one female poster said.
3. Cover themselves in tattoos.
4. Buy a boat.
5. Ride a motorcycle.
6. Earn millions while not having a job.
7. Do steroids.
7. Spit game.
8. Act like women.
9. Have an “edge”.
10. Be a criminal.
11. Be a gang member.
12. Have a goofy or effeminate steez.

Even up until my late boomer uncle’s heyday, most men could get women by being somewhat normal, not looking like a bum, and being employed.

 

[MatureDJ]

Men in the past also weren’t expected to:
1. Be a clown or comedian.

Jestermaxx

Jestermaxx or jestermaxxing is a term used in the incel community, most commonly to denote a man acting in an entertaining, amusing, histrionic or dramatic manner...

incels.wiki

7. Do steroids.

Gymcel

A gymcel is an incel who works out, believing that a muscular body will compensate for an unattractive face. Gymcels will often spend countless hours in the gym...

incels.wiki

Even up until my late boomer uncle’s heyday, most men could get women by being somewhat normal, not looking like a bum, and being employed.

it's OVER for PostBoomerCels.

 

[MatureDJ]

This happens a lot. It's become more common in both the Millennial and Gen Z generations. This wasn't that common for Gen X, Boomers, Silents, and the GI Generation.

Goodness, anyone in the GI Generation with a stripe and all 4 limbs had poon regularly paraded in front of him to choose (of course, he had to put a ring on it, but still) - except for ogres like Marty, of course:

 

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

I’m not sure who you are addressing.

But I’ll take a stab at it based on my experience growing up. The men who were so-called naturals likely did not learn anything special from older men. They had characteristics that made women lust over them.

Rich families
Violent streaks
Criminality
Gang membership
Good looks
Subculture involvement (eg, graffiti, rave, underground music)
Extreme popularity and social dominance
Thrill seeking


A misleading take. Men in the past had matchmaking, arranged or semi-arranged marriage, and social environments and institutions that made finding mates easy for ordinary men. They also had laws and social norms that kept female anti-social behavior in check.

Men in the past also weren’t expected to:
1. Be a clown or comedian.
2.Get the female psyche,” as one female poster said.
3. Cover themselves in tattoos.
4. Buy a boat.
5. Ride a motorcycle.
6. Earn millions while not having a job.
7. Do steroids.
7. Spit game.
8. Act like women.
9. Have an “edge”.
10. Be a criminal.
11. Be a gang member.
12. Have a goofy or effeminate steez.

Even up until my late boomer uncle’s heyday, most men could get women by being somewhat normal, not looking like a bum, and being employed.

so in other words, approaching women back then? generations, centuries ago, approaching was not neccessary back then as it is today? men didn't have to learn game back then?

 

[Manure Spherian]

so in other words, approaching women back then? generations, centuries ago, approaching was not neccessary back then as it is today? men didn't have to learn game back then?

Right.

 

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

Right.

i think your onto something, could have sworn i read something like that in a book that went over the history of that, and this video, in the beginning, kinda goes into good detail about what you said:

 

[Divorced w 3]

You can be born with talent but a coach always helps. Let the board coach you.

 

[zekko]

This. I think childhood is probably the biggest factor.

Childhood and attractiveness level, I'd guess.

 

[Scaramouche]

Hello H8,
Some of the greatest Don Juans I've met had older Sisters...It helps!
Another sub group that box above their weight are short unprepossessing Guys who adopted the role of Court Jester to avoid bullying at School.

 

[MatureDJ]

Thats hilarious. I actually wish I went to an all boys school,

It was junior high that messed me up. Why? Because I was new to the school and because of the girls. At that age the boy‘s hormones is going crazy for the girls and he will do anything. They tried to blind me, stab me, and I scarred up my face for life over the girls. So an all boys school is a actually a good thing,

Fine, I'll give Doc Brown a call, and we can go back and switch experiences.

 

[MatureDJ]

Another sub group that box above their weight are short unprepossessing Guys who adopted the role of Court Jester to avoid bullying at School.

Yes, they at least are able to remain in the cool social circle that way; however, nowadays, even top-level social circles always have a bunch of fat chicks, and the jester & fat chick are considered a tag-team clown show.

 

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

Right.

just a guess, but my assumption is, centuries ago, generations ago, it was easier for men to attract women or get girlfriends/wives back then, as in, shyer or quiet, introverted, socially awkward, socially inept men, had an easier time getting girlfriends/wives back then.

 

[Manure Spherian]

just a guess, but my assumption is, centuries ago, generations ago, it was easier for men to attract women or get girlfriends/wives back then, as in, shyer or quiet, introverted, socially awkward, socially inept men, had an easier time getting girlfriends/wives back then.

More like up to four decades ago, I believe.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

But most men and dads still don't know how to raise proper men since after the start of the industrial revolution where boys were left with mom in the house and with women in the school.

One of the reasons I became a stay-at-home dad.

 

[kleathe1]

another powerful statement i read from someone, who used to be in the dating/seduction industry, said:


"Do you think
centuries
ago
, generations
ago
, guys, men, needed a dating coach or pick up artist, for help in order to learn to know how to meet, talk to and interact, and attract women? Oh Hell No, this need for assistance and help has only emerged very recently"

I disagree, it may not have been a career path such as a blacksmith, shoemaker, etc., but I guarantee guys sitting around shooting the bull back in the day talked about women and the things that worked and didn't work. Sure, the dating coach industry is new, but the concept of men learning the skills from other men is not new.

 

[RangerMIke]

There is no such thing as 'a natural' all behavior is learned. Men that appear to be good with women learned this because they grew up in an environment where they observed family members and friends that had attractive characteristics. This can be learned, but it is very much like someone that learns a language they grew up with verse a person that studies a new language.

Things learned in childhood become inherent traits... if you were raised by a single mom (who BTW hated your father) sisters and aunts... surrounding by women, how to behave like an attractive man will not be intuitive. You can learn... but it is harder... and the best advice I can give is keep practicing... get experience... learn from mistakes... and do not let failure get inside your head, because the difference between a man that is good with women and those that are not is that men that have success with women do not give a fvck if something goes sideways... they move on quick to the next one.

 

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

There is no such thing as 'a natural' all behavior is learned. Men that appear to be good with women learned this because they grew up in an environment where they observed family members and friends that had attractive characteristics. This can be learned, but it is very much like someone that learns a language they grew up with verse a person that studies a new language.

Things learned in childhood become inherent traits... if you were raised by a single mom (who BTW hated your father) sisters and aunts... surrounding by women, how to behave like an attractive man will not be intuitive. You can learn... but it is harder... and the best advice I can give is keep practicing... get experience... learn from mistakes... and do not let failure get inside your head, because the difference between a man that is good with women and those that are not is that men that have success with women do not give a fvck if something goes sideways... they move on quick to the next one.

reason why a lot of people think naturals do exist, is because, those are the guys, men, who never had to seek help from a dating coach or pick up artist, seduction coach, or never had to go on a forum like this or never had to read a book on seduction, dating, in their whole lives, they just always knew how to successfully attract women, get girlfriends easily.

 

[Learning Curve]

Its like these guys, men, they never needed to seek help from a dating coach or pick up artist, they never needed a mentor or a wingman, guidance on this, they likely never had to read a single book or blog post, forum, on seduction, "game", dating advice in their whole lives, they just knew how to successfully interact with and approach, talk to, attract, court, seduce, and take the lead from day one.

I get more angry and upset whenever people say "comparison is the thief of joy, or don't compare yourself to others", that only adds fuel to fire in terms of resentment, because i'm sure tons of people have always wondered the why or cause of mysteries. Another reason, and i'm sure tons of guys, men in the world, have feelings of envy and resentment towards these type of guys, men, is because they never had to struggle or never had to go through any pain or adversity, never dealt with any awkwardness or never got labeled creepy or weird, never once made a woman feel uncomfortable when approaching or interacting with them, never had to put in any blood sweat and tears, they got to grow up having a normal youth, got to experience being sexually active or being in love very young, in the prime of their lives

I'm referring to guys, men, who got to experience having a girlfriend and losing their virginity in their teenage years, they just seemed to figure it out very early in life, its like as if, knowing how to talk to and interact with girls, flirting with them, getting a girlfriend, has always been common sense for them, or they just somehow learned it right away, i don't know how else to describe it or put it into words, i guess thats what people describe or refer to as "naturals".

Meanwhile, tons of guys, men, go into their 20s or more, and are either still virgins or never had GF's before, and still just don't have the game or attracting women figured out yet, getting a girlfriend is still hard for them, they feel they still lack the correct and proper social skills or flirting and social behaviors, courting skills, guys need to know or learn in order to attract women, get a girlfriend, etc.

To sum it up, why do you think some or many guys are naturals at this, as in, they either learn or figure it out very early in life like i described or many guys, men, not until much later in life or never at all? Are guys supposed to learn this stuff from family members or friends, etc.?

Are very few men in the world naturals? did most guys have to go through a journey or training, practice, trial and error, or get help from a mentor or help from people in some way or form?

I'm sure for many people, such as this article by Girls Chase, its like for these guys, i'm assuming some, not most, they never had to learn it, they just knew how to ever since they started liking or being attracted to women:https://www.girlschase.com/article/males-every-species-must-learn-game-mate

Or do you think a guys childhood has an effect on his his "game", ability to relate and connect with women has an affect on this too? This article states that its amazing what a healthy childhood can do. https://goodmenproject.com/featured...-naturals-with-women-and-others-are-clueless/

Overall, would you say Naturals are a very few percentage of men in the world, very few men in the world are like that?

I don't believe in naturals.

I believe in experience, persuasion and adaptability.

If you can be a chameleon and adapt your personality to the changes you find your self in with different people or women then you can be a master persuader.

Some people might have natural skills and be more natural with women but in my experience all of this people either had a ton of failures or experiments as I like to call them as I don't like the word "failure".

Don't always look at one side of things and think that that's it and they are "Natural" there is always the second side of things to any circumstance.