Is it even worth it for a guy like me to try with making moves in-person?

[BackInTheGame78]

I know. My refusal to pick a venue for our 2nd date (even after she asked me twice) was likely the main reason.

Ok, so let's say (hypothetically) I picked a venue, so the woman was willing to let the failure to get a joke slide. Even if I managed to get a 2nd date, I'd fail to understand more and more jokes as time went on. Eventually the woman would stop letting my inability to get jokes slide.

That has nothing to do with autism, that has to do with an inability to lead as a man.

You always lead interactions. Always.

If she is talking about something that you don't have interest in, change the subject.

If she asks you something you aren't interested in talking about say something like "I'll get back to that in a minute, but first I want to hear about the time you blah blah blah..." Then simply never return to the topic you don't want to talk about.

You pick the day, the location, the time, and when you get there you lead her to where you want to go...no hesitation, no standing looking around with uncertainty. You move in a straight line and she follows.

That's how you lead interactions with women. If you want to start having more success it sounds like that is something you need to work on.

Having autism isn't an excuse...especially if you are actually getting dates. It simply means you have to work harder at certain things than others. Just like some people have to work harder to understand math or foreign languages while others have it come easy.

That's not an excuse to suck at it, it's simply a lack of effort and work on your part to become better at it. In other words, you only want it if it comes easy, if you have to work at it, you'd rather make up excuses.

There are people who were not good at math in grade school that became math PhDs. Why? Because they worked hard to become better and improve. Same thing you could do but first you have to throw away all the excuses you keep coming up with as crutches.

Stop with all the words and why you can't do it and start going out and working at improving and start figuring out ways you can do it.

All your excuses are tools of incompetence used to build bridges to nowhere and monuments of nothingness, and those who use them seldom specialize in anything else.

 

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

In addition to being on the spectrum, I've been told (but not by a professional) that I have agoraphobia (in other words, I avoid situations that could make me uncomfortable or embarrassed).

I'd say my ASD and my agoraphobia both contribute to my lady struggles. My ASD makes it hard for me to read a woman's clues. And even in the rare occassion I am able to pick up on clues, I still refrain from shooting my shot (Because I'd be humiliated, and feel like the world's biggest idiot, if I were to get turned down. And then there would be the uncomfortable aspect of having to run into her post-rejection. Again, agoraphobes avoid situations that could lead to us being uncomfortable)

yeah, men with autism and obviously being unable to read womans social cues will unfortuneately put a man at sad risk of making a woman uncomfortable or being perceived as the creepy weird guy sadly

 

[BaronOfHair]

I'd say my ASD and my agoraphobia both contribute to my lady struggles. My ASD makes it hard for me to read a woman's clues. And even in the rare occassion I am able to pick up on clues, I still refrain from shooting my shot (Because I'd be humiliated, and feel like the world's biggest idiot, if I were to get turned down. And then there would be the uncomfortable aspect of having to run into her post-rejection. Again, agoraphobes avoid situations that could lead to us being uncomfortable)

Labels are of less importance than what we do. You're still desperately concocting rationalizations for not spending more time out in the fresh air and sunlight, among not just women, but your fellow humans

 

[BaronOfHair]

Exactly how is this different from 95% of guys?

Most "normal" guys have no idea either

OP is eerily akin to many website owners and university DEI coordinators these days. Publicly denounced for firing, expelling, or suspending someone for reasons which are patently unreasonable, they retort: "We don't sanction anyone. Those who are problematic sanction themselves, by saying or doing something that we have a knee-jerk reaction to"

That EVERYONE has knee- jerk reactions to external events sometimes, and that learning to not simply give in to those(Ex. Resisting the urge to fire, expell, or suspend someone, just because your fee-fees were momentarily awry)separates us from the animals, is lost upon many of us moderns

 

[BaronOfHair]

OP, today's older women are not the same as 30 years ago. 50 is indeed the new 40; lots of older women (a minority but a significant one) have good genes and have taken good care of themselves. Also, they tend to be more mature (obv), intelligent and sophisticated and may be more willing to look any neurodivergent issues. However, there is skin sag and they tend to be more manipulative and often there are insecurity and lowered sex-drive. The key for OP is identifying ones not only expressing interest but also ones with a sexual and confident vibe.

300 posts reaming OP about his preferences? FFS. People have different tastes and OP has a reasonable logical argument for his beyond mere proclivity. He's not banging his Mom and society has changed how they view older women - younger men relationships. If you haven't noticed this, you've got your head in the sand. That being said OP, it's still a good idea to keep your eye out for same-age and younger chicks who express interest.

The egoism on this board knows no bounds, as usual. Lmao.

Let's all hope and pray that OP doesn't start filling his veins with Black Tar Heroin also. There will be folks on here who respond "Relax, bro: It's not as bad as meth", rather than encouraging him to not treat the one body he has so poorly

 

[BaronOfHair]

I have an update.

It was recommended to me (on SoSuave) that I inform my therapist about my phobia of pregnancy (to explain my preference for older women).

I informed him of my pregnancy phobia at yesterday's session. I followed with "That's why my ideal woman is 45 to early 50s. Young enough that I still find her attractive, yet old enough I don't fear pregnancy."

Next, I acknowledged that I'm aware pregnancy is technically possible in that age bracket.

My therapist's response? He said even though pregnancy is possible in that age bracket, the odds are 1 in a million. That was really all he had to say about my pregnancy phobia (and how it impacts my age preference). He never suggested I get over my phobia, nor did he suggest I focus on broads in my own age bracket.

"Acknowledging the client's autonomy" and "being non-judgmental" is currently all the rage in the mental health industry, thus your shrink isn't likely to say outright "That's insane. Start pursuing women your own age or younger". That's where forums like SS come in handy... We're not bound by such constraints

 

[BackInTheGame78]

"Acknowledging the client's autonomy" and "being non-judgmental" is currently all the rage in the mental health industry, thus your shrink isn't likely to say outright "That's insane. Start pursuing women your own age or younger". That's where forums like SS come in handy... We're not bound by such constraints

At some point the therapist has to ensure his clients come back for more. Shutting down every idea as being nonsensical would make them leave.

 

[BaronOfHair]

Shutting down every idea as being nonsensical would make them leave.

For OP's sake, I hope his shrink has amounted to him words similar to those between 3:25-3:50

Awful truth is, we have to be receptive to aid, once we've solicited it. I'm at a loss as to what's worse...

The fact that OP continues to "Yes, but..."every last ounce of counsel he's received on this thread, encouraging him to get off his fixation on women decades his senior

OR

The fact that 1-2 folks here have actually encouraged him to keep going on as he has, with one recently remarking "Go ahead, bro... 50 is the new 40", despite that poisonous lie having been thoroughly obliterated back in the late 2000s


I might share your suspicion that this has all been next-level trolling, if I(And likely most of us)wasn't encountering at least a few dozen folks who operate in a fashion similar to OP on an almost daily basis nowadays. Yes, folks like this have always been among us, nonetheless they really seem to be on the increase these days

 

[BaronOfHair]

yeah, men with autism and obviously being unable to read womans social cues will unfortuneately put a man at sad risk of making a woman uncomfortable or being perceived as the creepy weird guy sadly

Guys who can "naturally" read social cues of any kind are less common than Baathists who didn't promptly join Al Qaeda in Iraq after the invasion, then go on to behead a journalist or 11. Damn near all of us have to research and practice this stuff

 

[GoodMan32]

That has nothing to do with autism, that has to do with an inability to lead as a man.

You always lead interactions. Always.

If she is talking about something that you don't have interest in, change the subject.

If she asks you something you aren't interested in talking about say something like "I'll get back to that in a minute, but first I want to hear about the time you blah blah blah..." Then simply never return to the topic you don't want to talk about.

You pick the day, the location, the time, and when you get there you lead her to where you want to go...no hesitation, no standing looking around with uncertainty. You move in a straight line and she follows.

That's how you lead interactions with women. If you want to start having more success it sounds like that is something you need to work on.

Having autism isn't an excuse...especially if you are actually getting dates. It simply means you have to work harder at certain things than others. Just like some people have to work harder to understand math or foreign languages while others have it come easy.

That's not an excuse to suck at it, it's simply a lack of effort and work on your part to become better at it. In other words, you only want it if it comes easy, if you have to work at it, you'd rather make up excuses.

There are people who were not good at math in grade school that became math PhDs. Why? Because they worked hard to become better and improve. Same thing you could do but first you have to throw away all the excuses you keep coming up with as crutches.

Stop with all the words and why you can't do it and start going out and working at improving and start figuring out ways you can do it.

All your excuses are tools of incompetence used to build bridges to nowhere and monuments of nothingness, and those who use them seldom specialize in anything else.

Good information about the man taking the lead. I will keep that in mind.

One thing I should mention: It's sort of a stretch to say I get dates. My last date was nearly a year ago. And before then, I hadn't been on a date since 2018.

 

[GoodMan32]

yeah, men with autism and obviously being unable to read womans social cues will unfortuneately put a man at sad risk of making a woman uncomfortable or being perceived as the creepy weird guy sadly

Yep, which explains why in high school, even classmates I had little to no contact with viewed me as the creepy guy.

 

[GoodMan32]

OP is eerily akin to many website owners and university DEI coordinators these days. Publicly denounced for firing, expelling, or suspending someone for reasons which are patently unreasonable, they retort: "We don't sanction anyone. Those who are problematic sanction themselves, by saying or doing something that we have a knee-jerk reaction to"

That EVERYONE has knee- jerk reactions to external events sometimes, and that learning to not simply give in to those(Ex. Resisting the urge to fire, expell, or suspend someone, just because your fee-fees were momentarily awry)separates us from the animals, is lost upon many of us moderns

I must say, I don't know where this analogy came from. Without delving into politics, let's just say I am 100% opposed to firing an employee for wrongthink.

 

[GoodMan32]

Let's all hope and pray that OP doesn't start filling his veins with Black Tar Heroin also. There will be folks on here who respond "Relax, bro: It's not as bad as meth", rather than encouraging him to not treat the one body he has so poorly

You're seriously comparing older women to heroin? Yikes.

 

[GoodMan32]

"Acknowledging the client's autonomy" and "being non-judgmental" is currently all the rage in the mental health industry, thus your shrink isn't likely to say outright "That's insane. Start pursuing women your own age or younger". That's where forums like SS come in handy... We're not bound by such constraints

Obviously he wouldn't say "That's insane."

If he really thought I should work on the pregnancy phobia though, he could at least say stuff like:

"Have you thought about getting a vasectomy?"

Or he might cite statistics of how effective condoms and birth control are.

Or "Would you like to work on overcoming your pregnancy phobia?"

Or he might ask me to elaborate on what exactly it is that terrifies me about pregnancy.

 

[GoodMan32]

At some point the therapist has to ensure his clients come back for more. Shutting down every idea as being nonsensical would make them leave.

It's a double-edged sword.

If a therapist shuts down everything the client says, the client will stop coming.

But on the other hand, if the client isn't getting better, the client will also stop coming (because the client will think the therapist is ineffective).

What a fine line therapists need to straddle.

 

[GoodMan32]

For OP's sake, I hope his shrink has amounted to him words similar to those between 3:25-3:50

Awful truth is, we have to be receptive to aid, once we've solicited it. I'm at a loss as to what's worse...

The fact that OP continues to "Yes, but..."every last ounce of counsel he's received on this thread, encouraging him to get off his fixation on women decades his senior

OR

The fact that 1-2 folks here have actually encouraged him to keep going on as he has, with one recently remarking "Go ahead, bro... 50 is the new 40", despite that poisonous lie having been thoroughly obliterated back in the late 2000s


I might share your suspicion that this has all been next-level trolling, if I(And likely most of us)wasn't encountering at least a few dozen folks who operate in a fashion similar to OP on an almost daily basis nowadays. Yes, folks like this have always been among us, nonetheless they really seem to be on the increase these days

You're right; I'm still lustful of older women.

I've acknowledged certain useful tips, however (like the fact the man is supposed to lead).

I even said I'd consider a young woman if she threw herself at me.

The "50 is the new 40" thing being debunked in the late 2000s (in other words, 2008-09ish) isn't relevant to 2024. That was 15 years ago.

 

[BaronOfHair]

You're seriously comparing older women to heroin? Yikes.

Your determination to remain fixated on bedding them, despite admitting that you already recognize intellectually that

-This is mostly rooted in your fear of getting a woman pregnant, not due to your not finding beautiful young women arousing

-Older women generally aren't interested in guys decades their junior, and even when they are, Moore and Kutcher's diasterous union is pretty much the norm, not an anomaly


Is pretty similar to an addiction. You know what you're doing is aberrant and likely to not end well, yet you continue you to do it anyway

 

[GoodMan32]

Your determination to remain fixated on bedding them, despite admitting that you already recognize intellectually that

-This is mostly rooted in your fear of getting a woman pregnant, not due to your not finding beautiful young women arousing

-Older women generally aren't interested in guys decades their junior, and even when they are, Moore and Kutcher's diasterous union is pretty much the norm, not an anomaly


Is pretty similar to an addiction. You know what you're doing is aberrant and likely to not end well, yet you continue you to do it anyway

Even though I find young women arousing, their attitudes tend to be bad.

Plus, after bedding so many older women, I've grown to like the fact an older woman's body isn't as perfect as a young woman's. Makes the experience feel more real. Sex with a young woman is like having sex with a Barbie doll.

I've also mentioned how, even though an older woman's body isn't as nice as a young woman's, it's still pretty nice before the age of 54 or so.

Then perhaps most importantly: The age gap between myself and a 45 year old is rapidly narrowing. Feels like just yesterday I was the 23 year old having an affair with a 45 year old married woman. Now I'm thirty-three.

(I mention 45 because that's the cutoff for when I no longer fear pregnancy)

Additionally, the fact age gap relationships aren't likely to be serious is a good thing. I don't want a serious relationship.

 

[BaronOfHair]

Obviously he wouldn't say "That's insane."

That so many therapists these days are blindly going along with the fad that is "Validating clients's lived experience", instead of being forthright in their communication ("Dude, this is real life, not White Palace or How Stella Got Her Groove Back. Start pursuing women your own age, and stop manufacturing these asinine justifications for not doing so")is nothing short of a tragedy. Our current era in mental health is a tragedy on par with the Represed Memory craze of The 80s


"If he really thought I should work on the pregnancy phobia though, he could at least say stuff like..."

Stop relying on your shrink to lead the treatment all by his lonesome. As the consumer, it's your role to say what's ailing you, and what you want instead... In this case, to get past your crippling fear of pursing women your own age and younger, and to eliminate your obsessive terror over impregnating a woman

 

[GoodMan32]

That so many therapists these days are blindly going along with the fad that is "Validating clients's lived experience", instead of being forthright in their communication ("Dude, this is real life, not White Palace or How Stella Got Her Groove Back. Start pursuing women your own age, and stop manufacturing these asinine justifications for not doing so")is nothing short of a tragedy. Our current era in mental health is a tragedy on par with the Represed Memory craze of The 80s


"If he really thought I should work on the pregnancy phobia though, he could at least say stuff like..."

Stop relying on your shrink to lead the treatment all by his lonesome. As the consumer, it's your role to say what's ailing you, and what you want instead... In this case, to get past your crippling fear of pursing women your own age and younger, and to eliminate your obsessive terror over impregnating a woman

In all fairness, I prefaced my comment (about preferring an older woman because of pregnancy fears) with "I've been hesitant to mention this because I don't want this fear to become the main focus of the therapy."

(There are lots of other issues we're working on)