Divorced Women and The Baggage They Carry

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Frank2500

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I can count the number of women who I had positive experiences with in the past and who were between the ages of 20-25. That number would probably be less than five. At the most, maybe four. And out of those four, many were women from foreign countries-the Caribbean, African, etc. The most positive experience I ever had was with a 29 year old woman. I met her at a mall and I was physically attracted to her. I talked to her and persuaded her to give me her number, although she did mention that a lot of the guys she'd met in the past didn't call her when she gave her number out. At the time, I was 27. She was a teacher, and it felt good for once to come across a woman in that age group with whom I could have an intellectual discussion.



You guys need to look at the whole picture here. Could location be part of the reason why I haven't had the best experiences with most women 20-25 especially? Perhaps...I'm not sure, but I doubt it. I live in Philadelphia and although it's called the City of Brotherly Love, people can be very rude. But that's not an excuse because I've experienced the same sort of crap with women in the same age group in other cities. If a woman doesn't appreciate being approached with class and respect, that's her problem. I don't have a rude bone in me, so if the women I have met in the past have preferred men who talk to them as if they are sluts and sex objects and that's what they want to hear, more power to them as well. The irony in all of this is that most of these women, after they get used for sex and abused multiple times and become tired goods, many start looking for men like me to settle down with and be fathers to their children. Why in the world would I want to settle down with such women then?


If you grow up not feeling accepted by many women in your age group and during your early to mid-twenties in college you were often passed over for the so-called thugs and athletes and the supposed rebels who could barely write a paper or construct a sentence, those events are gonna impact your life somehow. Dating in this country is so superficial and that is unfortunate. There are people like me out there who would appreciate simply being accepted for who we truly are as people. I'm at an age where I can't be spending my time worrying about a 23-25 year old woman for example complaining that "she didn't like my game." Give me a break. I agree with the poster who did say that dating is frustrating. And it is certainly unfair, because it isn't fair to everyone. It's just amazing to me that these days, many of these so-called HBs or hot, younger women who normally didn't give me the time of day in the past give me so much attention once I walk into a room, a mall, a store, etc., and even when they are with their boyfriends. If I hadn't worked as hard as I have to improve on my physical build, would they have been interested in me under normal circumstances? Absolutely not. Now all of a sudden, they look at me as if they are hypnotized. They think I should talk to them because now they perceive me as this muscular dude. People need to learn to be humble. No matter how pretty or handsome a woman or man maybe, that doesn't give you the reason to treat people like sh-t. It's not right.


So guys, all I'm asking for is that you give me a break with attempting to throw the "lack of confidence" label on me, ok? Because that has absolutely nothing to do with this post. When I feel attracted to a woman, I go right up and talk to her. What I'm saying however, is that women in their early twenties are no longer my priority. I'm tired of the games, tired of all the superficiality and shallowness, and I just want a mate who is normal. Let the superficial be with the superficial. I am not one of them. If a woman doesn't appreciate a guy who can have an intellectually stimulating conversation and finds him unattractive because he doesn't come across as a rough neck, I'm definitely not the kind og guy for her, and I have no regrets. Absoultely none.
 

Vulpine

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Frank2500 said:
To Rollo Tomassi and the other guys on here who keep misreading my post even though I try to be as articulate as possible: Confidence is not my problem and I'm not afraid of rejection. This has nothing to do with game. We all look for different things in mates. Those of you who desire women to have a series of one-night stands with and who want to sleep with as many of them as possible...more power to you. Not all men are looking for that. I have no problem with confidence and I have no fear talking to women within my age group. But you guys aren't listening to me.
I'm not mis-reading anything. You aren't the problem, Frank. Older women and the fuxed up attitudes of younger women are the problem.

In one hand, you have the older woman: may be decent looking, may be good in the sack, but... "Divorced Women and The Baggage They Carry" makes them a timebomb, a booby-trap set to sucker in AFC's and destroy their happiness and waste their time. They may seem like an oasis, but they are just a mirage. We are trying to prevent you from finding out the hard way.

On the other hand, there are the younger women. Angsty and mislead by society, they unknowingly follow a prescribed regimen of self-distruction to impress their peers. "Everyone is doing it. Look what's on MTV!" They are like little kids who need to be taught. They need to see the truth, and that truth is that by acting like princess barbies, they put off the very "quality men" they need to the point where they consider doing foolish things; foolish things like date older, divorced women with kids.

The fact of the matter is, you are irritated. In your irritation, you are looking for alternatives. Older women aren't a good alternative. Patience and determination is required here.

You aren't heeding our warnings, so by all means, Frank, give it a whirl. Do yourself a favor, though. Don't come back here and whine and rant about how you wasted months or years of your life on a woman who never deserved you, your time, or your attention in the first place.
----------------
If you ever go prospecting for gold, you'll find that you will have to sift through a lot of rubble before you find a nugget. However, you will find lots and lots of "fools gold" (iron pyrite). Iron pyrite has little value aside from "nice to look at". It's not called "fools gold" for no reason. Many a prospector has thought what they found was gold, some even dedicated their time to collecting up large amounts of it... only later to feel like a fool for wasting their time, resources, and energy on something so worthless. And we men here are urging you to keep looking for the nuggets, not settle for the fools gold, regardless of your frustrations.

Take some advice from your fellow prospectors who have wasted their time and have been fooled: older women shine like gold, but, are worthless to you. You may not think so now, but you'll soon find out.

Hey, this gold thing isn't a bad analogy. Let me further sell you on the value of gold. Hit iron pyrite with a hammer. It will crush into dust. You can't shape it to your needs. Hit gold with a hammer...

Right.

Gold will bend and flex and take on whatever shape you need it to be. Gold is malleable,trainable, which accounts for much of it's value. Young women are gold. Keep in mind that you'll have to sift through a LOT of rubble to find it, though. I'm not attracted to rubble at all, either, Frank. Keep prospecting.
 

Frank2500

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Re: One More Thing, Please...

I can count the number of women who I had positive experiences with in the past and who were between the ages of 20-25. That number would probably be less than five. At the most, maybe four. And out of those four, many were women from foreign countries-the Caribbean, African, etc. The most positive experience I ever had was with a 29 year old woman. I met her at a mall and I was attracted to her. I talked to her and persuaded her to give me her number, although she did mention that a lot of the guys she'd met in the past didn't call her when she gave her number out. At the time, I was 27. She was a teacher, and it felt good for once to come across a woman in that age group with whom I could have an intellectual discussion.



You guys need to look at the whole picture here. Could location be part of the reason why I haven't had the best experiences with most women 20-25 especially? Perhaps...I'm not sure, but I doubt it. I live in Philadelphia and although it's called the City of Brotherly Love, people can be very rude. But that's not an excuse because I've experienced the same sort of crap with women in the same age group in other cities. If a woman doesn't appreciate being approached with class and respect, that's her problem. I don't have a rude bone in me, so if the women I have met in the past have preferred men who talk to them as if they are sluts and sex objects and that's what they want to hear, more power to them as well. The irony in all of this is that most of these women, after they get used for sex and abused multiple times and become tired goods, many start looking for men like me to settle down with and be fathers to their children. Why in the world would I want to settle down with such women then?


If you grow up not feeling accepted by many women in your age group and during your early to mid-twenties in college you were often passed over for the so-called thugs and athletes and the supposed rebels who could barely write a paper or construct a sentence, those events are gonna impact your life somehow. Dating in this country is so superficial and that is unfortunate. There are people like me out there who would appreciate simply being accepted for who we truly are as people. I'm at an age where I can't be spending my time worrying about a 23-25 year old woman for example complaining that "she didn't like my game." Give me a break. I agree with the poster who did say that dating is frustrating. And it is certainly unfair, because it isn't fair to everyone. It's just amazing to me that these days, many of these so-called HBs or hot, younger women who normally didn't give me the time of day in the past give me so much attention once I walk into a room, a mall, a store, etc., and even when they are with their boyfriends. If I hadn't worked as hard as I have to improve on my physical build, would they have been interested in me under normal circumstances? Absolutely not. Now all of a sudden, they look at me as if they are hypnotized. They think I should talk to them because now they perceive me as this muscular dude. People need to learn to be humble. No matter how pretty or handsome a woman or man maybe, that doesn't give you the reason to treat people like sh-t. It's not right.



So guys, all I'm asking for is that you give me a break with attempting to throw the "lack of confidence" label on me, ok? Because that has absolutely nothing to do with this post. Don't try to use me as a sacrifice to score cheap points. As we all know, anyone can choose to represent themselves anyhow they wish on a computer because there is often no means to verify the accuracy of statements made. When I feel attracted to a woman, I go right up and talk to her. What I'm saying however, is that women in their early twenties are no longer my priority. I'm tired of the games, tired of all the superficiality and shallowness, and I just want a mate who is normal. Let the superficial be with the superficial. I am not one of them. If a woman doesn't appreciate a guy who can have an intellectually stimulating conversation and finds him unattractive because he doesn't come across as a rough neck, I'm definitely not the kind og guy for her, and I have no regrets. Absoultely none.
 

WestCoaster

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Frank, you started the thread and asked the questions. I don't think you wanted to hear our answers.

I believe your mind was made up before you posted: you wanted to date the two women you listed. If so, go ahead. But don't bash us for giving answers you asked for. Some of us have dated the type of women you're seeking.

Your mind is made up and you keep defending it ... have at it. When you get played like a fiddle, don't say we didn't tell you.

And for God's sake, again, do NOT listen to women for relationship/dating advice.
 

decades

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you are trying to be a savior, a white knight a rescuer. look for healthy sane stable problem and drama free women around your own age. crack the code why its not working with healthy stable younger women. Don't run in the other direction. There is no reason for you at your age to be the rescuer. You are attracted to underdogs and wounded doves. That could lead you to a life of misery if you don't understand this tendency in yourself.
 

At this point you probably have a woman (or multiple women) chasing you around, calling you all the time, wanting to be with you. So let's talk about how to KEEP a woman interested in you once you have her. This is BIG! There is nothing worse than getting dumped by a woman that you really, really like.

Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.

Frank2500

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Re:

For the millionth time folks, I'm not trying to be anyone's rescuer. I haven't even made up my mind regarding those two women yet. It's unlikely that if I were to pursue anything with either of them, it would be more than a casual relationship. I haven't said that I am looking for marriage. I just want you guys to understand my frustration.


And to the poster called Persistent Exaction, I'm glad that you have accurately analyzed the manner in which many young American women behave today. It's just very disappointing and shameful how a lot of them carry themselves. But like I said, women 20-29 are no longer my priority. I'm not saying that I've given up on them per say. What I'm saying is I've reached a point based on experiences running through 11 years (if that's not persistence, I wonder what is) where I'm just fared up and tired with all the crap. These so-called young women today are the same ones who would be complaining about the supposed lack of good men in the future. Yet when the so-called good men came around, they didn't want to give many of them a chance. Let them keep on chasing their bad boys and thugs. More power to them.
 

wayword

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Frank2500 said:
I can count the number of women who I had positive experiences with in the past and who were between the ages of 20-25. That number would probably be less than five. At the most, maybe four. And out of those four, many were women from foreign countries-the Caribbean, African, etc.

Dating in this country is so superficial and that is unfortunate. There are people like me out there who would appreciate simply being accepted for who we truly are as people. I'm at an age where I can't be spending my time worrying about a 23-25 year old woman for example complaining that "she didn't like my game."

What I'm saying however, is that women in their early twenties are no longer my priority. I'm tired of the games, tired of all the superficiality and shallowness, and I just want a mate who is normal.
You basically have 2 choices in this country:

1) Sport-phuck young stuck-up byches
2) Sport-phuck old single moms

Just remember that #2 is the same as #1 - just older and having to be nicer now cuz they are older and have more baggage. It's not by choice, though - but an act they are forced to put up.
 

WestCoaster

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Frank2500 said:
Let them keep on chasing their bad boys and thugs. More power to them.
Got news for you, most single mommies chase men like this like no tomorrow, despite being divorced once, twice, three times from just such characters. Leopards don't change their spots.

You have a choice as noted here: date baggage-less gals who may or may not be nutty; or date single mommy's who may or may not be psycho.

You're getting the same product, just older and more bitter. You're eyeballing the wrong young and old women.
 

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Frank2500 said:
I can count the number of women who I had positive experiences with in the past and who were between the ages of 20-25. That number would probably be less than five. At the most, maybe four. And out of those four, many were women from foreign countries-the Caribbean, African, etc. The most positive experience I ever had was with a 29 year old woman. I met her at a mall and I was attracted to her. I talked to her and persuaded her to give me her number, although she did mention that a lot of the guys she'd met in the past didn't call her when she gave her number out. At the time, I was 27. She was a teacher, and it felt good for once to come across a woman in that age group with whom I could have an intellectual discussion.



You guys need to look at the whole picture here.
No, YOU need to look at the whole picture here.

Personally, I was 5 for 5 with older women being a negative experience. On the other hand, there were actually SOME positive experiences with the younger women I've been with.

Then I found this site.

Since then, ALL the older women (1 :D), negative experience. Jeez, ya think? ALL the younger women? Positive experiences.

With the older woman, I was a dildo. Their future was the present, so I was just a filling the space. She was PSYCHO. Dude, she's still calling and talking to my voicemail message, e-mailing, texting... "Why don't you talk to me anymore?" Uh... I told her 4 months ago "why".

The married/divorced women with kids? Uh, I FB'd one chick that's married with kids. That was all she was worth to me: being a recepticle. She enjoys taking the shot in the mouth, so that's a mutually positive experience, I suppose. But, you can't count it as "dating" because I call, she shows up, we fux, she leaves. There isn't, and will never be, more than that. (BTW, younger) (BTW, trained to suit my needs)

With the younger women, I was a person, a partner, a prospect for their future.

Have your own experiences, I've said all I can say.
 

Sinistar

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Frank2500 said:
If you grow up not feeling accepted by many women in your age group and during your early to mid-twenties in college you were often passed over for the so-called thugs and athletes and the supposed rebels who could barely write a paper or construct a sentence, those events are gonna impact your life somehow.
...I think there is a nugget of information in this passage. Clearly these events have impacted your life. Many guys (afc's) go through this stage and just withdraw. They are the 20, 30 and 40-something virgins with high-standards, waiting for their "one". And there's another group (yes, still AFC) who are also plugged into the matrix and have found paths to intimacy - yet they are also self-defeating because they go counter to our basic human nature.

Perhaps you believe we give advice based only on forum interaction with no real life experiences to back it up. I can assure you, I was not just the "date the older woman" club member - I was their leader :) I habitually sought out older women because I thought they were more mature, more stable, etc.

Through the DJ cyberslap this site served up I was finally able to step back and see not only that it was a pattern, rather that it was behavior that would never lead to happiness and betterment of myself.

One thing I like about this site (although it takes some filtering) is that we're not gonna back you up and say 'Yeah, you're right younger women are just so shallow, fake, etc, etc, etc." Do you know why?

Because that's the very line of thinking and programming that got you (and me and countless others) to this point in the first place.

Nope, here you're just gonna get the truth. Whether you believe it or want to use it is totally up to you. The Red Pill.

These behaviours your observing in younger women are normal. It's just the way they do things. You can either accept that, learn more about it and use it to your advantage :) what the PUA's and DJ's do.

OR

You can keep falling back into the AFC frame with respect to younger women's behaviours.

Heck, I'll even give an example. After participating in this site and taking the time to understand and accept the truth regarding older women I started dating again. I limited myself to only younger women. And yes, lots and lots of not-so-good ones. At my age, a large number of the younger ones were also single momies. I ruled all of them out too. And every so often I found one of the better ones (affirmation that they are indeed out there). And one of these proved to be the right match for me. After dating nearly a year we got engaged and several months after that we are now married. To be quite honest, I had never considered marriage in my life until we I had known her for over half a year. Would you like a few particulars: She's younger, still capable of having children. She is healthy, happy, and friggin' hot. She's never been married, no kids, no bad habits and no addictions of any kinds. Her family is awesome, no druggies, no alcoholics or abusers. All of her family and siblings get along and do things together regularly. She has a healthy clutch of good girlfriend and no male girlfriends. She has a great job, but being the CEO is not her objective. She understands that I need to lead in our relationship and I swear I catch her smiling everytime she backs me up when I make a decision.

I would give your chances of finding something similar (in an considerably older divorced woman - especially with kids involved) to be less than 1 in 1000 (and that's being liberal which is definitely not me if you met me).
 

Men frequently err by talking too much. They often monopolize conversations, droning on and on about topics that bore women to tears. They think they're impressing the women when, in reality, they're depressing the women.

Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.

Mr.Positive

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Frank, there is a lot of good advise on this thread, however, it may not apply to you.

From what I gather, you're frustrated with the type of women you have been dating, and are tired of the games. I've been there too, you aren't alone. Dating should be fun, women should be fun, hell...life should be fun. If it isn't, then you need to do something. Going after a different group of women may not be the answer.

Maybe you should take a break from dating for now. Trying something new, find a new focus, passion. Take up sailing, rock climbing, travel...go trekking in Nepal, surfing, scubadiving. Do something different. Shake things up a bit. There is an infinite number of exciting adventures to get involved with. It's amazing that when you get excited about something new, you have the new energy, and women just seem to come out of the woodworks.

When women start affecting your overall happiness, it's time to focus on something else.
 

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Frank...there is absolutely NOTHING wrong with you. Date whoever you want to date and just keep an eye out for red flags. You don't have to date who other men tell you that you should want to date. Age has nothing to do with emotional health, stability and quality of character. If you find the traits that appeal to you in a woman that you are both attracted to and can communicate well with and feel comfortable with then just date her regardless of her age, past marital status or whether or not she has children. Knowing how to watch for warning signs in women they exhibit in the here and now will tell you far more than what went on in her past. You sound confident and secure enough in yourself to know what you want and what you don't want. Just watch the signals and go for whoever you like because THAT is what strong, confident and secure men do.
 

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Frank2500 said:
....the manner in which many young American women behave today. It's just very disappointing and shameful how a lot of them carry themselves. But like I said, women 20-29 are no longer my priority. I'm not saying that I've given up on them per say. What I'm saying is I've reached a point based on experiences running through 11 years (if that's not persistence, I wonder what is) where I'm just fared up and tired with all the crap. These so-called young women today are the same ones who would be complaining about the supposed lack of good men in the future. Yet when the so-called good men came around, they didn't want to give many of them a chance. Let them keep on chasing their bad boys and thugs. More power to them.

Frank, I really think you need to revisit the 'lack of confidence' angle some have spoke of.

-You seem to have stated above that you are failing with women 20-29; so you will just settle for what you can get from others outside that target group.

-It's not you; it's them. Women are MAKING you shop in the "older" department, their forcing you to make the choices you are making.

-You rate all American women by the actions of a few, your frustration with SOME makes you give up on ALL.

Hmmm, to me 'settling' and 'blaming' and 'making excuses' aren't really characteristics of a confident man.

I don't think you are happy with the conclusions and decisions you've made on this matter and I think this thread was just another step for you to try to justify them.
 

Wyldfire

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Frank has spent 11 years dating younger women. That is a long enough time for him to determine that they are not offering him what it is he is seeking. If he has not dated older women during that time and is finding so quickly after starting to date them that they offer more of what he is looking for then he should continue to do what he finds more satisfying. Repeating something you have tried for 11 years that does not satisfy you simply is NOT logical.
 

Mr.Positive

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Wyldfire said:
Frank has spent 11 years dating younger women. That is a long enough time for him to determine that they are not offering him what it is he is seeking. If he has not dated older women during that time and is finding so quickly after starting to date them that they offer more of what he is looking for then he should continue to do what he finds more satisfying. Repeating something you have tried for 11 years that does not satisfy you simply is NOT logical.
But giving up isn't logical either. Frank is exibiting a natural learned behavior, ie as a child learns that a stove can be hot not be being told, but by touching the stove and getting burnt. Frank has been burnt so to speak by dating the wrong women the past 11 years. He should take his knowledge and go forward, not backward. Quitting on a whole age group of women doesn't make sense.
 

Men frequently err by talking too much. They often monopolize conversations, droning on and on about topics that bore women to tears. They think they're impressing the women when, in reality, they're depressing the women.

Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.

Wyldfire

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Mr.Positive said:
But giving up isn't logical either. Frank is exibiting a natural learned behavior, ie as a child learns that a stove can be hot not be being told, but by touching the stove and getting burnt. Frank has been burnt so to speak by dating the wrong women the past 11 years. He should take his knowledge and go forward, not backward. Quitting on a whole age group of women doesn't make sense.
He's not quitting...he's exploring options he had not explored before. If he has only dated much younger women for the last 11 years then there is a good chance that he had previously been ruling out older women. He's also from another country. He comes from a different culture and from the sounds of it, the behavior and attitude of younger women in the US is really a turn off to him.

He's not asking anyone whether he should or should not give older women a shot. He is asking about divorced women and women with children...not age. One guy addressed the children issue and I am the only one that addressed both of his questions. Why is that? He's not asking what age women he should date. So why are so many people shoving their views down his throat about age?
 

Bad_Lil'Pixie

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Frank2500 said:
What I'm saying is I've reached a point based on experiences running through 11 years (if that's not persistence, I wonder what is) where I'm just fared up and tired with all the crap. These so-called young women today are the same ones who would be complaining about the supposed lack of good men in the future. Yet when the so-called good men came around, they didn't want to give many of them a chance. Let them keep on chasing their bad boys and thugs. More power to them.
11 years is NOTHING if the foundation of your approach lacked confidence.

Frank, if you came here saying how much joy and pleasure you find in older women, I'd be encouraging and saying 'good for you'.

But you came here saying that you HAVE to TRY to find pleasure in them because what you truly want isn't working out for you so well.

You are basing your actions and decisions on your past negative results AND you are allowing those same women you despise to control the direction your life is taking at the moment, that's your frustration Frank.
 

Wyldfire

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Seeing as Frank comes from a different culture where women tend to be more responsible and giving and less immature and selfish it would only stand to reason that he would not be satisfied with younger American women who are notoriously selfish, demanding, and quite often quite immature.

Frank would KNOW if his problem was confidence. He insists that he IS confident and always approaches women he is interested in with ease.

It is impossible for Frank to speak of any successes regarding older women because he has only dated younger women to this point. He is not satisfied with what he has been doing previously and is trying something different.

Frank was attracted to the older women he referred to in his original post. He is not "settling" for women he is not attracted to...he is making the choice to include groups of women he had not previously looked at. So far, it would appear that he feels pretty good about that choice.

Does this mean he should never give younger women a chance again? Of course not. It simply means that he should date people HE likes and is interested on rather than people that other men tell him he is SUPPOSED to like and be interested in.
 

Latinoman

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And frank is time to stop whinning and crying and take charge of your life.

YOU are the PROBLEM.
 

Wyldfire

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Frank...just date who you want to date.
 
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