Boot Camp for The Mature Man

[Mantra]

Ok... sitting here floating away in waves of oceanic serenity listening to the Whale Rider soundtrack with a hangover. Yes....it's sunday, and I've finished week 2.

I've got through my 10 convos with strangers, but I haven't written them all down but I'll see what I can remember.

Like ParallelE. I have about a 60% success rate at approaching and starting convos in pubs and bars, and this is where all of my action has taken place, first at a salsa class, and then out for some beers with dj2l8 last night. I can see that it is much harder for me to do this kind of thing out in the open during daytime. My aim is to get this part of my game more up and running now in week 3.

Like dj2l8 said, the salsa class was a little like shooting fish in a barrel. Got three convos started there. One from a cold approach, and two with people I had to partner in the class. Wasn't sure about including those two, but seeing as most people just dance with their allotted partner, and I started some c+f convo with them, and engaged, I'll include them. If you guys don't agree, I had some cold convos with people at a party the previous friday anyway, so the numbers are still up!

Went out in the Södermalm area of Stockholm last night with dj2l8. I'm still wary in some ways of including bar approaches, as with a bit of alcohol in the system you're cruising on a false engine in many respects. Anyway I did my approaches, but am going to work on the daytime and street side now in wk3. Dj2l8 and I also wondered what we should count 2 people together as, ie talking to two people who are together. We thought that seeing as that's one less approach, one should triple the time, so a minimum of 6 minutes if you're going to count them as two, IF you're engaging both of them in the convo - feedback on this would be appreciated guys!

My best line of approach with women was walking up to them and saying "Hello - are you friendly?" which they usually find to be different and disarming. Listening in on something else to break the ice, or seeing something to break the ice about is great too - like the south african chaps I got talking to because I heard that they were talking english, or the ecuadorians who I could obviously ask straight away "where are you lot from?".

I was toying with the idea of the DeAngelo patented "Hello, are you single?" but never got up and going with that one. I'll try it a few times this week I think as it's all going to be directed at dateable women.

I am seeing that my problem is in closing rather than approaching, so week 4 is going to be double challenging!!!! Can't wait.

Wise words from Francisco by the way. I think we would all be well advised to read them over and over!

 

[Ricky]

Well one of the girls has flaked on me. I had met her a month ago and we have been playing e-mail tag. It's a real low investment of time, but she gave me a too busy deal in her message and didn't counteroffer. I let her down easy because I understand being busy but I know I shouldn't have. Fortunately since she is a waittress at a local bar I can always go in and give her crap about it and ask for a free beer to make up for it. Pretty sure she'll cave in for the beer but as far as dating her, I'm not really interested.

I'm already getting nervous a bit about calling a girl tomorrow. We have e-mailed and have already hung out before, but this will be for an event with just us hanging out. I hate that feeling. Hopefully I can burn off the nervousness before the call.

**** for that matter I might even call her tonight to get it over with.

The f close girl is still calling. She didn't respond to my e-mail (Dear Jane e-mail in my other message), so when she called yesterday I actually picked up and told her the scoop.

Then I let her down easy and said I might show up at a certain bar if I had time. So she then called me at 11:30 and then had a friend call an hour later.

Guys seeing the AFC qualities of this girl as a recipient sure does prove alot to me. I really don't like desperate people LOL

 

[Mantra]

Ricky.... this is a bootcamp thread. Are you doing the bootcamp or not? If not, then there are probably other places to post about your ups and downs with the various women in your life.

Let's hear about how you're getting on with the bootcamp tasks!

 

[Ricky]

Point well taken Mantra. I can do the hi's and hellos but you are right I need to add more approaches.

I have been awful lazy about going out. Went out for a bit Friday and stayed in Saturday. But I felt like doing it, i wasn't moping or anything like that!

I'll be busy next week but will keep working on it so I have some bootcamp like stuff to report.

 

[dj2l8]

Week 2 AKA Stagnation: Still 7 to go

Hi folks,

As Mantra reported, we met up on the South Side this weekend to attempt to finish week 2. As Mantra stated after we met, "I've met many chicks on the net, but never a bloke!" H aha ha. We got a good laugh about that. For those of you who are just lurking, it's pretty freaking cool to be 1000's of Km's away from home, and met a damn cool chap who'se going through the same crap as yourself. Thanks to the DJ forum for that.

So, after a short trip for warm-up beers to the Vampire Lounge, we hit Kvarnen. I will disappoint all of you by saying that I froze up solid that night. Mantra was a machine...he says 60% success rate, but as far as I could tell, he had good convo with every woman that stopped his way. His approach is first rate and is not afraid to take some risks and say some crazy ****. Plus he has the added bonus of an ear to ear smile that definitely puts the ladies at easy. So we came and he had 5 o-7 to go and he knocked em all down before 2AM. He could have done twice that many if he wasn't trying to help me with my game that night. The only convo that occurred were with some girlies that Mantra opened up with a nice line about their curious look at our english speaking asses. That for about 20 minutes then her husband for 20. But damn, those don't count for me. I need strangers, cold approaches for me to get past this. Mantra suggested that I'm being a bit too orthodox here, but I'm so freaking petrified of this, that I have to do it right. The only other interesting event was a blown opp: repeated eye contact and smiles with the same girl in different parts of the bar over the evening. At one point she even stood within a meter of me and turned around to put her beer next to mine. Did I even flinch? Nope. Complete AFC system shutdown.

So, I left really freaking disappointed in myself and even while there, the downward spiral set in...fed on itself and slowly rotted me into a complete AFC. Lame.

Some reflection: I realize now, especially after spending some time with Mantra and Zentraveller that I have a LONG, LONG way to go in this DJ stuff. Zentraveller has a skin thicker than a Blue fin tuna and Mantra could pretty much cold approach the Swedish bikini team after a few beers. Me, I'd rather chew my left arm off with worn dentures than cold approach at a bar. The locale of this weekend REQUIRED approaches. As there was no place (like in my last post) to hang, look cool and cherry pick as they dropped by. It's definitely going to take me a few days to recover from this weekend...but all I've got is time.

Somewhere in the BC it talks about: "if only your feet can propel you to the person." Yeah...if only.

Some other comments: ParallelElvis. Great job this weekend. For someone who doesn't like to go to bars or clubs or stay out late, you've got some game. Keep up the good work.

Ricky, I say you start week 2 now. Forget all this other crap...if you've got dates or stuff, great, we'll help you out. But you gotta play ball with us pal.

 

[DoubleD]

Hey all.. I've been running a fairly loose bootcamp because I know I'm fine with the Eye Contact, Hello and random convos bit of things. However my main goal has always been and remains picking up in ANY location.. so my entire hello and convos have been with random people off the street.

Talked to a whole bunch of people from young to old. Even some HBs. To be honest I'm feeling kinda weird. I used to get that funny feeling in my stomach when talking to HBs but now I can apprach them and star a convo without a problem. Approached probably 10 of them in the last week and all is good. Generally they all smiled and we had a "polite" conversation. Most of my openers were "how to get to place ...." or "what do you think of..." or even "Hey where is somewhere good to go out tonight?" I think I need to work on something more interesting and engaging them more on a sexual level right from the start. If you start off with a boring topic its hard to get to something fun and juicy.. and you really can't bore a woman into liking you... :-D

Tonights approach on a HB @ Gym was more like approach i need to do.. i notice she has weirdly painted nails.. convo was something like
DD - "hey cool nails"
HB - "Thanks.. no ones ever said that?"
DD - "So what do you use them for?"
HB - "They are my secret weapon?"
DD - "oh really? *smirk*"
HB - "hahaha"
... and then general chit chat about stuff at Gym all the while getting great Eye contact.

I found out though that my main worry at the moment is # closing. I should have # closed the HB @ gym as well as others but this is the next step for me to pass. Week 3 isn't it? Or 4? I'm going to work on that next week anyway.... Hell i'll throw in the rejection bootcamp with that too.

I guess main experience I have is that its really not that scary. I adopt a just do it attitude and see what happens. Although , like I said in another post I am considering scripting some openers and convos to get correct state going. An interesting fun question that can be applied to everyone you meet when you can't come up with something interesting on the spot. Appreciate any feedback you guys may have. One final observation is that I am a tall, good looking guy and some girls get intimidated very quickly when meeting me... laugh nervously and act a little AFC themselves. Anyone got any tips around this one? How do you set the girlies at ease.. I also find that if I use C&F on these gals too early it totally freaks them out and makes them think I'm unnaproachable.. for me C&F usually works much better after they get to know me. (Ie: 1st date?.. not on pickup) Any feedback appreciated!

Lets all keep going!!

 

[dj2l8]

Week 2 (of Week 2)

Well, as I said in an SMS to Mantra last night...

"Tonight I did something I've done thousands of times before. I went out to grab a few beers by myself, stood next to chicks all night, and didn't say a f***ing word."

So yesterday, I went to the gym as usual. This gym has got to be the most unfriendly place in Sweden. Although I literally see the same 30 people 4-5 days a week, no one ever says a word. I'm lucky if I manage a 'Waz up' out of some of the roided monsters at this place. Must be the exceedingly high testosterone levels, who knows.

Anyways, decided to go grab 2 beers and see if I couldn't squeak out 1 convo. Went to a place called Tranan, a cool bar on the North side. Grabbed a spot at the bar next to 2 5's. Hoping to catch some initial eye contact, but what I got was a cold, frightened look as the one closest to me moved her jacket from one under-bar hook to one closer to her. And this was a girl I wouldn't touch mind you. So I proceeded to stand next to them for 2 hours. During that time, 3 different groups of girls came up in the space next to me to order some drinks. Managed a hello to two of them, nothing more than that other than old AFC behaviors of looking away and accomodating them as they wedged their way in. Yes it was ugly.

Francisco mentioned in his post that "Just relax and have fun with this stuff" is key. I must say, to me, there is nothing at all fun about this. However, I knew this wouldn't be fun. I'm fair too messed up for this to be fun or to 'just relax' about this stuff. This is more like an agoraphobic learning to go in public by going to a closing sale at Wallmart. I just can't imagine how I managed to get this f****d up by one bad experience when I was 19, but apparently I did. Mantra and I are going to talk about this tonight, he says he has some tips. Another friend of mine suggested I start BootCamp over again...especially since it took me 3 weeks to get 50 hellos and it looks like it will take at least a month to get through week 2. The suggestion was that maybe I keep doing the weeks until I can actually do them in 1 week. Seems like a good idea to me.

Now, changing the subject to something positive, let's welcome DD to the BC. Yeah! He sounds a lot more like Mantra...no problem on the approaches etc.

If anyone has any bright ideas about this phobia, now's the time folks. I'm about at the end of my rope here. And yes, I've tried every combo of booze and drugs out there...my inhibitions are chemically impenetrable. ;-)

Have a date tonight with another Swedish girl...I'm sure that will go fine. They usually do. This was a gril that again, I had nothing to do with meeting. Friend of a friend.

DJ2L8

 

[zentraveller]

DJ2l8: If only the rest of us had such problems huh? Lagging on the BC exercises but still laying Swedish birds regularly.



You may have read this already, but maybe this may help:

"You Became a Social Coward by Accident"

-- by Mike Pilinski --

(c) 2002 Kipling Kat Publishing Co. -- All Rights Reserved
http://www.highstatusmale.com

=========================================

I'll bet the following statement is true for any guy reading this
who doesn't do well with the ladies: You don't really understand
what it is you're doing WRONG that makes you so unattractive to
women... for the *exact same reason* that "Casanova" who
scores left and right with them doesn't understand what he's
doing RIGHT.

Huh? Read that again if you have to. Both YOU and
Casanova are essentially clueless as to why you ended up the
way that you are in terms of your skill levels (or lack there of)
when it comes to charming and seducing women. Of course,
Mr. Casanova isn't unhappy about his situation, right? But you
sure are.

Theory Time: I believe that both sets of behaviors which lie
at opposite ends of the spectrum are the result of accidents that
occurred when you were both just beginning to notice girls in a
different light (sexually)... sheer random incidents which involved
elements of good or bad luck, and nothing more.

It went like this: YOUR first trial and error experiences
occurred with a girl that simply DIDN'T LIKE YOU (probably
because of personal issues that had nothing to do with you, but
so what?) You thus ended up with a completely negative
reinforcement of your early efforts at seduction and socialization.
This awkward and possibly *shameful* first try at romance
robbed you of the critical early confidence you needed to keep on
experimenting and practicing your skills. It kicked off a
descending spiral of inaccurate behaviors that led to more and
more failures with women as time passed, further stunting your
social development.

More failure resulted in a complete loss of confidence,
growing social ineptitude and a withdrawal from the game of
flirting and even attempting to seduce women. Your behavioral
changes might've progressed to episodes of delusional
thinking, dark fantasies, etc. In other words, your *character*
changed to make it even less likely that you could successfully
interact with women, and voila'... a "nerd" was born.

Casanova, on the other hand -- due to simple GOOD fortune
and nothing else -- may've tried the exact same moves during
his adolescence just as you did, but HE happened to choose a
girl that LIKED him, and therefore responded to his fumbling first
efforts favorably. Get the picture?... a positive reaction to the
exact same inept moves that you made! Merely because of
random good luck, he happened to choose to work a girl who
responded to him in an emotionally reinforcing way.

This "big break" (that you didn't get) gave Casanova
confidence AND positive social feedback -- which further
provided a laboratory to fine tune his behaviors. Perhaps he
even grew up in an environment that supported or encouraged
those initial experimental behaviors -- a supportive older
sister or a female friend that he could talk to in confidence
whenever he needed advice? Someone to make the female
psyche seem less mysterious and intimidating? You, on the
other hand, may've grown up in an all-male environment where
women seemed remote and unfathomable. Possibly your every
move in this arena was met with scorn or ridicule whenever you
actually tried to act, making you even more gun shy.

You learned to associate fear and paralysis with the idea of
courting a woman.

Anyway, here's my point: Your downward turn could've just
as easily have been an upward turn had your luck been good
instead of bad with those first experiences. I believe that this
element of LUCK is more pivotal in our lives that most of us
realize. The timing of the luck is critical. It sets the stage for
the interplay of key events upon which your self-image is
manufactured in fits and starts. You see, there is really no
fundamental difference between the Social Casanova and the
Social Coward. Both are simply the end result of being turned in
different directions at a critical point in their lives.

Stated differently, your current status as a social coward is
all "nurture" (or in your case, lack of it...) and NOT "nature". You
out there reading this trying to find some edge with women are
no more genetically programmed to fail socially than the
Casanova is to succeed... you both simply LEARNED how to do
it as you traveled along divergent social-life paths.

Think about it... What if that first nervous reach for affection
had gone differently? What if that first girl you ever asked out
had said yes and became your "girlfriend" instead of laughing in
your face and running off to tell her friends what a loser you
were? Imagine how your social skills and confidence would've
improved over the subsequent months and years if that time had
been spent in social interaction (good, bad or ugly) with women
instead of social isolation? It would've given you a whole
different concept of yourself and made you an entirely different
person than you are today.

And to think that it all turned on that one damned UN-lucky
first break!

It's time to stop handing random chance the power to direct
your destiny. Time to make a course correction back into the
world of the living (and the socializing). There are techniques to
make it easier than you might think, but it all begins with a
decision not to let the faded echo of a long-ago negative event
continue to shape your life. And until you make that decision,
nothing will ever really change for you.

 

[parallelvis]

This post is long, but I type this stuff in my journal anyway so I thought I'd share it with you guys. Give me some feedback on whether or not I'm giving too much information.

10/10
I went out today on a mission to convo chicks. I planned a route that included two Targets, three bookstores and supermarket.

First I went to a large shoe store that was next to the first bookstore. Chicks were checking me out, but I was too scared to act. One rationalization was that the shelves were short throughout the store so everyone would be looking at me thinking I was a loser. One was that the chicks seemed to be concentrating on the shoes so it would be hard to get eye contact before the approach.

At the bookstore, I noticed a hot milf in all black with booming backside. I came close to approaching a few times and chickened out. Then something broke in my mind and I told myself that I was going to approach her no ifs, and buts or maybes. It reminded me of the feeling I had when I bungee jumped at Victoria Falls. I was scared ****less, my body was numb and heavy, but I had already paid a bunch of money, I knew that I wouldn't get hurt, so I leaned forward and jumped.

She had just left the customer service desk where she had been trying to find a book. I went up beside her about 3 feet away and said,"what kind of book are you looking for? I noticed you were having a hard time finding it." She said, "a book on web based design." We made book talk for a couple of minutes. She had an accent so I asked her where she was from originally. She said Brazil. I told her I had just seen a brazilian film called City of God. She thought it was too violent, etc.

Analysis: She had on a wedding ring and was touching it with her thumb. I assumed that she was saying, "I'm married you moron." But she could have just been nervous. I simply let the convo end after about three minutes.

Approach anxiety makes me stupid. I loved that film and I had about 10 good things to say about it such as "Yeah, it was hard to watch b/c of the violence, but the characters were so vibrant and passionate and some of the scenery was breathtaking. Are most Brazilians intensely passionate?" Also, I should have told her that I had been to Mozambique, another former portuguese colony, and busted out "I don't speak Portuguese" in Portuguese. I could have talked about their new years celebration where everyone parties for a couple of days and the pleasantly warm, crystal clear water of the Indian Ocean.

Anyway, the stuff that I did say was pretty lame. After I stopped saying stuff, she said, "Bye, I'll see you later." I realized that I wasn't ****y enough and I was trying to be too helpful. She had to sense that I wanted to bone her, but I was acting like a bookstore clerk. Really, why else would some random guy start talking to her?

After this I went to Pier One and saw no hotties. I then went to Target and pretty much searched the whole store twice but I chickened out on the only hottie I saw.

By this time I was exhausted. Searching for chicks, fear of failure, feelings of guilt for being a wuss, approach anxiety--all of these things will wear a man out.

I almost went home but instead went to a starbucks. I walked in and didn't see any hotties. I was so chicken and self-conscious and frazzled by that time, that I went to the counter and asked a question b/c I didn't want people to think I was up to anything. I decided to go home.

Just before I was about to pull onto the Interstate, I saw Whole Foods market and decided to go in, get something to eat, and sarge if given the opportunity. I was so frazzled and defeated that my body felt like concrete when I saw a hottie that I definitely had to approach.

I chickened out first and then I decided to loop back around talk to her even if whe was standing hand in hand with her boyfriend.

She was at the self-checkout lane. I came up behind her and said:

ME "Don't I know you from David's party?'

HB "I don't think so?"

ME "Are you sure? What's your name?"

HB "Laura, and I just moved here..."

ME "From Michigan?" (I'm pretty good at identifying regional accents and I thought I'd try to charm her)

HB "North Carolina." ( I blew that, but I guaruntee she grew up in the upper Midwest)

ME "Do you have any friends in Louisville?"

HB "No"

ME "Would you like to make one?"

HB "Yeah, are you saying I just made one?"

ME "Should we pick a time to meet for coffee or should you just give me your number?"

HB "We can meet." (Then we both started to think about our schedules and try to pick a day and time and I felt that the convo was losing momentum.)

ME "This is a little complicated. Just give me your # and I'll call you."

HB "Can you give me your number?"

ME "If you don't want to go out just tell me. It's OK.......What do you have a boyfriend or something?"

HB (looking a bit sullen) "Yes, I do have a boyfriend"

ME "That's cool. When's the wedding?"

HB (she smiled wide and laughed) "There is no wedding"

ME "Well let's do this then"

HB "Actually, he lives out of town" (the fact that she offered that info told me that I was in)

Anyway, we talked some more and it turns out that she's the rowing coach at the local university and that she is living with her grandmother until she finds her own place. Since she didn't want me calling granny's house and I didn't want to give out my number and give away some of my power, I got her email address.

Things I did right:

I approached her like I new her and it convinced me that I did. This put me in a very comfortable and warm state of mind. She had to pick up on it.

Also, I used various that I picked up in forums like "When's the wedding?", refusing to give her my number, and not giving her a chance to say no by offering her two options that were basically the same but created the illusion of choice.

Things I did wrong:

I could have left with her and gone out for coffee right then.

I could have talked to her more, but with this chick, I had a feeling that she dug the approach so much, that anything I said would have lowered my stock.

Also, for no f-ing reason, I offered that I would come to her end of town to get coffee. This was stupid b/c it's nice guyish and b/c we can't go to granny's to do the dirty. We need to be close to my place.

Plus, When she was searching for a pen, I kind of helped out a little to enthusiastically.

Finally, I noticed that she and I were both very nervous. Her lips were dry and she licked them a few times. When she left I had serious cotton mouth.

10/11
Today, I pulled in right in front of the outdoor seating area of a coffee house. These 2 HBs literally watched me parallel park (which I did in perfectly and that is a bit of a feat since it was a tight spot and I drive an 88 Buick).

They looked at me when I got out of the car. I mean they were definitely checking me out. Did I say anything playful or funny? Nope. I got scared, invented a few reasons why I shouldn't talk to them and went to the bookstore next door.

I did grab a book out of my car and go to the coffe shop and sat on a bench outside after I got some tea. This fifty-something year old guy I know was talking to this HB at a near me. This guy is known around town as he writes for a local paper and used to have a radio talk show. However, he had some sort of mental breakdown a few years ago and since he has become known as a drunk and a lech. He was hitting on this girl hard, trying to get her to go to lunch with him, saying how pretty she was, etc. She was nice to him, but wasn't having it.

He left and I made up some more reasons why I shouldn't talk to her. Then I was like screw it I'll go the way of the liar. So I asked her if she knew Bob and if he was ok, as he was looking pretty rough. I said I was kind of worried about him.

We talked about him for a minute and then went on to talk about nutrition and some other stuff for about 4 minutes. At one point she said something to let me know that she was done with the convo like "well, it was nice talking to you." I asked her another question and while she was talking I stood up thus acting like I was ending the encounter. This was good for my self-esteem b/c it sucks to be dismissed.

I think this one didn't go well b/c I was incongruent. I didn't give a **** about Bob or nutrition. Also, she was wearing mirrored sunglasses so I couldn't read her eyes. I was neither ****y nor funny. I sat there kind of slouching, leaning across the table asking banal questions and affirming her every response. It was like we were on Oprah.

I think congruence is important for me. It's hard having convos with chicks that I'm attracted to and not try to pick them up. Then again, I could view it as a performance and simply be congruent about using the encounter to hone my skills. I guess I'll figure it out as I go.

 

[zentraveller]

A for effort parralelvis! Keep up the good work.

 

[Mantra]

Well done parallelE. you're on a roll man..... keep it up.

If any of you haven't yet checked it out then I MUST recommend Krassus' post 'Logbook of an aspiring Cassanova' in the general discussion forum. It's all about approaches and he blazes a trail for us to follow..... great reading!

 

[DoubleD]

Go Paralelle!! I reckon you're doing awesome and you email closed the chick at the supermarket .. that rocks! Imagine if you did that once a week.. or even 5 times a week.. hey if nothing else the law of averages states that you'll fall upon a girl that will do what you want done!

I have some success of my own to report.. today I did my first random number close!!! YEAH!

I was walking past a supermakrket and see a girl who isn't out of my playboy fantasies but a HB i'd do.. so that was enough. I apporach her with some comment about the supermarket being closed and it being an evil ploy to get us hungry. (I was going to shop there too) We talked for around 20 mins.. and I'm thinking **** i gotta close this.. so I say "hey you got a cell and email?" She says.. "yeah ... sure!" Now here was my first mistake. I had just gotten back from Gym and was in my tracksuite without my cell and without my PEN! LOL So I ask her.. hey you got a pen? And she says .. nahhh sorry.. but give me your cell.. Now two problems here.. 1. ) Never just give your number.. at least trade. 2.) I don't know my cell number off by heart..

Anyway.. since I live just next door to the place I say.. hey wait here.. i'll go grab a pen. I come back down and she's still sitting in the same spot I told her to wait.. i get her details and she's all happy and saying stuff like "It was a real unexpected pleasure to meet you here". Lesson here is ALWAYS be ready.. because you never know when opportunity knocks! Hell tape a pen to your leg or something.. make your pen as important as your underwear.. ok you get me.

AWESOME!! Now I wished I could say that this was the magic pill that cures all my approach anxieties and settles it all..but hey we're all human.. if we all just keep going we'll make it.

A realisation I had was that hey.. the other stuff these Djs have said about EC, random conversations or whatever is real..so why can't the number close concept be just as "real"? And friends it was. So if you ever get stuck.. try thinking.. well the steps up to here were true.. so why shouldn't the next one be true as well?

Lets rock DJs!

 

[dj2l8]

Great job!

Hey Elvis, DD, great job on the pick ups. That makes you two and Mantra on Week 3 tomorrow. Congrats to you all.

Zentra, thanks for the read. I've read it before, but I need to read it again and again and again.

I'm still waiting to hear from some of you other DJ's on some ideas out there...

I lived Elvis's analogy to Bungee Jumping. That about pegs it!

Nothing to report here. Date went well, blah blah. I've organized a pub crawl with about 30 people on Friday...but honestly, they're not really strangers in that case. Should be fun though. Maybe I can use the group as incentive to try things out on other groups of ladies in the bar. Hey Mantra, hope you can make it. Lots of ladies will be along...

D2-way-2-late

 

[Mantra]

too right DJ2L8.....
I'm gonna be out to get week 3 finished! Although I have still to start it.
Salsa class this evening will get me up and running! (I hope!)

 

[Mantra]

Ok guys... update on the salsa class before I settle down for my morning meditation session.

I went to the class determined to notch up a few numbers, and as I entered the place I quipped to some latino HB7 who gave the heavy door an all-body-weight shove "you get a weight training workout included in the entry fee when you come here!!" to which she responded with a giggle and a few words. Exchanged a sentence or two but for some reason I was always moving away down to the cloakroom and didn't develop it.

After I'd left in my coat, I chatted to some little Thai HB6 that I had spoken to last week for a couple of minutes but she seemed a little nervous, and the convo was stale. Maybe I'm trying TOO hard to impress and my state is rubbing off.
My friend Bobby Peru arrived. As he was in the cloakroom queue I opened some lower quality HB5 who happened to be standing next to me with "hello, are you any good at this?" chatted to her and her HB7 friend for about 5 minutes, but, man, they weren't that bright and didn't understand my C+F at all. But, they left it up to me to eject!

Ok, during the class section of the evening I was in my element, blending some good C+F in to the partner rotation thing, with lines like "I hope you're not going to stand on my toes!!!" "Careful with those elbows, I don't want a black eye!" etc. One little asian woman who was apparently there with her husband, ended up in stitches of laughter at the end of our little stint, and startd giggling every time she looked my way for a few minutes after.

Ok, in the refreshment break, I opened a spanish girl who I had already opened during dancing. She was a HB7 maybe. Talked to her for about ten minutes - she was a real motormouth. Threw in a bit of cold reading about how I could tell that she was a really social person who liked to have an active scene around her which she threw herself into - that she seeked out people and stimulating experiences. Amazing response, shee looked at me as if I was some kind of insightful guru, even though I had stated the absolutely obvious. She introduced me to her spanish friends too, blokes unfortch, but I socialised freely with them, and it reminded me once more of how important it is with a 'life and soul of the party' attitide. Mr. Fingerz wrote some great stuff on this!

During the dancing, one girl looked like a shemale, great body and breasts, but looked like she had had no end of plastic ops to her face, and I'm sure she had a protruding adam's apple. YIKES - she kept trying to lead in the dancing too - that's my job!!!! Anyways, she had one of those tiny little leather rucksacks on her back the whole time, so I asked her if she had cheese sandwiches in there. I left it at that, because I had my suspicions and she was majorly unappealing.

When the nightclub part of the evening got started after the class, I danced with HB7Spanish for a bit, then opened her friend ( HB6) about that I'd heard she was a musician (which she was). Spoke to her for a few minutes and danced as well.

Later, leaning at the bar, I opened a HB6 beside me with "are you an advanced salsera" or something equally cheesy, which she affirmed, before going on to say that I was looking for a personal trainer in salsa as I was just starting out, to which she said "I am NOT that person!"
Hilarious stuff. I still fluffed her for a couple of minutes though, until her South American boyfriend turned up and kissed her with a very protective gesture, signalling "She's mine". Hey, man, I was only using her for practice anyway.

Anyway, there were some other really attractive HBs there who I didn't have the balls to approach. I also went out late afternoon to try some street approaches, but I always back out of them for some reason. For some reason I find these much easier if I have a wingman with me. HAVE to work on this area of my game. Krassius had a great philosophy in his post of Operation Autopilot - a kind of Kamikaze approach no-matter-what philosophy, which I'm going to try to implement.

Anyways - I have to say that I'm only on two so far for wk 3, as there were only two of the girls I spoke to last night that I would have been willing to date, HBSpanish, and HBMusician, and I want to do this properly, no including UGs and lower HBs to ratch up the numbers.

 

[DoubleD]

LOL Mantra.. loved your story.. and I tend to agree with you that half the problem as you carry on is that it gets harder and harder to actually find a quality woman that you'd like to date, ****.. whatever. I guess thats why its so important for me to meet people anywhere.. because its often in those anywhere situations that I see the most women I like. BTW you have inspired me to check out the Latin American Class at my local gym tomorrow night!

Last night I was catching up with some friends to attend a FREE introductory spiritual type lesson thing. I'm into this stuff generally but also they tend to be packed with open minded women. As I am standing outside i engange convo with 2 older women.. anyway I wasn't interested in dating them but I was quite happy when one of their Daughters arrived I engaged her immedialty and then let them go in while i "waited for friends". As we got in I kept my back to her and played as if she wasn't there.. my mates were saying "hey.. theres a chick totally checking you out!!" I ignored her the whole course.. (pretty easy since you close your eyes for most of it). Anyway at the end we ejected and went to the pub downstairs.. i couldn't get to her because she was in deep convo with some of the course guys. Then as I saw her outside told my mates to give me a second and i went out and approached her group. I disarmed by engaging one of the taller guys and made pleasant conversation. Then, i had to disarm another guy who was doing kino on her (and obviously knew her from before) with some C&F, which got her laughing and keeping good eye contact with me.. but I still couldn't shake the guy and i think that she felt some sort of pressure infront of him.. so I drew a wild card and said.. "hey its cold.. i'm going inside". It worked because she followed and he got left outside. Took her inside asked for her number (infront of mum and friends) .. then forgot her name and just said "ummm.. whats your name again??" To which she threw some sort of **** test.. which I ignored, got her name and that was that. (Hey at least I had my pen this time!! DoubleDs tip #2 - Remember the name.. hahah)

I went out early this morning and caught the train into the city. The train was packed with HOT women. Some students... (which look decivingly older than they are) and some business type women. Anyway didn't approach mainly because I am still anxious in starting up a random convo on a silent packed train... It would belike trying to hit on a gilr in an elevator... something I gotta work on.. but also because i hadn't validated my ticket and was going to feign that I only spoke english if a controler came. (not my fault stupid machine was out of order... but this is a secondary BS excuse to try and validate myself )

Anyway got off train a bit deluded that I hadn't opened a HB and was at the underground/subway and opened a very HB about directions and then moved the convo to shopping etc. She was friendly enough but the underground/subway arrived and I didn't get to try a # close on her. While on the train a **** hot Bod model walked on.. could tell she was a model.. portfolio in hand and looking wheeeeeeew!!! I think my brain went Because even though she was only on for one stop I really should have opened her.. *sigh*. Went about my business in town saying Hi to some random people.. and then proceeded back to the train.

At the train station had a 30 minute wait so thought "time to DJ". I saw another really hot chick but went totally blank. Then as I was waiting saw a HB walk past a few times and decided to open. Took me a bit to open.. just because she kept moving.. and was harder than usual because I sat there "thinking".. bad idea to think just do. Anyway opened her with something like "hey, so how long have you got to wait.. you look lost".. followed by a "isn't it weird that we're all waiting for trains and we all sit alone and don't chat just to burn some time?" She agreed.. and we got talking. She was nervous as hell talking.. what? Was I the first guy that had approached her??? Didn't number close.. got bored and left. Then on the train opened up a HB Student who was late for a class.. chatted to her for about 15 mins on the train and then she got off.. again didn't number close but should have for practice.

To be honest I have been keeping my eyes open to see if any other "naturals" out there are approaching women randomly.. and I just don't see it!! I have not seen 1 street approach! Have any of you guys ever seen a random approach and convo?? I mean in a club its rare enough to see guys engage.. seems like they go there with or as "friends" am I the only one on this or do you guys notice the same thing? Where have all the MEN gone???

(Oohhhh one final thing.. i went to a Pilates class.. I was the only male student! I totally reccomend it to all of you! The instructor even asked "why you do Pilates?" and my C&F response made the class laugh "To meet women" HAHAHAHHA)

 

[dj2l8]

Nice...

Hey DD,

Nice job on the closings. And way to go Mantra...you guys are doing great. Hey DD, give us some details about you, like where you live and crap like that. We don't have anything on you other than your age. This stuff is nice to have in your profile.

I've got nothing to report. I'm sick as a dog. Went over chickies house last night and got the boyfriend speech and how she dumped all the other guys she was dating for me. Oh sh*t. I managed to escape reasonably unhurt, but how do you tell a women a) no I'm not dating other women (yet) and b) i'm tired of NOT having dates so I'm trying to learn how to pick up women. Either of these things will have a cast iron frying pan inserted into your forehead before you can say "Lets Just Be Friends". Anyways, a little shuffle about my freedom and space and how I'm not ready (which are all 100% true) seemed to do the trick. Yack yack yack...like any of you care about this crap.

Please, what do you guys think about me starting the BC from scratch?

Get back to DJing!

 

[DoubleD]

Hey dj2l8.. about starting the BC from scratch I'd go it if you feel you need to... Hey everyone at their own pace.. (Like when I started I knew that the whole EC and Hi was not a big thing for me.. but # Closing was... although am slowly getting through that barrier too) Kinda funny reading your posts though... you got psychotic women in your life already and most of us are doing this to get some.. or some more? HEhehe Maybe you aint frustrated enough?? Since you got a steady supply of women you may not be driven/frustrated enough to get out there and push yourself more than usual? Every goal that takes effort to achieve takes both burning desire and planning... the planning part is this site, BC.. the burning desire.. well thats gotta come from within.

Ok.. so about me? I've just moved to Milan. Its kinda weird to go from picking up in English to picking up in another language. Even though I am fluent, I ran the risk of becoming a total AFC again.. so thats why I joined the bootcamp... to kick my ass into gear and get out there. For now things are going well enough.. and I'm just going to keep pushing till I have this all handled. I have to also say its great to have others going through the same things, sharing the whole experience and keeping us all encouraged.

ps: About your chick problems.. Ouch.. i remember being in that sorta situation a couple of months back. I'd say its a little late too get out clean. So just tell her straight and be prepared for the flying pan. Trust me .. it heals after a while.

 

[Ricky]

DJ28, something clicked in my mind at a point to where it was fun to talk to as many women as possible.

The way it clicked for me was to take all the pressure off. Now I regularly talk to as many cute women as possible. The easiest way is to get a keen eye and poke fun at stuff.

Is this boot camp enough for all of you. Yesterday I was joking around with a girl at work, she has a boyfriend and a kid, but at one point said to me "You're the oldest guy I've messed with yet" as if it were definite she was going to sleep with me at some point. She is 22. It could happen but I"m not going to mess with someone elses woman.

I am really relaxed with her because i don't need it from her.

Conversationally some of this website has led to confusion. As long as you can keep the conversation friendly and playful, you will have alot of success in building rapport with women. There is a big difference between friendly and playful and being an asskissing AFC.

I actually only get real nervous now when I call a girl on the phone. Because sometimes the initial rapport comes so easy that I can't believe that I got it and am afraid the girl will flake!

Try to get as relaxed as possible with different women. The only way to do it is to talk to as many women as possible. Joke with them all, don't even think of it as flirting.

 

[DoubleD]

Bit of a wasted weekend

Well.. monday again. Bit of a wasted weekend though. I WAS intending to start the weekend with a BANG and go to the latin american dancing course.. BUT.. after having worked out too hard at the gym my arms were locked from friday afternoon till saturday evening at a 90 Degree angle. I felt soooo stupid, and what a shame too.. there is only 1 weekend a week. Anyway I was slightly recovered Saturday night, but since I hadn't organised anything I headed out to some local joints. I was out alone and the local joints didn''t look that appealing.. now this is somewhat of an excuse but i really need to plan ahead and head into central milan to have a real party.. the local joints were packed with men and couples..

The only bootcamping I did get to do was on Sunday.. again @ Gym met 2 ugly girls.. which I normally wouldn't have bothered with but thought I'd better chat to just for kicks. So chatted to them for about 10 mins and then took off. I did also meet a guy at the gym who owns a pormos company.. they do all sorts of things for clubs and pubs.. so its a good contact to have. Goal for this week is to talk to and maybe even number close as many HB as I can find.. although thats just it.. when you really start to look its HARD to find what you like.

Of other positive news the HB i picked up outside the Super Markert invited me out on Sunday.. but since I don't know her that well I told her that I was too busy and would call her during the week. She wanted me to hang with her all day.. and frankly I'd rather just go for a drink or a coffee first.. then if she's interesting we can look at longer activities!

How is everyone else going!?