Warning: long! Thoughts from the abyss after 2 years between posts and an LTR

bukowski_merit

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why are you sleeping in the same bed as her?
my ex and me lived out the 6 months of our lease under the same roof...i stayed in basement, she stayed in room... i brought girls over - she the same guy... they argued constantly and girls i had over would listen to them and crack up...

but anyway - if i wasnt staying in the basement - id have slept on the couch in the living room...

---
she does not deserve a last fvck!
in your head, to even consider that, you must still believe you can get her back.
listen, even if that fvck made emotions come back to her - and she wanted you back - there's a 99% chance she'd do this stuff again within a month... you need massive time apart....

fvck someone new.
 

thecurtainfalls

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Bukowski, I appreciate you being a voice of reason right now. As you can tell my mind still isn't right. My rational and emotional minds are at war with one another.
 

Furyguy

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Great post man, read every word of it. Never been there myself, but it's an amazing story of all the good and bad that can come out of a serious relationship. Simultaneously a warning sign and glimpse of pleasures yet to come.

The work never ends, eh? Thanks for sharing, I know you will be all good in time.
 

Joe Stud

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Remember, these things happen to the best of us. Its the men (dj's) who bounce back that are the winners in life. when you fall, get up. life deals us these dissapointments... stop beating yourself up. sounds like you have learned from this experience, and go forth and conquor my lad. good luck to ya.
 

sodbuster

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YOu apparently took the breakup better than she expected. She was expecting you to beg and you didn't. So now maybe she has a change of heart and wants you back[for now][may have been the mother of all **** tests]. IF you want the make up sex,go ahead-you could probably have her back as a GF-just make sure you never go afc again. Let her know if she tries it again, she is GONE.

Of course it may be just goodbye sex.
 

thecurtainfalls

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sodbuster said:
YOu apparently took the breakup better than she expected. She was expecting you to beg and you didn't. So now maybe she has a change of heart and wants you back[for now][may have been the mother of all **** tests]. IF you want the make up sex,go ahead-you could probably have her back as a GF-just make sure you never go afc again. Let her know if she tries it again, she is GONE.

Of course it may be just goodbye sex.

sodbuster: I think you may have EXACTLY nailed it.

As an update, I apparently DID take the breakup better than she expected, exactly as you say. I was a total AFC while she was breaking up with me, after which point I headed to SoSuave that night and have been feeding her a steady diet of no contact as much as possible. I was gone ALL day yesterday while she stayed home... as much as it has been killing me to be in the same bed with her at night, she keeps rolling over to face me and get close to me, and "accidentally" resting her arm on me and stuff.

Now today my best friend calls me and tells me that he had a talk with her last night, and that she seems really depressed and thinks that I'm completely over it... and that while she didn't say it outright, he got the impression that she feels really stressed and like she made a horrible decision.

I'm posting this update for two reasons: number one, to give a real life field report that "no contact"/ganji games WORKS, or appears to be working for me in this situation. At the VERY least, I have confused her and startled her emotions in a way that she did not expect. At best, I gave her a week long dose of what life is like without me, and she realizes that I PASSED the mother of all **** tests (like sodbuster said).

Either way, I will continue to update the thread for DJs or DJs in training that can find something useful from this tricky situation.

And fear not, DJs -- if she does indeed come crawling back, which my friend who talked to her says is imminent -- it WILL be on my terms. I have distanced myself emotionally enough in the last week to realize the horrible AFCisms I perpetuated throughout the entire course of our relationship. Not only will I never be THAT dependent on this (or any other) person again, but I have realized my own self worth. I remembered the quality of girls I was hooking up with 2.5 years ago before this LTR, and I think "hey, that's still me". I'll be fine either way -- maybe with some extra scars or tough lessons learned, but I'll be okay.

Thank you all once again for your support.
 

gonnamakeit

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Dude. Don't think about sex or a relationship again. (if you were just horny like you told yourself you would wnat to see any girl naked not just her). It's her ego that wants you. So look at this if she broke up with you and you were upset she wouldn't want you but since your not upset she does want you and regrets it. If you don't want her she wants you if you do she doesn't. She just wants to see how important and great she is by seeing how a guys gets so upset at "losing" her. Screw that ego sh1t she just wants you back now because it'll fix the damaged ego from you not getting all upset then she won't want you anymore. Why would you want to go back and have a relationship and her desire for you only based on her ego. (she would break up with you again and not want you anyway). And don't contact her so you can get over her not so you can see her upset at you. Ganji games so you can see her wanting to be with is the exact same ego drive that she has wanting to see how important you are because of what a strong emotional effect you can have on others.

But good post I learned from it. The whole loving how people were impressed by your hot girlfreind really resonates with me. I wanted to have people see me get girls and get girls in tough situations and know I get the hottest girls. i realize now girls are not something to use to impress people or an accomplishment to get. Girls are for enjoyment only that is the motivation for getting them purely for enjoyment.
 

bukowski_merit

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trust me man... you may win her back emotionally temporarily... but without a long-term breakup... or another girl coming immediately into the picture - she will be back to herself very soon...

you can try... and best of luck to you... but i believe you'll be back... it's way too soon for her feelings to suddenly change...

i've heard tons of guys advised not to have "discussions" about things with women doing something they didn't like.... then they say they're going to do it... and come back on here and brag "i told her we weren't having enough $ex, and we had a 10 hour arguement and in the end - she agreed to more $ex".... then 2 months later - they'll be back saying "$ex went bye-bye again"... or "she's back to acting b!tchy"...

if you do go forward and do truely retake control of the relationship like you want to - be prepared for some resistance...

...

ps: the best ganja game of all is to not come home at all for one night/weekend.... all the chips will hit the table then...
 

C-quenced

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to cut down on this - we ended at about 4 years in... over some real dumb stuff.... i got a head start though =) i found this site and a few others BEFORE THE BREAKUP! (mostly to stop it from happening)

that still didnt stop it from happening.. but when it happened and she finally said 'we're through' - - - i feel a big change in me happened.... i smiled, acknowledged she said it - grabed my pillow off the bed... went into the basement (my video games, workout stuff, hangout area was down there) and played madden until 3am in the morning! without one tear... without one care...

LARGELY BECAUSE OF SITES LIKE THIS... BECAUSE I KNEW THAT MY LIFE WAS ABOUT TO BECOME AMAZING! I KNEW I WAS GOING TO SOAK UP EVERYTHING I COULD AND BECOME A LOT MORE HAPPY THAN I HAD BEEN THE LAST YEAR...

and i havent looked back...


I admire your determination :up: . Did you at least have any skepticism regarding the info on the site?

And to the OP: I also went through a very similiar situation in a 2 and a half year relationship. It was terrible. It was so bad that I've literally attempted every AFC move in the book to try to win this one back. This was a girl (and this is even more embarrassing) I never even had sex with due to christian values. In other words I f*cked an entire 2.5 years out of my life on someone who would turn out to be EXACTLY the same as the Laura (was that her name?) chick you described.

The only thing I can say now is to not allow feeling sorry for yourself to become a habit. It's happened to me and now (2 years later) I'm attempting to bring myself out for good and enjoy the rest of whatever my life has to offer. I wish you the best of luck.
 

Sandow

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Dude, it was inevitable, you guys were way too young to be living together. Yea, you can blame you AFC moves but c'mon, you know she was going to branch out and meet new people at some point.

In my opinion, I don't think there was anything you can do, even if you were still applying ur DJ principles. Did you ever talk about marriage? If not, this is just the natural course of young relationships. Anyways, you guys were too young to be that serious. Your single now, enjoy it!!!
 

Sandow

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looks like i missed the update, if you guys are back togther than kudos...but i dont think its a good idea. i dont wanna sound harsh here but it sounds like she is confused. if you guys get back togther and she will most likely develop the same feelings she had before. its like putting sour milk back in the fridge hoping it'll be better tomorrow. not gonna happen.
 

sodbuster

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IF you do get back together, tell her "I gave up too much of my life for you in the past,but I won't this time." and DO some of the things you gave up for her. Rebuild your social circle and have fun. SHe wants to pull this sh1t again, you'll already know the women you want to date next. My cousin had his wife tell him"we should think about a trial separation",he told her"separations are for pu$$ies,bring home the paperwork for a divorce and I'll help you fill it out"-still married.
 

thecurtainfalls

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gonnamakeit: Point taken. Like I said before, although I have a pretty good perspective on things right now and I definitely am in no danger of going AFC again any time soon, my mind still isn't right from being suddenly severed from my LIFE as I knew it the last 2.5 years. It helps a lot to read you guys' advice because what you all are saying is connecting with me very well on an intellectual level. Getting my emotions to match that is going to take time, unfortunately. I'm glad you enjoyed my story and identified with part of it.

bukowski: You've given me some pretty solid advice so far bro, and I do definitely see what you're saying. It could easily devolve back into where we were before. Although in the spirit of complete honesty, which this thread is 100%, I have to admit there is probably a certain scenario where I would consider trying one last time with her. This is borne out of my respect for the 75% of our relationship which wasn't ****ty, as well as the investment I've already made. But in a big way the damage is already done and I would probably end up doing what sodbuster suggests below (more on that in a second)

c-quenced: Ouch dude. I can sympathize with you on one front, I haven't had sex with my (now) ex in 3 weeks probably. My horniness is already at levels unseen since the Clinton administration.

Sandow: I got a lot out of your posts. I think you're right -- I don't take the majority of the blame for the situation deteriorating, but I do believe I had a hand in it, and I especially believe that I killed it faster than it would have died out naturally on its own. Part of me grudgingly BELIEVES what you are saying... that it is the natural course of a relationship like ours for two people our age. We're not really at the point in our lives where settling down like this is conducive to everything else we're trying to accomplish. But then again, it worked pretty damn well for quite a while, so who knows. I don't particularly think it's a great idea to give it another shot either, but like I said before I have been feeling weak occasionally and I admit I am considering it.

However, I want to note that for some reason, my desire to reunite with "Laura" is strongly based in current feelings of horniness. Some delusional part of me thinks I can have no-strings-attached sex with her a few more times before it's over. It's something that has occupied a lot of my thoughts the last two days. You have to understand, I've never had access to (warning: graphic descriptions ahead) sex with a girl that was A) so hot B) loved nothing more in life (for a while at least) than having me pull out of her and sucking me off to completion, then swallowing C) eager for me to ram her as hard as I could D) being as accomodating (positions, jizz locations, etc) as I wanted. I'm just being real here -- I've had some decent romps in the past with some cute girls but nothing compared to my sex life in this relationship, where I'd literally feel like I was going to bust the biggest nut every single time. It's one thing to say "go fvck someone new" but in all reality, there's no way I'm going to quickly or easily find someone to have such awesome sex with, considering how much I took myself out of the game the last 2.5 years.

sodbuster: once again, you pretty much identified where I'm coming from here. I'm going to give her the speech, in the 10% chance that she does come crawling back, where I explain my terms. If she doesn't like it or starts to put up too much resistance, I'm bailing. I may be confused and horny right now but I'm done letting myself get walked on. If she does sound agreeable with the idea of giving it another real shot, then like you said sodbuster, I'm going to spend a lot more time doing my own thing... both for my own benefit, and to make sure I'm properly positioned if and (likely) when it fizzles out.

The important thing, I think, that I'm taking away from this right now is how her breaking up with me ripped the band-aid off of my terribly dependent ass, and got me to see the error of a lot of my ways. The bottom line is, there's a way to love someone and also love yourself enough to know that you'd be fine in the end with or without them.
 

Oxide

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The "love chemicals" in your brain go away after 18 months, so it is very usual to lose attraction at that point.

Do you understand now why marriage is hard work, and is based on honesty, trust and respect, not just how many times you **** (and it is always a lot less after the first year)

May be I skimmed too much, but what did you actually learn?

you said you turned into AFC, so what do you imply, that you didn't really compromise, you just gave away all your positions at her whim (and even before that?)

I want a list of specific things that you learned. Thank you!
 

thecurtainfalls

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Oxide said:
The "love chemicals" in your brain go away after 18 months, so it is very usual to lose attraction at that point.

Do you understand now why marriage is hard work, and is based on honesty, trust and respect, not just how many times you **** (and it is always a lot less after the first year)

May be I skimmed too much, but what did you actually learn?

you said you turned into AFC, so what do you imply, that you didn't really compromise, you just gave away all your positions at her whim (and even before that?)

I want a list of specific things that you learned. Thank you!
I learned:

-It is very hard work to make a relationship work, especially making another person want to make it work when they have other things going on in their life too.

-Constantly supplicating and approaching the relationship from a position of wanting to make sure that I'm protecting/coddling/supplicating to her so that she feels "happy" or "comfortable" is a great way to **** everything up

-Getting too comfortable and going on autopilot isn't good either

-I learned that ****ing the **** out of a beautiful woman over a consistent period of time probably ranks in the top three things I'd like to keep doing in the immediate future

-Most importantly, and central to my recent epiphany is my realization that I was basing my self-worth on having her way too much. I allowed it to fuel my ego... I knew I had the hottest girlfriend of all my friends, they knew it, it was an amazing way of gaining me instant social proof when we were out. I'm not going to lie -- after largely fruitless high school years and a brief fear that I'd never really be successful with women, I think a part of my subconscious really does feel like I have something to prove... and that led me to seeking validation from myself and others. Now, let me just be clear for a moment: I don't mean to make it sound like our relationship was that one-dimensional, like it was one giant ego orgy for me. That's not true at all... I was really selfless in a lot of ways toward my ex, and I just loved the person that she was. The added ego boost from having a hot girlfriend was just a big mindfvcking bonus.



But that being said, since you skimmed, I'll just let you know that this is basically the first major relationship of my adult life, with someone that I basically was led to believe I had a long future with until things went south fast about 2 months ago. So I'm pretty mentally beat right now and at the point where I know what's good for me but it's just a question of following through on that.
 

Oxide

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thecurtainfalls said:
I learned:

-It is very hard work to make a relationship work, especially making another person want to make it work when they have other things going on in their life too.

-Constantly supplicating and approaching the relationship from a position of wanting to make sure that I'm protecting/coddling/supplicating to her so that she feels "happy" or "comfortable" is a great way to **** everything up

-Getting too comfortable and going on autopilot isn't good either

-I learned that ****ing the **** out of a beautiful woman over a consistent period of time probably ranks in the top three things I'd like to keep doing in the immediate future

-Most importantly, and central to my recent epiphany is my realization that I was basing my self-worth on having her way too much. I allowed it to fuel my ego... I knew I had the hottest girlfriend of all my friends, they knew it, it was an amazing way of gaining me instant social proof when we were out. I'm not going to lie -- after largely fruitless high school years and a brief fear that I'd never really be successful with women, I think a part of my subconscious really does feel like I have something to prove... and that led me to seeking validation from myself and others. Now, let me just be clear for a moment: I don't mean to make it sound like our relationship was that one-dimensional, like it was one giant ego orgy for me. That's not true at all... I was really selfless in a lot of ways toward my ex, and I just loved the person that she was. The added ego boost from having a hot girlfriend was just a big mindfvcking bonus.



But that being said, since you skimmed, I'll just let you know that this is basically the first major relationship of my adult life, with someone that I basically was led to believe I had a long future with until things went south fast about 2 months ago. So I'm pretty mentally beat right now and at the point where I know what's good for me but it's just a question of following through on that.


You did a great job on your reply.

I can totally see how you were getting validation from having the cute girl, it is normal, but I hear you grow out of it.

The wanting to bang a hot girl is just an extension of you wanting validation.

We should all learn to like ourselves through ourselves and not place so much validation on the outside factors like having a hot gf/ getting sex/ having a cool car.

Ask yourself this often - "if no one was around to see me do/have/ <THIS>, would I still want and enjoy <THIS>? Or am I doing this so other people can look at me?"

you'll be fine, just takes a little time. Go ahead and send me a pic of this girl, I will gladly tell you if she is as hot as you think she is. :up:
 

drak_ool

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dude i m in a hurry right now but i feel like i have to chime in my 2 cents cuz i REALLY feel you man...

Firstly, as someone else pointed out, why the hell are you sharing a bed with her? sleep on the futon/couch/inflatable mattress, watever, but not in a bed next to her, where your hormones will do the thinking. Scenario: for watever reason she starts initiating some hardcore action, grabbing your junk and shyt. In your stage of horniness, do you think your brain will be doing the decision making?

Secondly, so you think you can get her back on your terms, and have a healthy relationship with this girl? Think about it this way: she didn't break up with you over a spur of the moment thing/misunderstanding/because of some nasty rumour. She's been thinking about this for a while, as you pointed out yourself. Stuff b/w you two hasn't been working out for a WHILE, even before she made it official to you. So, in her mind, she s been done with you for quite some time.

BUT, you might ask, what if she changed her mind now? what if she in fact still loves me and is just realizing she can't live w/out me? However, do you think 1 week will make her change her perspective on you that she's been building up for 6+ months?

the answer is NO. The reason why she is second guessing her move is because it didn't go as she planned it out. She guessed that you would turn into a pathetic loser AFC, crying out and begging her to keep you, which in turn would make it a lot easier for her to despise you and get over you.

But you didn't do that (thank God! good job btw man), and now she is puzzled. Things didn't go according to her plan, she is puzzled, her emotions are all flustered and... she's got some renewed interest in you! However, as soon as you get close to her again, she ll revert back to the ho she really is, as examplified by how easy it was for her to just drop you in the first place.
Basically the reason why she's showing some interest now is because you are a bit of a challenge, not because she loves you, or thinks she wants to be back with you.

and honestly, do you want this girl back?
 

drak_ool

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ok, I still feel like I didn't truly get my point across...

Basically I can see 2 different scenarios when a girl breaks up with her long-time bf, and then gets back with him

SCENARIO 1: Her interest level is still high, everything is going good in the relationship, and then suddenly the bf does something really messed up in her eyes (usually revolving around cheating on her, or getting damn close to do it). She finds out, she flares up and she tells him it's over. But her interest level is still high. She still likes him, besides what he did. So she ends up rationalizing everything, especially if the bf apologizes, yet doesn't go AFC on her. And then they have a talk, and they end up back together. Notice, in this case, it's really the guy who's taking her back. He proved to her that he could live w/out her, while she proved to him that even though he cheated on her, she likes him so much that she is willing to overlook that. Balance of power in the relationship: clearly on the side of the dude.

SCENARIO 2: girl gradually loses interest over a period of months. Every day she gives her bf another chance, and at the end of every day she tells herself "no, I can't do this anymore". She ends up despising his AFC ways. Sure, she still feels simpathy and pity for him, but no more sexual attraction, no more interest in him. She breaks up with him, burying a dagger in his heart. At this point she proves to him that she don't need him in her life no more. And he does the right thing, goes no contact, and manages to rekindle some interest in the girl. She re-initiates contact, they end up talking about it and they get back together. At this point, the guy shows the girl that the whole no contact thing was just him faking. He shows her that in fact he still wants her, he still has high interest for her, since he is willing to take back a girl who showed him that she does not need him.

who do you think has power in this relationship? Even though you think you can get this girl back on your terms, just the fact that you're thinking about taking her back shows that you still care a lot about her, which she will sense. You will never have her on your own terms, cut your loses before they get heavier...
 
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Drak, I think you're overanalyzing. Like someone else said, sometimes people just fall apart. Even Kelly left Zack in Saved By The Bell and he never did anything wrong. (Yes it's just a TV show, but it stands true.)

This just looks like 1.)The time came for them to split up. 2.)If she's as hot as he says she is, you can't make a h** a housewife no matter how hard you try.
 
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