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The universe doesn't care about the "retards"
Idk, because you want to fvck the most attractive woman in the bar--who's probably at a table surrounded by orbiters and gfs--instead of settling on whatever chooses you? To have agency?
Make it make sense. So running your mouth for 5 to 15 minutes until you get a girl to show interest is earning her, but spending years (sometimes) to get a great job or a great body (which the hot girl probably doesn't even care about cause she's surrounded by guys who dunk on you by societal measures) isn't? Lol
50% lol? You either have compliance or you don't--and you can either demonstrate qualities that raise compliance or you can't. And that doesn't have to take a long time. I'm almost exclusively same night. Ya some girls might take 3 hrs vs 20 mins--just like you have to practice longer to shoot 3s than you would to make layups and you might miss more than the dude who only shoots layups--but who cares at that point? I'd rather spend 3 hrs on the girl I really want than dip out with whatever decides I'm the best they're doing that night.
Nah. It's not that binary. Confidence leads to achievements which leads to confidence which leads to achievements. Obviously past success helps--until your ego's so invested in past success that you're too afraid to roll up on the hottest girl at the bar because her back might be too you lol. And the most successful people usually face the most rejection and the most failure and remain confident in spite of that--read the biography of literally anyone worthwhile lol.
Show me where I advised anyone to ignore body language lol. I'm just saying that you can roll up on girls who aren't conveying initial interest and still make things happens a good % of the time--so why worry about that waiting for that initial interest?
I would. It's like waiting for the perfect job to recruit you instead of applying to the ones you want. I roll with naturals all the time--guys that get laid plenty but who rely on waiting for choosing signals. I'm fvcking hotter girls.
This is true almost across the board--almost everyone in the "community" who actually goes out and approaches has noted this. If they didn't have higher barriers to entry they'd literally be incessantly bombarded with so much male attention they wouldn't be able to function and all the guys they fvcked would be needy, clingy, insecure, etc. since they didn't even have the self-belief to roll up on her. (Also, almost everyone exaggerates the hotness of the girls they fvck--I've hung out with wayyy too many "wait for choosing signals" guys and seen what "chooses" them; there's a definite ceiling).
It's not binary. I definitely pay attention to body-language pre-approach. I said as much earlier in this thread. I don't spam anymore because I don't need to--but I also don't wait for IOIs--because I don't need to. But I learned infinitely more from spamming--which I did do for a couple years--than I did in my late teens/early 20s when I had to wait for girls to show interest before leading things forward. I've fvcked girls who I was convinced hated me right up until the point I was undressing them.
It doesn't matter. "Talking to my friends" is her frame. "Taking her home" is mine. Strongest frame wins. I never tracked stats, but vast, vast, vast majority of my bar pulls were girls who were talking to other people, sometimes other guys. Doesn't matter (tho obviously logistics and group management do). I've never lived in a city where hot girls who were 18-22ish went out solo.
I've never been much of a daygamer, but the hottest girl I've ever pulled from DG (not technically a pull cause we met up later cause I was on my way somewhere) was literally walking from the bank to her car with her back facing me. Didn't matter, I just rolled in and assumed that she liked me. And I prefer to get eye contact pre-approach, but that's not always possible, and it doesn't really matter. What matters is what happen after you open your mouth.
So will social calibration. Tho initially you will weird a lot of girls out, that shouldn't be happening vast, vast majority of the time.
So did I when I was starting out--doesn't really happen if your vibe and delivery are on point and you're reacting to their feedback--you startle the girl, step back, smile, palms up, say some sh1t that forces her to chase. Worst case scenario is typically, "Oh, we have to go to the bathroom" after a minute or two. Cya (granted vast, vast majority of my approaches have been in bars and clubs, where that behavior is expected and normalized--on the street, I'm typically a little more circumspect.
I've never gotten that particular one, except when girls ask me to buy them drinks and I tell them no, which is really just a sh1t test as well. In those cases, I usually like, "Girl, you suck at this. There's literally hundreds of thirsty fvckers who are just hoping for the chance to buy you a drink--and you're asking me?" Sometimes I'll be like, "Watch this" and open some dude beside us and intro them and tell buddy it's her birthday. Sometimes I'll go into some spiel about how fvcked up it is that most guys buy girls drinks to manipulate them into sleeping them because they're so pathetic they don't even feel like they deserve the girls attention without bribing them and I like girls who like me for me. Neither of those work 100% of the time--some girls, even ones that open you or throw massive IOIs, are really just trolling for drinks--their loss; but I'd guess that those work for me well over 60%-70% of the time
After enough experience, it's old hate. I know what attraction is. Sometimes, it's passive or other times it's overt. Irrelevant. I shoot my shot just cause. Modern women are a dumpster fire. Ran through and ****ed up. She could false accusation Chad or Tyrone for not getting the ring.
If hot women don't care about looks how come online dating is so detrimental?
Gonna keep this stupid vague, cause I don't wanna be doxxed or have some girl randomly find this and recognize herself. Most obvious example was super early in my game journey--I'd slept with some hot girls but only ones that showed obvious interest and helped lead interactions towards sex (minus one who became my ex). Girl from social circle at a house party. Wouldn't make eye contact. Wouldn't engage much in conversation. Would constantly triangulate. Only girl there so I just kept trying different sh1t I'd read online or stuff that'd worked for me in the past. Ended up sleeping adjacent to each other in the living room. She pretended to be asleep. I said fvck it and started talking to her. She wasn't asleep. Tried to get her over to my side of the living room. She wouldn't budge. Grabbed her wrist at one point and saw here eyes light up but was too noob to interpret that as meaningful interest--only IOI in probably 5 hrs. She left the next day, thought she hated me. She told my buddy she liked me and I was like, the fvck she does. Hit her up on SM; chatted a day or two; invited myself over when I was near her city. Cold, standoffish, literally sat on the floor across the room from me. Told her "Come here." "Why?" "Because I said so." She did, ended up carrying her to her bedroom. We were off and on for most of 3 yrs--messy cause I didn't know how to handle non-exclusive frame and it was long distance.
Don't know, don't use it. Really hot girls aren't on there anyway unless it's to plug their IG or OF (every guy I know who uses OLD IRL bangs 5s, 6s, some 7s, and maybe an 8 when he gets really, really super lucky and usually ends up with a fvcked up self-image as well as skewed perception of female hotness that's bound by rationalizations of what's attainable to him and what he feels entitled to--but I'm sure there are exceptions). Most girls keep their default age set to end at 25 or w/e, so non-starter for me.
You look exactly the same whether a girl makes eye contact with you pre-approach or plays with her hair or w/e or you tap her on the shoulder when she's standing at the bar.
This has nothing to do with anything. I have a high SMV (tho mostly looks and status in groups where I was already established--took me much longer to learn how to establish status wherever I am, mostly thru subcomms and getting ppl to qualify, very little money thru the peak of my game career)--I got blown tf for months when I first started cold approaching. But once I learned some verbal game, practiced my subcomms, practiced my tonality, etc., I got better results and more consistent results than I did before when I relied on IOIs and social circle. I also know guys IRL who don't have high SMV--if you're defining SMV by looks, money, status--both naturals and from the community who fvck way out of their league--again just with verbal game, subcomms, and being proactive. Ofc looks, money, status helps but behavior + game trumps those by a wide margin (until you start getting into celebrity or minor celebrity status). I know dozens of good looking, jacked, and/or rich dudes who don't fvck at all or fvck "age appropriate" women or girls who are way below what they should be able to get--but that's what happens when you let the market choose you instead of choosing your market. Just like most guys work sh1tty jobs (even if they pay well) they don't like because they settle for what's easily attainable without much risk and rationalize the rest.
Or you can just assume more risk or build the right relationships and make more money more quickly than you could on any "career" trajectory or "paying your dues"--sometimes beyond what you're "qualified" for by your resume or past achievements (outside of being an NFL player or some sh1t). If we're dealing in metaphors lol.
I was the one who made the "only the strong survive" comment and I was not involved in yall argument so idk wtf you mentioned that for with ya dumbass.
You right. Your first post was circumspect & spot on. I was spray-and-praying--didn't mean to hit you with collateral damage. Stand by the rest of my argument.
Just started shooting and hit a innocent bystander lol
Agree with everything you said.
My point was to avoid low interest women who give few short signals, and go for the high interest ones.
You said that you have not been much of a day game guy. I have been more day game than night game in the past decade. One of the big advantages of doing approaches in a non-bar setting is easier isolation. A woman at the grocery store or on an outdoor walking path is more likely to be isolated than a woman at the bar.
I would say that my 6'4" ex college athlete friend is the closest to a natural I've seen. His frame was strong when he was actively picking up. He ended up settling down and get married. If you look at his life now, it's a typical married guy in the suburbs life. It looks very beta.
You make a good point about hot women playing it very nonchalant and about the ceiling on choosing signal guys.
Yes when I walk into a busy venue, I know there will be a lot of eyes on me. However this is not the important part. Like at this stage. Don't worry about missing out on which ones are looking at you. There will be girls making a mental note to either signal you to approach them (end up next to you at the bar, or positioning themselves so they end up within your line of sight so that you don't miss them (even tho they are not looking at you) or approach you themselves. However at the moment you enter a venue, some girls could be busy doing something else where they did not notice you enter the venue. They could for instance be using the bathroom, ordering a drink, talking to their friends in person or through text. Or may have not arrived yet.
Speak for yourself, I know and grew up with plenty of friends and acquaintances who are eating very good from cold Approaching.