The counseling profession and their mindgames.

[Scaramouche]

DearMessageBoy,
Your latest post,is so measured so insightful, a very valuable contribution to this thread which is fast becoming one of the most interesting blow by blow accounts we have had for a long while...I go further than you,It was Jophils strong personality that attracted this Lady,she is it seems a leaf in the Stream,probably a bit mixed up?but she needs people who tell her what to do.Just now Leanne seems poised to take over Jophils role,well good luck it won't come cheap....I like the way that Jophil handled this thing but even though the Machiavellian approach of completely crushing your opponent like a ****roach does have its place,problem is I don't see people I sleep with as the enemy,it takes so long to find,groom and become comfortable with someone that I cant just cast them away like a soiled shirt...there are many examples of great leaders in the past who showed magnanamity,Julius Caesar and Alexander the Great spring to mind,and then there are equally successful conquerors like Ghenghis Khan and Joe Stalin,it depends really do you want to rule a burnt and conquered land or rule in peace and harmony?...In every situation in life take time out to consider your actions,think through what you want to keep before you destroy everything.So Jophil has won a very important Battle,but has he lost the War?Only time will tell.

 

[squirrels]

If you're TRULY "tired of putting up with women's games", then I don't even think you're benefitting from answering the phone and joking about "sex slaves" and such. If I put myself in her head, she knows you're just doing that to be a d!ck...which isn't your intention. (or maybe it is...who knows)

It's easy to "give advice" when you're sitting here watching from the outside, but what I'm thinking is that after you got up and walked, you should've just cut contact entirely...stopped answering the phone, stopped returning texts, Emails, all of it.

Then wait.

Then wait some more.

Wait until you get what you really want...either complete, apologetic capitulation and begging of forgiveness, or her just going away. If you're truly "fed up", either is an acceptable outcome.

I'll tell you...a lot of the reason I don't date women any more, don't go out of my way to meet or attract or date women, is because I know eventually, I will make her cry. Either she will start trying to rush the relationship and cry when I want to just let it develop at a natural pace, or she'll cry when she starts feeling guilty about having sex, or she'll cry for some other stupid sh!t, but she'll cry. They all cry.

And I don't WANT to make women cry. But they'll cry anywhere they are...they've been taught that their privileged and wonderful lives are drama-cases ready to happen and they're looking for any reason at all to make problems for themselves...and with the "men are evil" feminist attitude, a relationship is the quickest way to drama for a woman.

I honestly think sometimes they develop TACTICS for p!ssing men off, just to get them to react in a way that causes drama, so they can vilify them.

I want to reach and maintain a higher level of living...and at this level there isn't sufficient drama to satisfy a woman. Oh, there's action and adventure, and a fair share of comedy, maybe even some tragedy. But NEVER sufficient drama.

And every...EVERY time I try to come back into the woman's world, it turns out to be a DREADFUL mistake...she inevitably rapes me with drama, forces me to play a role I want no part of, makes me feel foolish, emasculates me, dehumanizes me for not wanting to participate in the same drama-games that every other "couple" participates in.

I was never a misogynist before. I dunno what happened to me. But I can't even go out and just "hook up" with a woman any more. Partly because I just don't want to have sex with a woman who can't enjoy it for what it is.

I may be so jaded that *I* can't enjoy it for what it is. It makes me feel old when I watch all the other people in the world just "giving up" and "settling down" and accepting an end to the adventure they used to be so passionate about in favor of some nonsense "housebroken" lives. Emphasis on "broken".

 

[jophil28]

If you're TRULY "tired of putting up with women's games", then I don't even think you're benefitting from answering the phone and joking about "sex slaves" and such. If I put myself in her head, she knows you're just doing that to be a d!ck...which isn't your intention. (or maybe it is...who knows)


.

You are right, of course.I am being a d1ck and like Tokyo Joe said I am indulgimg in ego gratification. I have no problem with ego gratification.

My concern is that HB apparently has some gripes with me that she has never revealed to me. She then consulted a psych under the pretext of resolving some issues with her sister and her father. Her sessions turned into bytch fests with me as the object of derision ,and Leanne fed into her grievances . I know of this woman but she and I have never met.
Instead of working on HB's protests , Leanne saw an irresistible opportunity to undermine my relationship with HB to fulfill some bizarre feminist agenda..

After all the drama that has been created by her and me in the past few days, I still have no clue about why she was unhappy enough to "see someone" .
I am willing to listen to her complaints, but it is her responsibility to shape her words and push them out of her mouth.., but as long as she and Leanne collude and conspire in their mindgames, I will continue to have some fun with a little more oneupmanship' ...or perhaps I will just call one of my perky '20 something' dance students and see if she wants to go out to dance some Salsa.

 

[Luthor Rex]

As for psychologists: they have to go to therapy themselves throughout their studies, because most of them are mental cases themselves. Mental cases are drawn to psychology like moths to a flame. I talked to a girl who studied psychology, and she said more than 2/3 of her class were head cases.

I first noticed this a long time ago when I was in college and took some psych classes for a general requirement.

I firmly believe that a lot of the people signing up for psych are doing so to figure out what is wrong with themselves.

They really need to make some kind of requirement that mental illness bars you from being a therapist.

 

[WaterTiger]

I'm reminded of the old joke:

A woman needs a man to listen to her problems & give her support.
A woman needs a man to help with household chores.
A woman needs a man to be a passionate & expert lover.
A woman needs a man to protect her from the dangers of the world.

A woman needs to make sure these men NEVER know about each other!

JoPhil, I'm usually your biggest fan...but I think you might have taken it a bit too far BEFORE this situation came to a head. The "Loveable *******" is a great guy to hang out with, but unless you're approachable, you'll never be more than that. I don't know all the details of your relationship, but...

I read all over this site about "Don't be a fool and listen to her problems! Only weak, pissy little AFC's ever listen to a woman's problems!" That's fine when your first starting out, but in a relationship, you have to listen sometimes. Otherwise, she'll tell some one else...and the REAL trouble starts.

If she can't talk to YOU...who DOES she talk to?

 

[The Message Boy]

Water Tiger says,

I read all over this site about "Don't be a fool and listen to her problems! Only weak, pissy little AFC's ever listen to a woman's problems!" That's fine when your first starting out, but in a relationship, you have to listen sometimes. Otherwise, she'll tell some one else...and the REAL trouble starts.

Thank you.

 

[The Message Boy]

Scaramouche I agree to an extent but I'm not sure that Jophil has "won" the battle because the chick never entered into anything.

I know from experience I've been under shrinks and their entire intention is to get you to speak about problems and try to pinpoint how to make you "feel" better about yourself. Not sure really what this shrink said to Jo's girl but I think it was just to get the girl to stop putting so much emphasis or importance on particular people to fulfill all her needs. But the girl hasn't actually DID anything yet.

Desert Fox says,

This tool is either:

1) a dumbass
2) a woman
3) someone who likes getting emotionally azz raped by other people

Ignore him!

1.) YOU make a response like that but I'm the dumbass? Let me get this right, out of ALL the things you could be doing you log in and type up a response like that? No contribution to the discussion, no nothing. And I'm the DUMBASS?
2.) AS IF you've actually had one of those in awhile
3.) NOW I understand why you are obsessed with me. It takes a fag-mindset think up fag **** like you just did.

Yes I will ignore you.

 

[brokenupinside]

I first noticed this a long time ago when I was in college and took some psych classes for a general requirement.

I firmly believe that a lot of the people signing up for psych are doing so to figure out what is wrong with themselves.

They really need to make some kind of requirement that mental illness bars you from being a therapist.

Psychs are manipulators.
They want to have control and they think the quickest way to gain control is to go to school for 4 years and learn about other peoples minds and how they work.It gives them a sense of superiority,that they know something you don't,a key to unlock secrets or interpret them.
Most of them are head cases,the ones that are not are in it just for the money and don't give a fuuk and the ones that care should not be therapists cause they get emotionally involved.:crazy:

 

[brokenupinside]

I don't thinnk Jophil jumped the gun....what is there to do once SHE tells you that she may need more men to fulfill her,right there she planted the seed of doubt forever.
What she is showing is that she is looking for someone to lead her out of the state she's in and right now it's the therapist.
It may very well be Jophil instead,so I would either tell her to foff like he did or say fuuk the therapy what you need is this and lead.Isn't this what this forum preaches?.
Or suggest a 4 way with 2 other guys and say ..."I call your azz first!".

 

[Warrior74]

Do the worst thing you can possibly do to them Jophil, leave them to suffer the consequences of their own actions.

In their world do you really think they even acknowledge consequences? Trust he will be blamed and shamed as being "weak and insecure" for walking away from her in her hour of "need and confusion". This will be the proof the therapist needs to twist this woman's mind in which ever way she see's fit. If this woman has serious problems, I hope she gets serious help, but if Jophil runs into her on the street as a crazy baglady five years from now..well we know what happened.

As grown women, they gotta be smart enough to not even entertain the thought of saying that their therapist suggested they should have 3 other guys. I mean who says that sort of thing with out thinking it through? I would expect that from a child, but not from an adult in a relationship. Unless she's just stupid and naive, how else could you take it, but as an attack? And if she's stupid and naive she needs to be cut loose anyway.

 

[MSwrestler]

LOL! Another real world example of the professionalism of a 'professional' woman. She ignores the identified real issue with her sister and father, immediately digs your existance to the surface and then proceeds to denegrate you in your girls eyes.

But of course as a master of manipulation, she just can't come out and say she is a womans studies degreed bitter feminist who hates men, she instead encourages her to date 4 men at the same time under the disguise that this is what she "needs" to be happy. All the while knowing that such an absurd piece of advice is guaranteed to implode leaving her devasted and ultimately hating all men; the counselors goal thereby accomplished.

The parasitic feminist meme almost found a new host.

Now the question is, will you take her back? It sounds like her only crime is being guilable. Red flag? I don't know. She was an emotional wreck hitting the booze after her therapy sessions. Obviously she was under the influence of a feminist who used her medical training to crawl inside your girls head.

Feminist don't hate men, they hate women. Feminist are anti-women, they hate the fact that they are suck with tit's and vags.

 

[guru1000]

Whatever the reason may be, Jophil felt disrespected and initially handled it properly.

I am assuming she was already in a probation status as a result of her daddy issues and therapist.

Having dealt with BPD's, he is wise enough to know when to pull the eject button. He has taken preemptive measures to avoid a potentially destructive relationship and is a trained technician in frame control. He recognized a frame pull with a probationary recruit and acted accordingly.

Jophil does not need to justify his actions. He has years of fruitful and destructive relationships to know what is healthy for him. He loses nothing in overindulging his boundaries and everything in passiveness. A woman will always respect you as long as you respect yourself first.

He has set a firm boundary in place. All he needs to do now is make a decision in whether to continue or end this arrangement.

 

[zekko]

I've noticed that the relationships that tend to look "functional" are the ones that are in the process of producing an AFC or the ones in which the women are content to play their role.

You're probably right about this. You can't have two totally equal people as a couple or else who is going to break tiebreakers? Maybe this is why the Bible says the male is the head of the female. Someone has to be the dominant one. The moral of this story then is to be sure you find a woman who is content to play her role. That role is not to be steamrolled by the male, but it is ultimately a subordinate one.

On the other hand, I know guys who simply aren't up to the task, so their wives have to run things, being as they are more sensible. I think that's the exception rather than the rule though.

 

[Tazman]

My father is in a relationship with a woman who wants him to be the head of the household, she actually told me this.

She gave an example of how one day she made my father's coffee with decaf instead of regular caffeinated and he got pissed off. He yelled out for her to make the regular stuff (I guess she tried this before) and she described with a smile how it made her jump into action and make his regular coffee. She liked the fact that he got loud with her in a dominant way.

I have a sister who could be described as having BPD and she gets really obnoxious at times, like physically fighting obnoxious. She was making a lot of noise late at night one time and I had to get up early for work so I was getting very annoyed.

I tried to ignore it but I couldn't and I just built up this rage until finally I opened my door and screamed at the top of my lungs for her to shut up. Usually she would have words and try and make something more out of it, but to my surprise I didn't here a peep out of her after that. She could probably sense how aggravated I was and decided to opt out of pushing me any further.

Women, in their own way, will push you to become dominant and if you don't man up, which should come natural, you will become a doormat.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

Women will sh!t test men as autonomously and subconsciously as a men will stare at a woman's big boobs. They cannot help it, and often enough, just like men staring at a nice rack or a great ass, even when they're aware of doing it they'll still do it. Men want to verify sexual availability to the same degree women want to verify a masculine dominance / confidence.

 

[Alle_Gory]

This thread is full of awesome.

 

[jophil28]

I read all over this site about "Don't be a fool and listen to her problems! Only weak, pissy little AFC's ever listen to a woman's problems!" That's fine when your first starting out, but in a relationship, you have to listen sometimes. Otherwise, she'll tell some one else...and the REAL trouble starts.

If she can't talk to YOU...who DOES she talk to?

W.T., she has not told me anything yet for me to listen to.

Oh, we have had a few minor scraps. Small arms stuff -the smoke cleared in an hour or so.

I am not sure how or where you got the impression that I was unwilling to listen.
Perhaps you were assuming that she felt "unheard" by me so she talked to Leanne instead.

 

[Jitterbug]

W.T., she has not told me anything yet for me to listen to....

That is fairly standard modern women's behaviour. They always b!tch to their friends, family & the whole world first before actually talking to the man they're meant to be in a relationship with.

 

[jophil28]

That is fairly standard modern women's behaviour. They always b!tch to their friends, family & the whole world first before actually talking to the man they're meant to be in a relationship with.

Indeed, and they are usually unwilling to see how this 'bytching to others' contributes to the demise of their LTRs' or marriages.
Easier to just blame the guy for everything, but keep it a secret from him .

 

[Danton1975]

Jophil,

I want to bring attention here to one fact. You didn't give a response right away but got up to "use the bathroom." Very effective as it gave you time to collect yourself and your thoughts. In selling, we are taught that when we have a lead from a potential prospect calling us, we should put them on hold for 30 sec or so just to collect our thoughts and calm down and come up with some sort of response. Kudos to you for realizing you had to do some quick thinking before you responded.