So my GF's not so "innocent" after all, what to do..

[StringShredder]

Originally posted by Wyldfire
This girl IS going out of her way to accomodate Will. She didn't argue or complain when he told her he didn't want her hanging around "Simon". Her response indicates that she values Will and doesn't want him to be upset.

You are clueless. There are any number of reasons why she might not want Will to be upset, having nothing to do with her interest in Will.

Sometimes people act accomodating simply because they don't like aggressive confrontations. Then they quietly go about getting what they really want.

Will is quite irrelevant to her desire for the old buddy; she does not need his approval, but she is too weak to just go out and assert herself outright by saying: "Will, I'm going back to my old fvckbuddy. That's just what I really want. Deal with it".

I've taken the position I have on this not because I don't think there is a risk that she could do something wrong. I take this position because to this point she has NOT done anything to warrant Will just dumping her because of something that happened before she got involved with him.

Doh! It would not be because of her past!!! It would be because of her present behavior, which is that she basically wants to now continue with an old lover! It would also be because of her manipulative nature. ("Gee, look at the sexual choice I have; I went 5 months without it and then almost overnight I got me a fvckbuddy! That should tell you how important you are! I can replace you overnight!"). All done under the guise of contrition and honesty. ("Hey, sure I did a bad thing to you, but I'm so scrupulously honest, I let you know I'm about to do it!").

It's not wrong that she wants an old sexual playmate. People have a right to go after whatever they want. (Right DJ's?) It's other aspects of her behavior that are wrong.

IF he were to do that it would make him look SO WEAK and insecure to the girl and everyone else who knows the situation. That's the last thing he wants or needs. If he dumps this girl without having a VALID and SOLID reason it WILL make him look like an insecure pansy...period.

Not at all. What will make him insecure is if he's indecisive in the action, or if he goes around seeking validation for his decision. In other words, if he appears that he cares whether the action appears to have a valid reason to the rest of the world. No, he just has to ditch her with the absolute conviction that it's the right decision for him no matter what anyone thinks. If anyone comes up to him with doubts, he has to squash them swiftly and immediately.

I don't think a guy could ever look like an insecure pansy for ditching a woman - at least not in comparison to clinging to a woman in spite of having good reasons not to.

You want a valid reason to ditch her? Not only does she want her old buddy, she hasn't even had sex with Will yet. Come on, she doesn't find him sexually attractive and is stringing him along. It's bull****.

Man, I don't know where you're coming from with your bullshyt replies. Oprah?

 

[Adrian]

P.S. Double Standards are stupid and modern day people are begining to accept this nonsense. Pretty soon everyone would be convinced that the laws of physics could be bent.

 

[Wyldfire]

StringShredder...apparently you didn't bother listening to the part where Will told her he didn't want her having any contact with "Simon" and where she AGREED with his request without any complaints at all. The guy hangs out with all of her female friends. What many of you fail to realize is that in order to never see "Simon" this girl has to essentially give up all spending time with her friends when they do things as a group. She is willing to do that to make Will feel better and you guys are still biotching about her. I guarantee not a one of you would give up spending time with your group of friends just because you once had sex with one of the girls who is also friends with your friends. The fact that she is willing to make such a big concession PROVES that she doesn't deserve to get dumped.

Some of you guys are acting like Will posted that he walked in and caught his girlfriend having sex with this guy or something. All she did was have sex with a guy in her circle of friends BEFORE meeting Will. Yes, she asked if he minded if she still saw him as a friend...but that is because the guy hangs out with all of her female friends and she doesn't want to feel like she can't have any damn friends. And even though agreeing not to be around "Simon" means that she can no longer do group things with the rest of her friends...she is still willing to do that FOR WILL.

Anyone who is STILL insisting this girl has done something worthy of being dumped is a bonehead....period.

 

[Adrian]

Wyldefire. You do make your point. I mean... this guys chick did f*ck up regardless and it's going to scar him for a while. He does have his reason to feel the way he does yet I also believe she doesn't deserve to be dumped. It's pretty obvious that she sees this guy as something special. Women just comlicate things more than they are suppossed to be. At the same time though I think he should be very wary of her actions. You can never believe EVERYTHING that a woman tells you and thats a fact.

 

[Wyldfire]

Originally posted by Adrian
Wyldefire. You do make your point. I mean... this guys chick did f*ck up regardless and it's going to scar him for a while. He does have his reason to feel the way he does yet I also believe she doesn't deserve to be dumped. It's pretty obvious that she sees this guy as something special. Women just comlicate things more than they are suppossed to be. At the same time though I think he should be very wary of her actions. You can never believe EVERYTHING that a woman tells you and thats a fact.

Will actually was feeling okay about the situation. Then a few guys started telling him to dump her and acting like she had cheated on him and rubbed his nose in it or something. Yes, he should be wary of this "Simon" guy...which he would have been anyway. But ultimately...for right now, the girl hasn't done anything worthy of being dumped and to do so would really make Will look weak and insecure. If she DOES do something out of line, I would be the first one to tell him to give her the boot.

Yes, women complicate things by doing and saying things that men don't understand. That's part of life...and the very things that drive men crazy about women are the things that are so alluring that it makes you want them at the same time.

 

[Alpha Male]

Originally posted by Wyldfire
Will actually was feeling okay about the situation. Then a few guys started telling him to dump her and acting like she had cheated on him and rubbed his nose in it or something. Yes, he should be wary of this "Simon" guy...which he would have been anyway. But ultimately...for right now, the girl hasn't done anything worthy of being dumped and to do so would really make Will look weak and insecure. If she DOES do something out of line, I would be the first one to tell him to give her the boot.

Yes, women complicate things by doing and saying things that men don't understand. That's part of life...and the very things that drive men crazy about women are the things that are so alluring that it makes you want them at the same time.

And visa versa baby

 

[Wyldfire]

Originally posted by Alpha Male
And visa versa baby

Nah...you just annoy me because you're British. It has nothing to do with any "vice-versa" stuff, trust me.

 

[StringShredder]

Originally posted by Wyldfire
I guarantee not a one of you would give up spending time with your group of friends just because you once had sex with one of the girls who is also friends with your friends.

... and that would not mean that I'm seeing everyone individually in that group as a friend, and it wouldn't mean that I need to ask anyone permission to be with that group on account of some individual there, doh!

Permission-seeking behavior indicates some kind of guilt about something.

The right thing to say would have been: "Will, there is a guy in my circle of friends that I once had sex with. He means nothing to me, but I have to see him if I'm not to drop out of that entire circle of friends. I want to be with my friends only, not with him. I don't want to see him by himself at all. I just wanted you to know about that, so you know about it from me, and not by chance from someone else who will twist it around in some way."

No permission asking, because there isn't anything to ask permission for, right? It's information-sharing only.

Permission-asking means "I want to fvck with your head, but I'm just an amateur at it and still feel I have to get an okay from a person before I do it to them".

Some of you guys are acting like Will posted that he walked in and caught his girlfriend having sex with this guy or something. All she did was have sex with a guy in her circle of friends BEFORE meeting Will.

and has yet to have sex with Will himself, love of her life! Oops.

He didn't catch her in anything. She came forward and said she wants to be with an old "friend" haha. Nothing wrong with that, it's just that Will has to understand it's going to be a triangle situation (in which she's more intimate with the other guy and Will is more of the "friend").

Yes, she asked if he minded if she still saw him as a friend...but that is because the guy hangs out with all of her female friends and she doesn't want to feel like she can't have any damn friends. And even though agreeing not to be around "Simon" means that she can no longer do group things with the rest of her friends...she is still willing to do that FOR WILL.

and that's healthy or what? How long will that last?

Anyone who is STILL insisting this girl has done something worthy of being dumped is a bonehead....period.

So your point is now that she's in fact a complete doormat who will ditch all her friends to be with a guy, and that makes her good to stay with. That's not good either. I'd right away break up with a girl that was ready to ditch all her friends for me. No thanks. I don't need a "look what I sacrificed for us" guilt trap!

Oh, but she won't have sex with him - she who will find a fvckbuddy when she's horny? Hmm... Something just doesn't add up, there. The girl isn't frigid. She likes sex, and knows how to get it when she wants it. Where does Will fit in, or why doesn't he? Maybe they will start doing it when the friends are out of the picture and there is nothing to do? Maybe she can't love and be intimate with the same guy so she needs two?

Trust me, it will be a lot better if the girl just goes back with her circle of friends, "Simon" and all. Maybe in that very circle, there is a better girl for Will.

Think about what is going to happen if the girl cuts herself off from that circle for a while. There will be rumors that Will disallowed her from seeing her friends. Everyone will think that Will is some kind of possessive control freak or something. No girl will want anything to do with him. It's a trap!!!

Will should find someone who can constructively deal with conflicting emotions rather than generate guilt.

---

I've got the word on you Simon. You better just start rhymin'. Cuz you're the biggest star on your label. And them otha niggaz just crumbs off my table. - Snoop Dogg

 

[StringShredder]

Originally posted by Wyldfire
But ultimately...for right now, the girl hasn't done anything worthy of being dumped and to do so would really make Will look weak and insecure.

Dr. Phil psychology alert!

You're forgetting that Will doesn't even have to reveal his true reasons for breaking up with her! All he has to say is "Sorry, my attraction to you has kind of worn off in the past while, so I think we should go our separate ways."

Come on, what were you born yesterday? Will doesn't owe anyone any explanation for his actions, nor does he have to be concerned with their validity in anyone's eyes. That's the basis of insecurity: not taking action until you have peer approval.

As far as everyone is concerned, Will has simply lost interest and that's that.

Then it remains to be seen whether she goes to Simon or comes crawling back to Will.

Ditching someone is reversible. It's a tactic. In this case, it's probably the best one for revealing what she's about, so why not drag it out?

For all you know, she's testing Will. How much guilt can I lay on Will? How much can I get away with while still maintaining his interest? How long can I string him along without intimacy? Will's answer should be that he avoids guilt-trap situations, and won't let her get away with much, and that he has other options.

When Will breaks the news to her, he's not going to act upset. He's not going to have nervous body language. He's going to be calm and suave.

Yes, women complicate things by doing and saying things that men don't understand.

That you don't understand, maybe.

 

[Wyldfire]

You need to stop trying to analyze this girls behavior while looking at it through a man's eyes.

You're forgetting that this is a girl, not a guy and that a girl's value system regarding sex is the complete opposite of what a guy's is.

For a guy...if he eagerly had sex with one girl but was hesitant to have sex with another girl, then YES...it would mean that he was more interested in and placed a higher VALUE in the girl he had sex with than in the one he hesitated to have sex with.

Girls are NOT wired that way. Girls are EMOTIONALLY wired, NOT physically wired like guys. A girl who is willing to make sacrifices to make a guy feel better EMOTIONALLY places a higher value in him than she does a guy she is willing to NOT have contact with but has had sex with in the past.

You guys are trying to judge who she places more value in by using a man's value system instead of a woman's.

 

[The Rake]

Originally posted by Adrian
It's an insult to know that some other dude had his way with her and left happy while she comes on to you hoping that you would take the "left overs". Personally..... I take it as an indirect insult. It really ****ing pisses me off how some would let a woman get away with all the things they do.

Big Willy is this nutcase of woman's emotional friend while she craves Simon's hot rod still. Look, Big Willy, but don't touch. Simon received her sizzling hot bod with no emotional baggage while Big Willy still hasn't sniffed her pvssy after all this while. She's holding back with Big Willy because she likes him a lot. Yeah right.

 

[StringShredder]

Originally posted by Wyldfire
A girl who is willing to make sacrifices to make a guy feel better EMOTIONALLY places a higher value in him than she does a guy she is willing to NOT have contact with but has had sex with in the past.

The only test to actually prove that is for Will to distance himself from her. Say that he needs time apart, whatever.

I have a hard time seeing how person who withholds sex from you, acting like someone "innocent" who takes things slowly, and then brags about a past casual encounter to your face, can possibly care how you feel.

It doesn't matter if it's a man to woman, woman to man, or gay to gay, lesbian to lesbian. It's a very low tactic to play on someone.

 

[Fed X-Man]

Willy......you are lucky that you have gotten all this advice....I posted the same situation and a few people told me to dump her??? Wyldfire is the only one on this thread that has made any kind of sense of your situation and made me realize a few things about mine.

The problem here people for a guy like Willy or myself is that you do get this constant nagging visual in your head and it is very hard to shake. Willy has his Simon....I have my Russ, but what you have to realize Willy is that Simon may up his game and as said before "will not go silently into the night". I know for a fact that given the chance Russ would totally go for some play if it ever came his way again.....Willy....at all costs do not allow her to hang around this guy.....AT ALL!!!

The thing of it is....is that if FB wants to get laid again bad enough and you give him his shot by saying "yea' I guess so" then you might as well lay down a red carpet for him. When it comes to FVCKING there is no honor among DJ's....you can take that for what it's worth, but I will not allow her to see this guy in one on one situation ever again...just for the simple fact that I know how guys are because I am one and I've seen my boys play the man-***** role.

Just be careful man.....CYA brother....CYA with this chick. The visuals I can't really offer advice on because even though they have died down I still think about that **** at least once a day and when I see this guy again it will make it worse and that is why I try not to think about it and avoid that idiot as much as possible. Do not judge her though.....she did this before you met her man....was none of your business to begin with and if she did tell you without you asking then she told you for a reason, but people on here have twisted that reason around a thousand times, so unfortunatley you have to draw your own conclusions from why she told.......just remember your the DJ and you can kick her ass to the curb at any given moment.

 

[penkitten]

sheesh, this post isnt getting anywhere.
just start asking her to do more stuff with you, which would mean less time around the circle of friends that contain the previous fb.

 

[Fed X-Man]

No way.....no time around the previous FB at all...PERIOD. What guy would pass up the chance for a quickie after a little DJ'ing and smooth talk would get him that. CYA Willy!!!

 

[Fenderules]

wyldefire has this one.




wtf so theer is something wrong with a girl who like sex just for the sake of liking sex? i mean I personally am not free of that whole double standard thing but im not gonna dump a girl cause she and another guy were **** buddies........ thats so flippant. You guys that are saying that are really insecure. I mean so wha tif happens, big deal.

 

[Fenderules]

how would you feel it if she did not want you cause your were a **** buddy with another girl. maby that will make you think how trivial it is

 

[Adrian]

wtf so theer is something wrong with a girl who like sex just for the sake of liking sex? i mean I personally am not free of that whole double standard thing but im not gonna dump a girl cause she and another guy were **** buddies........ thats so flipp

Most girls like sex. But..... That doesn't mean they should go around f***ing everyone. It's wrong for a guy to do it but it's even more wrong when a woman does it. It's a hard thing to swallow when you find out that the woman you have feelings for was f***ing her "fb" like she was in a hardcore porn flick. Most guys find that very insulting. And it is. You really can't blame them for being insecure.

how would you feel it if she did not want you cause your were a **** buddy with another girl. maby that will make you think how trivial it is

what you just stated is an example of double standards. If the guy was a fb with another girl then so what? She should understand that it's a guy for crying out loud. Guys oftenly think with the wrong head. As long as the man isn't a player she should have almost nothing to complain about. a lot of you guys in this forum make me wanna puke sometimes. It's disgusting to know some of you think this way.

 

[Alpha Male]

Originally posted by Wyldfire
Nah...you just annoy me because you're British. It has nothing to do with any "vice-versa" stuff, trust me.

Charming. So after I agreed with you over Willy's problems, you're getting all nationalist on my ass. You just get better and better kid.

 

[Wyldfire]

Originally posted by Alpha Male
Charming. So after I agreed with you over Willy's problems, you're getting all nationalist on my ass. You just get better and better kid.

Actually, I'm old enough to be your mother...so "kid" doesn't apply.

British men tend to have bad attitudes towards American women...and usually assume they are all feminists. I find that to be both annoying and offensive because I am an anti-feminist. However, on this very forum I have been attacked many, many times by British (and a few Canadian) men who automatically assume I'm a feminist. On a few occassions I was actually saying the SAME thing they were saying and they were STILL attacking me and treating me like some radical feminist. That is what my comment about you being British meant. As politically incorrect as it is to say that men from certain countries annoy me...it's true. Of course there are a few exceptions, but it's happened enough where I've noticed a pattern.

Okay, we're off topic...but if you want to start a thread in Anything Else I'll respond to you there.