Monkey
Master Don Juan
That was more than an 'attempt' that was a fully blown stay the hell away from me big time dump!
Single again! Read my break-up email.
- Thread starter Rev
- Start date
That was more than an 'attempt' that was a fully blown stay the hell away from me big time dump!
Howie Farkes
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I'll second that!
You dis'ed her kids, infront of them, she dumped your ass and you still think she worships your ball sweat?
Lionheart
Master Don Juan
I agree with Tek.
I demand respect, if the woman can't sort her ****ing kids out to respect her man, after he has tried his best to get along with them, they that just shows the lack of respect that she has for him.
Or she's a bad parent (and possibly both)
Rev is getting off light here, and I am usually against retaliation due to the DJ principles, but I think Rev should shoot her an email back and explain a few things, she has got on her parental high-horse here, and she has to know that she should have intervened and sorted out her little brats.
If i was getting that crap from a single mother, I would respectfully ask her to respect me and get her kids to stop misbehaving towards me, if she refused - then I walk.
I do not demand Primacy in the womans life, I know once a parent, then always a parent, but I don't think it's too much to ask for the woman to keep her kids in line.
My 2 pence.
Lion.
I demand respect, if the woman can't sort her ****ing kids out to respect her man, after he has tried his best to get along with them, they that just shows the lack of respect that she has for him.
Or she's a bad parent (and possibly both
)Rev is getting off light here, and I am usually against retaliation due to the DJ principles, but I think Rev should shoot her an email back and explain a few things, she has got on her parental high-horse here, and she has to know that she should have intervened and sorted out her little brats.
If i was getting that crap from a single mother, I would respectfully ask her to respect me and get her kids to stop misbehaving towards me, if she refused - then I walk.
I do not demand Primacy in the womans life, I know once a parent, then always a parent, but I don't think it's too much to ask for the woman to keep her kids in line.
My 2 pence.
Lion.
Dark Nimbus and Lionheart "get it".
Many of the respondents here may have been talking about a single woman casually dating some guy. But what we're talking about is a committed relationship on the road to marriage. If all the guy wants is to bang mom while she is totally responsible for her kids, then he's not a gentleman and deserves their disrespect.
Part of the committment the single mother should be ready to make is to choose a GENTLEMAN that will be upright, moral and responsible enough to assume the mantle of surrogate father to her children. Children do better in families where the man/father figure is dominant in the classical and noble sense of fatherhood.
If you're dating a single mom, and things begin to get serious, first of all, she should have the sense to be only dating a man who is not only a gentleman and good to her, but he will make a good father/father figure to her children. Anything else and she's a trollop. At the same time, if the man is hanging around this single mom long enough, the tacit signal is that he's interested in the full role of husband/father.
At some point, when the relationship gets serious and the man proves himself to be all of the above, the single mom should have already realized this and should allow her new man to assume a leadership role. When the kids whine and mewl as even the best kids will (remember, they test too) she should defer to him when appropriate.
Each relationship is different, but kids need to see that mommy has chosen well (he's a good man) and that even though he's not their biological father, he loves them and deserves their respect especially if the relationship seems to be leading to long-term commitment/marriage. Anything less shortchanges all involved.
Many of the respondents here may have been talking about a single woman casually dating some guy. But what we're talking about is a committed relationship on the road to marriage. If all the guy wants is to bang mom while she is totally responsible for her kids, then he's not a gentleman and deserves their disrespect.
Part of the committment the single mother should be ready to make is to choose a GENTLEMAN that will be upright, moral and responsible enough to assume the mantle of surrogate father to her children. Children do better in families where the man/father figure is dominant in the classical and noble sense of fatherhood.
If you're dating a single mom, and things begin to get serious, first of all, she should have the sense to be only dating a man who is not only a gentleman and good to her, but he will make a good father/father figure to her children. Anything else and she's a trollop. At the same time, if the man is hanging around this single mom long enough, the tacit signal is that he's interested in the full role of husband/father.
At some point, when the relationship gets serious and the man proves himself to be all of the above, the single mom should have already realized this and should allow her new man to assume a leadership role. When the kids whine and mewl as even the best kids will (remember, they test too) she should defer to him when appropriate.
Each relationship is different, but kids need to see that mommy has chosen well (he's a good man) and that even though he's not their biological father, he loves them and deserves their respect especially if the relationship seems to be leading to long-term commitment/marriage. Anything less shortchanges all involved.
Oscar Wilde
Master Don Juan
This is all I need to quote from you Liz, because it demonstrates 2 things:
1. You are way outta line being abusive to RKTek (and you should have the guts to realise this and to apologise to him)
and
2. You may have read his posts but you have obviously completely failed to comprehend his point. I think that a possibility is you may have let your emotions rule your head, and you didn't try to understand him.
And please, leave out the abuse if you reply to me. Thanks.
I agree with RkTek, and I'm not so sure that Starman and Gio disagree with him - the say they disagree, but they pick apart an argument that he didn't make. You guys need to understand his posts.
Oscar.
Starman
Master Don Juan
you still havent answered my question RK..maybe you can help me "get it "?
Giovanni Casanova
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And I think that it was made fairly clear by the first post in this thread that was exactly what was happening. The kids "almost make banging the mom not worth it", he tries to avoid being around the kids, etc. I think it's been fairly well established that the case in point here is a guy that just wanted to bang a single mom without having to "deal" with her kids -- much less be some sort of father figure for them.
The rest of what you say, for the most part, I don't necessarily disagree with. HOWEVER, the point that I am trying to make here is as follows: No good mother will EVER love anyone or anything more than her children. I do not feel that any woman should love me more than her (or our) kids. Likewise, I would never love any woman more than I would love my kids. Plain and simple.
As I've said before, there are different kinds of love... romantic love, sexual love, the love you have for your friends, the love you have for Mountain Dew, the love you have for your kids, etc. You can love your kids more than anything but still love your spouse. You're not splitting romantic love between your kids and your spouse. That being said, however, if my spouse and my kid were both drowning or otherwise about to meet their demise and I could only save one, I would save my kid.
Oscar Wilde
Master Don Juan
Let me attempt so...
In order to create a working healthy family unit in this situation, the kids *must* have respect for the father-figure-type (the mothers bf).
In order for the kids to have respect for this person, the mother must demonstrate that she respects him.
She did not do so in this case.
(although he didn't do himself any favours either, made several bad mistakes).
Starman
Master Don Juan
"No good mother will EVER love anyone or anything more than her children."
True that. Both supported bioligically and in psych journals.
Oscar,
In the case of the original poster, I agree with what you guys are saying. But as far as the idea that Parents should love each other more than their children is poppycock and idealistic.
True that. Both supported bioligically and in psych journals.
Oscar,
In the case of the original poster, I agree with what you guys are saying. But as far as the idea that Parents should love each other more than their children is poppycock and idealistic.
Oscar Wilde
Master Don Juan
Excellent. Although I think it's a general concept of mutual respect that applies to all relationships.
That's why "dissing" someone is such a big deal, people don't mind when you respectfully disagree, but disrespect is unfair.
(That's also why I called Liz on her disrespectful comments).
Absolutely, 100% agreement.
See, I knew the views weren't a million miles appart
Giovanni Casanova
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In this case, the "father-figure" (if you can even call him such a thing with a straight face) was not worthy of respect... of the mother, or of the children.
Is this the question to which you refer?:
"Just out of curiosity RKTEK, where are you getting your facts from? or are you just basing your post based on your own judgement value?"
If it is, sorry, at first I thought was either purely rhetorical or a thinly disguised put-down.
To answer this question, I derive my stance from first-hand observation of marriages that not only 'lasted' but were strong and produced well-adjusted children/adults.
In addition, I have had occasion to date some otherwise wonderful single moms. This was in the 'old' days, when unfamiliar with the term 'AFC'. Each time I went into the situation with the most altuistic intentions of first of all being a great guy to this woman, and if the situation matured, being a responsible, moral and noble father figure for her (note, I said her) children. Part of the problem may have been my wimpiness in those days, but after awhile I began to see that I was nowhere near first in her heart which her kids immediately picked up on. This happened to me three times in my life before I finally figured out not only what was happening, but more importantly, what I would tolerate.
Yes, there are different kinds of love, but many of the single moms out there don't know how to differentiate what they are and it's up to the GENTLEMAN/DJ to take a stand. Most of the single moms I met and dated, which I'd bet represents a fair majority of them, dated and married the classic "jerk"and still haven't gotten past that stage.
We've discussed it so many times on this forum, if given a choice, women fall in love with, have children for and cry the most over...JERKS. Many women prefer to date and then marry *ssholes. Go figure.
After the jerk dumps her and the kids, many single moms are still as clueless as ever and instinctively run after another jerk. In fact, they might expect him to be such a jerk, lowlife, poor husband/father figure that they have NO INTENTION of allowing him to assume the proper man/father/husband/leader figure in the new home. The result is that she insidiously degrades him whether she means to or not. And modern feminized society is so used to male-bashing, no one notices or has the sense to see or demand better.
I am posting a link here for more on a tiny but growing anti male-bashing backlash.
http://www.sosuave.com/vBulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=28564
All of the above is where I get my stance on this issue.
BGMan
Master Don Juan
I'd have to agree with Gio on this one.
We all have acted like "brats" when we were little, but not all the time. If people stopped having "brats" then the human race would die out.
I personally think that the best parents for any child are the natural mother and father, because they feel a special bond to the child that nobody else can. My own father was a single mother's child and got the sh!t end of the stick for that reason; he had several younger siblings who were treated better than he was because they were his stepfather's natural children. Because of all this, I will never date single mothers, or, for that matter, if I get married, adopt any children. If I do encounter a single mother, I will encourage her to try to get back with her kid(s)'s father.
On the other hand, women who have a ridiculous love for a soulless lump of protoplasm (kitty cats, dogs, parrots, whatever) don't deserve my respect one bit!
BGMan
We all have acted like "brats" when we were little, but not all the time. If people stopped having "brats" then the human race would die out.
I personally think that the best parents for any child are the natural mother and father, because they feel a special bond to the child that nobody else can. My own father was a single mother's child and got the sh!t end of the stick for that reason; he had several younger siblings who were treated better than he was because they were his stepfather's natural children. Because of all this, I will never date single mothers, or, for that matter, if I get married, adopt any children. If I do encounter a single mother, I will encourage her to try to get back with her kid(s)'s father.
On the other hand, women who have a ridiculous love for a soulless lump of protoplasm (kitty cats, dogs, parrots, whatever) don't deserve my respect one bit!
BGMan
Starman
Master Don Juan
Heh Liz's comments were just out of line, but I was laughing because I cant imagine someone sitting at their computers and getting all worked up over a post. I'll bet she took a bat to her computer when she was done.
RK
" To answer this question, I derive my stance from first-hand observation of marriages that not only 'lasted' but were strong and produced well-adjusted children/adults."
How exactly did you come to the conclusion that these marriages worked because the parents loved each other above their children?
"I began to see that I was nowhere near first in her heart which her kids immediately picked up on"
and in 98% of womens lives..their children are #1
Sounds like you just had some bad experiences with single moms and competing with the children for mom's affection
RK
" To answer this question, I derive my stance from first-hand observation of marriages that not only 'lasted' but were strong and produced well-adjusted children/adults."
How exactly did you come to the conclusion that these marriages worked because the parents loved each other above their children?
"I began to see that I was nowhere near first in her heart which her kids immediately picked up on"
and in 98% of womens lives..their children are #1
Sounds like you just had some bad experiences with single moms and competing with the children for mom's affection
Rev you're a d^ckhead, a complete a*shole, and in this case, you're a jerk. You're not a DJ. You're a jerk. You're not an AFC. You're a jerk. The way you acted was completely immature, insensibile, and disgusting. Oh, and you're insecure. You're the kind of guy I would have knocked the f*ck out and made sure you didn't get up again for the next year.
A hanging is in order...
I wish for you the worst and hope that you remain single. You're not worthy of anyone's respect.
Turn your act around idiot and just maybe you'll have substance in your life. Man, you remind me of alcoholic fathers that beat their children with belts, sticks, and throw them around the room. Pig.
A hanging is in order...
I wish for you the worst and hope that you remain single. You're not worthy of anyone's respect.
Turn your act around idiot and just maybe you'll have substance in your life. Man, you remind me of alcoholic fathers that beat their children with belts, sticks, and throw them around the room. Pig.
Absolutely f*cking right.
thissucks003
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I have notice alot of you guys are posting that respect should be given. Respect is never given. Respect is earned.
Anyone who thinks that the mother should put her boyfriend/husband above her kids is in a rude awakening when you have your own kids. If you don't believe me, just go ask your mother.
TS
Anyone who thinks that the mother should put her boyfriend/husband above her kids is in a rude awakening when you have your own kids. If you don't believe me, just go ask your mother.
TS
Oscar Wilde
Master Don Juan
Devils advocate
I suspect that that is not the way you operate.
Oscar.
So your attitude is to disrespect everybody until they prove that they've earned your respect? Interesting. How does that work for you?
I suspect that that is not the way you operate.
Oscar.
RKTek, I'm usually in total agreement with the things you post, but here I only agree partway. Mostly I disagree with your asessment of Rev's situation. I think you're superimposing your bad experiences onto all single moms.
You said she didn't respect him, and that was obvious, and that's the reason the kid's didn't respect him. From Rev's post, it's obvious that he never liked her kids, and thought that he should be able to screw their mom without having to deal with them. He tried to avoid them, and wasn't able to escape them this time, which he usually tries to do.
From the mom's email, she only now realizes what his true attitude toward the kids is. He obviously called them names and told her she should handle them better. The kids were probably not in perfect behavior, but no kids that age ever are. They weren't testing him, they were just having fun. From the kid's comment to his mom, it's obvious that he wanted Rev to like him, but could pick up on Rev's too obvious distaste for them.
I totally agree with what you wrote about the necessity of a single mother picking a gentleman and someone who would be a good father figure. This single mom had no reason to believe Rev was otherwise until he voiced his true feelings about her "brats from hell". Then she did what she should have done, and showed him the door immediately. Where in her actions did she show disrespect for him? Even in breaking up with him, she was rational and told him exactly what he did wrong, and why he shouldn't repeat those actions in the future.
As far as primacy in the relationship, I don't even think that's an issue. You love your kids with an unconditional parental love, and you love your partner with an intimate love. One doesn't detract from the other. I agree that the parents should present one unit to the kids, and no parent should side with the kids against the other parent. However, in the case with a single mom, the new guy shouldn't instantly be given any dominion over the kids. The kids should have to respect him at all times to set the groundwork in case it works out, but no more than that. Only when the mom decides that he's going to be a part of their lives in the long-term should he be given authority over them.
You said she didn't respect him, and that was obvious, and that's the reason the kid's didn't respect him. From Rev's post, it's obvious that he never liked her kids, and thought that he should be able to screw their mom without having to deal with them. He tried to avoid them, and wasn't able to escape them this time, which he usually tries to do.
From the mom's email, she only now realizes what his true attitude toward the kids is. He obviously called them names and told her she should handle them better. The kids were probably not in perfect behavior, but no kids that age ever are. They weren't testing him, they were just having fun. From the kid's comment to his mom, it's obvious that he wanted Rev to like him, but could pick up on Rev's too obvious distaste for them.
I totally agree with what you wrote about the necessity of a single mother picking a gentleman and someone who would be a good father figure. This single mom had no reason to believe Rev was otherwise until he voiced his true feelings about her "brats from hell". Then she did what she should have done, and showed him the door immediately. Where in her actions did she show disrespect for him? Even in breaking up with him, she was rational and told him exactly what he did wrong, and why he shouldn't repeat those actions in the future.
As far as primacy in the relationship, I don't even think that's an issue. You love your kids with an unconditional parental love, and you love your partner with an intimate love. One doesn't detract from the other. I agree that the parents should present one unit to the kids, and no parent should side with the kids against the other parent. However, in the case with a single mom, the new guy shouldn't instantly be given any dominion over the kids. The kids should have to respect him at all times to set the groundwork in case it works out, but no more than that. Only when the mom decides that he's going to be a part of their lives in the long-term should he be given authority over them.
thissucks003
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Re: Devils advocate
TS
I didn't say disrespect anyone. I respect those who have shown themselves to be respected. It's more of a neutral position until they have proven themselves of being either respected or disrespected. It's not an either or situation. You keep your eye's open. They usaully show themselves of falling into one area or another.
TS
