She said I'm too nice -- why?

[drmeathead]

dude i think you can save this situation but you need a game plan.

first dont call or text her for a week unless of course she gets in touch with you.

when yuo do call tell her you are going to such and such a place at such and such a time (a weekday, 4 days ahead of time). you think she should come with you. she balks at all just say ok and hang up. and forget her.

like these guys are saying be more sexual with her on the date. say without saying. women dont want to talk directly about sex with a stranger. they love to hint about it though. hinting about sex winds them up and then they can "fall on a ****" and not be sluts because they didnt see it coming. illogical i know. be on the alert for **** tests as well as indicators that you are in the friend zone. just stay cool with the **** tests. i imagine that she will give you some form of a "you arent as nice as i thought" line. if she does, just wink and give her a **** eating, i am going **** you in the alley behind the bar smile. oh if she starts on her problems, you are not her emotional tampon or her social worker. end the date. keep it funny and light. no dreams or past secrets. keep it in the here and now. she doesnt deserve to hear about either from you. oh and dont ask her what she thinks of you or how you are doing. her opnion doesnt matter. act as though it were impossible to fail. let that be your mantra and that is how you are doing.

build up the kino. use funny stories. stories that make you out to be the man. let them love the image as my bro says. the kino is key. you cant really go in for the kiss if you arent touching her arm as you make the climatic point on a story. lean in and whisper in her ear about some chump or something stupid across the room. make seem as though it is your secret. look for her to reciprocate. if she does, sell high. walk her to the car. try to kiss her. unles you guys are ****ed up dont try to kiss her at the bar. dance floor sure. somewhere else in the bar ok sure but NOT AT THE BAR. ifshe cheeks yuo, bounce. destroy her number. dont say hi or anything when ur out. dont look at her if you see her out. forget her. you will be just fine.

 

[Cenotaph]

What you said:What's your impression of me?

She hears:I'm a snivling little wussy boy begging for your approval

Exactly!.. One of the worst things you can say on a first date... approval seeking is not attractive.

 

[Victory Unlimited]

Yo JONWON,

VERY, VERY interesting.

I often forget to think of it in THIS way. You're right, it IS an insult to a woman to turn her off-----AFTER she's already shown at least SOME interest in you by going out with you in the first place. To hit a woman with insecurity at THIS point can be interpreted as being as bad as punishing her for GOOD behavior.

I guess it's similiar to that old joke where the guy says:

"No thanks, ma'am. I wouldn't want to belong to NO club that would have "ME" as a member." lol


Very insightful, JONWON.:rockon:

 

[Tazman]

What you said:What's your impression of me?

She hears:I'm a snivling little wussy boy begging for your approval with all my smooth tricks I learned. Do you like me yet? Huh? Huh? Do you like me?

I have to second this or maybe third now. This is probably the most crucial. You aren't in a good position because you seem to be trying too hard. When a chick is sort of luke warm about you, she looks for things to criticize. She's going to try and make you work for it, don't fall into this game because you may end up giving her an ego boost with nothing to show for it.

 

[STR8UP]

Last night I was getting pretty touchy feely with a chick I met a few weeks ago. At the end of the night she started talking about how most men she meets are either gay, married, or worthless, blahblah.

I met this chick through another girl I know. So at he end of the night she starts with that whole "where are all the good men" routine, and somewhere during the convo she says something like "I was talking with "A" earlier (the other girl I know) about when the last time was that she had met a decent guy and she said it was when she met you. That's why we invited you tonite, cause you're a decent guy".

I don't think she actually said "decent guy" twice, but it stuck in my head that she would refer to me in that way.

Is a "decent" guy sexually attractive and a "nice" guy not?

It caused me to wonder for a minute, because when a woman is saying something like this she is usually trying to tell you that she would rather have sex with an immediate family member than do it with you, but this chick definitely was not blowing me off.

Just reinforces the need to watch her actions rather than listening to what she is saying.

 

[jophil28]

Here are my definitions of Nice and Decent.

Woman says - "You are a NICE guy" ( She means - you are a little boring, and I feel only some comfortable affection for you . However you are headed for the friend zone. I want you to be a male girlfriend )

The woman says - " You are a decent guy" ( She means - I feel a spark of attraction for you and I also sense that you are a man of character - I like that in a man . I would like to see you again.)

Anyone else have a take on this ?

 

[CoolRunning]

Guys, apart from the "what do you think of me" line, which I will never use again, I think one of my main problems on day2s is using humor too much. On a day2, do you ever joke around? Or is all humor you use based on flirting?

And what do the masters TALK about on a day2? Just keep it real, talk about passions, friendships, lives? Or do you make the mood fun and light?

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

STR8UP, how old is the woman who called you "decent"?

Last night I was getting pretty touchy feely with a chick I met a few weeks ago. At the end of the night she started talking about how most men she meets are either gay, married, or worthless, blahblah.

,... at he end of the night she starts with that whole "where are all the good men" routine, and somewhere during the convo she says something like "I was talking with "A" earlier (the other girl I know) about when the last time was that she had met a decent guy and she said it was when she met you.

The reason I ask is because you're experiencing a feminine social contrivance here. When women reach the age of 27-30 (sometimes earlier depending on their upbringing) the priority of the conditions necessary for their intimacy rearrange. Women like to call this their 'biological clock', which has a kernel of truth to it since they're beginning the down side of their fertility bell curve, but it's reallly more of a "cashing in their chips" before the party's over. They have to facilitate finding a long term prospect to meet their need for security (and again, lets not forget that security comes in many forms) since they've reached a point where they're beginning to recognize that their sexual marketability is on a decline (when compared with younger women and their own ability to compete for male attention with them).

At this stage women become aware of a long term necessity for security and thus their psychology requires a shift to accomodate their changing conditions. This is where the social contrivance comes into play in order to protect their egos. From their late teens into their late 20's (possibly early 30's) women enjoy the apex of their sexual marketability, but now they're forced to switch this mentality in order to justify their reprioritizing of their conditions for intimacy. The socially correct way of doing this is foisting the shame and blame on men being unable to meet their requirements.

Thus we get the Where Have All the Cowboys Gone social contrivance and women can 'legitimately' complain that there are no "decent" men around with the wherewithall to live up to their new sexual priorities. They conveniently wonder where all the 'Nice Guys' went, when in fact they've been there all along throughout their teens and 20's, but they simply haven't seriously considered them as sexually desireable. Now that long term security is becoming an imperative, the Nice Guy, with a good paying job, maybe a house and some investments, who's always been Mr. Loyal/Dependable, Captain-save-a-Ho through her 20's, is "just a little quirky" now and "I've always really loved him."

This is the end-game gambit for women - to simultaneously make that psychological shift that justifies previous behavior (spring break in Cancun) and make the 'Decent' guy think that she's always been Mrs. Virtuous-Responsible and knows a great guy when she see one. This is the point where she gets her cake and eats it too, and there are far too many AFCs who've been so deprived for so long that will line up around the block to be that 'Decent' guy for her and play that role for her while they put their heads in the sand with regard to her prior behaviors. This isn't to imply a moral issue, just a simple pragmatic one. As human beings, we'll all do what our conditions demand from us, (including willfully ignoring behavior in order to breed) but bear this social contrivance in mind when it's presented to you and be prepared for it.

 

[Latinoman]

CoolRunning,

1- How old is she? Are you both from the U.S.?
2- When did she call you a "nice" guy (e.g. after both of you paid for the drinks or before? After the hug or before?)
3- Do you have any history about her past relationships? (Divorce? Former fiance? cheating boyfriends?)
4- Does she lives alone or with her parents?
5- Does she has any kids?

 

[Latinoman]

Note:
I'm not equiped to talk about "date 1" or "date 2"...as I don't remember going on a date in my adulthood life with a woman that I have not already kissed or phucked.

 

[CoolRunning]

CoolRunning,

1- How old is she? Are you both from the U.S.?
2- When did she call you a "nice" guy (e.g. after both of you paid for the drinks or before? After the hug or before?)
3- Do you have any history about her past relationships? (Divorce? Former fiance? cheating boyfriends?)
4- Does she lives alone or with her parents?
5- Does she has any kids?

1- 29, I'm 27. Both from USA.
2- She'd paid for drinks, I had not yet paid for the appetizers.
3- No idea.
4- Roommate.
5- No.

Bear in mind, this was an online dating meetup. So I had literally only conversed with her for maybe 20 min on the phone, then this date took 2.5 hrs.

I'm not equiped to talk about "date 1" or "date 2"...as I don't remember going on a date in my adulthood life with a woman that I have not already kissed or phucked.

Well, as much as I'd like to be there and am trying to get there, I'm not. All this dating nonsense is my training to be where you are...see my sig for my past. Rest assured I am fully aware of the 4-10 hr rule and am not gonna get into something where we've been dating for weeks but still not had sex.

 

[Latinoman]

How did she end up paying for drinks?

Here is the thing...I know of a LOT of women that would not consider a man that fail on the following:

No paying during the FIRST date.

In fact, that's something that I tell my female friends or family members. To look for two main things (among others) that appear to be trivial:

1- If he does not tip

or

2- If he does not offer to pay (first date)


And I tell them that if he does #1 or #2...then they should disqualify him. It is a test that I encourage women to do.

 

[Latinoman]

Well, as much as I'd like to be there and am trying to get there, I'm not. All this dating nonsense is my training to be where you are...see my sig for my past. Rest assured I am fully aware of the 4-10 hr rule and am not gonna get into something where we've been dating for weeks but still not had sex.

I understand that.

In my case...I apply "seduction" and THEN do the "dating". No the other way around.

Now...I'm not against dating. It is just that it can become a little expensive. And although, I have no problems paying for a first date...I rather do that for a person that I truly enjoy her company with.

Now...I will probably have to date at some time in the future...but if I do, I rather do that in very inexpensive places and for the sole purpose of ME doing the QUALIFYING. (e.g. If I'm not sure I want to seduce a woman...I might date her IF I cannot find other ways to interact with her in public).

 

[Latinoman]

CoolRunning...the ONLY thing that concerns me in this particular thread is not the fact that she said, "You are too nice".

What concerns me the most is how you are reacting to that statement.

I have been told "You are a nice guy"...and I simply smile...as I know very well that I'm NOT. It doesn't take them long to realize that I'm far from nice.

I'm a GOOD man. As a GOOD man takes care of his people and is law abiding and focus on his career, etc. But not a "nice guy".

But I like the approach suggested by Joekerr of making her QUALIFY that statement (something that I don't think has occurred to me as when I typically meet a woman, I tend to put them in a 'self-qualifying' mode).

 

[kyphan]

I agree with Latinoman. Really, you're too hung up on the word "nice." To her, "nice" may mean "kind" or "good," which are things a man should be. I've been called "nice" before, and I know when it's a positive thing and when she's saying "You are too boring for me."

 

[STR8UP]

STR8UP, how old is the woman who called you "decent"?

She's 32.

But the interesting thing is, another one of her complaints was "men always wanting to marry her".

Of course, we all know that women are ALWAYS looking for a long term partner, but this and a few other comments led me to think that she wasn't exactly desperate to find a hubby.

She might have said that because I was joking around with our mutual friend recently about wanting to find a fukk buddy. Could have gotten back to her that I am open to that kind of arrangement and she was just letting me know she's game.

 

[CoolRunning]

HOLY **** GUYS.

I called her this evening. I think I'm getting a better read on her personality -- she's not one of the high energy squeaky girls, who's fun to vibe with, she's more demure, sarcastic even. We chatted on the phone for about 15 min - joked a bit, talked about what we did last weekend, etc. I invited her over to dinner at my place this week, and the ONLY hint of resistance was that she had plans the day I suggested, so she suggested another one.

I HAVE SO MANY QUESTIONS!!!

1) I told her I'd email her directions. I also plan on asking her to bring a bottle of wine, something appropriate for the fish we're going to have. Sound reasonable?

2) I want to take this all the way. Her coming over is a direct SOI - she WANTS to get laid. I just have to make it happen. ANY advice you have on this would be great.

3) The plan: (a) make dinner, have her help with some of the stuff like chopping vegetables. Good kino opportunity. (b) play scrabble or watch a movie afterwards (c) start making out during the movie and escalate from there. How does this sound?

4) The REAL question in my mind is how to move toward the first kiss. This is the biggest sticking point of mine. Should I do it in the kitchen? During the movie? I'm pretty sure I can escalate after the first kiss, I've done it before (on the one girl I've ****ed, and a fat ogre girl my penis wouldn't get hard for). I just need to know when to kiss her. When I go for the first kiss, should the vibe be playful, like we're messing around in the kitchen and I go "c'mere you" and move in? Or should the vibe be muted, like we're talking on the couch and I just stop and stare into her eyes then move in?

 

[Latinoman]

1) I told her I'd email her directions. I also plan on asking her to bring a bottle of wine, something appropriate for the fish we're going to have. Sound reasonable?

It might work.

Personally...I tell them that the only thing they need to bring is their beautiful smile. Then wink.

Pay attention to details. Remember, you are a HOST.

Dude...get the wine. The reason I say this is because YOU should be the one putting her in the mood. Buy a white one or a chardonay. Heck, buy both. And buy them from some foreign country such as Chile, Australia, South Africa, Spain or even Argentina. You can find some very unexpensive ones (less than $20). Remember, you will be opening ONE. The other one can be used for another victim of seduction. So, it is an "investment". Another thing...the trick here that in the future...when she goes to a wine store and see a wine from let's say Argentina...she will associate that with YOU. Also...if possible...try to have the correct wine glasses (slightly different between red and white wines). But that is not a requirement. (Note: make sure your bathroom and bedroom and kitchen are VERY clean and you fridge too).


You see? If she goes to your house...then YOU are in control. It is NOW time for seducing her.

It is like the "camaleon" move. You can be cold and collective in Public. Funny and cucky too. But once she is in your place (at least for the first time)...you become a great host. Attentive. Kind of confuse them. Then make your move.

Note: Make sure she tells you if she is allergic to something. And please...buy FRESH seafood. Don't cook too much as you don't want her to feel "bloated" (a bloated woman is NOT going to get naked in front of you for the FIRST time).

And don't forget the "tour".

 

[kyphan]

HOLY **** GUYS.

I called her this evening. I think I'm getting a better read on her personality -- she's not one of the high energy squeaky girls, who's fun to vibe with, she's more demure, sarcastic even. We chatted on the phone for about 15 min - joked a bit, talked about what we did last weekend, etc. I invited her over to dinner at my place this week, and the ONLY hint of resistance was that she had plans the day I suggested, so she suggested another one.

I HAVE SO MANY QUESTIONS!!!

1) I told her I'd email her directions. I also plan on asking her to bring a bottle of wine, something appropriate for the fish we're going to have. Sound reasonable?

2) I want to take this all the way. Her coming over is a direct SOI - she WANTS to get laid. I just have to make it happen. ANY advice you have on this would be great.

3) The plan: (a) make dinner, have her help with some of the stuff like chopping vegetables. Good kino opportunity. (b) play scrabble or watch a movie afterwards (c) start making out during the movie and escalate from there. How does this sound?

4) The REAL question in my mind is how to move toward the first kiss. This is the biggest sticking point of mine. Should I do it in the kitchen? During the movie? I'm pretty sure I can escalate after the first kiss, I've done it before (on the one girl I've ****ed, and a fat ogre girl my penis wouldn't get hard for). I just need to know when to kiss her. When I go for the first kiss, should the vibe be playful, like we're messing around in the kitchen and I go "c'mere you" and move in? Or should the vibe be muted, like we're talking on the couch and I just stop and stare into her eyes then move in?

Good job, man.

I agree with Latinoman, buy the wine yourself. Asking someone to bring stuff is great if you're having a dinner party, but not for an intimate evening between you and a lady.

Look, I love all the planning - plan the EVENTS and not HOW you're going to escalate things. Figure out all the details of the night. Know what games you have on hand, what movies you'll suggest, and make sure you set the table up nicely.

You'll figure out when to go for the kiss. Just be your charming self, keep her interested and use some kino. If she's interested you'll figure it out. Take your time though, don't try making out with her halfway through cooking the meal unless she's throwing huge signals at you. Don't wait until the movie's over, of course, by then it might be a little too late. Escalate it from there.

Above all, man, even if you don't get laid, have fun. That's all life should be about, having fun.

 

[Vulpine]

Hahah, funny. The last time I pulled the "first kiss" at my place was hillarious.

The movie finished and started rolling the credits.

V: *claps hands, rubs together briskly as if warming them up* "ALRIGHT! Makeout time!" *gets up, turns off movie/tv, turns on iPod wired into stereo*

When I turned to come back, I caught her finishing up wetting her lips.
So, I sat back down on the couch facing her, gave a little laugh through my nose and smiled (because "there is no spoon" went through my head), then leaned in for the makeout. She didn't say a word (until the ASD kicked in, but that's another story).

No, wait, that wasn't the last first kiss at my place... the last one, myself and three peeps came back from the bar. The target was sitting across from me at the table as we were all sitting chatting, drinking, etc. The chick had been steady EC'ing me and smiling, so after I finished my drink...

V: "Ok." *gets up, slides in chair, starts walking, stops and looks at chick - holds out hand* "Come on."
HB: *gets up, takes hand*
V: *leads her to the bedroom, closes door behind us, grabs her up and starts making out, ends up on bed*

She didn't say a word, either... hmm.

:crackup: I used to struggle soooo hard with the first kiss. Then I realized: chicks like kissing, just like I do. They wouldn't be at your house if they didn't want you to kiss them... I mean, really, why would they be there? So, I just started taking. "I want some of that, gimme." *take*

It's only a matter of when YOU want to start making out. Hell, say "oops, hold on" pause the movie, start kissing her, then just when it starts getting good... stop and say "Ahh, ok." and unpause the movie.

Hell, set the tone of the evening early and greet her with it at the door - you might not have to bother cooking.

Dude, don't plan. Don't come up with a plan to make a plan to meet a goal of planning to enact scenario #6A if the original plan doesn't reach the mid-term goal of forcasts outlined by the plan.

Infact, open the door with no idea of what's going on. Then, stand there staring at her. If you do it right, it will be hilarious, and "auto-pilot" will kick in like if a guy friend was over for a visit. "HAHAHA! Just kidding, come on in."

Enjoy.