Money for Pu$$y

[jophil28]

You can actually go to a club, walk up to a girl, stand really close to her, and start whispering in her ear. You know how she will react? With a big wide smile. Because you didn't hesitate and you didn't try to impress with stupid external appearances or possessions.

We all need to stop b1tching about what women are looking for, and actually talk to them! Because a girl likes a guy who talks to her without hesitation. He isn't afraid. He isn't insecure like all the other guys. He isn't trying to throw money around to show people how cool he is. Now if he wants to throw money around, than all the power to him, but I don't believe that's very attractive.

What he said.

Guys who throw money around to impress others, particularly woman, are usually the object of ridicule and contempt BEHIND their back.. All the free loaders and the backslappers will rally round while the drinks are flowing, but when the money runs out, so do they.

 

[ketostix]

If you believe wealth increases confidence, then that's great. Go make some more money to increase your confidence. But you should've been confident in the first place.

You are missing my point that confidence is in part perception. Acting confident and even being confident in itself can be percieved by someone else (A woman) as confident, arrogance, pushy, needy, creepy or any other way someone chooses to percieve it. It all depends on what you have to back that confidence up with.

Because if you're not a confident, outgoing individual, no amount of money in this world can change you. The only thing that can change you is yourself.

You can make that claim but that doesn't make it true. Also you seem to believe that confidence doesn't have to be based on anything but your own mindset. That's not entirely true.

If you are a tax-paying resident in the United States, you are automatically wealthier than 90% of people in the world. So basically, everyone on this forum is a wealthy son of a b1tch. You aren't starving. You aren't drinking dirty-ass water like 100's of millions of peole in this world. You don't live in a little shack with no refrigeration, no running water, no electricty, no air conditioning.

The point is status. Status is relative. You might be wealthy relative to a woman in a 3rd world country, but relative to an American woman you might be poor.

We are already rich, yet too pathetic to realize it. Because we are too busy nit-picking about what "wealth" is. As far as monetary wealth goes, we have plenty of it. What we lack is true wealth. True wealth is being positive, energetic, outgoing, cheerful, in a dark, rough world. And if you think you need more money for people to like you, or you think you need more money to become more confident, than you I feel sorry for you.

This is an another strawman argument similar to your last. I never said you NEED more wealth for people to like you or you need NEED more money to become more confident. I only said money can help facilitate it.

Part of being positive and energetic is changing your life. Go work out. Go for a jog at the park. Go smile at the cute girl in the store. She isn't gonna hate you for it. You would be amazed at how positive energy can drastically change your life. Instead of hating people and looking down upon them without even knowing them, you can actually speak to them. Imagine that?

OK fine but how does having money keep you from doing those things and how does it necessarily mean you hate people and look down on them? It doesn't.

You can actually go to a club, walk up to a girl, stand really close to her, and start whispering in her ear. You know how she will react? With a big wide smile. Because you didn't hesitate and you didn't try to impress with stupid external appearances or possessions.

She might smile, but big deal. She might do a lot of things from walking away, eye coding her friends to ****block you to grabing your hand and dragging you out of the bar. The point is how she reacts to you is dependent on more than just "confidence", like I said it depends on her perception, and external appearances and your status. You cannot predict how a woman is going to react in a hypothetical just because you believe you're confident. There's more to it than just confidence.

Is money a factor as far as attracting women? Based on the fact that you are already richer than 90% of people in the world, I say you have plenty of it already. But even if you think you need more, just remember that the 20,000 people who starve to death every day in this world, just wanted a meal.

I addressed this earlier. This is neither here nor there.

You have food, you have a crib, you have transportation, you're a goddamn man with all the potential God gave you. If you still can't succeed with women with what you got, you're hopeless.

Obviously people and women aren't that simple. There's social heirarchy and competiveness.

We all need to stop b1tching about what women are looking for, and actually talk to them! Because a girl likes a guy who talks to her without hesitation. He isn't afraid. He isn't insecure like all the other guys. He isn't trying to throw money around to show people how cool he is. Now if he wants to throw money around, than all the power to him, but I don't believe that's very attractive.

Talking to a woman without hesitation is part of it but it's not all there is to it and doesn't quarantee attraction. You seem to totally disregard status. With staus the women will be coming to you and trying to win you over. this is what happens with the proverbial rockstar. I find it ironic and kind of hypocritical that you most likely aspire to be a rockstar since you are in a band.

She basically wants a dude who is happy because guess what! She's wants to be happy too! You know why? Because she's a human being just like you.

So if you think you monetary wealth increases your success with women, or makes you more confidant around women, than you better be increasing your monetary wealth.

Yeah wealth does more for you than just help attract women.

If you're like me, and are confident and secure without much wealth, than the idea that wealth increases confidence and/or success with women is ridiculous, because I'm already confident and successful with women. I don't really care what rich people, or poor people, or happy people, or pissed off people are doing with their lives. I can't control them. I can't change them.

It's hard enough to just change your own damn self than try to worry about or change everyone else in the world.

I'm not saying you need wealth to have success with women or to feel confident and secure. I'm saying it only helps. For someone who says they're content and don't care what anyone else does, you sure are strident in trying to convince others your "anti-wealth" view is right.

 

[STR8UP]

What he said.

Guys who throw money around to impress others, particularly woman, are usually the object of ridicule and contempt BEHIND their back.. All the free loaders and the backslappers will rally round while the drinks are flowing, but when the money runs out, so do they.

1) If you are throwing money around simply to impress people, you missed the point.

2) If you are hanging out with free loaders, you are doing it wrong.

When you "entertain" people, you aren't buying the bums with no money drinks. You figure that out early.

And as far as the women go....lets just say that you might not be fukking them, or you might not be fukking them that night, but rest assured, if you are hanging out with the right people, the opportunities it will present you with are many.

The source of this contention is what i said earlier, saying that not having a large amount of wealth is "missing out" and thus having something less. There's no need to think like this.

Well, if you consider the fact that if you are an overall good person, you will be held in even higher regard and with more respect from your peers if you are wealthy. Others will argue with me on this, but it's a nailed on fact.

And on top of this the opportunities it presents you with women increase exponentially.

So yea, I stick by my point of "you are missing something if you aren't wealthy". Actually, you miss out on a lot of things, but for the sake of this discussion I won't go into any more.

If you believe wealth increases confidence, then that's great. Go make some more money to increase your confidence. But you should've been confident in the first place.

I don't believe it does.... I KNOW it does. It is a sense of accomplishment just as a promotion at work or painting a masterpiece. If you were confident when you were poor, you would be more confident when you become wealthy.

If you are a tax-paying resident in the United States, you are automatically wealthier than 90% of people in the world.

Moot point.

It's all relative, so if you live in THIS society, you ARE NOT automatically wealthy. You might be able to retire with $200,000 worth of income producing assets (in the states) in a third world country and live well, but that doesn't mean you are wealthy by the US standards.

We are already rich, yet too pathetic to realize it. Because we are too busy nit-picking about what "wealth" is. As far as monetary wealth goes, we have plenty of it. What we lack is true wealth. True wealth is being positive, energetic, outgoing, cheerful, in a dark, rough world. And if you think you need more money for people to like you, or you think you need more money to become more confident, than you I feel sorry for you.

I agree with the premise of what you are saying, however, I can't help but pick up on the negativity toward wealth, and that usually stems from having a poor attitude toward money.

Is money a factor as far as attracting women? Based on the fact that you are already richer than 90% of people in the world, I say you have plenty of it already. But even if you think you need more, just remember that the 20,000 people who starve to death every day in this world, just wanted a meal.

Sounds like an attempt at shaming. Shame on you.

You have food, you have a crib, you have transportation, you're a goddamn man with all the potential God gave you. If you still can't succeed with women with what you got, you're hopeless.

Again, back to the whole "can't" argument that wasn't even argued in the first place.

So if you think you monetary wealth increases your success with women, or makes you more confidant around women, than you better be increasing your monetary wealth.

Again, I don't "think", I KNOW.

But that isn't WHY I pursue wealth. I do so because I feel that it is my calling, and I want to enjoy the security that wealth can provide that NOTHING else in the world can. Not a happy family or a loving wife or parents....NOTHING.

And before you get your panties in a bunch, I'm not saying that these other things aren't beneficial or important, but they won't be able to do much for you if you contract a disease and you insurance gets capped out, or if you get into a car accident and can't work anymore. That kind of security only comes from true wealth.

If you're like me, and are confident and secure without much wealth, than the idea that wealth increases confidence and/or success with women is ridiculous, because I'm already confident and successful with women......

Ridiculous? How do you know? You've never been wealthy so you have no idea what you are talking about.

No one's calling anyone stupid. I don't judge people.

For the sake of peace i change my previous statement into "can not entirely understand".

I have never been shot out of a cannon into the sky and don't know how that feels either. Neither have i been diving and swimming with the great white sharks in south africa. If someone who did it would tell me, i have no idea, i'd say "Really? Tell me what it's like. How does it work? Where do i start?"

It's another one of those things that's easy for people to say, because if you don't choose exactly the right PC wording, someone who is already defensive about the subject is gonna jump all over it and everyone else rallies around them with their allegations of condescension and contempt.

I don't look down on anyone. I was out with some friends Saturday night who live with their parents in the ghetto.

But the wealthy guy has the advantage and not just because women are "gold diggers". This is due to subjective perception. For example, what was perceived as insecure, analytical, withdrawn, depressed for the broke guy oftentimes gets perceived as modest, intelligent, higher status, and not easily amused for the wealthy guy.

This is an excellent point, and it just goes to illustrate the perception factor and how it is so much different among the different levels of social strata.

What was it I heard one time? If the guy is poor, he's crazy. If he's middle class he's neurotic. If he's rich, he's eccentric. Same qualities, but as you move up the perception goes from bad to good.

Naw....wealthy people don't have it any better!

 

[STR8UP]

Good point about confidence Keto.

This guy is confident in what? His ability to beat everyone's high score in guitar hero?

Where does TRUE confidence come from? It comes from a sense of accomplishment.

Men aspire to build and "conquer" the world. Men aspire to get a good job that pays a lot to make life easier for them and allow them freedom to do what they want in life.

Any Joe who can string two sentences together can go out and pick up and fukk women, but how much value does he truly have to them? An attractive, sane woman with her sh!t together who is looking to secure a long term partner might fukk you a couple of times for kicks if you are good looking enough, but when it comes down to what she really desires, no offense, but she isn't looking for the part time musician part time wal mart stock boy.

If you wanna play PUA and run around through a constant revolving door of women and consider that to be "successful" with women, I guess you got it all figured out. But if you are looking for more, your options will be limited by the choices you make in life.

 

[Mr.Positive]

Any Joe who can string two sentences together can go out and pick up and fukk women, but how much value does he truly have to them? An attractive, sane woman with her sh!t together who is looking to secure a long term partner might fukk you a couple of times for kicks if you are good looking enough, but when it comes down to what she really desires, no offense, but she isn't looking for the part time musician part time wal mart stock boy.

Str8up, you need to see this as more than a rich or poor issue. Most people fall in between this, and as long as a guy has a normal decent job, he can do very well with women.

An attractive sane woman is looking for an attractive sane man, who also can take care of himself financially. The biggest turn-off for women is a guy who lives with his parents. Why? Because he can't take care of himself and provide for himself.

Please see that it's a bell curve, and it curves at a guy who earns a decent amount to take care of his business, and save, but is not wealthy.

You may be in the minority wealthy "curve"...don't think for a moment that the rest of us don't do just fine in attracting women. I don't think you 'gain' that much on the rest of us, on attraction level, because of money.

I'm very happy with my sex life, and the women I spend time with now. They are quality women and I am not rich.

 

[thisishowitis]

So everybody, if you lack confidence, you better start making more money. Because making more money, will definately increase your confidence. How do I know this? Because Str8up and Ketostix said so. (i guess from their real world experience?)

What if you're already confident? You still need to make more money, to be even more confident.

What the f4ck is confidence anyway? Well it's all perception. If you're insecure, analytical, withdrawn, depressed, and sitting in the corner by yourself, BUT, you're rich, you will be perceived as modest, intelligent, higher status, and not easily amused. How do I know this? Because ketostix said so.

And, if you're confident, and have had sex with multiple women, yet you aren't wealthy, an attractive, sane women, with her sh1t together, will flat out NOT desire you because she desires WEALTH and LOOKS and PERSONALITY along with a hundred other meticulously picked categories. If you aren't at least a 9.98 out of 10 in all categories, YOU aren't GOOD enough.

Face it folks, you suck. You're face isn't f4cking symmetrical and your car isn't so nice. You don't have a big mansion. That's simply not good enough for a QUALITY woman.

Yeah I know, that cute blonde is looking at you with those beautiful eyes, but she won't like you, because you don't pass her big ass CHECKLIST.

She has this checklist because she is from a different universe than you. This universe is constructed out of gold and diamonds. Also, her skin and bones are made of synthetic material that don't respond well to a man's touch. So don't you dare touch her. Or say "hi". Or ask her things you want to know about her. Or ask her out on a date. Don't even f4ckin' look at her mr. two outta ten.

And if you ever dare, talk to this woman. Hesitate. Be unsure of yourself. She wants a man who gets what he wants. So sit in the corner and cry, because you don't have enough money to be a confident man.

You believed she was a normal human being just like you. WRONG. You believed it was easy to have a good time with a fellow human being, WRONG. Start analyzing sh1t more, and getting yourself all pissed off at that b1tch, who wouldn't even respond to your timid eye contact.

And if you're fat. Don't do anything about it. If you had confidence, you would begin to change it immediately because being confident means you are full of conviction. (as merriam webster states) But you're a whiny loser, who sits in the corner, with no faith, no confidence, and, most importantly, no self-love.

So we have all learned a great lesson. We need to make more money, so that we'll be more confident, and so everyone will like us. We also have to satisfy the many needs on a woman's precious checklist, especially the first thing on a woman's checklist, which is (drumroll) MONEY!!!

 

[StevenR]

If you are rich, everyone will want your money, and I mean everyone whether you think so or not.
People will totally kiss your a$$, but only do it for the money. If you don't believe me, this is even institutionalized. If my dad goes to a financial planner, or to get a loan or refinancing for his business(this used to be the case anyway), they would fly my parents to a fancy resort and wine and dine them. But of course the only reason they are doing this is because they want my parents money.

If my dad wants to buy out a minority shareholder and business partner he has known a good part of his life, this "friend" will try to write a contract that will screw him over to the maximum extent he can get away with. This is in spite of the fact that he rode on my dad's proverbial tailcoat to become rich himself. The employees who are in bookkeeping might try to embezzle, at least some of them will. The government wants your money, everyone wants your money.

Okay, there are quite a few genuine people out there too, but when you have money, and people know, it becomes more difficult to trust people's motives. Either that or it is pretty obvious they want some of your money. I am not wealthy but my parents are and I have seen this in their life.

This is something to keep in mind with women if you ever become a multimillionaire. Use it to get sex if you want, but realize if you grandstand with it you will not know her true feelings past a ONS.

Here is a tangential story, you don't have to read it if you don't want to but it is a story of how people treat others based on perceived status, an experience in how people relate to others depending on how much money they are perceived to have. I remember when my parents moved out of their nice house to get an even nicer house, and they had to rent a house for several months while the better house was being built. (they had a good offer on their old place before the new place was done)

The rental was in an upper middle class gated community about 5 miles from where they were building their very large house on 3 acres of waterfront. The rental house was a nice neighborhood but they were really just glorified tract houses. Our neighbors did not know why my parents were renting, just that they were "the renters". I remember the neighbors looking down their noses at our family because they thought we were of lower social status or something simply because we were renting. They didn't say that or anything, but I could sense it from them.
Then the new house is built and we move into it, and suddenly we are the elitists lol. Unfortunately they sent me to a private school where everyone was rich so I never had that advantage with chicks when I was still identified by my parents socioeconomic status.

 

[TheHumanist]

Well, if you consider the fact that if you are an overall good person, you will be held in even higher regard and with more respect from your peers if you are wealthy. Others will argue with me on this, but it's a nailed on fact.

And on top of this the opportunities it presents you with women increase exponentially.

So yea, I stick by my point of "you are missing something if you aren't wealthy". Actually, you miss out on a lot of things, but for the sake of this discussion I won't go into any more.

Well I must disagree on basis of while wealth brings more opportunities with women and need so much esteem. It is one thing to not be an ambitionless walmart cashier living on the streets, it is another if someone is like an archeaologist or a teacher who is only paid so much. Even professors, most doctors, and most engineers are paid so much. It seems you are basically saying no one can get a decent wife unless he is in lower upper class. Anyone else fails. I cannot agree to that even as I agree to many other points here.

 

[Aenigma]

Well I must disagree on basis of while wealth brings more opportunities with women and need so much esteem. It is one thing to not be an ambitionless walmart cashier living on the streets, it is another if someone is like an archeaologist or a teacher who is only paid so much. Even professors, most doctors, and most engineers are paid so much. It seems you are basically saying no one can get a decent wife unless he is in lower upper class. Anyone else fails. I cannot agree to that even as I agree to many other points here.

Generally speaking-

There are only so many wealthy men to go around. They get the 9-10s
The lower upper class-upper middle class get the next level down 8.5-9.5
The rest of the middle class get the 7-8s
The poor get the ugly ones.

With all else being equal (which it never is) the archeaologists, teachers, and other working professionsals will not get the best women. They'll get the next level down- who couldn't get the rich/handsome men they really desired. These men weren't the women's first pick- they SETTLED for them because it was the best man they could acquire.

With that said- can you get a decent wife by just being another smoe struggling from paycheck to paycheck? Obviously- that's most men in America. They can get a "decent" wife. I deserve more. I'd rather struggle and fight and make my place at the top of the world and get the best woman (or women ) I can as a result of my efforts. To hell with decent, to hell with average! Nothing but the best for me- I refuse to settle, and I'll get the best out there as a result!

 

[potato]

Have any of you ever seen the TV show, Millionaire Matchmaker. Week after week you can watch men with lots and lots of money, some of them decent looking and still having to go to a matchmaking service to get a date.

Within my social/business circle is a man who claims to be worth $50 million. Regularly he gets some pretty hot looking women, mostly by impressing them with his money. Rarely does one of these women stay around for more than a month or so. I see those women as little more than high class call girls.

My friend Amanda works as a stripper. A good portion of her income comes from guys with lots of money to throw away. A couple of them will give her around $400-500 a night, several nights a week and she doesn’t even touch them.

Most wealthy men who I encounter tend to be married and for a long time, making the whole attracting women a mute point except for those men who have difficulty getting women with or without wealth in the first place.

To the subject of wealth, status, and social proof.

I began my working career as an engineer and worked up to a project manager. In the 90’s I was often given bonuses in the form of stock options which turned out to be highly profitable. By time I was 40 I owned my home, had money set aside, including that for my children’s education, and owed money to no one. I then quit my job and became an artist. Nowadays I work 3 or 4 days a week and often not more than 5 or 6 hours a day. I have few expenses so why work more than I have to.

Currently I live rather simply preferring to live off the grid; for instance riding my bicycle rather than driving my car and generating my own electricity.

When encountering women I’ve always downplayed whatever wealth I’ve had, often with the idea that I wanted a woman who liked me for me and not anything else. It seems to me that the numbers of women being attracted to me has always been a function of my socializing moreso than anything else. The more I socialize, the more women that I meet – simple as that.

During my time as a project manager I developed a keen sense that socializing, taking an interest in people as people, regardless of their position, went a long way in getting things done. As an artist, that socializing, which I guess some of you would call networking, is essential at getting to the clients I need most.

Funny thing about my art. I don’t make nearly the money I did when I had a real job yet people tend to treat me like a celebrity which is really just an outgrowth of that whole socializing/networking thing. I don’t think that my celebrity-like persona attracts women as much as my persona itself which makes me celebrity-like.

Just my opinion but throughout this thread there has been the notion that one’s wealth makes one more attractive. I think that this is backwards. Those individuals who tend to be better looking, more charming than most, tend to be more successful. Thus, that charm that brings them success in one area of their life also brings them success elsewhere.

In the final analysis, whenever I encounter a woman who I am attracted to and her to I, whatever wealth, status, or social proof either of us has never seems to be an issue one way or the other, other than just being incidental.

 

[TheHumanist]

Generally speaking-

There are only so many wealthy men to go around. They get the 9-10s
The lower upper class-upper middle class get the next level down 8.5-9.5
The rest of the middle class get the 7-8s
The poor get the ugly ones.

With all else being equal (which it never is) the archeaologists, teachers, and other working professionsals will not get the best women. They'll get the next level down- who couldn't get the rich/handsome men they really desired. These men weren't the women's first pick- they SETTLED for them because it was the best man they could acquire.

With that said- can you get a decent wife by just being another smoe struggling from paycheck to paycheck? Obviously- that's most men in America. They can get a "decent" wife. I deserve more. I'd rather struggle and fight and make my place at the top of the world and get the best woman (or women ) I can as a result of my efforts. To hell with decent, to hell with average! Nothing but the best for me- I refuse to settle, and I'll get the best out there as a result!

No no, that's not the point I'm trying to convey. Yes, of course if money was the only factor to go by for men and women is by looks, then the wealthiest would get the best look and so on. With that as the only criterea, its that or randomness and we know it would not be randomness.

But I'm try to say that the value of a man is dangerously sounding that as part of being a man of high value, he must be wealthy. The thing is, many people don't become rich, not because they are ambitionless, but because their field only pay so much. I choose an archeologist as an example for these are people who love to do their career, but despite their expertise even the ones that find the biggest discoveries and get published on the news are not very rich at all. It sounds that he should be considered a lesser man (with all other things equal). I also question the idea that we should put wealth into so much importance, it would be nice, but should we be unsatisfied and unhappy if we aren't millionaires or at a lesser extreme unless we can't make ends meet and doing menial work? We should aim on getting as wealthy as we can, but we shouldn't value it so highly that we give too much weight that when weighting options that we sacrifice something higher than its value.

 

[ketostix]

So everybody, if you lack confidence, you better start making more money. Because making more money, will definately increase your confidence. How do I know this? Because Str8up and Ketostix said so. (i guess from their real world experience?)

What if you're already confident? You still need to make more money, to be even more confident.

What the f4ck is confidence anyway? Well it's all perception. If you're insecure, analytical, withdrawn, depressed, and sitting in the corner by yourself, BUT, you're rich, you will be perceived as modest, intelligent, higher status, and not easily amused. How do I know this? Because ketostix said so.

And, if you're confident, and have had sex with multiple women, yet you aren't wealthy, an attractive, sane women, with her sh1t together, will flat out NOT desire you because she desires WEALTH and LOOKS and PERSONALITY along with a hundred other meticulously picked categories. If you aren't at least a 9.98 out of 10 in all categories, YOU aren't GOOD enough.

Face it folks, you suck. You're face isn't f4cking symmetrical and your car isn't so nice. You don't have a big mansion. That's simply not good enough for a QUALITY woman.

Yeah I know, that cute blonde is looking at you with those beautiful eyes, but she won't like you, because you don't pass her big ass CHECKLIST.

She has this checklist because she is from a different universe than you. This universe is constructed out of gold and diamonds. Also, her skin and bones are made of synthetic material that don't respond well to a man's touch. So don't you dare touch her. Or say "hi". Or ask her things you want to know about her. Or ask her out on a date. Don't even f4ckin' look at her mr. two outta ten.

And if you ever dare, talk to this woman. Hesitate. Be unsure of yourself. She wants a man who gets what he wants. So sit in the corner and cry, because you don't have enough money to be a confident man.

You believed she was a normal human being just like you. WRONG. You believed it was easy to have a good time with a fellow human being, WRONG. Start analyzing sh1t more, and getting yourself all pissed off at that b1tch, who wouldn't even respond to your timid eye contact.

And if you're fat. Don't do anything about it. If you had confidence, you would begin to change it immediately because being confident means you are full of conviction. (as merriam webster states) But you're a whiny loser, who sits in the corner, with no faith, no confidence, and, most importantly, no self-love.

So we have all learned a great lesson. We need to make more money, so that we'll be more confident, and so everyone will like us. We also have to satisfy the many needs on a woman's precious checklist, especially the first thing on a woman's checklist, which is (drumroll) MONEY!!!

Strawman argument post of the year award. I think you broke the record in one post! :cheer:

 

[ketostix]

Here is a tangential story, you don't have to read it if you don't want to but it is a story of how people treat others based on perceived status, an experience in how people relate to others depending on how much money they are perceived to have. I remember when my parents moved out of their nice house to get an even nicer house, and they had to rent a house for several months while the better house was being built. (they had a good offer on their old place before the new place was done)

The rental was in an upper middle class gated community about 5 miles from where they were building their very large house on 3 acres of waterfront. The rental house was a nice neighborhood but they were really just glorified tract houses. Our neighbors did not know why my parents were renting, just that they were "the renters". I remember the neighbors looking down their noses at our family because they thought we were of lower social status or something simply because we were renting. They didn't say that or anything, but I could sense it from them.
Then the new house is built and we move into it, and suddenly we are the elitists lol. Unfortunately they sent me to a private school where everyone was rich so I never had that advantage with chicks when I was still identified by my parents socioeconomic status.

Good example of the point I made earlier. Wealth is relative and so is percieved value AND EVERY OTHER QUALITY you might have (wealth, looks, personality, etc.). For some to argue that wealth and having other qualities aren't of value and aren't relative is silly.

 

[StevenR]

I have read a good portion of this thread, not all of it, and here is my insight into the whole money/happiness issue. There is a difference between money and what I will call "value" or "value capital"(not to be confused with a persons esteem or worth which is something totally different than what I am describing). Money is part of value but not all value is money. Value capital is everything in life that makes you happy, what you have in total, of which money is a part of. Some examples of value capital may include quality of life, lifestyle, living in a desirable location, the ability to travel, basically to do what you want to do. In short, the ability to do things that make you happy.

Depending on your personality and luck, generally for middle class people the more money you make the more value you must give up in other areas of your life. This may include being a stockbroker, attorney, or similar as opposed to an artist or archaeologist like you would rather be. You don't particularly care for the job but at least it pays good money. However, to get this money you have to give up value elsewhere. Not doing with your time what makes you more happy is giving up value. Working longer hours is giving up value. Living in a suburb when you would rather have a cabin in the woods is trading value for money. You are trading various other forms of value for more money. If this value/money tradeoff gets to out of balance you become increasingly miserable and come to the conclusion that money doesn't buy happiness.

I am sure many of you have heard the saying "time is money". Well, time isn't literally money, but it is a form of value that you can exchanged for money.

Conversely, if you are unemployed and broke your value/money ratio is out of whack in the other direction. Sure you have plenty of time to do whatever you want to do, but you don't have the money to enjoy that time the way you want to. Freedom is a form of value, freedom is also limited by a job but in a different way. In a job you are giving up time, being broke you are giving up the ability to travel, go out, buy nice things, etc. so your free time that you are broke no longer has the same value as free time +$$$.

The ideal is to increase the total value capital and not just how much time or money you have. This is what truly wealthy people have successfully done. They have figured out a way, usually with a lot of hard work where they gave up value earlier in their life, to exponentially increase their value several years down the road. Early in their life, instead of exchanging value for money in a static job, they exchanged value for building up means to make money that will grow over time.

What they end up with is the ability to both generate lots of income and have the time and freedom to enjoy if if they desire. They have the freedom of the broke and unemployed person with the money, actually a lot more money, than the well paid worker. Of course they usually sacrificed value earlier in what my dad once called "sweat equity", but in the end they have more value than others. But at the same time infinite money does not mean you will have infinite value capital either.

Once you have enough money to do whatever you want, more money on top of that isn't going to make much of a difference. In other words, increasing money past a certain point will give you an increasingly marginal return on value capital. The total amount of value capital you can have has a finite limit, there is only so much time in a day. There is only so much you can personally do with your money to increase your value capital. I think this is something else that gets people confused into the notion that money cannot buy happiness. This is more true when you are talking about the difference between $100 million net worth and a billion dollars, a billion isn't going to make you that much personally happier than $100 million will.

I think that is actually, tax purposes aside, why non-sociopathic wealthy people may give to charity, cause it makes them feel good hence is another way to increase their value capital(happiness) even further. Getting into politics, fighting for what they believe is a good cause, and other things the wealthy can do also increases their happiness, it makes them feel good to have political influence and power or to change the world in a direction they want by supporting a particular cause and giving their money to that support. There are also currently limits to what money can do to improve quality of life. You will still get old and die, you can still get cancer and die(but may get better medical treatment). So money isn't quite everything, but it sure helps. However, I don't think this is the only route to take in life.

Someone can have a happy life if their value/money ratio is adequately balanced. An artist or archaeologist may not normally become wealthy(but sometimes do), nor is amassing wealth their primary goal. Of course they want to have money, but not at the expense of giving up value in other areas of their life. Those other areas are spending time doing something they have an inner passion for. They will not be happy broke, but as long as they are making enough money to live adequately, they are content in trading value(time doing something they like) in place of extra money. Hence they are normally happier than the person who gave up most of their other value capital for more money.

The ultimate jackpot in life is if you can find something you are happy doing, and you become wealthy doing that. This would include professional athletes, rock stars, actors/actresses, people like Rachael Ray who made a business out of her passion for cooking, authors, etc. Of course not all of them are balanced individuals but I think that goes with the territory of being creative and nothing to do with how much value capital they have.

So in conclusion when we are arguing about whether money brings happiness, I think what people are really talking about is total value of which money is an essential part of, but is not all there is. I hope I made at least some sense.

 

[bigjohnson]

It's all relative, so if you live in THIS society, you ARE NOT automatically wealthy. You might be able to retire with $200,000 worth of income producing assets (in the states) in a third world country and live well, but that doesn't mean you are wealthy by the US standards.

Don't you love it when the guy you're arguing with makes your point for you? If any taxpayer from the US visits or relocates/retires to one of those 90% places .... he has to dodge and duck all the pussy that flies at him and falls out of the sky on him.

 

[ketostix]

Don't you love it when the guy you're arguing with makes your point for you? If any taxpayer from the US visits or relocates/retires to one of those 90% places .... he has to dodge and duck all the pussy that flies at him and falls out of the sky on him.

It's not because American men are relatively wealthier though! It's because American men ALL have more confidence than all the resident males there(and the confidence is NOT because the American is relatively more weathy either!) Also non-American women are much more materialistic than America women (I'm not sure why that is though ). [sarcasm]

 

[STR8UP]

Oops wrong post...

 

[edger]

But to really answer your question, it is because:

1) I've said this fifty bajillion times already, but this hinges on all things being equal! Read this fifteen times. Please.

Wealth isn't the ONLY factor. Understand? Looks aren't the ONLY factor. Confidence isn't the ONLY factor.

Women have a bunch of switches and for whatever reason or reasons one guy might have what it takes to flip enough of them to attract her to him.

Make sense?

I've been out of this thread for about a week, been very busy.

I see your point. You're saying the guy has to have it ALL(confidence, money, looks)...you're saying if it came down to a "wealthy" guy vs. a "middle-income" guy, who both had LOOKS and CONFIDENCE, she'd choose the "wealthy" guy.

 

[edger]

Edger, I never disagreed with STR8UP that women are attracted to men with the means to provide.

I'm saying, throughout this discussion, you've disagreed with him on the premise that "attractive women specifically hone in on wealthy guys", THEN claimed the opposite.

Here it is:

I agree, a woman might leave when a better provider comes along

You're saying a woman will leave the "middle-income" guy, once the "wealthy" guy comes along...or at least that's how I interpret your statement.

If the guy isn't providing efficiently or fully, then I could see the woman securing a relationship with a guy who CAN provide efficiently and fully(or as you would say provide, "better"). But if both the wealthy guy and middle-income guy are EQUALLY providing fully and efficiently, then I can't see how she would leave the middle-income guy.

 

[edger]

By the way, ThisIsHowItIs, I defintely know all too well that the broke musician lands nice female specimens. I'm a musician myself(though not "broke"), and I see it all the time.