booty-naughtyness-spur
Senior Don Juan
hey now... i resemble that remark...
i find some of what MysteryWoman is preaching suspect. but at least she threw the disclaimer of "some woman," not all.
Looks are more important than you think! Merged [Official thread]
- Thread starter MysteryWoman
- Start date
- Status
i find some of what MysteryWoman is preaching suspect. but at least she threw the disclaimer of "some woman," not all.
TO MYSTERY WOMAN!
Mystery woman, I think you are missing one very important point. In the real world there is a lot of subjectivity when it comes to looks. Granted, at the extremes there tends to be a lot of agreement (ie. most people think male swim suit models and female swim suit models are hot). However, when it comes to most average people there is a lot of disagreement.
I will even use myself as an example. Take a look at this picture: http://170.224.13.100/picsnum/164/044/1640440210.jpg
That's me. Now check this out. I don't know if you think I look good looking or not in that picture but I can tell you that a lot of women do and a lot of women don't. Some women would rate me as pretty plain or dorky and some women would rate me as an 8 or a 9. Some of the women that think I don't look good in that picture are what I perceive to be ugly. Some of the women that think I'm hot in that picture I think are hot also. I can never predict who will think I'm hot by what they look like. Sure, if I was extremely ugly then it would be unlikely that any girl would really want me unless she had no choice. However, I'm the type of guy that falls into the grey area. That's why you have to have courage. For men like me DON JUAN skills are very important. If I gave up because a few girls don't like me I'd never be "THE MAN". So sure, if we polled 100 women, Antonio Sabado Junior might get a 9.5 rating and I might get a 6 but that doesn't mean that some women with a rating of 9.5 won't want to get busy with me. SOME WILL and they would probably think I'm an 8 or a 9!!!! In fact, I bet you $1000 there is even a woman out there somewhere that thinks I'm better looking than Antonio! That's how weird the world is. And that's all that matters to me.
Ramin
Mystery woman, I think you are missing one very important point. In the real world there is a lot of subjectivity when it comes to looks. Granted, at the extremes there tends to be a lot of agreement (ie. most people think male swim suit models and female swim suit models are hot). However, when it comes to most average people there is a lot of disagreement.
I will even use myself as an example. Take a look at this picture: http://170.224.13.100/picsnum/164/044/1640440210.jpg
That's me. Now check this out. I don't know if you think I look good looking or not in that picture but I can tell you that a lot of women do and a lot of women don't. Some women would rate me as pretty plain or dorky and some women would rate me as an 8 or a 9. Some of the women that think I don't look good in that picture are what I perceive to be ugly. Some of the women that think I'm hot in that picture I think are hot also. I can never predict who will think I'm hot by what they look like. Sure, if I was extremely ugly then it would be unlikely that any girl would really want me unless she had no choice. However, I'm the type of guy that falls into the grey area. That's why you have to have courage. For men like me DON JUAN skills are very important. If I gave up because a few girls don't like me I'd never be "THE MAN". So sure, if we polled 100 women, Antonio Sabado Junior might get a 9.5 rating and I might get a 6 but that doesn't mean that some women with a rating of 9.5 won't want to get busy with me. SOME WILL and they would probably think I'm an 8 or a 9!!!! In fact, I bet you $1000 there is even a woman out there somewhere that thinks I'm better looking than Antonio! That's how weird the world is. And that's all that matters to me.
Ramin
billythekid78
Don Juan
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Facts:
1. Attraction is mostly on a psychological basis.
Psychology has proved we find more attractive those people whom we like. Meaning that if we like their personality we tend to rate them as better looking. Or vice versa. If we don't like the personality of some person we tend to rate them as less attractive them they really are. This is moreso for women than men.
2. Women don't know what they want
'Nuff said
3. Don't take advice ON women FROM women.
Self-explanatory
In conclusion:
Mystery Woman's thread is trying to produce insecurities among the men of sosuave.
I mean even if looks were the most important thing (which they aren't) and I know from experience. Why would you try to force upon the fragile personalities that you know most men on these boards have? All they need is another excuse to quit learning and improving and they will. They'll leave this place and stop working on self-improvment because they were convinced "i'm not good looking enough and i'll remain a virgin for life... and that's it". And probably develop some inferiority complex.
On to a practical example:
I know everything that has been said before like ugly guys often seen dating beatifull women is common truth. But here's something I experienced personally.
About 8-9 months ago I was still like all the years before that deemed ugly by most girls. And one particular girl even commented to one guy about me (who she didn't know was my friend) "look at the guy coming in now - he's the ugliest you've ever seen.
After I improved myself, developing a strong manly personality and getting alot more confidence and just seeming manlier in the way I walk and the voice I use and most importantly appearing with a big curtain of mistery about me... I started getting girls saying "he's gorgeus", "he's pretty (never thought you could say that for a guy)" and getting complimented alot from girls. I started the kind of compliments HBs get from pathetic AFCs.
And the most interesting part? I was making out with that girl I mentioned just 2 weeks ago.
Did I have plastic surgery? Did I go thru a great change in my physical apperance? No! I didn't even get a new haircut or shed a single pound. And yet I had gone from a 4 to an 8 in girls' eyes just improving my personality and DJ skills.
1. Attraction is mostly on a psychological basis.
Psychology has proved we find more attractive those people whom we like. Meaning that if we like their personality we tend to rate them as better looking. Or vice versa. If we don't like the personality of some person we tend to rate them as less attractive them they really are. This is moreso for women than men.
2. Women don't know what they want
'Nuff said
3. Don't take advice ON women FROM women.
Self-explanatory
In conclusion:
Mystery Woman's thread is trying to produce insecurities among the men of sosuave.
I mean even if looks were the most important thing (which they aren't) and I know from experience. Why would you try to force upon the fragile personalities that you know most men on these boards have? All they need is another excuse to quit learning and improving and they will. They'll leave this place and stop working on self-improvment because they were convinced "i'm not good looking enough and i'll remain a virgin for life... and that's it". And probably develop some inferiority complex.
On to a practical example:
I know everything that has been said before like ugly guys often seen dating beatifull women is common truth. But here's something I experienced personally.
About 8-9 months ago I was still like all the years before that deemed ugly by most girls. And one particular girl even commented to one guy about me (who she didn't know was my friend) "look at the guy coming in now - he's the ugliest you've ever seen.
After I improved myself, developing a strong manly personality and getting alot more confidence and just seeming manlier in the way I walk and the voice I use and most importantly appearing with a big curtain of mistery about me... I started getting girls saying "he's gorgeus", "he's pretty (never thought you could say that for a guy)" and getting complimented alot from girls. I started the kind of compliments HBs get from pathetic AFCs.
And the most interesting part? I was making out with that girl I mentioned just 2 weeks ago.
Did I have plastic surgery? Did I go thru a great change in my physical apperance? No! I didn't even get a new haircut or shed a single pound. And yet I had gone from a 4 to an 8 in girls' eyes just improving my personality and DJ skills.
SexPDX
Master Don Juan
The length of some of these looks threads always gives me a headache so I have not read most of this thread. I am sorry if what I have to say here is redundant.
Looks do matter. However, the MAIN reason they matter is because they affect the guy's ability to convey the belief of his attractiveness.
I have friends who used to be out of shape and got in very good shape. They got more girls. Did girls think they were more attactive just based on the change in their looks? Yes. But another thing that happened that made a BIGGER difference is that by BECOMING more attractive they were more able to convey thir BELIEF that they were attractive.
-PDX
Looks do matter. However, the MAIN reason they matter is because they affect the guy's ability to convey the belief of his attractiveness.
I have friends who used to be out of shape and got in very good shape. They got more girls. Did girls think they were more attactive just based on the change in their looks? Yes. But another thing that happened that made a BIGGER difference is that by BECOMING more attractive they were more able to convey thir BELIEF that they were attractive.
-PDX
billythekid78
Don Juan
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what gets me, is that all the HBs tend to have impenetrable b*tch shields which are near impossible to break down unless you are some sort of male model, or come out with EXACTLY the right C+F remark for the situation.
The other thing to remember is that girls who place a high value on look are probably best not knowing anyhow, especially if they're impolite, this evening whilst waiting to move through a bit of this club I was in I made eye contact with a pretty girl standing against the wall next to me, she held my gaze, so I continiued to look at her and gave her a smile, then she looked me up and down and made a face that showed she thought I wasnt good looking enough for her high standards (wish I'd thought of some good C+F response), the fact that she did this didnt piss me off too much, if she was going to make such a snap judgement she probably wasnt worth getting to know, but the realisation that I possibly wasnt looking great this evening (I need a haircut for a start) was enough to dent my confidence for the rest of the evening. Unfortunately first impressions count for alot,
What I really need I guess is some sort of constant subliminal reminder that some women do find me attractive, (I've managed a 9 on hotornot) and some way of instinctively avoiding the stuck up b*tches
The other thing to remember is that girls who place a high value on look are probably best not knowing anyhow, especially if they're impolite, this evening whilst waiting to move through a bit of this club I was in I made eye contact with a pretty girl standing against the wall next to me, she held my gaze, so I continiued to look at her and gave her a smile, then she looked me up and down and made a face that showed she thought I wasnt good looking enough for her high standards (wish I'd thought of some good C+F response), the fact that she did this didnt piss me off too much, if she was going to make such a snap judgement she probably wasnt worth getting to know, but the realisation that I possibly wasnt looking great this evening (I need a haircut for a start) was enough to dent my confidence for the rest of the evening. Unfortunately first impressions count for alot,
What I really need I guess is some sort of constant subliminal reminder that some women do find me attractive, (I've managed a 9 on hotornot) and some way of instinctively avoiding the stuck up b*tches
( . )( . )
Banned
Yes very true, it gets your foot in the door so to speak
Chubbs Peterson
Senior Don Juan
There's a VERY important distintion to be made...
... and that is that Males and Females have different value scales as far as looks are concerned.
OF COURSE females want a good looking guy. Why wouldn't they? But looks aren't the MAIN thing females want. If you don't have a GOOD personality to match the good looks, you're not gonna last very long. Because ultimately, females desire RELATIONSHIPS. You can't have a "relationship" with a good looking face.
Good looks + Bad personality = Bad relationship.
Generally, MALES aren't as relationship oriented as Females. We are more "Object" oriented. We don't actually need to TALK or RELATE to female to get satisfaction from her. Our satisfaction stems from merely looking at her.
Good looks + Bad personality = Good "objectification"
Looks DO count, but males place more value on it because mostly that's all we need from a woman to be satisfied.
... and that is that Males and Females have different value scales as far as looks are concerned.
OF COURSE females want a good looking guy. Why wouldn't they? But looks aren't the MAIN thing females want. If you don't have a GOOD personality to match the good looks, you're not gonna last very long. Because ultimately, females desire RELATIONSHIPS. You can't have a "relationship" with a good looking face.
Good looks + Bad personality = Bad relationship.
Generally, MALES aren't as relationship oriented as Females. We are more "Object" oriented. We don't actually need to TALK or RELATE to female to get satisfaction from her. Our satisfaction stems from merely looking at her.
Good looks + Bad personality = Good "objectification"
Looks DO count, but males place more value on it because mostly that's all we need from a woman to be satisfied.
billythekid78
Don Juan
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mahon83050
Banned
Ramin,
I agree with you 100%. There are guys (the ones you see in Soap Operas or modelling in some add who 98% of women will think are hot. These are guys with the perfectly balanced nose, cheeks etc...your Pitts, Clooneys, Paul Walkers etc. However , probably only 1-5% of the male population fits into this category. I am like Ramin and most other people, I do not have a stunning looking face at first glance and I have my MINOR facial assymetries like MOST other guys do. Most girls will find me average or cute, a few stunning and a few ugly. I came to realize looks do matter, of course....but if you are in the Grey Area 4-7 Range (like most of us are) you can still manage to get an attractive chick if you have game. If you are 30+ lbs overweight or have an ugly face.....I don't think you are going to attract hot women now matter how much DJ skills you have. Sure, I have seen many guys in the grey area with very hot women, but not guys in the 1-3 range. Bottom Line, if you are atleast average you will still be a Brad Pitt to some hot chick.
I agree with you 100%. There are guys (the ones you see in Soap Operas or modelling in some add who 98% of women will think are hot. These are guys with the perfectly balanced nose, cheeks etc...your Pitts, Clooneys, Paul Walkers etc. However , probably only 1-5% of the male population fits into this category. I am like Ramin and most other people, I do not have a stunning looking face at first glance and I have my MINOR facial assymetries like MOST other guys do. Most girls will find me average or cute, a few stunning and a few ugly. I came to realize looks do matter, of course....but if you are in the Grey Area 4-7 Range (like most of us are) you can still manage to get an attractive chick if you have game. If you are 30+ lbs overweight or have an ugly face.....I don't think you are going to attract hot women now matter how much DJ skills you have. Sure, I have seen many guys in the grey area with very hot women, but not guys in the 1-3 range. Bottom Line, if you are atleast average you will still be a Brad Pitt to some hot chick.
billythekid78
Don Juan
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Bingo.
Some of you people need to do a little research on evolutionary psychology instead of drawing your own conclusions based upon what appears on the surface.
Men want youthful good looks in a mate and women want a man with resources. Looks is one of the many assets a man may posess to increase his chances of attracting a good looking woman, but all else being equal the woman will choose the man with the gold any day.
This is why confidence is such a big issue. Modern day people are innundated with so much information every minute of every day, they have evolved a shortcut to assessing others. In short, confidence is one method women use to sniff out men who have potential and eliminate those with no potential. After all, who would a person's potential better than themselves?
You can find a scientific explaination for mate selection in the book The Moral Animal by Robert Wright. You people can hypothesise and guess all you like but there is a very basic explaination for our actions as humans. If you think you know more than the doctors that study this stuff for a living you should have a way to back up your claims, that's all I can say.
Gangster Of Love
Master Don Juan
Guys, don't you think you are being a little harsh on Mystery? She was just saying that looks do matter. They do. To say that they don't is being naive. How important looks are to each women varies, but the woman must find you attractive, and more times than not, physical attractiveness does matter. Should it matter? You might say "well, people shouldn't care" , "looks shouldn't matter!" Well, guess what? They do. Let's not live in the shoulds or coulds.
Mystery Woman was just saying that looks matter to women more than men think, or realize they do. As a guy, I think that's something good to know. Guys, do the looks in a woman matter to you? Sure they do. It might not be the only thing we look at, but we want to find the person attractive. Why are we acting so shocked and butt hurt at the fact that somebody says that women are into looks more than men realize. Its her opinion, and it is pretty accurate. You can't generalize, but you better believe that a good majority of women do care about looks, just like we do. I don't think she was saying that it was the only thing she looked into, but she did admit that it is important. Why shouldn't it be? Because she's a woman? Come on guys, we should have pride in doing what we can to look good. We owe it to ourselves.
In the last 2 months i've dropped 15 pounds of fat, and changed the way my body looks. Guess what, I am looked at, talked at, and complimented more by women now, than I was two months ago. I am the same person, yet been getting noticed a lot more recently, just because the improvement in my physique. Some women like nice faces, some are more into the nice body. There needs to be some attraction. Kinda like us guys, we have our preferences, don't we?
Mystery Woman was just saying that looks matter to women more than men think, or realize they do. As a guy, I think that's something good to know. Guys, do the looks in a woman matter to you? Sure they do. It might not be the only thing we look at, but we want to find the person attractive. Why are we acting so shocked and butt hurt at the fact that somebody says that women are into looks more than men realize. Its her opinion, and it is pretty accurate. You can't generalize, but you better believe that a good majority of women do care about looks, just like we do. I don't think she was saying that it was the only thing she looked into, but she did admit that it is important. Why shouldn't it be? Because she's a woman? Come on guys, we should have pride in doing what we can to look good. We owe it to ourselves.
In the last 2 months i've dropped 15 pounds of fat, and changed the way my body looks. Guess what, I am looked at, talked at, and complimented more by women now, than I was two months ago. I am the same person, yet been getting noticed a lot more recently, just because the improvement in my physique. Some women like nice faces, some are more into the nice body. There needs to be some attraction. Kinda like us guys, we have our preferences, don't we?
sflawstudent
Don Juan
I don't claim to be the most knowledgeable DJ in this thread (far from it, in fact), but it seems to me that this is all really simple.
At the most general level, both men and women look for VALUE from prospective partners.
Stunning looks are one means to hold value. Having money is another. Others include the ability to make conversation, the ability to give your partner some kind of social status, having respect from others, having raw physical strength, and so on. The different genders seem to generally differ in what they're after, but looks are valuable to both.
If you're an ugly mofo, you're not going to get with a model unless you provide TREMENDOUS value elsewhere. That value might be giving a woman feelings she's never experienced before, such as being the first guy to not put her on a pedestal, etc. This, in theory, can create the anecdotal situation everyone talks about where some Lyle Lovett-looking guy can be nailing a 10.
But all the examples like Mick Jagger, etc. are BS. That guy provides tremendous value in terms of financial resources, the feeling of being close to fame, etc. ... it doesn't matter what he looks like.
Also keep in mind that you have to be entirely clear what you're talking about. What you or I find "attractive" is susceptible to outside influence. A friend says a girl's hot, she (usually) becomes more attractive to you. I see Jennifer Garner in a polaroid from a club, I give her a 7 - I see her on the cover of 12 magazines and hear all my friends say she's hot, and I increase my value of her without really thinking about it.
Raw, physical attraction, on the other hand, is to me something that is there before the other means of providing value enter the calculus.
At the most general level, both men and women look for VALUE from prospective partners.
Stunning looks are one means to hold value. Having money is another. Others include the ability to make conversation, the ability to give your partner some kind of social status, having respect from others, having raw physical strength, and so on. The different genders seem to generally differ in what they're after, but looks are valuable to both.
If you're an ugly mofo, you're not going to get with a model unless you provide TREMENDOUS value elsewhere. That value might be giving a woman feelings she's never experienced before, such as being the first guy to not put her on a pedestal, etc. This, in theory, can create the anecdotal situation everyone talks about where some Lyle Lovett-looking guy can be nailing a 10.
But all the examples like Mick Jagger, etc. are BS. That guy provides tremendous value in terms of financial resources, the feeling of being close to fame, etc. ... it doesn't matter what he looks like.
Also keep in mind that you have to be entirely clear what you're talking about. What you or I find "attractive" is susceptible to outside influence. A friend says a girl's hot, she (usually) becomes more attractive to you. I see Jennifer Garner in a polaroid from a club, I give her a 7 - I see her on the cover of 12 magazines and hear all my friends say she's hot, and I increase my value of her without really thinking about it.
Raw, physical attraction, on the other hand, is to me something that is there before the other means of providing value enter the calculus.
MysteryWoman
Master Don Juan
The guy who sent is photo is not ugly, and the evolutionary theory has slight flaws, although mainly true, is dated.
Many guys can't handle the fact that women are becoming more looks oriented than ever before, as women are more finacially independent.
In my university newspaper last month, a female student wrote an article about &*%!@ university being an ugly university (any guy who attends the same university as me may have read this article), complaining that the number of goodlooking girls out number the guys. Although I see quite a few guys on campus I like the look off.
I never said you have to be a model to get a girl. But any guy who thinks that a woman that does not care about looks is naive.
Many years ago men experienced the feelings of romantic passionate love much more than women did, the plain simple reason is that they had much more freedom to go for looks.
I'm just saying for a women to be sexually into to some extent she has to be physically attracted to you, attitude does not attract a girls attention, it simply maintains it.
Like many girls initially I always said personality was the most important factor, but have to admit alone it was not enough, I had to be into the guys look to be able to date him.
But I still agree that men have the freedom to trade higher. But I have never seen a model look that happy on the arm of an ugly man, it was definately not "can't keep my hands off him".
I can't help being interested in a guys look, but aleast I'm not a gold digger.
Guys wouldn't you be upset if you found out the girl you were dating was not really attracted to you, and was with you for another reason?
Many guys can't handle the fact that women are becoming more looks oriented than ever before, as women are more finacially independent.
In my university newspaper last month, a female student wrote an article about &*%!@ university being an ugly university (any guy who attends the same university as me may have read this article), complaining that the number of goodlooking girls out number the guys. Although I see quite a few guys on campus I like the look off.
I never said you have to be a model to get a girl. But any guy who thinks that a woman that does not care about looks is naive.
Many years ago men experienced the feelings of romantic passionate love much more than women did, the plain simple reason is that they had much more freedom to go for looks.
I'm just saying for a women to be sexually into to some extent she has to be physically attracted to you, attitude does not attract a girls attention, it simply maintains it.
Like many girls initially I always said personality was the most important factor, but have to admit alone it was not enough, I had to be into the guys look to be able to date him.
But I still agree that men have the freedom to trade higher. But I have never seen a model look that happy on the arm of an ugly man, it was definately not "can't keep my hands off him".
I can't help being interested in a guys look, but aleast I'm not a gold digger.
Guys wouldn't you be upset if you found out the girl you were dating was not really attracted to you, and was with you for another reason?
sflawstudent
Don Juan
The bottom line is that you're dead-on, MW.
Back in the day, as long as a guy was a good provider, he'd be guaranteed to be a hot commodity. The ironic part of this is that a guy's odds of being a good provider were much greater (about 85-90% greater, if we were to quantify it) back when women weren't in the work force. As long as a guy didn't look like a freak and he had a solid gig as a middle-manager at IBM, all the women from the local social club would be looking to set him up with relatively attractive women. Ah, the pre-sexual revolution. So repressed, yet so beautiful.
Now women can be choosy, and this is one reason for the amazing increase in male vanity the last decade or so has seen.
Improving oneself for the sake of doing so is admirable, but most improvements are inextricably linked to improving in order to make oneself more attractive to women. I don't wear Gucci shoes because I love the fit, and I don't work out every day to be muscular just for the hell of it. I'm "improving myself" with the latter, but if it didn't increase my value to women, I probably wouldn't do it.
Back in the day, as long as a guy was a good provider, he'd be guaranteed to be a hot commodity. The ironic part of this is that a guy's odds of being a good provider were much greater (about 85-90% greater, if we were to quantify it) back when women weren't in the work force. As long as a guy didn't look like a freak and he had a solid gig as a middle-manager at IBM, all the women from the local social club would be looking to set him up with relatively attractive women. Ah, the pre-sexual revolution. So repressed, yet so beautiful.
Now women can be choosy, and this is one reason for the amazing increase in male vanity the last decade or so has seen.
Improving oneself for the sake of doing so is admirable, but most improvements are inextricably linked to improving in order to make oneself more attractive to women. I don't wear Gucci shoes because I love the fit, and I don't work out every day to be muscular just for the hell of it. I'm "improving myself" with the latter, but if it didn't increase my value to women, I probably wouldn't do it.
Thank you, MysteryWoman, it HAS NEVER occurred to me that women are harsher about looks then men are, thank you so much for enlightening my incredibly ignorant nature.
But the greater detail of what you were saying lacked accuracy.
What I was trying to say before, is that a lot of average looking women are REALLY harsh about looks when they can't ultimately afford to be.
A woman who is a 6 or 7 and does nothing but talk about looks all the time, yet believes she DESERVES a good-looking, rich, successful, funny man who will be good father material, is living on another planet.
It just ain't gonna happen.
You have to have something to offer the man as well, otherwise the best you will do is a ONS with a good looking guy who has nothing else going for him, or doesn't have the communication skills or confidence to do better.
Why would a guy who 'has everything' be wasting his time with an average woman who just talks about looks all the time? Answer: he wouldn't.
Now if a guy is very good looking but on a stupidity level to the point where he only talks about looks all the time, THAT WILL NOT IMPRESS THE HBs.
Your HB analogy is a very poor one, because there ARE many HBs about who ARE less shallow than the 6s or 7s. They can also be a lot 'deeper' for want of a better word.
Yes, things like height, colour, complexion etc. do affect the overall picture, I admitted that.
But you have to accept that a lot of the good DJs on this forum have a 'only go for the HBs' ideology precisely because they ALREADY know how shallow average women can be. They don't need some bitter Londoner trying to hurt their egos, it doesn't work, these men have been who they are all their lives, you're not shocking anybody, MysteryWoman.
These are the guys who YOU think are probably desperate, when they aren't. Because they CAN get HBs and they genuinely don't give a s.hit about average looking women who just whinge on about looks all the time.
I appreciate that any guy on this thread who is four foot tall or has two heads WILL disagree with me and tend to agree more with MysteryWoman, but what we're talking about here are a generation of women who grew up in front of a TV set and think they DESERVE the perfect man just because they happen to be who they are.
They will end up lonely and unwanted because they have next to nothing to offer back, besides a heart that has forgotten how to sing.
But the greater detail of what you were saying lacked accuracy.
What I was trying to say before, is that a lot of average looking women are REALLY harsh about looks when they can't ultimately afford to be.
A woman who is a 6 or 7 and does nothing but talk about looks all the time, yet believes she DESERVES a good-looking, rich, successful, funny man who will be good father material, is living on another planet.
It just ain't gonna happen.
You have to have something to offer the man as well, otherwise the best you will do is a ONS with a good looking guy who has nothing else going for him, or doesn't have the communication skills or confidence to do better.
Why would a guy who 'has everything' be wasting his time with an average woman who just talks about looks all the time? Answer: he wouldn't.
Now if a guy is very good looking but on a stupidity level to the point where he only talks about looks all the time, THAT WILL NOT IMPRESS THE HBs.
Your HB analogy is a very poor one, because there ARE many HBs about who ARE less shallow than the 6s or 7s. They can also be a lot 'deeper' for want of a better word.
Yes, things like height, colour, complexion etc. do affect the overall picture, I admitted that.
But you have to accept that a lot of the good DJs on this forum have a 'only go for the HBs' ideology precisely because they ALREADY know how shallow average women can be. They don't need some bitter Londoner trying to hurt their egos, it doesn't work, these men have been who they are all their lives, you're not shocking anybody, MysteryWoman.
These are the guys who YOU think are probably desperate, when they aren't. Because they CAN get HBs and they genuinely don't give a s.hit about average looking women who just whinge on about looks all the time.
I appreciate that any guy on this thread who is four foot tall or has two heads WILL disagree with me and tend to agree more with MysteryWoman, but what we're talking about here are a generation of women who grew up in front of a TV set and think they DESERVE the perfect man just because they happen to be who they are.
They will end up lonely and unwanted because they have next to nothing to offer back, besides a heart that has forgotten how to sing.
MysteryWoman
Master Don Juan
Brad 23 obviously isn't that good looking
If you really believe that average looking girls are more selective on the whole, you've got it wrong.
I am not angry or bitter, I've dated hot guys. And will not date guys I am not attracted to.
Brad 23 likes to believe that it is okay for an average looking guy to date goodlooking women, yet as the ARROGANCE to criticise women who go for looks.
The only guy who is free to really criticise is the one who can put his hand on his heart and say he never judges a woman on her looks.
Brad 23 needs to pull his socks up!
If you really believe that average looking girls are more selective on the whole, you've got it wrong.
I am not angry or bitter, I've dated hot guys. And will not date guys I am not attracted to.
Brad 23 likes to believe that it is okay for an average looking guy to date goodlooking women, yet as the ARROGANCE to criticise women who go for looks.
The only guy who is free to really criticise is the one who can put his hand on his heart and say he never judges a woman on her looks.
Brad 23 needs to pull his socks up!
You're wrong , MysteryWoman.
Most of the guys I know go for girls who tend to be HBs because there IS often a very good chance of her not being shallow.
You say I'm obviously not good looking. If you only give a s.hit about very good looking guys, then YOU would probably not think I am good looking.
But a lot of HBs would disagree with that - i.e. the ones I haved pulled in my life so far!
Your argument is way too simplistic, you're not telling anybody in
this forum something they don't already now.
Straightforwardly put, shallow women don't like themselves because they KNOW they judge a man's VALUE by how he looks.
I'm not sure a man judges a woman's VALUE by how she looks. He might think 'I want to fcuk her,' or simply 'She looks good' but he won't necessarily THINK she is WORTH more as a human being. Of course, in such a scenario, the male is the more arrogant of the two!!
I am walking proof that women have varying tastes in men, but they are too selfish to understand another woman's different taste, because only their taste in men is the 'right' one.
So what happened to all these hot guys you've dated? Did they use you for sex or just get bored with the conversation?
Most of the guys I know go for girls who tend to be HBs because there IS often a very good chance of her not being shallow.
You say I'm obviously not good looking. If you only give a s.hit about very good looking guys, then YOU would probably not think I am good looking.
But a lot of HBs would disagree with that - i.e. the ones I haved pulled in my life so far!
Your argument is way too simplistic, you're not telling anybody in
this forum something they don't already now.
Straightforwardly put, shallow women don't like themselves because they KNOW they judge a man's VALUE by how he looks.
I'm not sure a man judges a woman's VALUE by how she looks. He might think 'I want to fcuk her,' or simply 'She looks good' but he won't necessarily THINK she is WORTH more as a human being. Of course, in such a scenario, the male is the more arrogant of the two!!
I am walking proof that women have varying tastes in men, but they are too selfish to understand another woman's different taste, because only their taste in men is the 'right' one.
So what happened to all these hot guys you've dated? Did they use you for sex or just get bored with the conversation?
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