Let's Be Real Here Pt.4 - "GAME" alone cannot create physical attraction

[SW15]

I was watching a movie on the couch with this chick way back. We started making out heavily. (She picked a night where her roommate was out. It was totally on for us.)

Anyway, it was a very funny movie playing on the tv where I knew the lines. During the makeout, I could overhear the funny scene. I pulled back and burst out laughing. (Couldn’t help it.). She walked me to the door and said good night. It was over. The laughing killed the moment and was a major turnoff to her.

One night I was at the club in the early 2000s. I was using some funny routines. These two girls laughed hysterically. One of them told me I should do standup comedy. But as soon as my funny routines ran out, one of the girls approached this super serious (seemingly pissed off in appearance) guy. They left together shortly after.

TLDR: Mating is serious business. There is something sultry/sexy/alpha about being serious when you are trying to pull or seduce. Humor is more entertainment and friend-like. While some playfulness can be ok, excessive humor can kill the moment.

I was 29 at the time. She was a very cute 23 blonde. It was our 3rd date. Everything was going perfectly up until that point. Then it was game over.

If we had hooked up before, it would have been cute and totally forgivable. But I was still in the “probationary period” so zero mistakes were allowed.

"Probationary periods" have gotten even more strict since that era you describe in the early 2000s. A date of a certain quality that would have warranted a second date in the 2000-2006 era would result in a ghosting in the 2010-present era.

Being a funny beta male, contrary to what this article says, won't persuade women into having s*x.

In general, what you say is true. The only exception is social circle. If a beta male has a strong social circle and meets women through social circle introductions, then being funny might help. If a beta male is meeting women through tech-based methods or approaching strangers, being funny won't matter much.

Social circle is one of the few ways that a beta can find a woman. Without a social circle, a beta will need more money/status.

 

[Smooth_texter]

I'm mostly polyamorous and while most of my lovers will stay with me for years, I'm not into monogamous LTR. And most women like me because I'm a witty interesting non-conformist Einzelganger and different from the guys they usually ended up with.


I think you misread that I said to use humour to get out of 'situations', but I'm not talking about joking yourself to mask stupidity.
I wouldn't get in the situation you describe. First of all, I don't try to impress women by surrounding them with luxury. Second, if I do go to a restaurant (instead of cooking for women, which impresses them way more than restaurant reservations) I always call ahead to reserve a table (and ask them to put a bar stool/child chair next to the table for my cat.
If you try to impress a woman with luxury dining and you don't prep by making reservations and knowing the menu, you're an idiot. It's a good **** test to see how psychologically resilient your date is, but that's another strategy.


Again, never did I say 'joking'. Telling jokes is not the same as having a sense of humour.
And I do talk "right off the bat" with women about serious topics and difficult life problems because I counsel women with C-PTSD. And I can do that because I use the right tone and women feel safe around me.


I think that you confuse 'humour' with 'cracking jokes'. It's the difference between 'wit' and 'trying to be funny'.

As you have said, you have built a niche style, which attracts women looking for that type of man. You combine it with wit and humor, and this works well on them. My advice was for the regular Joe, who doesn't stand out with anything, that he would need to pick his exact moments with humor, but mostly would need to become interesting/good looking first (something to set him apart from the other men) and keep some sexual tension in the interactions.

This is because most women have heard enough compliments and humor/wit from regular Joes, so this alone will not impress them that much (my point was related to the dating phase, not already established relationships).

The example that I described was to show that humor cannot be used in all difficult situations, especially with a woman that you have just started dating. It is not the way I organize or conduct my dates. I presume you use humor in your counseling, in order to create a positive and safe environment for your clients, and in your polyamorous relationships. This is a very different setting than being on a first of second date with a new woman, and having nothing going on for you.

 

[Smooth_texter]

True. My husband is 6’3” so he is tall. I was a little on the fence at first as he’s blond with blue eyes (not my usual type) but he is objectively handsome.

Taking off (literally) will comment further later….

@BeExcellent - I am waiting for you to convince me that your husband won you over with charm alone (and not the fact that he is 6'3'', earns 6 figures or was a semi pro athlete).

 

[Smooth_texter]

"Probationary periods" have gotten even more strict since that era you describe in the early 2000s. A date of a certain quality that would have warranted a second date in the 2000-2006 era would result in a ghosting in the 2010-present era.



In general, what you say is true. The only exception is social circle. If a beta male has a strong social circle and meets women through social circle introductions, then being funny might help. If a beta male is meeting women through tech-based methods or approaching strangers, being funny won't matter much.

Social circle is one of the few ways that a beta can find a woman. Without a social circle, a beta will need more money/status.

Yes, there is literally no room for mistakes now. I presume this is due to all of the abundance that women experience from the various digital sources.

Everything from choosing the best words possible when you match, to choosing the perfect place for the date, things that you say and so on.

As I have said previously - it was easier 10-12 years ago, with having little or no game. But we must adapt.

 

[SW15]

Yes, there is literally no room for mistakes now. I presume this is due to all of the abundance that women experience from the various digital sources.

Everything from choosing the best words possible when you match, to choosing the perfect place for the date, things that you say and so on.

As I have said previously - it was easier 10-12 years ago, having little or no game. But we must adapt.

In the era in between when dating websites got de-stigmatized (roughly 2005) and the launch of swipe apps (2012) is when female abundance took off. Even in the late 2000s when women were using online dating websites, they gave men from the websites zero room for error.

The app environment just exploded all the bad trends from the website era.

I remember the early 2010s before apps took off and arranging some dates via website and realizing I had no margin for error. It was stressful.

The absolute worst interactions any man will have in early stage dating will be from dates arranged from a tech-based method. Women don't treat men who approach them in-person too much better than the tech-arranged men, but it is a slight upgrade.

If a normie range looks man desires humane treatment in the early stages of dating, the only way to get that now is through social circle arranged dates. Normie range is under 8 to 8.5 in looks. I've had my photos rated on Photofeeler at around a 7 depending on the photo.

 

[Smooth_texter]

I got that, but I wanted to put forth that 'humour' is an umbrella term, including 'joking', 'wit', 'sarcasm', et cetera; but also a positive happy mindset that helps chasing the dark clouds away. None of this will work by themselves, so you also need to be engaging in speech and reasonably attractive. Another thing is that while many people think they have humour, their humour isn't really funny or witty, their 'sarcasm' more 'sour grapes', and their jokes mostly at the expense of others.


I don't approach, but that doesn't mean I'm not approached. And if I fancy a woman who approaches me, I'm free to pursue them, as I do regularly. The difference is that I have sex in abundance. New lovers are welcome, but not needed. Because I lack that urge to pounce on sex, women tend to get even more interested and my humorous deflections from their 'penetrating' interview questions heighten the tension in women who are used to having all their questions promptly answered. I'm a novelist, so I know how to 'engage the audience' by delaying the answers to their questions and constantly creating new waves of curiosity.

All my polyamorous relationships start with dating a stranger.
All my counseling patients meet me for the first time and have to be put at ease.

I use humour in all my interactions with all women, strange or familiar.

I get it, but as you have said - you are getting approached. This basically means that the women that do so are already physically attracted (looking for the artist type, which is their type). From there on, not much game is needed (Unless a man is not socially calibrated). And wit/humor is one of the tools in that toolbox. The other things that you have mentioned are added bonuses, which increase their attraction.

This proves the whole premise of my thread - "GAME" cannot create physical attraction, but you can increase physical attraction that is already there with "GAME".

 

[characternote]

This proves the whole premise of my thread - "GAME" cannot create physical attraction, but you can increase physical attraction that is already there with "GAME".

This is essentially work Mark Manson says - that game is their to AMPLIFY EXISTING attraction.

 

[Hamurabimbi]

Here's an experiance I had, that points out that Game can be non-existant, or even negative. But the end result is success. I'm a big outdoors fanatic and in particular, love the desert. I found out there was a leader-led series of day-hikes over a long weekend in SoCal. So I signed up and drove down. Stayed overnight before the meetup at a small town. When I got up, I made the mistake of drinking the room coffee. As it wound up giving me GI issues, a bit later. I drove and met up with the group. About a dozen and the leader. Most were middle aged, a few couples and a young woman who was a student at UNLV. I noticed she drove a nice Mustang. I chatted a bit with her and a few others. Well. The bad coffee kicked in and, it being the desert, with minimal cover, I had to walk almost to the horizon to find cover to take a dump. I got back I told the group I wasn't feeling well, would drive back to town and meet them tomorrow. Without hesitation, the UNLV girl said she'd felt like going back to town as well. We drove into town and met at the motel parking lot. She right away said; " Lets get a room." I told her; "You understand I'm sick? And not like a headache, or stuffy nose sick." She shrugged it off and said, 'that's fine, Just get Pepto-bismal or something. You'll get better." Well. I did get better in a couple of hours. We did the deed and the next day, we got up too late to meet the group. So we did some hiking around on our own.

I did meet up with her a couple of months later for New Years Eve in LA.

 

[Smooth_texter]

This is essentially work Mark Manson says - that game is their to AMPLIFY EXISTING attraction.

I don't know who that is, but I will check his stuff.

Thanks!

 

[Smooth_texter]

You need a combination of 'skills/talents', absolutely.

I do find that it balances itself. For instance, I didn't wear an eyepatch before 2015, and probably wasn't so 'interesting' to women. I also noticed more interest after I grew my beard which also makes me appear more masculine and as a result I don't have to 'woo' women with my words like I used to need.

Yes, exactly.

The more masculine/interesting look that you created, the less effort required from you via verbal and text game. And also lower effort required for maintaining existing relationships, due to the fact that you stand off from a crowd. You were basically looks maxing in a specific niche.

 

[Smooth_texter]

Here's an experiance I had, that points out that Game can be non-existant, or even negative. But the end result is success. I'm a big outdoors fanatic and in particular, love the desert. I found out there was a leader-led series of day-hikes over a long weekend in SoCal. So I signed up and drove down. Stayed overnight before the meetup at a small town. When I got up, I made the mistake of drinking the room coffee. As it wound up giving me GI issues, a bit later. I drove and met up with the group. About a dozen and the leader. Most were middle aged, a few couples and a young woman who was a student at UNLV. I noticed she drove a nice Mustang. I chatted a bit with her and a few others. Well. The bad coffee kicked in and, it being the desert, with minimal cover, I had to walk almost to the horizon to find cover to take a dump. I got back I told the group I wasn't feeling well, would drive back to town and meet them tomorrow. Without hesitation, the UNLV girl said she'd felt like going back to town as well. We drove into town and met at the motel parking lot. She right away said; " Lets get a room." I told her; "You understand I'm sick? And not like a headache, or stuffy nose sick." She shrugged it off and said, 'that's fine, Just get Pepto-bismal or something. You'll get better." Well. I did get better in a couple of hours. We did the deed and the next day, we got up too late to meet the group. So we did some hiking around on our own.

I did meet up with her a couple of months later for New Years Eve in LA.

Yes, this usually happens when a woman is very physically attracted or you are her best option (at the given moment). No game is needed, unless you are socially awkward. Modern women are a lot more active and aggressive than in previous generations. If she really likes you, she would try everything to make it happen. For example, a woman once created a whole fake party with lots of our mutual friends just to flirt with me and create a setting in which I would seduce her.

I also remember back in college when a few women were inviting me to their places to "study". They were attracted for some reason, and it definitely was not my game.

And other such examples. I believe most men can remember such experiences, and if they can't - they probably weren't able to detect female interest and female game on time.

 

[BeExcellent]

@BeExcellent - I am waiting for you to convince me that your husband won you over with charm alone (and not the fact that he is 6'3'', earns 6 figures or was a semi pro athlete).

He didn’t. I have certain criteria and I am attractive enough to attract the type man who meets that criteria. The SMP is self selecting. High SMV people can attract other high SMV people. If an individual is not high SMV then reality is that such an individual is unlikely to be able to attract and maintain a high SMV partner.

Game or charm helps men of similar attractiveness differentiate themselves from others. Game or charm can raise SMV as well but generally not by a huge amount. A 3 isn’t suddenly going to become a 9 on game alone.

My husband had game/charm but had sufficient physical attractiveness that he got the opportunity to demonstrate his charm.

 

[Smooth_texter]

He didn’t. I have certain criteria and I am attractive enough to attract the type man who meets that criteria. The SMP is self selecting. High SMV people can attract other high SMV people. If an individual is not high SMV then reality is that such an individual is unlikely to be able to attract and maintain a high SMV partner.

Game or charm helps men of similar attractiveness differentiate themselves from others. Game or charm can raise SMV as well but generally not by a huge amount. A 3 isn’t suddenly going to become a 9 on game alone.

My husband had game/charm but had sufficient physical attractiveness that he got the opportunity to demonstrate his charm.

Thank you, that was my point.

"GAME" cannot create physical attraction, contrary to what is said by PUAs and red pill podcasts (or even discussed here). It can amplify it, if it was already there, by showing experience (pre-selection).

Most of the attractive people (women in specific) by default have very good game, since whether they like it or not, get approached a lot or have to deal with a lot of interested potential partners. So they would know at minimum how to effectively "brush off" low value candidates.

 

[BeExcellent]

You have no idea. NO idea, lol

 

[Smooth_texter]

You have no idea. NO idea, lol

I did not quite understood you here.

I have no idea how many suitors you had to brush off, or I have no idea what I am talking about?

 

[BeExcellent]

No idea how much unwanted attention attractive women get.

I am grateful but it’s a responsibility too.

 

[Smooth_texter]

No idea how much unwanted attention attractive women get.

I am grateful but it’s a responsibility too.

I can see that receiving a lot of attention is every woman's personal drug of choice, even for a married one. A woman's game is to dress or create an environment in which she would attract the most interest, or even make the suitors compete for her.

It would be interesting to know you honest thoughts on what might happen if you came across a man that is taller, more handsome, with a better physique and net worth that your current husband?

 

[Serenity]

I'm just gonna say that the one thing that changed everything for me was game, nothing else changed. I went from barely any interest from women to getting relatively easy lays, just by figuring out which buttons to press.

I read all the time here about how looks and such is so damn important, but unless you look absolutely hideous or like a landwhale it's probably the single most incorrect general assumption about female attraction I see.

They are not men, they aren't attracted to men in same way we get attracted to women. Women are the ones who have to prioritize their looks first, there's an entire multi billion dollar industry just to cater to female beauty.

But sure, go ahead spending years working on your looks only to just rarely getting all the way with women because your character is dull and boring.

All you have to do is make them feel good, make them have fun. Your looks aren't going to do sh!t to give them that sort of tingles.

Both aspects can be worked on simultaneously though, it's just stupid to ignore game and put all your money on looks.

 

[DreamAgain]

I'm just gonna say that the one thing that changed everything for me was game, nothing else changed. I went from barely any interest from women to getting relatively easy lays, just by figuring out which buttons to press.

I read all the time here about how looks and such is so damn important, but unless you look absolutely hideous or like a landwhale it's probably the single most incorrect general assumption about female attraction I see.

They are not men, they aren't attracted to men in same way we get attracted to women. Women are the ones who have to prioritize their looks first, there's an entire multi billion dollar industry just to cater to female beauty.

But sure, go ahead spending years working on your looks only to just rarely getting all the way with women because your character is dull and boring.

All you have to do is make them feel good, make them have fun. Your looks aren't going to do sh!t to give them that sort of tingles.

Both aspects can be worked on simultaneously though, it's just stupid to ignore game and put all your money on looks.

I found the opposite to be true. The more I worked on my charisma, became more knowledgable, increased my wittiness, it had a worse effect on my dates.

Most attractive girls I have been on dates with only liked to talk about trips, restaurants, how bad traffic is, and gossiping about her friends. Trends on social media, new shows on Netflix. Maybe a brief comment on their work on how annoying their boss is.

More charisma, more knowledge about various topics did nothing to help with relatability to any of this.

Working on my physique and my finances helped me much more than that.

 

[Serenity]

I found the opposite to be true. The more I worked on my charisma, became more knowledgable, increased my wittiness, it had a worse effect on my dates.

Most attractive girls I have been on dates with only liked to talk about trips, restaurants, how bad traffic is, and gossiping about her friends. Trends on social media, new shows on Netflix. Maybe a brief comment on their work on how annoying their boss is.

More charisma, more knowledge about various topics did nothing to help with relatability to any of this.

Working on my physique and my finances helped me much more than that.

Sounds like some boring ass women if you ask me...