Is Texting / Facebook Killing Cold Approach Game?

[spinaroonie]

Posted this on another thread. Thought I'd post it here to get the input of the older, wiser, more experienced guys on this forum.
 
The 2000s saw a dramatic acceleration in the growth of female-centric communications technology - namely, the explosion of texting, social networking, and online dating. Yet most PUA material, the DJ Bible, Book of Pook etc. was developed in the late 90s/early 2000s, before smartphones and Facebook. IMO PUA/DJ theory hasn't kept pace with the evolution of communications technology, especially now that the "seduction community" has morphed into the "seduction industry".
 
IMO all the growth in technology has had a negative effect on game. Simply, girls today have too many distractions and too many options. When was the last time you saw an attractive young woman traveling alone without iPod earpods, or peering down at her smartphone, or without a cell phone glued to her ear?
 
There was a time when “getting a number” actually meant something. You’d call her home and she’d pick up, you’d have an actual phone conversation, and you’d set up a date. Seems like something from the Jurassic period, but the older guys here will attest to this.
 
Now it’s 2011. How many threads have we read here where a guy seemingly has a great interaction with a girl in a club and gets the number, only to have the girl screen out his call or ignore his texts the next day? “Flaking” as a verb didn’t exist in the 90s or earlier – flakes were something that came with dandruff.
 
It’s funny to read guys in here still crowing about getting numbers. Fellas, numbers means nothing. Girls today give out their number like candy on Halloween. How many of those numbers are translating to dates and lays?
 
Now guys will come on here and say that it’s all a numbers game – that you need to talk to 100 girls and get 20 numbers, play these little text games, and maybe get 3 dates out of it. Who has time for that sh*t? I have other demands on my time – I work, I study, I work out, volunteer, have hobbies, and spend time with family and friends. Far better to invest in one quality interaction with one quality girl that I’ll be assured of eventually dating and laying.
 
If Mystery and Style had to contend with today’s bar/club/night game environment (and not the late 90s), Mystery wouldn’t have developed his ingenious Mystery Method and Style wouldn’t have written The Game. They likely would have growing frustrated with the constant cell phones, the constant smartphones, the constant texting and Facebooking, the constant pics-with-digital-cameras and attention-wh*ring, the constant flaking – and quit. There would be no PUA community and no PUA industry. Of course, none of this was epidemic in the late 90s/early 00s because the technology didn’t exist.
 
Mystery and Style were the right guys that came about in the right place at the right time – in the Web 1.0 era when the internet permitted the anonymous dissemination of information worldwide via newsgroups, but before the machinations of Web 2.0 (social networking, online dating, smartphones & texting) that have killed the game these guys developed.
 
Game 1.0 is dead. It’s time for Game 2.0 – game in the smartphone era.

 

[synergy1]

My stance is that we must embrace the trends and utilize them to supplement our goings with women. Facebook and mobile phones are in. There is no getting around that. It would be like walking when the automobile is around...our current infrastructure is conducive towards owning a car. Likewise, it is best to accept these trends and go from there.

Should one rely on these technologies as a crutch like so many? No. Its still paramount to create attention at the onset when you first meet the chick. The chief difference is you can play this game with many more than before. Its a numbers game, and one might have to widen their net a little in order to ensure success.

On Facebook specifically, its key to show , not tell. I don't really have much on my actual profile aside from a ton of quotes from famous authors ( 48 laws of power baby). What you have is a bunch of pictures that shows you travel, are active socially ,and in shape. I don't really mention much beyond that. If you have the image that you are the man, than you are in good shape. Hint: its better to actually BE the man!

I am still learning how to cope in this new-ish environment just as much as the next guy. I am hoping this year to be a good learning experience, and to share success stories and failures with all you folks. Let the games begin!

 

[Jeffst1980]

Good thread.

I'd imagine that, going forward, social circle game is all that will matter. Of course, everyone's "social circle" will number in the hundreds.

The big problem with cold approach pickups is that the girl can flake without consequence. Call out a girl on being a flake, and she and her friends will brand you as a stalker--even though SHE, not you, committed the social transgression. Attention is like crack to girls, so they are actually pretty welcoming of having "stalkers" constantly trying to get in touch with them.

Some have advocated trying ONLY for single night lays, but that is a lot harder than it sounds. In any major city, logistical problems abound, especially on weekend nights. Your best bet is to pickup during the day, Paul Janka style (I don't agree with a lot of what he does, but some of his ideas are extremely relevant to "game 2.0")..and go for the meet on a weekday night. At least then, isolation is already established and you won't have to worry about her friends cb-ing you. Weekend nights, you can get a makeout pretty easily, but that's about it.

I go into any cold approach situation EXPECTING the girl to flake before I can get a solid day2 in. I try to text high value, low pressure funny **** almost immediately to try to build enough rapport...sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. What DOESN'T work is waiting a few days to call, and expecting her to pick up or return your call. You CAN NOT be "mysterious" and expect her to agree to a day2. So, text away. I haven't found ANY solution to what to do when the line goes "dead," so to speak.

I would imagine the key to time bridging in the era of flakiness is to make every communication fun and emotionally charged, and just plow until something hooks. Bulk messages are good for this, because the recipient has no way of knowing they are bulk. Make a list of the flakes in your phone, and bulk mail em periodically. Only takes a second, and what's the worst that can happen?

I still use good ol fashioned phone calls to set up meets, but I'm considering switching entirely to text. I notice that a lot of younger women DO NOT answer calls at all, and once you leave a voicemail, your value is already compromised a bit.

This is an interesting subject to me because I think a lot of the community material has become quite dated. All those "in field" videos that result in a number or a makeout are really missing the point and celebrating something that is rather easy to do. If someone can come up with a truly definitive system for "text game," they'll be much more relevant to contemporary pickup than any of the founding fathers of game.

I think there's an answer to this problem, but I sure as hell can't figure it out. I do know that having an ego that causes you to feel disrespected by those who flake, or being too proud to chase will really limit your success. This is especially difficult to deal with when you've invested a lot of time and effort in improving yourself.

 

[The Duke]

I think faKebook is a haven for chumps and attention w h o r es. Its a social epidemic. Funny how something so "social" really isn't social at all. Its more about me me me me me me me. Look at what an attention w h o r e I can be...I am amazing blah blah blah.

 

[runner83]

I think faKebook is a haven for chumps and attention w h o r es. Its a social epidemic. Funny how something so "social" really isn't social at all. Its more about me me me me me me me. Look at what an attention w h o r e I can be...I am amazing blah blah blah.

That is basically it.

To me, I don't see the point of having all sorts of "friends" on it, a lot of
whom you never see anyway.

Since I try to minimise try online, spending any time on this cr*p is not something that is worth my time.

Texting on the other hand, I think is a much better way ti go than a phone call. Cancels out the time factor and you can do it at anytime.

 

[Noodles]

It’s funny to read guys in here still crowing about getting numbers. Fellas, numbers means nothing. Girls today give out their number like candy on Halloween. How many of those numbers are translating to dates and lays?

It depends on how they got it I guess. I know girls that will give out their number like their name. The question is how long where you talking to her BEFORE you got her number. How were things going? Did you make her laugh? Was she seem interested? A phone number represents a girl likes you. And on it's own it doesn't mean that anymore - but surely we all know when a girl likes us and it's worth calling her...right?

I don't see how chatting to random women is any different to chatting to a random guy. If I'm in the gym, dance class, watching football, at a bar, whatever...I will often chat to random people - male or female - it makes no difference. If I happen to be chatting to a girl, and she impresses me enough I will ask for her number. If she doesn't and we haven't clicked I won't. Why waste my time calling someone, going for drinks etc if it's not there? If you did click...she'll answer your call...and she won't flake.

 

[squirrels]

So...if I'm getting your message correctly, what you're saying is you're scared of competing with the Internets for a girl's attention, right?

For the true PUA/DJ, there is no such thing as a "cold approach". A "cold approach" results from the DJ's inability to find common ground or to frame the situation in a way that does not seem awkward.

I've always hated that term..."cold approach". Reminds me of that thread a while back where that kid got kicked out of his student union for creeping out girls...he'd just hang out there and hit on every girl that walked by until he garnered himself a negative reputation.

Even at something like a nightclub, the fact that you're at the same bar, listening to the same music, watching the same people is common ground enough to start a conversation.

Dude, I have eavesdropped on girls' cellphone calls before and used it as a conversation opener. Yes, you can do that if you calibrate her right....if you're relaxed, calm, and don't make a big deal of it.

The phones are here to stay, man. What would Mystery do if he operated in the smartphone era? He would figure out how to leverage it to his advantage. "Hey, is that an iPhone 4/Droid X/etc" is a great conversation opener.

Don't wish the game was easier...become a better player.

At the root-level, women understand that all this social networking is garbage. It's just something they use to occupy their time until they find a man that they'd rather spend time hanging out with.

 

[Colossus]

I've been texting almost exclusively for a while now. Granted, I have far fewer options here than I did up in the big city, but that's where I used it the most and it was largely effective.

Facebook is garbage for game IMO....it's just a big attention vehicle.

I will say that texting is not foolproof, and prone to misunderstandings. I think it is a pretty reliable tool to gauge interest if you look at response times. If a girl takes an entire DAY or more to get back to me---next. This is all common sense, really, no one needs to write a book about it. The one rule of thumb that is critical to adhere to however is the 1:1 rule. Never send more texts than you are receiving!!! Exceeding this is a death knell...and I'm pretty sure data would support it.

 

[The Duke]

Noodles, I don't know how experienced you are with American girls but I've been around long enough to know there are some big attention *****s out there who will email and text all day long for days. Every thing is clicking along great and you think this chic is highly interested. Then when it comes time to go out you get 101 bull **** excuses.

They can get their needs met via texting and fakebook, no need to actually talk or go out with a guy.

There are way too many chump males out there catering to this pathetic behavioral trend.

 

[Big Overseas 1]

I think women use texts and facebook to get attention from guys from a distance. They string fellas along for months who don't have any real world options.

But fellas who can cold approach will usually cut off these teasers in a heartbeat.

 

[zekko]

Facebook and mobile phones are in. There is no getting around that. It would be like walking when the automobile is around...our current infrastructure is conducive towards owning a car. Likewise, it is best to accept these trends and go from there.

Just as recently as a few months ago I was still seeing a lot of those "never text a woman, texting is for pvssies and AFCs" posts. I'm pleased to see that this mindset is changing around here. Like you say, it isn't going anywhere. Keep up with the times or fall behind.

I've thought about starting a Facebook page (although I doubt that I'll actually get around to it). For those of you who are into that sort of thing, I need to know how many friends you have to have so you don't look like a chode. Seems like you'd be shooting yourself in the foot if you only had like three friends on there lol.

On the other hand, I can't imagine having hundreds and hundreds of Facebook friends like women do. They sort of feed off the attention and social proof. If you have less friends than a woman, does that hurt your social proof in their eyes?

 

[logic1]

I think texting, facebooking, IM'n, chatting and whatever else can keep you from face to face interaction are the tools creating the massive population of chumpers we have today.

As someone mentioned above this is a social epidemic being levied on our society.

I wonder how many facebook pages have caused socially weak people to jump out of windows. Seriously, what are the teen suicide rates because of this chit? No doubt its higher than it was 30 years ago?

 

[Slickster]

Flaking has been around since women were created. It's not something new because of technology. Women are fickle and get distracted by other men all the time. It will always be this way.

Gaming via text, email, facebook, etc is just plain weak in my opinion. It's way too easy for guys to use these tools as a crutch when they are too afraid to actually talk to women face to face. It prevents a guy from learning real world skills.

If you actually think that you can build attraction and a meaningful connection with a woman via text messaging or the internet then that is the root of your problem right there. It's all fluff and meaningless, hence all the flaking.

Put 100 single men with super strong game in a room with 100 single women. Then give 100 different men and 100 women smartphones and give them all access to each other's numbers and profiles. Those 100 men with the smartphones could be the best "text gamers" in the world, there is no way they will get laid more on that night. Text has no substance and that is why it mostly gets you no where.

You can say that Game 1.0 is dead but the guys practicing it are getting laid by real women. The Game 2.0 guys are busy texting and facebooking themselves right into Flakeville. Enjoy the cybersex.

At the root of it all is the fact that women require male attention. If men put their phones down and stopped facebooking where would the women get their fix?

 

[Jeffst1980]

Flaking has been around since women were created. It's not something new because of technology. Women are fickle and get distracted by other men all the time. It will always be this way.

Gaming via text, email, facebook, etc is just plain weak in my opinion. It's way too easy for guys to use these tools as a crutch when they are too afraid to actually talk to women face to face. It prevents a guy from learning real world skills.

If you actually think that you can build attraction and a meaningful connection with a woman via text messaging or the internet then that is the root of your problem right there. It's all fluff and meaningless, hence all the flaking.

Put 100 single men with super strong game in a room with 100 single women. Then give 100 different men and 100 women smartphones and give them all access to each other's numbers and profiles. Those 100 men with the smartphones could be the best "text gamers" in the world, there is no way they will get laid more on that night. Text has no substance and that is why it mostly gets you no where.

You can say that Game 1.0 is dead but the guys practicing it are getting laid by real women. The Game 2.0 guys are busy texting and facebooking themselves right into Flakeville. Enjoy the cybersex.

At the root of it all is the fact that women require male attention. If men put their phones down and stopped facebooking where would the women get their fix?

No one's gonna argue that texting, facebook, etc. will build attraction more than face to face interaction.

The issue we're dealing with is time bridging--getting to a day2. This is where the distractions take place; girls are very hesitant to make definite plans, because they are getting invited out to stuff all the time.

If you can GET a woman to meet you face-to-face, game 1.0 is all you need. But, getting her to commit to meet you is harder than it was 5-10 years ago. I think technology and a sound byte culture is to blame for this.

 

[spinaroonie]

No one's gonna argue that texting, facebook, etc. will build attraction more than face to face interaction.

The issue we're dealing with is time bridging--getting to a day2. This is where the distractions take place; girls are very hesitant to make definite plans, because they are getting invited out to stuff all the time.

If you can GET a woman to meet you face-to-face, game 1.0 is all you need. But, getting her to commit to meet you is harder than it was 5-10 years ago. I think technology and a sound byte culture is to blame for this.

This. Most younger women today have the attention span of a fruitfly, coupled with more demands on their attention than ever before.

Having said that, I believe the power of building rapport over the PHONE is vastly underestimated. Most younger guys will pull a number and play a bunch of little text games, then act surprised when she invariably loses interest and flakes. Fellas, she's playing the same text games with 20 other guys she's met at the clubs and reveling in the attention.

Pick up the phone and call. If she won't pick up, text and schedule a time for "a quick chat". In today's hyper-stimulated environment, having an old school 30 minute phone conversation is effectively like having a Day 2. Moreover, when you're texting/IM'ing she could be multitasking a million things at once. When she's on the phone, she has to effectively dedicate and invest ALL her attention to you - a Herculean feat for most younger girls. A genuine bond can develop through the phone - especially as most guys today don't call, and younger girls today are seldom used to talking to guys on the phone. Girls will say they fall in love a man's voice; I've yet to hear of a girl fall in love with a man's texting skills.

Be a suave lothario and separate yourself from all the the texting/Facebooking chumps. Pick up the phone and call.

 

[KarmaSutra]

Jesus Christ.

Most of you aren't hopeless romantics. You're fvcking hopeless.

Incessantly blaming chicks for being "attention slags" or having minute attention spans? Really? This is how you confront your inability to COMMUNICATE with the opposite sex?

Facebook and texting are methods of communicating with women. Nothing more. If you have no actual skill or confidence, it's only fitting you blame Facebook or texting as why you can't read women, or talk to them interestingly.

It's growth. Like going from 8-track, to cassette, to cd's to mp3's; everything is evolution.

Which of you fvcktards are still plugging cassette's into the stereo?

 

[Jitterbug]

Killing - No.

Changing - Yes.

spinaroonie, I'm familiar with your whining on various blogs and I've read your approaches. It's no surprise you're encountering such flakes. I bet you're a bit of an aspie and can't read social cues very well. Or you're too clumsy to realise how bad you are in your approaches. Or really unattractive. In any case, you need to pick a new hunting ground.

 

[synergy1]

Jesus Christ.

Most of you aren't hopeless romantics. You're fvcking hopeless.

Incessantly blaming chicks for being "attention slags" or having minute attention spans? Really? This is how you confront your inability to COMMUNICATE with the opposite sex?

Facebook and texting are methods of communicating with women. Nothing more. If you have no actual skill or confidence, it's only fitting you blame Facebook or texting as why you can't read women, or talk to them interestingly.

Initially I would have agreed with this statement, but observations are leading me to different conclusions. Observations of all my chick friends *and* being that guy that chicks talk to on their phones at all times. You know, the one who is bored of you so she starts texting some other dude. Actually as of late, its become rather burdensome talking to these girls. They are out with their friends and than feel the need to shoot me something about creepy guys or whatever.

My ideal life would involve not owning a car. I would live within a city and either walk everywhere, or take public transportation to get **** done. Actually , car ownership is a huge burden on my life and I dislike it. However, rather than being a hopeless like you indicated, i purchased a new car and paid it off 2 years early. Whats my point? I still embrace the new technology/ times without necessarily liking it. Same goes for the texting/facebook....might not be a fan but don't confuse that for under-utilization!

On the other hand, I can't imagine having hundreds and hundreds of Facebook friends like women do. They sort of feed off the attention and social proof. If you have less friends than a woman, does that hurt your social proof in their eyes?

Many of the women I hook up with/ date often have more friends than I do. At 600, I feel this is too many and frequently remove people I have no plan on talking too again. As for fewer friends than a mark, it doesn't matter. Women who have over 700 friends are merely acquaintances with these people and nothing more.

 

[zekko]

Many of the women I hook up with/ date often have more friends than I do. At 600, I feel this is too many and frequently remove people I have no plan on talking too again. As for fewer friends than a mark, it doesn't matter. Women who have over 700 friends are merely acquaintances with these people and nothing more.

You have 600 friends on Facebook!? I realize these are mostly acquaintences, but I don't think I even KNOW 600 people. Is there a certian number of friends on there you are expected to have? This is what concerns me. I wouldn't want women to see I have only 50-100 friends on there (pick any number) and decide I'm a chode ("Look, he has no social proof"). I don't want to waste my time cultivating a bunch of "Facebook friends".

 

[synergy1]

You have 600 friends on Facebook!? I realize these are mostly acquaintences, but I don't think I even KNOW 600 people. Is there a certian number of friends on there you are expected to have? This is what concerns me. I wouldn't want women to see I have only 50-100 friends on there (pick any number) and decide I'm a chode ("Look, he has no social proof"). I don't want to waste my time cultivating a bunch of "Facebook friends".

I got an account in 2004 back when it was college only and slowly added friends as I met them. I was relatively outgoing during graduate school and was teaching multiple engineering classes while playing and reffing many sports within the campus recreation department. At one point, I had Jenn Sterger as a friend as well as Elisha Cuthbert ( both since removed me ), but the fake friends currently only count for 2 of them. In a way , I feel sorry for the two people on my friends list who are celebrities ( pro athletes), as they seem to feel some sort of obligation to add people they don't know.

In your case, it would be different. Older people simply won't have as many friends as the kids who had FB in college. Lets face it, you don't make as many friends after college..you start to lose them if anything. Would this affect you? Honestly not sure. It might be less relevant for your success than mine.