FR: Lust Wars IV: A New Hope

[donjuanapprentice01]

Wow man, Luke... Maybe I shouldn't be giving you advice cuz I'm as bad as you are (25 year old virgin), but you are making this WAY too complicated!

Just set a time to go out, when both of you have the time, and ... have a good time! No need to watch a clock, or put these dates in categories.. just go out, and have a good time. If it lasts an hour... it lasts an hour... if it lasts 10 hours, good... it lasts 10 ... if it doesn't end with a f-close, oh well... at least you had a good time, if you get laid.. congrats, but it's just a bonus.

Case in point, my female friend called me up tonight and asked if I wanted to go out for dinner... which I said sure, cuz I just got home from work and didn't feel like cooking. I know I wasn't getting a lay out if it.. but I went and had a good time, spent alot more time with each other than we had planned, and that's all that counts.

anyways, that's my piece.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Feed-back from second girl from internet - one with chemistry 2.

Good points: She called me a complete gentleman and has not written off the idea of either talking to me again or seeing me again.

Bad points: She felt unsure if I was my 'real' self on that date and complaint that she didn't get to know me any better after seeing me.

RESULT: It's an astonding success. I'm very happy with the results.

I'm still a mystery to her, she doesn't know me, and she doesn't have any grounds to dismiss me, and therefore she cant. She has no choice now, but to date me again to find out more about me. This was what I wanted, pure skill. A girl is trying to find reasons to get rid of me on the first date - the trick is, TO GIVE HER NONE, and on the second date, you have a few hours with her anyway in a seductive setting --- perfect.

WHAT I HAVE DONE:

- Seduction date is now being set up at a park for about a few hours - I've suggested to her (dont' worry, I'm not a moron, I didn't tell her in this way I'm saying here, I talked to her in chick language), in order for her to have a chance to know who I am, other than the 'complete gentleman' impression, she has to see me again in this seduction date. Of course, there are no canned lines on a seduction date and you can be your true self. The book says so - the point of the PRIMING date is to hide yourself and by-pass her screening tests, so you can go to the more advance SEDUCTION dates.

So far it's looking VERY good - and the HTSWW must have an inbuilt - mystery method - in it's dating concepts or something - there is no better rush than to be a complete mystery with a girl after that first coffee date -
now if this seduction date goes well, as it is in a park that has a waterfall, and this is my 'seductive intuitive sence', then home-run, see if a k-close will happen. If not, and I get this seduction date - and it goes nowhere, well experience is still experience.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Well, looks like whatever PRIMING date experiment's went, it looks like that one with chemistry 2 has fallen through.

Attempted @-kiss close PRIMING by email on the first one, who said she hoped I'm not mad about Sunday, I told her, not to worry, she can always make out, oops, make it up with me (just kidding). A bit of overkill by suggesting she be my first kiss - but hey, whatever.
Just sent this email like two minutes ago. I've decided a bit of e-mail spontenuity, where I can make mistakes, even if a GM routine is attempted is not a big deal, here's how I see it:

Was she asked to kiss me on my last date? NO.
Was a kiss close attempted here using GM stuff? YES.
If I do see her again - chances are, I WONT BE WASTING TIME BECAUSE SHE KNOWS I'M EXPECTING A KISS, if I dont see her, no time wasted, if I do see her, a k-close may be inevitable on the next date as she's primed up.

Screw the other chemistry 2 girl - I'm going to kiss close this babe -- hey, what can I say. There is still another one on the lurch that I may pursue as well on a seduction date - i'm not sure where she stands, but shall soon find out.

 

[rocky_mtn]

Luke,

explain the @-close. did you try a kiss close over e-mail? If so, you need to study the finer points of kissing. Its supposed to be spontaneous, not something that you verbally or make a written agreement over.

You don't ask a girl to kiss her, you give her a hug and then plant a kiss on her with little or no warning required.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Luke,

explain the @-close. did you try a kiss close over e-mail? If so, you need to study the finer points of kissing. Its supposed to be spontaneous, not something that you verbally or make a written agreement over.

You don't ask a girl to kiss her, you give her a hug and then plant a kiss on her with little or no warning required.

Technically, I didn't ask her to kiss me, I planted a seed in her mind about the idea of us kissing on the next date.

The point here, is this is just as well another test, so far it's quite an amibious type of relationship, and I'm not sure if she's seeing me as a friend, boyfriend or lover at this stage, and perhaps - you are right, it's not a kiss-close, but it's sort of a test of the waters to see if she is averse to the idea or she isn't.

If she isn't averse - she likely wont comment about the joke on her reply. It will occur spontenously on the date itself, but she's primed on the idea that I'm interested in it now - if I gave off an asexual message before that I wasn't into kissing by telling her I never kissed anyone before when she counter-asked me about my first kiss.

If she is averse and 'strongly objects' or goes LJBF, then at least there is no 'ambiguities' on any expectations from her if I go out with her again. So, in a sence, this comes again as some sort of test. I thought I put on a natural GM stuff on it. With a good test like this, if she makes it obviously clear that there is no chance of any kiss and she sees me like a brother or soem other crap like that, then I know that I may really decide not to go out with her again, and simply move on to sarge and see if I can connect with someone else. It's as simple as that.

The book 'HTSWW' teaches that kiss-tests are a cool thing - you are just guaging her response to see if she would like to kiss - and here it's done in a joking manner, and that a kiss should not just be made out of the blue, the book does teach that kissing at 'romantic moments' is the point of seduction dates - or the dates that are conductive to those types of moments.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Declaring a C&B on one of the PRIMING dates - on the Chemistry 2 girl.

I've folded on her and am no longer interested in pursuing her and sent a nuke message.

2 other girls on this list who went through the PRIMING dates will be checked out.

****

I'm making a mental application to disqualify the Chemistry 2 girl, because due to lack of chemistry or spark, or the girl's ethnicity and religious affiliation, I think the results should not qualify - would like to ask all other girls out for coffee - however, script lines would be played with ALONG with direct sexual questions to guage attitude of sex, and it goes without saying, that the chemistry should be there.

ALSO, SEDUCTION-DATES should take precedence over PRIMING dates, if there is a chance to jump to a SEDUCTION date, or meet the girl in her house or apartment to watch a movie -- the fvck the PRIMING date and go straight for SEDUCTION. Why would you slow down a momentum on a girl who may be ready now - who may not be ready tommorow? Knock, knock, on my head.

*******

 

[The Truth]

I have to say something here. You are turning something natural and exciting into a science class!

If you don't relax and let things flow you're going to be scaring these women away. Scientists aren't attractive people in general nor very interesting.

I respect you for taking control and actually doing something but the impression you give from these posts is that you are a very uptight, methodical and dare I say, boring, sort of guy.

Women want spontaneous, raw sexual and emotional energy, and to have fun and get lost in the moment. They can only experience that if that's what you feel in yourself.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

I have to say something here. You are turning something natural and exciting into a science class!

If you don't relax and let things flow you're going to be scaring these women away. Scientists aren't attractive people in general nor very interesting.

I respect you for taking control and actually doing something but the impression you give from these posts is that you are a very uptight, methodical and dare I say, boring, sort of guy.

Women want spontaneous, raw sexual and emotional energy, and to have fun and get lost in the moment. They can only experience that if that's what you feel in yourself.

I think a whole string of c&b are forthcoming before I get to that stage, we just have to see how they c&b, and when I get comfortable with the c&b's, then I can look into that aspect. Let's face it, unless you have a bottle of alcohol, and two people get drunk, that's unlikely to happen on a coffee priming date.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Now, I would like to reiterate again, despite the well-intentioned advice from "Truth", that I do not believe that people should resort to taking drugs of any form or even alcohol to change their personalities to impress girls. With sufficient rejections and c&b experiences are enough to get used to this stuff.

This 'change your personality' advice to please women too me almost sounds like saying 'go and take some drugs or intoxicate yourself to impress chicks because they cant accept you for who you are.' I say, and I'm sure others will agree that taking drugs to impress chicks with your 'new personality' is for LOSERS and hope nobody on here is into that.

 

[radronOmega]

Luke,

I commend your effort to working so hard on these dates, but as with what the other DJs on this thread said, you're being too methodical. These "canned routines" of yours scare me a little. Yah, all of us have lines and techniques, but it seems as if you've scripted the entire conversation. Women can tell a fake from a mile away. And after two dates if you haven't gotten a kiss yet then you're in danger of LJBF zone if you don't make a move.

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=37710
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=37710
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=37710

I'd suggest reading through that. Also

Good points: She called me a complete gentleman and has not written off the idea of either talking to me again or seeing me again.

Bad points: She felt unsure if I was my 'real' self on that date and complaint that she didn't get to know me any better after seeing me

that seems like a date gone wrong in my opinion. "gentleman" and "not written off" are weak statements as opposed to "questioning personality authenticity". You're a man of reason, look at the pros and cons. Not written off is a defensive statement looking for some sort of hope left in her, and "gentleman" isn't the same as "amazing, swept me off my feet". Now questioning the authenticity of yourself, that's bad, bad, bad.


Also, kiss test are called kiss test for a reason. You should at some point actually kiss her or else you'll look like a tease and she'll be turned off bythe time you actually lean in for one.

 

[pooparu]

This 'change your personality' advice to please women too me almost sounds like saying 'go and take some drugs or intoxicate yourself to impress chicks because they cant accept you for who you are.' I say, and I'm sure others will agree that taking drugs to impress chicks with your 'new personality' is for LOSERS and hope nobody on here is into that.

.....you don't realize the irony in this statement? This book (whatever it is), is telling you to fake conversations, don't be yourself, and look at this from a "logical" standpoint, and you are calling people losers for having a new personality under the influence of drugs or alcohol?

Stop looking at this like a science project. Read your reports, then go read someone inspiring like pook or BBB's posts, and look at the HUGE difference. BBB's post are filled with passion and the outcome is to enjoy your life. Your's is to "K close" or "F close".

Another piece of the puzzle you are missing: You blaming your mother is NOT helping you. It's just letting you hide the fact that you aren't successful by shifting the blame.

Also, you should not be happy with just existing on a date. That's all you are doing. And what's even funnier, is that the girl just basically told you that your scripted lines aren't working. She doesn't even know who you are, in the least bit. She can't say you are confident, smooth, happy, she can't even say you are TOO nice, she has no feeling about you, and that's even worse than having NEGATIVE feelings after you have dated someone.

Good luck with this science project though man, i guess you are too good for the DJ bible or something.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Two of the girls have C&B due to some funny e-correspondence afterwards. One girl has not been followed up with - but was from an offline referral and more likely to stick.

I've given up internet sarging until October, as ALL of the C&B failures were from internet dates - and I'm starting to EXCLUSIVELY focus on OFFLINE women only until the weather gets colder.

I dont know if anyone else here thinks the internet just sucks for meeting women and sarging, but I know different people have different experiences.

For me, internet sarging is not helpful:
-) the chemistry online is always better than offline when you meet a completely different person.
-) attention *****s or girls that are on ego-trips or juggling guys all around.
-) Not working on social anxiety, not approaching, your just another email amongst many other desperate losers on there who are overloading the overinflated egos of many girls.

I feel better approaching a girl, seeing if there is chemistry, flirting with her a while to see if we can get along or at least feel comfortable, then closing for the number is cool - or just number close right away if in a bad mood and want to C&B a few times first. That's what I intend to do now.

I'm thinking of skipping PRIMING dates and going straight for SEDUCTION dates - I think that would be the next phase of my experimentations. I'm right now PISSED at the PRIMING date results.

Go STRAIGHT to her apartment to watch movies, go STRAIGHT on a seduction date (let her pay for it or go dutch). That's what I'm thinking about next.


However, the first girl, I'm having a funny feeling about her - I cant put my finger on it, I'll post a reply later and describe what the last letter I wrote to her was, or paraphrase it. I keep getting mixed-vibes with her. Without her, the internet sarging is defined as an ABSOLUTE DISASTER - with DATES THAT C&B - with NO CONNECTION. It's hard to believe that there is even ONE girl that has connected to me, INCLUDING HER - but could she be the exception to the rule - or that you cant be unlucky ALL the time, I'm not sure.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Stop looking at this like a science project. Read your reports, then go read someone inspiring like pook or BBB's posts, and look at the HUGE difference. BBB's post are filled with passion and the outcome is to enjoy your life. Your's is to "K close" or "F close".

Well, it's easy for you to say if you have k closed or f closed before with someone that meant something.

Another piece of the puzzle you are missing: You blaming your mother is NOT helping you. It's just letting you hide the fact that you aren't successful by shifting the blame.

I cant flirt easily if my mom's around. You think she should be around when I'm approaching and flirting and contact-closing?

Also, you should not be happy with just existing on a date. That's all you are doing. And what's even funnier, is that the girl just basically told you that your scripted lines aren't working. She doesn't even know who you are, in the least bit. She can't say you are confident, smooth, happy, she can't even say you are TOO nice, she has no feeling about you, and that's even worse than having NEGATIVE feelings after you have dated someone.

What are you trying to do, rub my c&b on me or something?

Who gives a crap what any particular girl thinks, I think the problems go half way. Again, the girl in question is a 32 y/o INTERNET girl -- wtf am I doign dating women over 30 y/o, my parents tell me? You know what - they are right? These women over 30 y/o that have profiles on the internet have these following problems:

1) They have a child somewhere in the background.

2) They have been through a few nasty break-ups or relationships, possibly even divorced. Certainly not needy virgins looking to get some.

3) They are looking to settle and marry someone, and may look at my financial profile more seriously.

4) They are set in their ways.

Now, when they are meeting a teenage boy in a 30 y/o body that lives with parents, and the 'green'ness is just flowing through my face - what is going to happen in that set-up? It's a set-up conductive of a c&b, better just approach people offline and take my chances.

[/QUOTE]

 

[Luke Skywalker]

I told her that if she wants to continue going on coffee dates that's fine by me, but I'll continue looking if it doesn't go any further than that (i.e. like a long date somewhere or some action).

The 'I'll continue looking' part sounds harsh, but I'm putting it into the perspective of NEXT. If she doesn't give me what I want, then NEXT, but keep her on board in the event she comes around - leaving an open-end.

Anyway, it seems like a long-shot, but she's the only person that may disprove that my interent sarging experience was an ABSOLUTE disaster - again, I'm offline sarging for now, and intending to start that up again soon.

I took a break from all this for a week, and now I'm back on again, that's right, took a break from women for about a week that's why I wasn't posting here or around here in a week's time.

 

[Phyzzle]

Declaring a C&B on one of the PRIMING dates - on the Chemistry 2 girl.

I've folded on her and am no longer interested in pursuing her and sent a nuke message.

C&B? Nuke message? What do these mean? And what happened? Did she make a date, and call you back later to cancel?

 

[d9930380]

Luke your going by the rules too much. Don't look to next a girl and certainly don't tell a girl that.

You're right Luke, don't do drugs or alchohol just to impress/have confidence. She will like you MUCH more if you don't but if she's drinking, have a drink. Don't get drunk unless she gets drunk etc.

Some girls will like to take it slow, some fast. It's not a reason to "next" someone.

Being mysterious is all good and well but you also have to give her a reason to WANT to go out with you again. It's weird because you said:

"
Good points: She called me a complete gentleman and has not written off the idea of either talking to me again or seeing me again.

Bad points: She felt unsure if I was my 'real' self on that date and complaint that she didn't get to know me any better after seeing me.

RESULT: It's an astonding success. I'm very happy with the results.
"

I personally didn't think that was a success. Unless this is the 1950s, being called a gentleman normally isn't a good sign. It normally means, you're boring and I want to give you a compliment but they best thing I can think of is your manners.

Try to sell yourself more instead of worrying about the stuff you don't want her to know.

Try to have a bit more fun and assume she will like you, if she doesn't then what have you lost. That's what dating is all about - getting to know the other person to see if you will be good for each other.

Don't tell her any of your problems, just sell the good stuff.

BTW - If you go out with a girl and act like a friend then she will see you as a friend. You have to ask yourself: What do YOU want? If it's a girlfriend, make it clear that's why your there by your actions. Make her reject you! If you don't then you will reject yourself by not trying hard enough. You should allways aim for a kiss close.

But you're in the field now. That's the hardest step. It won't take you too long now - that's the best thing.

 

[pooparu]

What are you trying to do, rub my c&b on me or something?

Who gives a crap what any particular girl thinks, I think the problems go half way. Again, the girl in question is a 32 y/o INTERNET girl -- wtf am I doign dating women over 30 y/o, my parents tell me? You know what - they are right? These women over 30 y/o that have profiles on the internet have these following problems:

1) They have a child somewhere in the background.

2) They have been through a few nasty break-ups or relationships, possibly even divorced. Certainly not needy virgins looking to get some.

3) They are looking to settle and marry someone, and may look at my financial profile more seriously.

4) They are set in their ways.

Now, when they are meeting a teenage boy in a 30 y/o body that lives with parents, and the 'green'ness is just flowing through my face - what is going to happen in that set-up? It's a set-up conductive of a c&b, better just approach people offline and take my chances.

[/QUOTE]

I'm not looking to rub your C&B in your face, its great to have them, but you aren't LEARNING from them. You hear what the women are saying, you understand it, but you do NOTHING about it. You keep saying, "well all women are different, maybe the next one will be better".

Let me give you advice, INTERNET WOMEN ARE REAL WOMEN. I've heard of guys who are ****ing crazy successful meeting hot women online, just because you meet them online instead of in the mall doesn't make them any less woman. And where there are negatives there also positives:

1. Many women over 30 are not only reaching sexual peak, but also know what they want sexually and are more open about it.

2. Many of them ARE looking to have a good time after a divorce a break up, you wouldn't believe how many women just want to have fun after being in a tied down relationship or something.

3. Women over 30 can teach you alot about the world since you've kind of been living a sheltered life.

STOP looking at the negatives, LOOK AT THE POSITIVES. Life doesn't have to be negative, MAKE it positive.

Until you destroy these limiting beliefs (research getting into them, I personally used alot of David D techniques to destroy these. As you can see I'm a big advocate of David D for working on your inner self, him and the bible make an explosive combination for self improvement, look into his advanced/mastery series, disregard everything else, except maybe his e book its been a while since I read that though), you are going to keep creatively avoiding this stuff and making excuses.


and I hope you realize to be successful you don't need to sarge. I know guys who just expand their social circle through friends and then **** the women they meet through there, going out and cold approaching isn't the only way to succeed man, maybe you aren't the best cold approacher, but maybe there are alot of women that you're friends know that wuld find you attractive, you need to get out there and make friends first and then you learn things that NO book can teach you, trust me.

 

[d9930380]

Yes but only make friends with women IF YOU get something out of it. e.g. An "In" into a group of friends of her's.

Never be friends with a woman unless there is a reason. It isn't worth it!

 

[Luke Skywalker]

I'm not looking to rub your C&B in your face, its great to have them, but you aren't LEARNING from them. You hear what the women are saying, you understand it, but you do NOTHING about it. You keep saying, "well all women are different, maybe the next one will be better".

That's what ONE woman said. Another one was amused. Like I said, different people have different reactions. The one that took it serious was over 30, the one that was amused was 25.

Let me give you advice, INTERNET WOMEN ARE REAL WOMEN. I've heard of guys who are ****ing crazy successful meeting hot women online, just because you meet them online instead of in the mall doesn't make them any less woman. And where there are negatives there also positives:

Well, let me rephrase myself. Internet dating doesn't work for me, and as it's summer time here where I live, there's no point sitting behind a computer to find out the following depressive news for the day:

1) Nobody online is interested in me.

2) If someone is interested in me, the date will C&b and will have a miserable effect afterwards.

3) My already shot ego can only go one level lower after such an experience.

I already got a few phone numberd doing contact-closes on girls offline, in a couple of days - more than I got four months being online. Different people may have their own special 'luck' in different areas, well mine certainly isn't online.

Besides that, most online woman over 30 will say they want a relationship or would have some sort of 'relationship' b1tch shield - and I'm too green for them. So, sure, maybe it will work for other people, but not for me.

STOP looking at the negatives, LOOK AT THE POSITIVES. Life doesn't have to be negative, MAKE it positive.

Nothing online is working for me - how do you change that to a positive?

Until you destroy these limiting beliefs (research getting into them, I personally used alot of David D techniques to destroy these. As you can see I'm a big advocate of David D for working on your inner self, him and the bible make an explosive combination for self improvement, look into his advanced/mastery series, disregard everything else, except maybe his e book its been a while since I read that though), you are going to keep creatively avoiding this stuff and making excuses.

Well, re-read this post, it's more than just limiting beliefs - I'm sure you have not been hapless in EVERY SINGLE CASE WITH EVERY WOMAN YOU'VE MEET IN YOUR LIFE that you've meet online. Well I have.

If you really think David D will work, then I'm listening, how do I get a copy of that stuff? Anyway, tell me about working on your inner self, and where to read in the DJ bible that talks about this, in a nut-shell. Is it just having positive thoughts - I've read stuff about the subconcious mind - is it something like that?

and I hope you realize to be successful you don't need to sarge. I know guys who just expand their social circle through friends and then **** the women they meet through there, going out and cold approaching isn't the only way to succeed man, maybe you aren't the best cold approacher, but maybe there are alot of women that you're friends know that wuld find you attractive, you need to get out there and make friends first and then you learn things that NO book can teach you, trust me.

I dont mind cold approaching because you know the girls are going to be out of your life fast when you c&b and you wont have to deal with them again.
You can only just practise. I'm not used to telling friends in social circles or anywhere that I'm looking for a girl.

 

[d9930380]

Luke, as I said. Your approaching this ALL wrong. Your setting out to fail. At the moment you think being successful is not being blown out completely but getting a friend. This is the wrong attitude!!!

It's better to c&b than to be a friend. At least the girl in question saw you as a man looking for what men want. It also frees your mind up to sarge more women.

Now I'm not saying don't make friends with ANY women but choose your friends carefully, only be their friend if YOU get something out of it. i.e. an introduction to her friends etc.

You hit the nail on the head, you're green. Everyone has to start somewhere! The problem isn't anything to do with you really... just that the **** people learned when they where 16, you're learning it now except with older women. You have to realise you will make mistakes along the way but those mistakes are what you need to get better.

Don't worry about ego, you have to harden yourself to failure and remember the reason you're failing isn't anything to do with YOU, just that you're a beginner and you'll get better.