FR: 2 approaches at the mall.

[Snow Plowman]

Just going to go down the line happen to notice this thread and seems like a pretty good discussion.

El Stud me and you have talked about many of the mistakes and sticking points you have. But like I said take some of the advice from others here, because the way that I do this is different from majority of the community and that's only because the way I'm learning pickup is rather new.

You are trying too hard to script these approaches and also your cold readings don't seem to be working out too well for you.

A big misconception is thinking that you need all these smooth, tight, lines and stuff. The words really don't mean much, so longs your not tripping over your own game. (Game killers) It was still a cold read and it hooked the set.

Yeah openers do matter. Girls can smell phoniness a mile away. Thats why those stupid pick up lines never work. Being sincere is much better way to "open" her.

Another big misconception, and I think this is what holds a lot of people back. The hear all these openers online and when there in field they depend on the openers they've heard online thinking those are better than something they came up with.

Opener doesn't matter one bit, because it only starts the conversation. It's plowing through that is important about opening. If you don't believe me get a loads of the so called "best" openers an you'll notice there isn't much difference. An you talk about phoniness go up to a girl and say what El Stud said. Then say "Ok, I'm lying, I wasn't taking a survey..." and plow from there and I bet you the set still opens.

Quit with all the b.s. about "opening lines" and especially your jesus story. Learn to look at the girl, or observe her and open with something that relates to her. (maybe she's wearing something that interests you).

How far have you actually gotten with these pick up lines? If not so far, maybe its time you changed your approach... You're supposed to learn from your failures and mistakes and apply it for future references, yet you keep doing it over and over.

I personally don't like relying on canned material. But his stuff is 100% him, its his real experiences, just like we all tend to tell people about typically the same stories.

The mistakes he is mainly making isn't due to his "Opener" or his stories. It's his sub-communication and him relying on his few lines. An this is the reason why I never liked Routines because you start to think what you have to say isn't good enough. You kind of set up a standard of what is good to say and not good to say when really its BS.

*sigh* The Jesus story is crap, bin it.

There really isn't nothing wrong with his story, whether the story is crap or not to you, when it comes to pickup so longs your enthusaistic about it and hitting punchlines then your good enough.

The way I see it so longs you like the story or want to say the story then you should.

You can't just flip from story to story, there has to be some sort of link. If she mentioned jesus, then go for the story, otherwise, you'd get more sucess if you plucked hair out your ballsack.

This is truly wrong because this is what made me actually start getting better. As the guy from RSD calls it "shifting the sands" there isn't nothing for the girl to really grab onto. An it also is about being unpredictable.

One minute your saying hey, the next your hugging her and calling her your gf. The next minute your breaking up with her. An before you know it your talking about ants and your telling her about your "picnic" story, and before you know it your demonstrating to her how you was holding the girl who you was eating the apple with during the picnic.

There doesn't need to be any transitions, or else then certain openers would've never been created because it would be hard to branch off of it due to the context your in. If you watch high value guys or just guys who are natural, there constantly talking about different things and bringing things up randomly. Of course you have to have common sense and calibrate it or else you can come off as retarded or socially incompetent.

Everyone is telling you the truth, Snow Plowman (I think you said he was your mentor) would tell you, your just not improving. Sure, like you said sometimes your stories are funny, sometimes you can get a little interest, but your method is too hit and miss to have any sort of real success.

Canned lines just don't work unless you deliver them with total confidence, and it seems like your not doing that with yours.

It's funny because from when I first spoke to him, to now, he's improved a lot. But like you said he does have a long way to go and needs a lot of tweaking, but like anything it takes time.

Yeah, your right, she probably can't tell their canned, but my experience with canned material is that it's not really delivered in the same genuine, individual attention that your on the spot stuff is.

100% true

No explanation necessary really, the man speaks the truth. Now you can say random things, hell I do it all the time, but there has to be some underlying connection between it and the previous thing either you or her said, you have to vibe.

Too an extent your right, its only if your "plowing" that you'd be random to get through. Now when it comes to vibing you just having fun and having a good time. I tend to think it's best to have wide rapport when vibing. Deep rapport is just not my thing until I've known them for a while.

But either way I'm still random but not as random as I would be when first opening. To me so longs you use it sparingly then your good enough. There is no need for every 30 seconds to be switching it up throught a 10 minute conversation, unless your really trying to get some attraction. But overall you don't want to be completly obnoxious.

So, let me get this straight. You joked about a girl throwing up on you "like a pig" while on a ride? Yeah, creepy. She probably introduced you to her friends because she was scared of being alone with you. I mean call me old fashioned but I don't think girls like being compared to pigs. And don't give none of this "negging" her crap. You want the woman to feel insecure without you, not insecure in general.

Basically, why you're failing, is because you come off immature. Not saying that you are neccesairly, but by the stories you tell, I could see how people could construe you as immature.

Now this was complete BS. Why would a chick introduce a lamo to her friends? She thought he was cool to a certain extent, he actually doesn't even know how interested she was in because he never really escalated to see where she was at.

But anyway, saying he comes off immature because of his story is another thing that was BS and I'm just going to run through this real quick.

Playfulness is what spikes up emotions and gets that good vibe because of all the energy, emotions, laughter, etc. How are you going to do that if your all serious thinking your in the mob. Yes to be playful is childlike but that is what gets the women emotional.

- For one thing it shows your just having a good time and don't want anything from her. (That's huge)
- You're high value because you have good social skills and people want to be around you
- You're fun and you're a sexual being

There is no way your going to be all serious on a wall open a girl and then just expect to slap her ass, because she probably isn't having fun. Now you go in pumping buying temperature and then while playing around you slap her ass then you've just spiked attraction.

Saying Playfulness or being playful as immature is pure BS. (I'm not saying go in and be a clown who is just there to do entertaining) An this is why most people aren't getting girls because they don't know all they mainly have to do is convey there "Real" personality and have fun. If I had to give one piece of advice to anyone it would always be "Have fun" if your not having fun then you're not getting anything.

There's a difference between interest and being polite. It seems to me they were humouring you, now, I wasn't there so I'm not 100% sure. It just seems to me that there is no interest there.

I see exactly where you're coming from because I used to think the same. The problem is that the girl's may have been attracted to some extent. It's just you never knew because you was never "Closing". Let me ask you this out of all those chicks you were talking about that introduced was all giggly and having a good time, how many of them did you actually try to kiss? How many of them were you always escalating to see how far you were?

Reason I say this is because girls aren't going to help you pickup them up, and many girl's play hard to get as a way to act like there high value. Ever notice hb9s and 10s thinking there the sh!t and playing hard to get and then you have guys coming back saying "Attention *****".

Up to this day I used to always think nobody in my school liked me because no girl's came up and talked to me. Ever since I've learned how to convey my personality and bring my best self to the table, I've had girls open me. Back when I was first starting out I'd get opened two times a week. It was a big realization for me...

 

[Snow Plowman]

...

Also, my veiw on plowing: If you're good enough, and congruent in your material, you shouldn't have to plow.

This is very important and like my favorite thing to do in pickup. The way I like to think of plowing is conveying your personality at mach speed. You're giving her a preview of what you're about and its going so fast that she becomes attracted off plowing. If you've noticed most guru's and guys who are starting out do this.

If you look at the guru's there usually unreactive and just plowing through it because they've got so comfortable plowing.

The newbies or guys who do a lot of "Routines" there way of plowing is there "Stack". Notice if you go on forums which is very routine based they talk about stacking. An so when they go in a set they do routine after routine as a way to plow. Now when you don't use routines, your basically being unreactive and/or using attraction techniques or kinoing from off the top of your head and in the moment.

This is why I always try to tell people to plow because this is why most people don't open because they think there opener isn't good enough when really the opener doesn't matter at all. It's when you plow, because say you say an opener. Once you've said the opener it is done because you've completed the purpose of the opener, and that is to start the conversation. So now what? are you going to go interview style? Did you run out of things to say?

Instead right off the opener CONVEY YOUR PERSONALITY aka Plow. Tell stories, bust on her, roleplay, confuse her, mess around. Put your personality on the line, HAVE fun. Now your not worrying about what she says, thinks, or how she responds to what your saying, your just staying in your own frame and reality and just saying and doing what you want.

An that's when she sees the preview of who you are and she starts to feel "Attraction" for you and that's how you really start working. It wasn't about the fancy opener or lines, it was more about you convey your real personality.

El Stud's biggest problem right now is not "Closing" and actually pushing the set as far as it can go just to get the feedback. If everyone was to go for the #, kiss, extraction in every set, even if you met them for 30 seconds, then you'd be so well calibrated and your game would surely improve.

 

[WesCottII]

I can honestly say I didn't read most of your post Snowman. You're getting my back up telling me I'm wrong with what I'm doing.

I lost my V's coming up 2 years ago, I slept with 19 girls since, so try not to have the audacity to start throwing "guru bullsh*t" at me. I don't care what they do, most of it sucks for day to day use. IMO

Don't come giving me "thats truly wrong" until you get the results I get, doing what I do.

 

[theunflushables]

Agreed. Yeah I don't have as big number as WesCott, but in the almost 5 years I've slept with 10 and 3 of those years were spent in a relationship. An as Sinatra sang, I did it my way. Maybe I've found an alternative,unless I'm a natural DJer and I don't actually think through the processes. Hey either way is fine with me. And Plowman if openers don't matter go up to the next girl you see and ask if she farted, if she doesnt run away in disgust and instead says "no, why?" Answer "Because you just blew me away."

Yeah, you don't have to be serious in your approach, but to liken someone to a pig throwing up is generally not cool, and if she finds it funny maybe you should stop hitting on girls and start the real challenge, women.

 

[ElStud]

Agreed. Yeah I don't have as big number as WesCott, but in the almost 5 years I've slept with 10 and 3 of those years were spent in a relationship. An as Sinatra sang, I did it my way. Maybe I've found an alternative,unless I'm a natural DJer and I don't actually think through the processes. Hey either way is fine with me. And Plowman if openers don't matter go up to the next girl you see and ask if she farted, if she doesnt run away in disgust and instead says "no, why?" Answer "Because you just blew me away."

Yeah, you don't have to be serious in your approach, but to liken someone to a pig throwing up is generally not cool, and if she finds it funny maybe you should stop hitting on girls and start the real challenge, women.

You've never heard of such a thing as playing have you? Age doesn't even matter, you could go up to a freaking granny with that stuff and you'll still get the same results. And honestly, you could go up to a girl with the whole fart thing and still get very good results, because like Snow Plowman said, openers don't really matter. She's not going to walk away if you say that and so what if she doesn't respond? I would just plow from there, I'm not looking for a response, that's being reactive.

And like I said, it's called being playful, you think everything is serious when it's not. Do I really think she's a pig? No, I'm just teasing her, playing with her. In one set the girls took me to their friends, why? Because they thought I was a jerk for calling them pigs? No, because they knew I was just playing with them and having a good time. I used that approach again on a group of girls and they laughed before I was even done talking.

Words don't really matter much. You can go up to a girl and say "I like salad" and if you have the game to back it up you can still get her.

 

[theunflushables]

No, actually I don't take much at all in my life that seriously. I just think there is a better way to have fun and a good time with someone than ripping on them.

As for "I like Salad" My friend did just that for a while, except changed it to "cookies", needless to say I got attention for "working with the mentally challenged".

Anyways, you're failing at your approaches and yet everyone who has given you advice you have said they don't know what they're talking about. Since you're not open to advice, you have no reason to post, so you can go back to playing Dungeons and Dragons now.

 

[GaryUranga]

el stud, you need to build that inmediate fun connection with the people instead of just caring too much about what youre doing, both are important, its a social interaction, go up and talk/act like youve known her for years I dunno if youre doign that already but that proyects and communicates youre someone fun to be around of doing that while communicating status will get you the best results, I know because Im pretty good at communicatign status but not at getting that good interaction with people in general (I used to be socially retarded)

 

[ElStud]

No, actually I don't take much at all in my life that seriously. I just think there is a better way to have fun and a good time with someone than ripping on them.

As for "I like Salad" My friend did just that for a while, except changed it to "cookies", needless to say I got attention for "working with the mentally challenged".

Anyways, you're failing at your approaches and yet everyone who has given you advice you have said they don't know what they're talking about. Since you're not open to advice, you have no reason to post, so you can go back to playing Dungeons and Dragons now.

Haha, Dungeons and Dragons that's a good one, I bet you feel real good yourself right now. And your friend did it wrong dude. Got attention for working with the mentally challenged? He must have been saying it like he was indeed mentally challenged or believed what he was saying was something a mentally challenged person would say. And that's "you", that's the way you do things, Snow Plowman does things different, as do I. I'm not saying your advice isn't good, but it's not my method of doing it.

el stud, you need to build that inmediate fun connection with the people instead of just caring too much about what youre doing, both are important, its a social interaction, go up and talk/act like youve known her for years I dunno if youre doign that already but that proyects and communicates youre someone fun to be around of doing that while communicating status will get you the best results, I know because Im pretty good at communicatign status but not at getting that good interaction with people in general (I used to be socially retarded)

I already don't care too much about what I say to the girl, I simply say whatever to a girl, it's called plowing. And I already am having fun with the girls, that's what the whole point of doing all that playful stuff is. Do I really think she's a pig? No, I'm just teasing her, which is why she laughs rather than calling me a f*cking jerk or something, she knows I'm playing. Go up to her saying that sh*t all serious, she will think you're a jerk, but say it playfully and she'll know you're just having fun. Infact to prove my point that you can open with anything, I'll try that fart thing on a girl when I go to the mall tommorow.

It's all about conveying, you're nervous she'll sense it immediately, you're confident, she'll sense it immediately, you just want her number/just want to get in her pants, she knows. That's why you have fun with the girl.

 

[Snow Plowman]

I can honestly say I didn't read most of your post Snowman. You're getting my back up telling me I'm wrong with what I'm doing.

I lost my V's coming up 2 years ago, I slept with 19 girls since, so try not to have the audacity to start throwing "guru bullsh*t" at me. I don't care what they do, most of it sucks for day to day use. IMO

It's funny how you interpreted it that way, but anyways like I always said there are so many different ways to go about this and in our case we both go about it differently.

I'm not going to sit here and stroke my ego about all my success, but so longs your getting the results then keep on doing what your doing. In my case I'm getting results and I'm passing what I've learned.

I would never say something unless I've actually tried it and shifting the sands was a big improvement to my game. I haven't been in the game as long as you have but I surely had massive success.

Don't come giving me "thats truly wrong" until you get the results I get, doing what I do.

This is the part that cracked me up the most because I'm not even really heavy on getting lay after lay anymore. Maybe when I first started but its all about building a lifestyle and everything I've learnt helpped me to get where I am now.

The type of social circle I've built from learning this is probably better than actually getting the lays.

Like I said you are wrong thinking there have to be transitions from story to story, because I personally always going from one thing to the next, back to something, escalating, etc. An you know what the girls love it and at the end of the day I had fun and she's had fun an at times we just so happened to mess around and ended up having sex.

It's not about being a "Guru" because I could careless about that crap, its about actually improving, if you didn't try something then don't shut it out until you've tried it.

Like Routines, you could give me a sheet full of routines and there is no way I'd be able to even say one routine, because it's not my real personality and that is why I never got too into MM or anything that dealt with canned because then I would've never learned anything.

What is important is conveying your personality, at the end of the day however you convey, so longs you do it your going to get laid. An so far for the 6 months or so that I've been doing this the worst set I've had was a girl ignoring me or "You're to young".

And Plowman if openers don't matter go up to the next girl you see and ask if she farted, if she doesnt run away in disgust and instead says "no, why?" Answer "Because you just blew me away."

Yeah, you don't have to be serious in your approach, but to liken someone to a pig throwing up is generally not cool, and if she finds it funny maybe you should stop hitting on girls and start the real challenge, women.

I've already proved this same exact statement to myself when I first started out. I swore up and down that if I didn't have a good opener I couldn't open, until I actually found out what attracts a woman and everything behind the words, lines, and techniques. (This is because I couldn't do routines)

An you know what started happening, I was a guy who was heavy on Sexual Inneundo, I'd constantly talk about...

- Pulling my dik out and slapping the girl in the face
- Busting all in her face
- If a girl said something I didn't like I'd say stuff like "Don't let me fuk you" instead of saying "Fuk you up

At that time I was turning delusional because it was a big realizations, my stories sucked and you want to know how I knew it sucked because in my social circle my friends hated how I talked to girls and they couldn't understand why girls was attracted.

Not to stroke my ego but I literally had two girls who would just sit there and watch me go on my little rambling.

So when it comes to talking about a "Fart" opener it doesn't matter. To me that actually sounds a bit normal because I remember starting out I'd say some pretty reckless openers.

But when I talk about openers and stuff not mattering, because it's only really about conveying your personality. I don't mean for you to open in a way that will step on your game. (Hitting ASD walls, Autopilot responses, etc) You would have to use common sense.

But I can see where you are coming from thinking the opener matters but once you fully understand plowing and conveying your personality you'll realize it doesn't matter. The only reason I tested it was because I read about one guy opening while climbing a fence just to get to a set, and a guy who opened by licking a chicks face. (I've never went that extreme yet)

For me the most extreme opener was probably me going up a random chick, embracing her and saying "O yea baby that spot right there ahhh". (I actually thought I knew her and that's why I did it) An you know what happened, the fuking set opened. She was laughing, she didn't get pissed or nothing and that's when I really noticed it doesn't matter.

All that getting the perfect story can help but isn't neccessary. The stuff I say isn't no longer tight because its not worth the mental energy.

Edit - I also know what your saying about throwing up and stuff which I personally wouldn't go deep into, but if it was a little comment like that, then I see no problem with it. Just 3 days ago on the way to a club I was talking with a girl and we were talking about sneaking into the cemetery right next to us, an you know what topic came up..."Rape", I personally wouldn't talk about that but just for the learning experienced I played around with it and framed it in a playful way an it turned out to actually be pretty funny. Her making her screams that she would make, and us just spinning around the story back and forth, it turned into something that was fun instead of negative. It didn't affect the interaction at all.

 

[theunflushables]

In fact I do feel good about myself ElStud. Flaming people over the internet is so cool. Actually I have a very A-hole personality, so I say stuff like that all the time. Maybe to make myself feel better, maybe because its funny to flame somebody I've never met but whatever pulls your trigger right?

As for my "mentally challenged" friend. There is soo much I could say about him. Basically it boils down to he spits the best game I've ever seen (unless he's acting all schizophrenic i.e. the cookies) but as soon as the girl is interested, he wusses out. Completely ass backwards from most insecure people.

And Plowman, I think you might know how to do a proper opener like you illustrate above, I just feel ElStud isnt quite hitting it, as he first exampled at the begining of this thread. Although I personally wouldnt use things discussed and I'm pretty happy for what I've accomplished my own way, it seems others around here feel if I dont do it the DJ way I'm failing. Its kinda annoying.

 

[ElStud]

It's like to talking to a wall, you don't listen. There's no such thing as a proper opener. And what if it isn't proper by your standards? I opened to a girl with that throwing up thing and she takes me to her friends and another set laughs. I think this proves that it really doesn't matter what you open with.

 

[WesCottII]

It's funny how you interpreted it that way, but anyways like I always said there are so many different ways to go about this and in our case we both go about it differently.

I'm not going to sit here and stroke my ego about all my success, but so longs your getting the results then keep on doing what your doing. In my case I'm getting results and I'm passing what I've learned.

As am I, but you come in here telling me I'm wrong. Even though I have more success.

I would never say something unless I've actually tried it and shifting the sands was a big improvement to my game. I haven't been in the game as long as you have but I surely had massive success.

Is that you justifying yourself?



This is the part that cracked me up the most because I'm not even really heavy on getting lay after lay anymore. Maybe when I first started but its all about building a lifestyle and everything I've learnt helpped me to get where I am now.

The type of social circle I've built from learning this is probably better than actually getting the lays.

Like I said you are wrong thinking there have to be transitions from story to story, because I personally always going from one thing to the next, back to something, escalating, etc. An you know what the girls love it and at the end of the day I had fun and she's had fun an at times we just so happened to mess around and ended up having sex.

I thought the social circle was more important than getting lays?

It's not about being a "Guru" because I could careless about that crap, its about actually improving, if you didn't try something then don't shut it out until you've tried it.



Like Routines, you could give me a sheet full of routines and there is no way I'd be able to even say one routine, because it's not my real personality and that is why I never got too into MM or anything that dealt with canned because then I would've never learned anything.

Well done, you've just parroted my own point back at me

What is important is conveying your personality, at the end of the day however you convey, so longs you do it your going to get laid. An so far for the 6 months or so that I've been doing this the worst set I've had was a girl ignoring me or "You're to young".

Congratulations, but then again, it was never about the lay was it? You're whole argument is full of holes. You drone on about not wanting the lay...but all your "sets" are geared towards getting laid? You sound like you're making excuses for not getting laid. Thats the part that cracked ME up.

I'll forgive you for being such a "jonny-know-it-all" because you're probably about 16, have had no dealings with older, real women out of highschool, and frankly you're just the average teenager, speaking on that which you have no idea, as though you're some sort of master. When you can pick girls up almost at will, come talk to me. Until then, I'd keep your buttonhole zipped kiddo.

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[Snow Plowman]

This has got way off topic but either way like I said to what you said, you were wrong because I don't really transition with stuff, becuse certain things wouldn't even be able to have a transition and end up never even being said.

You're right I'm no longer in it, primarly for getting laid. It's more of me doing it because it's actually fun and addicting. Every day that you go out and just socialize alone, turns into a new adventure and that's primarly why I love the game.

The last part cracked me up. In no way would I say I "Know it all":crackup:

At the sametime I'm not going to sit here and have one guy saying something doesn't work when I do the exact same thing and get results. An then to top it off because you have "19" lays in the community your way is the right way. Which is wrong because there are so many different ways but at the end of the day it's still doing one thing and that's conveying your personality.

If we were here arguing about the most success (You've probably laid 5-6 more girls than me), then everyone should stop doing what there doing and just learn Mystery Method or RSD because those guys got laid more than us. But that isn't the case.

Bottomline if you never tried something then don't dumb it down when other people are getting results. It's like saying Mystery Method doesn't work but yet you have thousands of people who are out there daily getting laid by just following the structure and guidelines. There is no way I could say "Routines don't work" because for one I can't use them and I've seen guys use it and actually get success.

It's rather funny that were actually going back and forth over something that really doesn't matter, an how I'm a supposedly "16 year old wannabe pimp":crackup:

But either way for past 6 months I've been going out 5-6 days a week practicing and getting that calibration. When you strip down all the BS, it will always come back to convey your personality. When it comes down to it a stupid crappy story didn't play much of a role in you getting laid. You're so called fancy opener didn't play much of a role. What played a role was "Who you are" and how you conveyed it. We all out in the field so just go out there test it out and you'll see it comes back to that one thing. After awhile you'll realize openers, stories, all that stuff guys constantly search for as a way to feel entitled to talk to women, was helpful at the time because of the mindset they were in, but at the end of the day, it wasn't neccessary.

 

[WesCottII]

You can sit there all you want chewing the fat about openers, fact is it's not working because he has got no numbers, day2's, whatever from it. My veiw on it is that the material isn't working, and he can't jump from story to story, because it's not right for him, wether it works for you or not.

I never said my way was "right", because I tweaked my style for me, and it probably wouldn't work for someone else, and if you use the phrase "which is wrong" one more time, imma come rearrange your teeth. You're no more of a "right/wrong" judge than I am, so can it.

Thanks for the lesson, but I'm way ahead of you, so stop with the santamonious stuff ok?

Edit: Make it twenty

 

[ElStud]

Oh man, it's pointless talking to you. I haven't gotten any numbers? But I have I really asked for any? I haven't gone to day 2? But have I really tried to go to Day 2? No. So you can take that not working bullsh*t somewhere else. My goal is to get interest from women and that's what I do. I get laughs, questions and that's pretty much all I've been going for.

 

[Lust]

Well, summers here and I'm not going to let that slow my game down. So today I went to the mall and approached 2 chicks. And let me tell you, at this mall atleast, it's hard to find a lot of chicks my age, that AREN'T with a boyfriend or with their parents. Anyway, here they go:

Approach #1
I see these chicks walking in the mall and I go up to them.

Yeah, that approach sucked ass dude.

Approach # 2
Saw this hot chick working at some sort of counter and approached her.

Yeah, that one pretty much sucked to. I was thinking about going for the number, but she really didn't seem all that interested. Infact, I could tell she really wasn't interesed in the end because by the time I asked her name, I could tell that she really wanted me to leave and really wanted to get back to work.

Mate, you aren't taking in any of the advice you are getting.

People have been giving you advice for AGES, and yet your game is still around the same level. I think what you are doing is, you think the magic is in the material, in what you say, so you are trying to get it out.

"Oh she won't like me, but she'll love the material! I gotta get the material out quick" - That's what your posts are usually screaming out at me.

You aren't taking in enough of the advice you are given. People here give you HUGE amounts of advice, yet you either discard it saying it's because of this or that, or defend yourself saying you actually did do this or that, or come up with some reason for not doing what you should.

All you have to do, is take in ALL the good advice you are given, even if you think you are doing it right, or you are doing whatever the advice is telling you to, just take it ALL in. Seriously, with all the comments you've been getting, and all the approaches you have been doing, you should be a pro by now.

 

[ElStud]

I read the magic of the material thing and I immediately thought "what is this dude smoking". I don't even know where you're coming from dude. You guys don't understand that I have my own method of doing it, that's working. No numbers? I haven't asked for any recently. And like Snow Plowman said if you really want to bring this down to who gets laid the most, the people that use Mystery Method and RSD do. You guys tell him he's wrong, but you've never tried his methods because of your own little presumptions? Ignorance. Do I tell you you guys or wrong? No, I just tell you I use a different method, but I'm saying your advice doesn't work for your particular method.

Don't try and bring that 'no success' crap because I've repeatedly given you guys examples of how I have had success with these methods. Dat, dat, I know what you're going to say, no numbers right? That's because I haven't asked for any. I succeed at what I want to do and that's get the girl laughing and interested.

Anyway, I'm going to sarge at the mall today, hopefully I'll try to atleast number close.

 

[theunflushables]

When I say "proper opening", I'm not saying there is only one way to do things. What I mean is Plowman executes his opener properly, meaning he gets results where you don't. I am sure he doesnt sneek up behind people and tap them.

If your goal is getting laughs, thats cool, but you're selling yourself short of getting numbers.

 

[Snow Plowman]

My veiw on it is that the material isn't working, and he can't jump from story to story, because it's not right for him, wether it works for you or not.

Now I clearly see what your saying. But I've talked to him about his sets already and I found out its not even the material that is messing him up. The cold read and the story everyone is bashing on is not what he is doing wrong.

Majority of his approaches
- He is trying for rapport (The best example is when he says "Tell me a little about yourself")
- He is being reactive (In this case he is asking questions as a way to keep the conversation going because he can't vibe)
- He is Qualifying
- He doesn't have a clear understanding of social dynamics (In this case he ignored one of the girls in the 2set and that girl ended up being bored and pulled her away

Those 4 things alone is killing his sets. I've spoke to him and his many problem is that he believes that material is what gets you the girl, but its really who you are that gets you the girl.

An that has nothing to do with the way that I pickup, its if you strip down all the lines, techniques, routines, theory, etc. You will find certain stuff is always occuring whether we all have different methods.

For example "Women don't want to be held accountable for anything that happens so you must lead". It doesn't matter what method you use, you still need to know that if you want to consitently pull. You basically have to take full responsiblity for everything that happens.

Same with Buying temperature, eye coding, state, etc. All those stuff is just basic social dynamics, it has nothing to do with a method or way of picking up.

An that is why many guys waste there time searching for all these lines, thinking that's the magic pill.

Take what saying how you want. Like anything you can decide to use it or scrap it, this is my last post about this whole field report because it kind of got off topic

imma come rearrange your teeth.

:nono:
Don't come with that BS, I'm going to stop it right there

When I say "proper opening", I'm not saying there is only one way to do things. What I mean is Plowman executes his opener properly, meaning he gets results where you don't. I am sure he doesnt sneek up behind people and tap them.

If your goal is getting laughs, thats cool, but you're selling yourself short of getting numbers.

Glad you can have a discussion without your emotions or ego affecting you.

The way me and El Stud approaches is really different because of the whole mindset that he is in and the whole way of his approach. While I'm based on just conveying my personality, he is more focused on what he is actually saying.

When I'm opening I'm only focused on conveying dominance, being authentic, high value, and cool. When I actual get to the set me Voice is expressive and my eye contact is solid and what happens after I say an opener...I plow it. I don't care what she says, thinks, or even how she responds. I'm just conveying my personality, saying and doing what I want to do.

Now I told him he should learn MM or from someone else because he won't be able to get what I'm doing no time soon, because you'd actually have to be going in the field to actually see the stuff that I'm talking about, because 90% of the time its non verbal or very subtle things.

By him just being reactive to the girls is killing his sets.

 

[theunflushables]

yeah, sometimes I feel that if there is anything more imporant in the room than my ego, I want it caught and shot.