Another Sexless LTR - How to stay?

[LiveYourDream]

TL; DR. Thoughts and considerations for OP to self reflect on. Some highlights in bold.

@MrPwr Take all I shared before and will here as well, with the understanding that it was/is a response to a only a few hundred words you used to describe a full four year relationship that led to a marriage proposal and more. You have primarily shared aspects of what isn’t working and little to nothing about what has kept you involved and proposing after four years. That can quickly shift the responses here and the momentum you feel associated with it. I feel moved to throw out some more thoughts and questions for your personal consideration.

What kept you choosing to be with her year after year? What inspired you to propose marriage? Were you inspired by who she is, her character and the joy and value she brings to your life? Did you propose mostly because she was pushing for it? And or others expected it? Because it’s been four years? Because you had no plan of your own so why not?

With all due respect, you sound like you are young and like you are still fairly wobbly in who you are as an individual, and also as a man in this world. I am not saying that to judge you but to offer it up for your own self reflection. Your posts explain how she leads and chooses what happens in a variety of ways. That what interests *her* and pleases her seems to guide what you two do or don't. Maybe there is more to it. It sounds so much to me like she has a maturity, a more dominant personality, like she’s more self assured, she’s more clear about what she likes and doesn’t or some combination of all of those. Where are those qualities in you? Do you even know? I get the sense she pretty much calls the shots and you follow along, to please her and/or you don’t really know who you are, so defaulting to her feels easier somehow? Just throwing out possibilities. Where are you in all of it? Are you clear, uncertain, mostly stoned?

To me, you sound like you are swallowed up and don’t exist a lot within the relationship. Again, I am not saying that to judge you but to suggest you deeply reflect , for yourself. Who would you be and what choices would you make for your life, if you were not deferring to her and trying to please her? Do you even know?

She also seems to have a more masculine essence or it’s more dominant right now, at least as you describe her. You seem to be holding the more submissive vibe. Some men genuinely prefer that role. They like not making decisions and simply following directions. Most do not. When relationships turn that way and balance is not restored, friction, resentment, dissatisfaction and so much more brews and results in an eventual splitting. Unfortunately that breaking point often occurs after marriage and kids.

Moving on from a marriage and all the lost hopes and dreams they had associated, that challenges people immensely. You don’t have kids yet. You are fortunate that if you walk away you have the ability to not be tied to her with on-going shared parenting and custody arrangements. That would be immensely challenging on top of everything else. Be wise and take time to make the right choice for you. Do not let her biological clock lead you to jump on her train and have a child because it is right for her, right now/soon.

I don’t get the sense you really know who you are. How can you show up fully and properly choose a fitting life partner then? How do you insure your own needs and desires are met, and not simply an after thought of hers, if even that?

What about kids? Is it really wise to bring a child into the world when you are hardly steady yourself? I get you are in school. This is about far more than a piece of paper. To me it is about a deeper maturity and solidity in yourself. You’d be homeless right now or close, if she broke up with you. You are living a life dependent on her. That will kill sexual polarity. She’s in her masculine. You are living more submissive but have an unsatisfied masculine sex drive. It’s got to be sorted for their to be a happy relationship. Without a more solid you, a more solid relationship, why add a child to that that? Having a child will amplify stress and thus issues and weak links exponentially. I don’t want to rain on your parade. I just want to encourage you to really get clear in you.

Was your relationship ever balanced where you were the leader? It sounds more like you’ve always been the pleaser and she’s set the expectations. While you are displeased with your sex life I am not clear about the rest. Without her side I could imagine her as being ok with both your sex and relationship dynamics or dissatisfied but feeling helpless. I am not entirely convinced either way She may be deeply frustrated and disappointed below the surface, at how much you lay back and handle school, while she takes care of things now. What do you think? What does she say?

You seem to have deferred so much to her. Are you really ready to give up even more when there is a child?

I question what experience you had before her. I get the sense you find your set up with her comfortable enough, to you, outside of the minimal sex.

To me I see a man who seems he’s being swept up in a current more than genuinely choosing from a solid foundation and sense of himself. Maybe all my projections. Again, not judging just offering food for thought. Best you find clarity for yourself, before you intertwine more deeply with her and having kids.

Which would you rather right now and why?
1. Give up sex and the leadership role in your relationship, to be with her long enough to have a child, with no guarantee of more

or

2. Be alone for a while and get yourself more figured out and on your own solid footing in this world???

3. You make it up

And why your choice and not the others

I do want to mention that if you two truly had a different masculine feminine dynamic earlier in your relationship, and it was enjoyed by both of you...it’s possible you are both just beyond out of sorts playing your current dynamics now. Or had she been more dominant or directive in bed as well? Only you know...

I am also not getting the vibe you have ever deeply embraced/lived your masculine essence and/or being a leader in this life...at least not yet/lately. Is that true? Is it something you feel drawn to, intimidated by, or pretty content with how things are?

Offering this all to you to reflect upon, for yourself. I’d simply like to see you live your best life and with as few regrets as possible. Again, your life...only you know what is deeply true for you. i wish you the best whatever you choose.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

Why to stay? If she even cared enough sex would be happening.

 

[MrPwr]

TL; DR. Thoughts and considerations for OP to self reflect on. Some highlights in bold.

@MrPwr Take all I shared before and will here as well, with the understanding that it was/is a response to a only a few hundred words you used to describe a full four year relationship that led to a marriage proposal and more. You have primarily shared aspects of what isn’t working and little to nothing about what has kept you involved and proposing after four years. That can quickly shift the responses here and the momentum you feel associated with it. I feel moved to throw out some more thoughts and questions for your personal consideration.

What kept you choosing to be with her year after year? What inspired you to propose marriage? Were you inspired by who she is, her character and the joy and value she brings to your life? Did you propose mostly because she was pushing for it? And or others expected it? Because it’s been four years? Because you had no plan of your own so why not?

With all due respect, you sound like you are young and like you are still fairly wobbly in who you are as an individual, and also as a man in this world. I am not saying that to judge you but to offer it up for your own self reflection. Your posts explain how she leads and chooses what happens in a variety of ways. That what interests *her* and pleases her seems to guide what you two do or don't. Maybe there is more to it. It sounds so much to me like she has a maturity, a more dominant personality, like she’s more self assured, she’s more clear about what she likes and doesn’t or some combination of all of those. Where are those qualities in you? Do you even know? I get the sense she pretty much calls the shots and you follow along, to please her and/or you don’t really know who you are, so defaulting to her feels easier somehow? Just throwing out possibilities. Where are you in all of it? Are you clear, uncertain, mostly stoned?

To me, you sound like you are swallowed up and don’t exist a lot within the relationship. Again, I am not saying that to judge you but to suggest you deeply reflect , for yourself. Who would you be and what choices would you make for your life, if you were not deferring to her and trying to please her? Do you even know?

She also seems to have a more masculine essence or it’s more dominant right now, at least as you describe her. You seem to be holding the more submissive vibe. Some men genuinely prefer that role. They like not making decisions and simply following directions. Most do not. When relationships turn that way and balance is not restored, friction, resentment, dissatisfaction and so much more brews and results in an eventual splitting. Unfortunately that breaking point often occurs after marriage and kids.

Moving on from a marriage and all the lost hopes and dreams they had associated, that challenges people immensely. You don’t have kids yet. You are fortunate that if you walk away you have the ability to not be tied to her with on-going shared parenting and custody arrangements. That would be immensely challenging on top of everything else. Be wise and take time to make the right choice for you. Do not let her biological clock lead you to jump on her train and have a child because it is right for her, right now/soon.

I don’t get the sense you really know who you are. How can you show up fully and properly choose a fitting life partner then? How do you insure your own needs and desires are met, and not simply an after thought of hers, if even that?

What about kids? Is it really wise to bring a child into the world when you are hardly steady yourself? I get you are in school. This is about far more than a piece of paper. To me it is about a deeper maturity and solidity in yourself. You’d be homeless right now or close, if she broke up with you. You are living a life dependent on her. That will kill sexual polarity. She’s in her masculine. You are living more submissive but have an unsatisfied masculine sex drive. It’s got to be sorted for their to be a happy relationship. Without a more solid you, a more solid relationship, why add a child to that that? Having a child will amplify stress and thus issues and weak links exponentially. I don’t want to rain on your parade. I just want to encourage you to really get clear in you.

Was your relationship ever balanced where you were the leader? It sounds more like you’ve always been the pleaser and she’s set the expectations. While you are displeased with your sex life I am not clear about the rest. Without her side I could imagine her as being ok with both your sex and relationship dynamics or dissatisfied but feeling helpless. I am not entirely convinced either way She may be deeply frustrated and disappointed below the surface, at how much you lay back and handle school, while she takes care of things now. What do you think? What does she say?

You seem to have deferred so much to her. Are you really ready to give up even more when there is a child?

I question what experience you had before her. I get the sense you find your set up with her comfortable enough, to you, outside of the minimal sex.

To me I see a man who seems he’s being swept up in a current more than genuinely choosing from a solid foundation and sense of himself. Maybe all my projections. Again, not judging just offering food for thought. Best you find clarity for yourself, before you intertwine more deeply with her and having kids.

Which would you rather right now and why?
1. Give up sex and the leadership role in your relationship, to be with her long enough to have a child, with no guarantee of more

or

2. Be alone for a while and get yourself more figured out and on your own solid footing in this world???

3. You make it up

And why your choice and not the others

I do want to mention that if you two truly had a different masculine feminine dynamic earlier in your relationship, and it was enjoyed by both of you...it’s possible you are both just beyond out of sorts playing your current dynamics now. Or had she been more dominant or directive in bed as well? Only you know...

I am also not getting the vibe you have ever deeply embraced/lived your masculine essence and/or being a leader in this life...at least not yet/lately. Is that true? Is it something you feel drawn to, intimidated by, or pretty content with how things are?

Offering this all to you to reflect upon, for yourself. I’d simply like to see you live your best life and with as few regrets as possible. Again, your life...only you know what is deeply true for you. i wish you the best whatever you choose.

This is a fantastic comment. A lot of your assessment is scarily accurate. I spent several hours last night writing a reply and deleting what I had written. There is so much I don't have the answer for but I think I have precipitated the best answer to summarise it all, and is something you eluded to.
I am a young man, who has been operating on auto-mode most of the way to 25years, with an indoctrinated set of values and goals that I do not naturally align with.
I have had a burning desire to fill a hole (title of my sextape) and previously no Idea how to do it (title of my sextape), or what to do it with (title of my sextape)
Jokes aside now,
Lots of Jordan Peterson lectures, Thomas Sowell books/interviews and other similar media I have consumed in recent years and reformed my world view. Red pill seems like the natural next step for me, but required a kickstart in the form of a rejection from the woman I thought I loved, aka Trauma.
After many casual encounters and fk buddies, a relationship with a girl who is smart, very lovely, and I get along with well is all too easy.
Some time after meeting her I discovered what my "life's work" is going to be (I have a significant innovation in the works, and I will pursue it to a higher degree once I graduate) and outside of that, having a girlfriend who has very low to non-existent attraction for me, and no respect for me as a man, seems like a waste of my time. She doesn't need me, for anything other than my good genes, and future provisioning.
That goal I have will save thousands of lives and potentially billions of dollars if fully implemented, and that is only in my country.
I'm not sure the time I will sacrifice to save a sexless relationship, and the ongoing effort required to maintain that success (if it is even possible) is worth the loss of time I could spend on my mission.
I see younger, more attractive, more willing women everywhere. In the city where I work, where I go to university, with very little effort I could have almost any of them. The uni-student girls especially. In some cases they are 10yrs my junior, very available and melt if I just say "Hi."
But I know with virtually unending effort (for which I have empirical evidence) I still wont "have" the one I proposed to.

 

[LiveYourDream]

@MrPwr I am glad what I shared resonated and was helpful to you.

You are finding your inner clarity. That is huge. Stay true to yourself. Move forward in your life according to that alignment, within yourself.

Caring about her does not mean you have to be with her or be the one who fulfills her dreams. Sometimes the most loving and yet challenging thing to do is to be honest and let someone you love go. I’m not advocating either way. Best if you fully choose, so you own your choice. Be radically honest with yourself. You don’t want regrets looking back someday. Follow that clarity from within. Only you know what is most true for you. Own it.

No matter what it is time to get off auto pilot. Get onto YOUR dream. Become the captain of your own ship!!! Stay at the helm! Follow your passion. Don’t wait till you graduate. Put time and energy into it now. Little bit by little bit. Invest time and energy into it.

Relative to your idea/mission...Plant seeds. Water them. Watch them grow. Work on your idea and let it enliven you. Spend time with it often. Make it a priority. It will serve your well-being. Become/Be a MAN on HIS mission. YOUR mission. Your masculine nature will reignite. How you experience life will shift. I am excited for you. I am wishing you the best.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

This is a fantastic comment. A lot of your assessment is scarily accurate. I spent several hours last night writing a reply and deleting what I had written. There is so much I don't have the answer for but I think I have precipitated the best answer to summarise it all, and is something you eluded to.
I am a young man, who has been operating on auto-mode most of the way to 25years, with an indoctrinated set of values and goals that I do not naturally align with.
I have had a burning desire to fill a hole (title of my sextape) and previously no Idea how to do it (title of my sextape), or what to do it with (title of my sextape)
Jokes aside now,
Lots of Jordan Peterson lectures, Thomas Sowell books/interviews and other similar media I have consumed in recent years and reformed my world view. Red pill seems like the natural next step for me, but required a kickstart in the form of a rejection from the woman I thought I loved, aka Trauma.
After many casual encounters and fk buddies, a relationship with a girl who is smart, very lovely, and I get along with well is all too easy.
Some time after meeting her I discovered what my "life's work" is going to be (I have a significant innovation in the works, and I will pursue it to a higher degree once I graduate) and outside of that, having a girlfriend who has very low to non-existent attraction for me, and no respect for me as a man, seems like a waste of my time. She doesn't need me, for anything other than my good genes, and future provisioning.
That goal I have will save thousands of lives and potentially billions of dollars if fully implemented, and that is only in my country.
I'm not sure the time I will sacrifice to save a sexless relationship, and the ongoing effort required to maintain that success (if it is even possible) is worth the loss of time I could spend on my mission.
I see younger, more attractive, more willing women everywhere. In the city where I work, where I go to university, with very little effort I could have almost any of them. The uni-student girls especially. In some cases they are 10yrs my junior, very available and melt if I just say "Hi."
But I know with virtually unending effort (for which I have empirical evidence) I still wont "have" the one I proposed to.

Your one situation can eventually drain all your drive, motivation and creativity and cause you to stall and back slide in your endeavors. Its because you are not validated there. Yet you want her. Thats a dynamic that will drain you. Try cheating on her to see if it helps the energy. Might as well.

 

[Lookatu]

Caring about her does not mean you have to be with her or be the one who fulfills her dreams. Sometimes the most loving and yet challenging thing to do is to be honest and let someone you love go.

I know you meant this for OP but this is the most powerful statement I've heard as it relates to me. Thank you so much as it's been therapeutic for me.
I've always had doubts and regrets for a woman whom I was madly in love with in my 20's whom I've lost and I never made peace with it or could rest. You've just brought me peace and rest with that with the statement above.

 

[MrPwr]

So last night I woke up grinding her ass hard***
(Subconscious me is apparently very randy) and she wasn't objecting or telling me to fk off so I decided fk it and I pinned her down prone (protection first, no babies) and then went to pound town.
She wasn't all "loved up" this morning or wanting affection/attention. Just normal morning girl.

Meanwhile I'm confused as.

 

[MrPwr]

On overcompensating. Pretty simple concept. I will try to convey it so that you can see it

It’s the same way that most women can tell a pick-up guy trying to have game. what his internal structure is, is in contrast to what he is being. Like the words and actions don’t match what her eyes and instincts are observing at a micro level. The vibe is off. His eyes don’t have the right set or his micro motions to his body language are off in slight ways. Women can be and are masters at social acuity.

Men are not so gifted as a rule. And are very likely to get a woman wrong. He listens to her words, explanations, reasonings to obtain truths or bottom line conclusions.
A woman especially, is overcompensating. The woman who dresses like a sexual dynamite package is not normally a high end sex package. she is presenting herself in a way that is designed to compete for men’s attention. It is not however an indicator of sexual mastery. Or even the idea that she will be overt in her quest to obtain sex.

My favorite is of course the average dressed, seemingly “average” attractive woman. She is many times more likely to be a master cok sucker. She wears her clothes well or even sometimes purposely un-flashy. Mostly she will have the girl next door wholesome look. This is the one that eats up men. Most likely to have the trait that wrecks weak men cloaked as bad dogs. The hidden beta is food.

Are you seeing it yet? All women are chameleons. They are not being evil. They are highly skilled at getting what they want/need out of men and life. Men are service creatures. For the most part they work hard and are way more dependable.

All women want sex and all women are having sex. Even if she has to masturbate every two days during lunch. She is still turned on by men all the time. Regardless of any and all past experiences.

The woman who says, “I’m don’t need as much sex” or “I’m not that sexual” is lying. She is highly sexual. Just not when it comes to you. You are old news and you were most likely easy to get.

She is overcompensating so she doesn’t have to have as much sex with you. You comment or ask about it and will get the same old lines men across the entire planet hear every day from their girlfriends and wives. Do you actually think your situation is new or in any way unique to many of us? You drop her in front of a man who turns her on and she will fuk like a rabbit. Every chance she gets. She won’t be able to stay away from him.

Yeah that makes total sense, I have seen, met and fvked the "averaged dressed, seemingly average attractive woman" and I can attest to her ability to suck the chrome off a tow hitch. She also wanted me to "stage a break in and rape" to fulfil a fantasy of hers. So they can be all kinds of crazy. I declined, as I'm too pretty for prison.
But I totally get it!
I think also I was a deluded before as I never considered this to apply to my current partner. She claims to never masturbate, but probably just lying. She is very much "**** oriented" for orgasm and it doesn't take much to get her there.

 

[Lookatu]

She claims to never masturbate, but probably just lying. She is very much "**** oriented" for orgasm and it doesn't take much to get her there.

This is probably true. There are women that only want an orgasm with an actual person. If you could get free pvssy at will, would you wanna masturbate too?

I find women that don't masturbate or hardly masturbate somewhat good because their ****oris is still sensitive for them to orgasm easily. The worst are the constant masturbators that uses all these dildos and vibrators that numbs their **** and loosens their pvssy. LOL

 

[AureliusMaximus]

Another Sexless LTR - How to stay?

This title tells everything that is wrong with this thread and it sort of piss me off too.
Why the fauuark doesn't anyone want this?

 

[MrPwr]

This is probably true. There are women that only want an orgasm with an actual person. If you could get free pvssy at will, would you wanna masturbate too?

I find women that don't masturbate or hardly masturbate somewhat good because their ****oris is still sensitive for them to orgasm easily. The worst are the constant masturbators that uses all these dildos and vibrators that numbs their **** and loosens their pvssy. LOL

Literally is the worst.
I'm not a small dude so when I fvk a chick who feels loose and hasn't had kids i'm like "where the giant dildo at?"
I guess it is the female version of porn for men. It ruins the real sexual experience for both of you.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

Literally is the worst.
I'm not a small dude so when I fvk a chick who feels loose and hasn't had kids i'm like "where the giant dildo at?"
I guess it is the female version of porn for men. It ruins the real sexual experience for both of you.

Imagine if there's no huge dildos? That she's just huge like that? Sometimes its just not compatible.

 

[MrPwr]

Imagine if there's no huge dildos? That she's just huge like that? Sometimes its just not compatible.

Sometimes you would be correct. I have some great anecdotal evidence to back up my claims

 

[mrgoodstuff]

Sometimes you would be correct. I have some great anecdotal evidence to back up my claims

I met one like that. She was like 5'1" but vaginally she was huge.

 

[MrPwr]

Dropping in for an update.

Crushing it at work, got a 16% payrise with another coming after I deliver my current project.
Crushing the gym, went from 20% bodyfat to 12% and gained 5kg muscle (have receipts for this) and in a better state than I was @20y/o (my previous fitness peak)
Started going out more with friends.
Took my girl on a trip, planned & paid for everything.
Purchased my first investment property.

Learned a truckload about LTRs from Rian Stone. I jive with his content and delivery style so have seen the most success with this, likely due to congruency with my personality (each to their own)

Go figure, we now fork multiple times a week.
Even BJ's and hand jobs (which never used to happen).
I never get the bs excuses I was getting before, but I am also reading her better.

Anyway, if anyone finds this in the future, there is hope.
Don't bin a relationship until you are on top of your game and be hyper-critical of whether you are in-fact on top of your game.

 

[metalwater]

don't look back, you are not going that way.

she can ride with you as long as she behaves like she wants to.

when your rising women stick to you. when comes to the storm, not so much.

just keep rising and all else will follow on.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

Dropping in for an update.

Crushing it at work, got a 16% payrise with another coming after I deliver my current project.
Crushing the gym, went from 20% bodyfat to 12% and gained 5kg muscle (have receipts for this) and in a better state than I was @20y/o (my previous fitness peak)
Started going out more with friends.
Took my girl on a trip, planned & paid for everything.
Purchased my first investment property.

Learned a truckload about LTRs from Rian Stone. I jive with his content and delivery style so have seen the most success with this, likely due to congruency with my personality (each to their own)

Go figure, we now fork multiple times a week.
Even BJ's and hand jobs (which never used to happen).
I never get the bs excuses I was getting before, but I am also reading her better.

Anyway, if anyone finds this in the future, there is hope.
Don't bin a relationship until you are on top of your game and be hyper-critical of whether you are in-fact on top of your game.

Stay focused on your physical and financial

 

[Zimbabwe]

While that is an option (dumping) I detest the idea of taking any of what she has worked for. I know that sentiment isn't shared by the wider female population but those are my personal principles.
As for the dumping I would prefer to try repair.
If I could figure out how establish myself as... frame bearer? despite my current situation, even once and maintain it even for just a short time then I know it could be done.

While I do respect your integrity, you need to be looking out for your best interests in this situation. She obviously doesn't have high IL for you.

 

[MrPwr]

While I do respect your integrity, you need to be looking out for your best interests in this situation. She obviously doesn't have high IL for you.

Thanks for your comment.
That statement you quoted from my earlier post...feels like a lifetime ago.
A lot of what I said before is probably not even relevant now, so much has changed. And I have learned a lot about her along the way.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

We don't like "withholding" around here. The real reason its done is pretty bad. She can do it if she wants but chooses not to. She doesn't think you will go anywhere and you can't make her.

Its done because the situation is more about "control" and she does not really like you.