I had a flirt session the other day. Ran into her again today. What to make of her behavior?

[AllTiedUp]

There is no cure for retardation, unfortunately.

We're all screwed then

 

[Clockwerk50]

There's a woman I have a flirtatious repertoire with who works for a different company in my office building. She's in her 60s and married. I don't think she'd really take it beyond flirting (but if she offered sex, I'd take it)

There's also a woman from a different company in my office building who compliments my appearance from time to time (and has even initiated locker room talk). She's late 30s. I don't find her attractive (even if she was 45+)

As for the cafe, I enjoy going there from time to time (and at least want the option to go back)

The story about slipping a female coworker my digits was done in a manner where I insisted I only wanted to be friends (because a man really has to tiptoe at work; as you said, HR views men as guilty until proven innocent)

Back to the Cafe girl, the discussion isn't pointless. The fact I'd like to at least get some degree of success with her (even if not sex) means I'd like it if she'd escalate beyond Monday's flirt session.

Men’s responsibility is to lead, escalate, and create opportunities where romance can blossom. Since you did not do the above, and since she put herself out there, she thought you were not interested.

Like I have said multiple times, women communicate covertly and men communicate overtly.

 

[GoodMan32]

It definitely isn't a "don't poop where you eat situation". The cafe in the office building isn't that important. It is somewhat dependent upon how often a guy would use a cafe/restaurant within his own office building.

Previously, I mentioned the likelihood of a barista/restaurant staffer to change jobs. In most cases, turnover is high in those locations and a female will change jobs within a matter of months. Another consideration is how often the man changes jobs. I have changed jobs multiple times and when I change jobs, it means I stop going to the cafe/restaurant within that office building of an ex-employer.

There's one thing I recommend for men who work in larger office buildings with multiple companies. I recommend men attempt to attract and seduce women who work at other companies in the same building. It's not "crapping where you eat". There are no consequences there. It's unknown how long she will work for a company in the building and how long you will work there as well. I have found dates in various buildings where I have worked over the years.

In that situation, I think that it is better if she's further away in the building and rarely ever seen as compared to a woman who works for a different company on the same floor in that building or even one floor away. As an example, let's say there's a 20 story office building. If you (as the man) work on the 17th Floor and she works on the 5th Floor, then it's not likely you'll see each other much. In general, you are likely to only see her every so often in the building's lobby. If a rejection happens or if a first-second date with her goes bad, then you won't have to see her often and be reminded of that.



That's weak and passive. If you are going to crap where you eat, at least be the man and lead the interaction.

Fear of HR is a common feeling for men. It a feeling that white collar worker men tend to have regardless of whether their ideology is blue pill, red pill, or black pill. HR managers and HR representatives tend to be mostly female and don't perceive men well in those situations. Men are always guilty until proven innocent in an HR scenario related to mating in the workplace.



This is an irrelevant conversation then.

She's attractive and you should be interested.

You are only not interested in sex with her because of your oddities related to autism and another possible mental disorder.

A neurotypical would be interested in this situation.

You self-sabotage many interactions due to your oddities. It's you.



Neurotypical men misread IOIs all the time. Neurotypical men also known for thinking that some service industry worker is interested in them when she's really not. That's why I made that thread in 2020 about hitting on women who work with the public. It's so rare that a woman who works with the public is interested in a customer.

I have a brand new story on the general topic of the gender double standard when it comes to HR (you had mentioned on your post that HR favors a woman over a man)

My workplace had our Christmas luncheon today. One of the managers from another department took some pictures. Being camera-shy, I tried to avoid the camera.

About 25 minutes ago, that manager emailed the pictures she took to the whole office. I then replied-all "Even though I tried to avoid the camera, going as far as putting my head down when I knew you were taking a picture, I see I made it into a few pictures."

The female manager then replied "The camera will always find you. You look great." She replied all. Which means the whole office (including HR) saw that she told me I look great.

Imagine if the roles were reversed (and a male manager told a camera-shy female employee she looks great) on an email HR is tagged on. He'd be fired by the end of the day.

 

[GoodMan32]

This post is proof that your entire mindset needs to change with approaches. You present as someone petrified to make a mistake and how you will be perceived if you are turned down. You need to understand that it ultimately isn't a big deal. Everyone in this thread is telling you this, yet you continue to make excuses.

Of course you will get turned down. All of us get turned down. It is just part of the game. Accept that and it will set you free and you will realize you are always playing with house money when it comes to cold approaching. Also, stop saying you will come off "creepy." This is like Jealous Woman Speak 101 for women who never get approached to shame men from approaching hotter women. Men who are afraid (like you) then repeat it as an out for never making a cold approach. Stop living in fear brother and simply talk to women. In fact, just go talk to them to start and DON'T ask them out. No pressure. Just make conversation and get comfortable with it. I think you will find by doing a thing it gets easier. But you must change this mindset.

Good luck.

I've mentioned on the forum before that I'm pretty good at talking to a woman platonically (Hell, other than one LGBT guy, the table I sat at for our Christmas luncheon today was all female. They loved chatting with me)

It's only when I try to take it more-than-platonic that I fall apart.

As for the creepy thing, I'm an autist. Autists are prone to unknowingly acting creepy. My phobia of getting viewed as creepy if I make a move on a woman is valid. It's understandable why my phobia of getting viewed as creepy is stronger than the typical man's phobia.

There's literature online explaining why "creepy" is the worst word a woman could possibly call a man by the way.

 

[SW15]

Men’s responsibility is to lead, escalate, and create opportunities where romance can blossom. Since you did not do the above, and since she put herself out there, she thought you were not interested.

Like I have said multiple times, women communicate covertly and men communicate overtly.

I agree with this if she was truly interested in that moment. I tend to think baristas/waitresses generally aren't interested in customers. On the off chance she was interested, then your analysis is perfect.

I have a brand new story on the general topic of the gender double standard when it comes to HR (you had mentioned on your post that HR favors a woman over a man)

My workplace had our Christmas luncheon today. One of the managers from another department took some pictures. Being camera-shy, I tried to avoid the camera.

About 25 minutes ago, that manager emailed the pictures she took to the whole office. I then replied-all "Even though I tried to avoid the camera, going as far as putting my head down when I knew you were taking a picture, I see I made it into a few pictures."

The female manager then replied "The camera will always find you. You look great." She replied all. Which means the whole office (including HR) saw that she told me I look great.

Imagine if the roles were reversed (and a male manager told a camera-shy female employee she looks great) on an email HR is tagged on. He'd be fired by the end of the day.

In these situations, females have more freedom to act without getting in trouble than males do. It is what it is. It's unfortunate and a consequence of working in white collar. I recommend more men skip going to college and work in a trade occupation. These things don't happen in blue collar work/trades.

 

[Hamurabimbi]

I have a brand new story on the general topic of the gender double standard when it comes to HR (you had mentioned on your post that HR favors a woman over a man)

My workplace had our Christmas luncheon today. One of the managers from another department took some pictures. Being camera-shy, I tried to avoid the camera.

About 25 minutes ago, that manager emailed the pictures she took to the whole office. I then replied-all "Even though I tried to avoid the camera, going as far as putting my head down when I knew you were taking a picture, I see I made it into a few pictures."

The female manager then replied "The camera will always find you. You look great." She replied all. Which means the whole office (including HR) saw that she told me I look great.

Imagine if the roles were reversed (and a male manager told a camera-shy female employee she looks great) on an email HR is tagged on. He'd be fired by the end of the day.

That was incredibly mild. I cannot imagine this would be an issue even if a man said it.

 

[SW15]

OP is on the Spectrum, correct?

Yes. He has said so many times.

Most SS posters are not on the Spectrum.
He is seeking help from the wrong place.
We cannot put ourselves in OPs shoes.

Valid points.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

I have a brand new story on the general topic of the gender double standard when it comes to HR (you had mentioned on your post that HR favors a woman over a man)

My workplace had our Christmas luncheon today. One of the managers from another department took some pictures. Being camera-shy, I tried to avoid the camera.

About 25 minutes ago, that manager emailed the pictures she took to the whole office. I then replied-all "Even though I tried to avoid the camera, going as far as putting my head down when I knew you were taking a picture, I see I made it into a few pictures."

The female manager then replied "The camera will always find you. You look great." She replied all. Which means the whole office (including HR) saw that she told me I look great.

Imagine if the roles were reversed (and a male manager told a camera-shy female employee she looks great) on an email HR is tagged on. He'd be fired by the end of the day.

Why?

What exactly was "harrassing" about that remark?

 

[GoodMan32]

In the universe where she thinks there's something wrong with her because you don't want to have sex with her even when she's available and you look like you could do with a good f*ck.

I'm sure she would feel much less rejected, but more relieved, if she had known all you wanted was to see her urinate.

You act like the way you feel rejection is the only way people can experience rejection.

Since some people experience rejection when my tomcat ignores them, I tell you that people with fragile egos can easily feel rejected even when that's not intentional. I know you're autistic, but you can at least try to look at something from a different perspective.

She doesn't know I don't want sex with her.

For all she knows, maybe I just didn't find it appropriate to ask for sex while she's on the job.

And for all any of us know, perhaps she's on board with allowing a guy to watch her pee.

 

[GoodMan32]

OP wants some cheat code to only have women say yes as if that works that way in any other aspect of life where everything always goes your way 100% of the time.

Then he has some other fvcked up mental stuff going on with them having to be old and wrinkly to want to fvck them.

Honestly, OP should just jack off and save himself the time and mental energy. I cannot imagine any fulfillment he is getting even if he is able to somehow get a woman to agree to fvck him and they most certainly are not getting any.

I'm willing to risk having a woman say no...but only if I'm highly unlikely to ever run into her again. For example, the woman at the 1st speed dating event I wanted to exchange contact information with (but got turned down).

I shot my shot because I knew I was highly unlikely to ever run into her again.

Some of my partners have gotten fulfillment, I know that for a fact.

 

[GoodMan32]

Sounds to me like she was practicing her seducing skills on you. She must've sensed your weirdness and thought of you as easy practice.
Just like some here and in the manosphere advise guys to practice on ugly and fat girls in order to become confident to hit on the 8s and 9s.

Since the norm is for the man to be the seducer, I don't know why a broad would need to practice her seduction skills.

She has a big chest. That right there is all she needs in order to seduce men.

 

[GoodMan32]

Unfortunately I'm afraid that some men are simply not build for this...I've seen it all around me where dudes just don't wanna put in the effort (anymore), and even personally I have to REALLY set my mind to it otherwise ain't shyte happening.

Don't try to demoralise OP, but let's be real; the process of making that needed transformation is a personal matter. Nobody can give him any other advice than to go ALL IN on life. Perhaps he could put it in writing but I guess it will turn out to be something like a dairy.

In order to change his mindset OP needs t understand that this journey will take a thousand miles AT LEAST. Its no different from wanna go from obese to ripped as it takes a whole lotta tiny and some big steps to change. However, I do salute him for trying. Most definitely. But tbh I don't see how he will make that transformation with this mindset.

With the fetish for exclusively older women on top of this, OP is playing this game on hard mode highest difficulty. It's no different from a 40+ y.o man with let's say a dad bod saying he only falls for 22 y.o redheads with blue eyes and perky tits. Annoying preferences that make a " challenging " situation even more difficult

AITA? Maybe I am. Again not trying to demoralise dudes like him, but all these mental gymnastics also lead to nowhere. Maybe it's time to hang em up, take a step back and accept that you don't really want it.

It makes sense that a middle aged man with a dad bod will struggle to pull 22 year olds.

It's strange, on the other hand, that a guy like me is at a disadvantage when pursuing older broads. I'm skinny with a decent amount of definition (my profile picture is my bicep), average-to-above-average in looks; and I'm at the sweet spot where I'm old enough to be firmly into adulthood, yet young enough she'd be getting a significantly younger smash-piece.

I'm glad you acknowledge I'm at least trying to make more effort lately (between the speed dating events and the cafe girl whose looks I complimented)

 

[GoodMan32]

OP is on the Spectrum, correct?
Most SS posters are not on the Spectrum.
He is seeking help from the wrong place.
We cannot put ourselves in OPs shoes.

Yeah, I'm an autist.

It's true you have a hard time putting yourself in my shoes.

Then again, autism forums aren't exactly helpful either. A lot of the men are even bigger failures than me (so they have no guidance to give me). And the broads on autism forums are prone to creep-shaming us (yes, even autistic broads creep-shame male autists)

With how mild my case is, I probably have more in common with many neurotypicals than I do with more severe autists.

 

[GoodMan32]

The guys who want to start new sexual relationships with 45-60 year old women are typically blue pilled 45-60 year old men or men 60+.

There are plenty of 45-60 year old men in sexual relationships with 45-60 year old women. These relationships are often 10+ year long relationships and often 20+ year long ones.

It is highly abnormal for an early 30s man to be looking that much older.

By the time a man reaches his early 30s, he is older than a substantial number of women. As an early to mid 30s man, it is the perfect time in life to be seeking a somewhat younger woman and have a wide selection of somewhat younger women.

I think it is a common thing for a very young man (18-24) to have sex with a 40 something woman. This is usually one of his mom's friends/acquaintances when it happens. It's rare that an 18-24 year old man will go find a woman 40+ to have sex with him through in-person approaching. Tech methods might help with this because a lot of unusual stuff can be found in mating, especially when a person lacks social skills to find it through his personal network.

I bagged some cougars through tech methods when I was in college.

 

[GoodMan32]

She probably thought that about you, for about a second, after you didn't try to close the deal after she went out of her way to make it easy on you.

You've been discounted and forgotten.

Now you can go the cafe without feeling awkward.

Yay.

I don't appreciate posters acting like it's somehow a character flaw that I didn't put in more effort to close the deal.

On @SW15's first reply to this thread, he linked a thread about how it's inadvisable to ask a woman out at a service job.

Give me a break.

Besides, I escalated somewhat (by telling her she looks good too). At that point, she had the option to continue the flirt session. She's to blame too.

 

[GoodMan32]

Men’s responsibility is to lead, escalate, and create opportunities where romance can blossom. Since you did not do the above, and since she put herself out there, she thought you were not interested.

Like I have said multiple times, women communicate covertly and men communicate overtly.

Even if telling her she looks good too wasn't officially "closing the deal" on my part, it's at least an example of an overt action.

What a strange world we live in where a broad thinks a man who told her she looks good somehow isn't interested.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

Yes, it looks like another double digit ego thread...

 

[New_Journey]

@GoodMan32 bro, let me ask you this. What do you want from life? Because since you joined this forum everything you do is complain and whine.

Masculine men don't complain, they do what needs to be done to obtain what they desire in life. Your behavior behind the keyboard os extremely unattractive and repulsive to any female. I can't imagine how are you in person.

What are you trying to gain in this forum?

 

[GoodMan32]

I agree with this if she was truly interested in that moment. I tend to think baristas/waitresses generally aren't interested in customers. On the off chance she was interested, then your analysis is perfect.



In these situations, females have more freedom to act without getting in trouble than males do. It is what it is. It's unfortunate and a consequence of working in white collar. I recommend more men skip going to college and work in a trade occupation. These things don't happen in blue collar work/trades.

It's true there's none of the HR double standard in blue collar jobs.

But on the flipside, blue collar jobs tend to be sausage fests (In other words, even if you can theoretically shoot your shot on a female blue collar coworker without getting ratted out to HR, it's highly unlikely there will be any suitable female coworkers in the first place)

 

[GoodMan32]

That was incredibly mild. I cannot imagine this would be an issue even if a man said it.

I suppose it's possible a man could get away with it.

Still, a lot of men are petrified to say anything even mildly complimentary of a female coworker's appearance.

For example, one time a female coworker asked me if I thought another female coworker's haircut looked cute (right in front of the coworker with the haircut). I replied "I don't think I'm allowed to answer that question."

(Part of it could have been guilty conscience on my part. The female coworker who got the haircut had the nicest backside of any woman I've ever worked with. I really wanted to get my paws on that backside. She's the coworker I slipped my digits to)