Law of Attraction Scam

[Asasione]

Sir, "Think and Grow Rich" by Napoleon Hill was released in 1937. The concept of the "Law of Attraction" came out of New Thought Movement teaching of the late 1800's from people such as Phineas Quimby. The concept of the Law of Attraction was not created by Napoleon Hill Sir, I have posted links so that you can actually look up and research the information rather than trying to argue "your opinion".

And for your information, I've been reading Napoleon Hill, Dale Carnegie, and certain other Self-Help Guru books since I've been 16. It's why I know so much about the New Thought Movement.

I didn't say he created it, seems you can't even comprehend something as simple as brought into the mainstream. The Bible has law of attraction type of thought as well and even there action is a requirement so you interpreted it your own way to skew the narrative to your bullsh*t statements of just believing things will happen if you will it strongly enough. Always love arguing in circles don't you

 

[Tenacity]

I didn't say he created it, seems you can't even comprehend something as simple as brought into the mainstream. The Bible has law of attraction type of thought as well and even there action is a requirement so you interpreted it your own way to skew the narrative to your bullsh*t statements of just believing things will happen if you will it strongly enough. Always love arguing in circles don't you

Sir......once again......I have posted links, resources, and research on the definition of what the Law of Attraction is, where it was formulated, how it came about, and the current state of the theory today.

I'm not twisting anything Sir, I just posted the information for you to review for yourself.

Also, the Bible or any Religion is not scientific research Sir. The Bible, Religion, and the Law of Attraction are one of the same, in that they are only "theories" that people have chosen to believe in (as they have the RIGHT to do so) but they cannot be utilized as statements of fact, scientific research, scientific data, or anything of the such.

I will summarize the findings for you once again:

- Law Of Attraction theory comes out of New Thought Movement ramblings and teachings in the 1800s

- The 1900s, the self-help industry begins to take off and they use the New Thought Movement related teachings and ramblings as the foundation for the industry (including the Law of Attraction theory). The Self-Help Gurus would tweek, modify, and rework different variations of the ramblings to make them more "sellable" to the marketplace.

- Today, the self-help industry is a multi, multi, multi BILLION DOLLAR industry selling the notion that your thoughts create success and good health.......even though (despite that multi, multi, multi BILLION dollar industry) America is more overweight, obese, broke, and in debt today than damn near EVER before in history.

 

[Asasione]

Sir......once again......I have posted links, resources, and research on the definition of what the Law of Attraction is, where it was formulated, how it came about, and the current state of the theory today.

I'm not twisting anything Sir, I just posted the information for you to review for yourself.

Also, the Bible or any Religion is not scientific research Sir. The Bible, Religion, and the Law of Attraction are one of the same, in that they are only "theories" that people have chosen to believe in (as they have the RIGHT to do so) but they cannot be utilized as statements of fact, scientific research, scientific data, or anything of the such.

I will summarize the findings for you once again:

- Law Of Attraction theory comes out of New Thought Movement ramblings and teachings in the 1800s

- The 1900s, the self-help industry begins to take off and they use the New Thought Movement related teachings and ramblings as the foundation for the industry (including the Law of Attraction theory). The Self-Help Gurus would tweek, modify, and rework different variations of the ramblings to make them more "sellable" to the marketplace.

- Today, the self-help industry is a multi, multi, multi BILLION DOLLAR industry selling the notion that your thoughts create success and good health.......even though (despite that multi, multi, multi BILLION dollar industry) America is more overweight, obese, broke, and in debt today than damn near EVER before in history.

As I said you simply won't accept things and will keep arguing, the Bible whether you want to believe it or not predates your new thought movement links and it has action as a component. I'm not a religious person but this a fact. Those summaries you put don't actually correlate the way you imagine they do especially the last one. If you've read those books then why are you twisting the words into a narrative that fits an agenda you want to push, that they sell you into an idea that thoughts manifest your desires with no action?

Let's just agree to disagree as I know you love being right and arguing incessantly over pointless things and summarizing the same points over and over lol. Good day

 

[Tenacity]

As I said you simply won't accept things and will keep arguing, the Bible whether you want to believe it or not predates your new thought movement links and it has action as a component. I'm not a religious person but this a fact. Those summaries you put don't actually correlate the way you imagine they do especially the last one. If you've read those books then why are you twisting the words into a narrative that fits an agenda you want to push, that they sell you into an idea that thoughts manifest your desires with no action?

Let's just agree to disagree as I know you love being right and arguing incessantly over pointless things and summarizing the same points over and over lol. Good day

Yeah, we can stop arguing as you keep (strangely) telling me that I'm not "accepting" something or "reading" something, when I literally would repost the exact definitions, theories, etc., right back to you?

The Bible, which is used by Prosperity Gospel Preachers, does not promote the Law of Attraction, it promotes "favors from God through faith". The Bible says that if you tithe, give offerings, pray, be kind-hearted, believe, and follow the "holy spirit", God will BLESS you with various material things along with good health, peace, and love.

The Law of Attraction states that whatever you PUT out as energy into the universe, is what the universe will give back to you. It does not mention anything about God, or Faith, or anything like that.

The Prosperity Gospel Preachers have packaged a "product" called the Prosperity Gospel, to include a variation of the Law of Attraction in combination with Bible teachings. The Self-Help Gurus don't include Bible teachings, they just talk about "The Universe". So with the Prosperity Gospel Preachers, "the genie granting your wishes" is GOD. With the Self-Help Gurus, "the genie granting your wishes" is THE UNIVERSE.

You discussing N. Hill, a Self-Help Guru who packaged his own "product", is not really the topic of this thread. The topic of the thread is if the Law of Attraction is an ineffective theory and in discussing this, you have to keep the conversation STRICTLY on the Law of Attraction theory..........not the repackaged variations that include other variables (such as God, or action, or executed plans, or goals, etc.) that the Self-Help Gurus and Church Pastors have ADDED to the theory to market a "product".

But maybe what I'm saying is going over your head, so I understand.

 

[Asasione]

Yeah, we can stop arguing as you keep (strangely) telling me that I'm not "accepting" something or "reading" something, when I literally would repost the exact definitions, theories, etc., right back to you?

The Bible, which is used by Prosperity Gospel Preachers, does not promote the Law of Attraction, it promotes "favors from God through faith". The Bible says that if you tithe, give offerings, pray, be kind-hearted, believe, and follow the "holy spirit", God will BLESS you with various material things along with good health, peace, and love.

The Law of Attraction states that whatever you PUT out as energy into the universe, is what the universe will give back to you. It does not mention anything about God, or Faith, or anything like that.

The Prosperity Gospel Preachers have packaged a "product" called the Prosperity Gospel, to include a variation of the Law of Attraction in combination with Bible teachings. The Self-Help Gurus don't include Bible teachings, they just talk about "The Universe". So with the Prosperity Gospel Preachers, "the genie granting your wishes" is GOD. With the Self-Help Gurus, "the genie granting your wishes" is THE UNIVERSE.

You discussing N. Hill, a Self-Help Guru who packaged his own "product", is not really the topic of this thread. The topic of the thread is if the Law of Attraction is an ineffective theory and in discussing this, you have to keep the conversation STRICTLY on the Law of Attraction theory..........not the repackaged variations that include other variables (such as God, or action, or executed plans, or goals, etc.) that the Self-Help Gurus and Church Pastors have ADDED to the theory to market a "product".

But maybe what I'm saying is going over your head, so I understand.

Good job being predictable. The Bible has more content involving law of attraction type thought than you know had you read it like a book instead listening to sermons or wherever you get your crappy summaries. It's got contradictory stories and statements throughout but there are multiple instances where belief not specifically attributed to God but faith as you call it, with action is said to will what you want to happen. Of course God is attributed to all good and bad things in the Bible implicitly.

Sure buddy the universe, and all that, good talk lol.

 

[Tenacity]

Good job being predictable. The Bible has more content involving law of attraction type thought than you know had you read it like a book instead listening to sermons or wherever you get your crappy summaries..

I actually used to work in Church Ministry and have read the bible front to back (pretty much) before. But like I said, we can discontinue the discussion as it doesn't appear as though you are looking to have a credible one.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

If you guys spent less time arguing and more time on meditating on your desires, you'd be rich and surrounded by porn stars.

See, right now there's a huge sack of cash with your name on it, AND a bunch of hot virgin porn stars desperate to deliver it straight to your door, but your negative energy is clouding their fragile porn star minds and they are incapable of discerning your location, since you surround yourself with such negativity.

I recommending spending the next seven days focusing on the holy number, "69," while drinking only holy water and specifically NOT masturbating.

If that doesn't work, turn off the lights go into your bathroom, stare into your mirror and say, "Bloody Mary" three times as slowly as you can with as much intention as you can.

If THAT doesn't work, then put a sign on your front door that says:, "Hand Jobs for $5."

Then sit on the other side of your unlocked door with a blindfold on so your customers don't get nervous.

Just leave a glass jar so they can leave a tip when they're done.

(Also be sure to wear a glove and a facemask).

 

[PeasantPlayer]

Sir, the Law of Attraction comes from the New Thought Movement and the definition of the Law of Attraction is specifically that if you believe it, you can have it. If you believe strong enough, with all of your heart and soul, the universe will manifest THAT which you believe (no matter if it's positive or negative).

That's the theory Sir.



Correct, but this is not the Law of Attraction.

I understand, but if I believe I can fly a plane and sit around all day and not practice. I will not fly a plane. I would have to go out an actually practice (masculine) taking action mixed with imagination

 

[QuadDeuces]

I know a few successful enterpeneurs in my life, self made men, multi-millionaires. (One of whom is my brother in law, who owns multiple companies with over a 250 employees.)
They have very positive mindset, an anything is possible mindset, they are always busy with the next project, with the future, their fire lights up when a new oportunity arises, they are interested in other people, generous, upbeat, when bad things happen, they pick themselves up and don't talk about it for too long.
When people do to them something wrong they don't wallow about that person, they just cut those people out their life to focus on other people and oportunities.
The bottom line of their vision of life is that they are the main character of their movie, that life is a beautiful place full of oportunities, they know that by giving chances to others they can become more prosperous themselves. They create win-win situations.

I also know a lot of broke losers.
They talk about other people, they talk about what a victim they are, they talk about all the things they hate, when something bad happens they keep going on and on about it. They have a negative mindset, they are always jealous.
The bottom line of their vision of life is that they are a victim of a cruel horrible world.
And others who have been doing better than them should be cut down to their level. They create lose-lose situations.

 

[byers90]

I didn't say he created it, seems you can't even comprehend something as simple as brought into the mainstream. The Bible has law of attraction type of thought as well and even there action is a requirement so you interpreted it your own way to skew the narrative to your bullsh*t statements of just believing things will happen if you will it strongly enough. Always love arguing in circles don't you

Yes, the name "New Thought" is actually a bit silly because there was nothing new about it all....as you said if you go back to the Bible you'll find verses like "As a man thinketh in his heart so is he", the teachings of Jesus on having faith the size of a Mustard seed being able to move mountains etc. If you go back even further you'll find it in the Hermetica - the notion that mind/thought is causative. So this ancient principle has long been out in the open - the New Thought movement was just simply the vehicle that commercialized it and made it accessible to the public. Since then there's been no shortage of material, with "The Secret" being the biggest book/movie that has stemmed from New Thought. I didn't read the book but did see the video - it was okay. I felt it left some things out, for example it's not enough to just think of 1 million dollars. You can do that until the cows come home, it won't do anything for you, especially when deep down you most likely don't believe you deserve that million dollars. And that's the thing...your desire must be congruent with your belief in having it....many people desire x but very few from what I have seen feel they can have or deserve it, whatever it may be. Of course I am talking about "lofty" things here...most people are taught to believe they can't, or aren't good enough, or any other such thing.

I'm of the camp that believes in it. I've used it towards very specific things and its proven itself to my satisfaction...when I've mentioned it to the other people, the skeptics have said "It would've happened anyway". It happens again, "Well it would've happened anyway". You could do it 1000x and it's always "It would've anyway, so do it once more". Now could it have just simply happened anyway? Sure, I wouldn't rule it out. They could have just simply been "coincidences"....however when I think of a couple very specific times in which it has happened....to me it doesn't feel like just a coincidence and I highly doubt it would've *just happened*.

At the end of the day people will either believe in it or not. If they don't, perfectly alright, but you owe it to yourself to test it. You have to test it and not just give it lip service. A lot of people say "oh yeah I believe in it, law of attraction, imagining creates reality" but if they are perfectly honest....i'd wager they think about how they can't, the different kinds of doubts they have...basically their mind is consumed with what they don't want the majority of the time. So do put it to the test and set the bar high - it's important to pick things that aren't *impossible* but appear difficult so when it does occur, you can't just dismiss it as chance. If you do that, and it happens, and then you try it again and it proves itself again, and this happens over and over....what then does it matter what the world thinks?

For those of you who are into this kind of stuff I suggest you check out Neville Goddard. He is very similar to Joseph Murphy which some of you have probably heard of- He is my favorite lecturer/writer on this subject & I do feel he is the best (And that is not just my opinion). You'll find a lot of actual live lectures on youtube. He was active back in the 1940's until the early 1970s.

 

[Cigar]

The law of attraction requires action. Not sure where y'all missed out on that.

Not really. You're getting your definition from someone other than the people who made this stupid psychobabble famous. That's the whole point that makes the "law of attraction" hilariously stupid, they promote that you can obtain these things with hardly any action because of "energy", "entropy", or "as a man think, so is he." You haven't seen these rubbish stories of these charlatans telling people that thoughts can shrink cancerous tumors, have you? You should watch the videos above.

Setting a goal and then "taking action" towards it is not the law of attraction - it's common sense. The law of attraction is a parody of this, it panders to the lazy and weak who'll buy that crap course for $997 to feel better about their lives for a week, or pay $4997 to go to a seminar to jump/clap like an idiot. and of course it lines the pockets of the scammers pushing it. The self-help industry is a racket and it comes in many forms. Money, spirituality, PUA/dating, or just some vague definitions of success or happiness. Tony Robbins, Deepak Chopra, Tai Lopez, Elliot Hulse, Jason Capital, Corey Wayne, Grant Cardone, Brendan Burchard, they're all frauds the lot of them. They should be locked up.

There are stories of people just imagining or meditating on $5,000 checks coming in the mail, and lo and behold there they started coming! Sure buddy.

 

[guru1000]

I notice a trend between the pikers and those who invest into the power of thinking. Important to note all opposed to thinking theories have a net worth less than one mil. Coincidence?

 

[Tenacity]

I notice a trend between the pikers and those who invest into the power of thinking. Important to note all opposed to thinking theories have a net worth less than one mil. Coincidence?

Besides @BeExcellent and @bigneil (who is banned and can't respond).........along with @guru1000 (based on what he claims), does any one of you 84,000 Sosuave members have a $1 million net worth right now? I'll wait......

In addition, the "Self-Help" Guru/Positive Thinking industry is reported to be at least $20 billion a year (if not more). But the vast majority of Americans (nearly 80%) are living paycheck-to-paycheck, they aren't saving for retirement, and their net worths are very low (if they are positive at all).

So with a $20 billion a year industry, that means A LOT of Americans subscribe to the Positive Thinking/Law Of Attraction product.....but hardly NO American is doing well financially and even health wise, 70% are overweight and 40% are obese.

So make that make sense.

 

[Macaframalama]

Besides @BeExcellent and @bigneil (who is banned and can't respond).........along with @guru1000 (based on what he claims), does any one of you 84,000 Sosuave members have a $1 million net worth right now? I'll wait......

In addition, the "Self-Help" Guru/Positive Thinking industry is reported to be at least $20 billion a year (if not more). But the vast majority of Americans (nearly 80%) are living paycheck-to-paycheck, they aren't saving for retirement, and their net worths are very low (if they are positive at all).

So with a $20 billion a year industry, that means A LOT of Americans subscribe to the Positive Thinking/Law Of Attraction product.....but hardly NO American is doing well financially and even health wise, 70% are overweight and 40% are obese.

So make that make sense.

So what?
Care to take a gander at what the fast food, soda, beer, etc industries generate in yearly in the U.S.?

 

[Tenacity]

So what?
Care to take a gander at what the fast food, soda, beer, etc industries generate in yearly in the U.S.?

A LOT lol.

But my point is this:

- If the theory of the Law of Attraction/Positive Thinking concept is that those who participate in the concept will ATTRACT financial and health prosperity to them.......

- .........and the related Self-Help industry is over $20 billion a year alone in the US

- ..........but 80% of Americans live paycheck-to-paycheck with 60% of them not being able to come up with $400 - $600 for an emergency, along with 70% being overweight and 40% being obese

- HOW THEN can the concepts be working if these are the results of Americans who are indulging in these concepts to the tune of $20 billion PLUS per year?

I'll await your response.

 

[Macaframalama]

A LOT lol.

But my point is this:

- If the theory of the Law of Attraction/Positive Thinking concept is that those who participate in the concept will ATTRACT financial and health prosperity to them.......

- .........and the related Self-Help industry is over $20 billion a year alone in the US

- ..........but 80% of Americans live paycheck-to-paycheck with 60% of them not being able to come up with $400 - $600 for an emergency, along with 70% being overweight and 40% being obese

- HOW THEN can the concepts be working if these are the results of Americans who are indulging in these concepts to the tune of $20 billion PLUS per year?

I'll await your response.

For the same exact reason ppl make New Year's resolutions, buy a gym membership, use it a few times and then fail to keep persistent. A huge portion of Americans are just lazy and lack determination.

 

[Tenacity]

For the same exact reason ppl make New Year's resolutions, buy a gym membership, use it a few times and then fail to keep persistent. A huge portion of Americans are just lazy and lack determination.

So you believe there's nothing wrong with the concepts, but that Americans just aren't performing the concepts correctly? I guess that could be the reason.....but Sir....to the tune of $20 billion a year though?

I mean $20 billion is a lot of tapes, books, seminars, Youtube clicks, etc., and that $20 billion does NOT include the amount of non-taxed donations that are taken in on Sunday morning in various churches across the country that promote the similar concept, which estimates show can be another $20 - $30 billion a year (or more) through donations.

I mean, with all of that money and consumption.....there HAS to be something a bit "off" here don't you think? It just looks to me, when you look at the current financial state of most Americans, that the only people being financially "blessed" off of these concepts......are the people SELLING the concepts lol.

 

[Macaframalama]

So you believe there's nothing wrong with the concepts, but that Americans just aren't performing the concepts correctly? I guess that could be the reason.....but Sir....to the tune of $20 billion a year though?

I mean $20 billion is a lot of tapes, books, seminars, Youtube clicks, etc., and that $20 billion does NOT include the amount of non-taxed donations that are taken in on Sunday morning in various churches across the country that promote the similar concept, which estimates show can be another $20 - $30 billion a year (or more) through donations.

I mean, with all of that money and consumption.....there HAS to be something a bit "off" here don't you think? It just looks to me, when you look at the current financial state of most Americans, that the only people being financially "blessed" off of these concepts......are the people SELLING the concepts lol.

I don't think it's that simple, no. Out of the names you mentioned, I'm aware of Hulse, but don't follow and Robbins, who I actually like, but haven't listened to alot, have read several Chopra books, which I thought were a little cheesy, but I got alot out of too and Hill's book, which I think is a great book. I'm sure there are alot of snake oil salesmen, just like the fitness industry, for example. Even then, with the most well thought out plan put to paper, one can fail to get results, from failing to execute properly. Personal achievement requires skin in the game. I would never suggest putting all your eggs in one basket, but it starts with thought. I take a holistic view on things and positive thinking is just one aspect. I refuse to defeat myself, before the actual work has even begun.

 

[guru1000]

In addition, the "Self-Help" Guru/Positive Thinking industry is reported to be at least $20 billion a year (if not more). But the vast majority of Americans (nearly 80%) are living paycheck-to-paycheck, they aren't saving for retirement, and their net worths are very low (if they are positive at all).

So with a $20 billion a year industry, that means A LOT of Americans subscribe to the Positive Thinking/Law Of Attraction product.....but hardly NO American is doing well financially and even health wise, 70% are overweight and 40% are obese.

So make that make sense.

Those with large thinking paradigms but no success does not belie the principle that gargantuan success is subject to large thinking paradigms.

Let’s see if your logic can make sense of that.

 

[Cigar]

I don't think it's that simple, no. Out of the names you mentioned, I'm aware of Hulse, but don't follow and Robbins, who I actually like, but haven't listened to alot, have read several Chopra books, which I thought were a little cheesy, but I got alot out of too and Hill's book, which I think is a great book. I'm sure there are alot of snake oil salesmen, just like the fitness industry, for example. Even then, with the most well thought out plan put to paper, one can fail to get results, from failing to execute properly. Personal achievement requires skin in the game. I would never suggest putting all your eggs in one basket, but it starts with thought. I take a holistic view on things and positive thinking is just one aspect. I refuse to defeat myself, before the actual work has even begun.

The fitness industry is different.

A guy claiming to be a fitness guru MUST be in shape. Our eyes are most intuitive and don't deceive us, so even the must gullible clown on planet earth won't take fitness advice from a 300 lb landwhale.

But a smooth talking snake oil salesman like Chopra can fool the masses. This dude can talk for 2 hours on a meditation CD and say ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. He is a pioneer in this New Age bs racket. But it takes different faces like I said. Jason Capital and Corey Wayne do PUA, Grant Cardone and Tony Robbins do money, Deepak does spirituality, and Tai Lopez and Elliott Hulse do a wider variety of just this vague definition of happiness.

All frauds.