Again.. what makes a long relationship a healthy one? I'm still waiting for that answer.
Why do most men start to "degrade" in LTR's?
- Thread starter Infern0
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Wait, so you're like a blind person asking what the color red is?
The longer you stay with the same woman, the more you bond with her. The more oxytocin (cuddle chemical) she forms. The more unforgettable you become to her. The more orgasms she has had with you. The more sex you have had with her. The more you can trust her. The more often she will text you. The more excited she will be to see you. Even if you have love at first sight, after 6 months you will love each other more (WAY more according to her the other night). The sex gets much better. Just holding her feels better than sex. Just being inside her feels better than an orgasm used to. Sex feels like one continuous orgasm for hours. You can go three straight times even in your 40's. You both learn to fulfill the image that turns the other on most. You can sense when she is in the room. You know exactly how to satisfy her so you kind of own her. She has a strong emotional connection with you so if she strays and has a one night stand, it will make her regret it and she will miss you. She will then avoid straying on you as long as you are true to her. You can talk about her having your children someday and what they would look like. She will tell you she never felt closer to any man in her life and that you can trust her to be loyal to you. You can relax with her alone in your place with all your stuff. You know she will be there if you ever need to rely on her. You won't find this with more than a few girls in your life. I've lived in 25 cities and I've only found a handful of girls like this.
I prefer that to random one night stands myself, but you might not.
Tenacity
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There's a lot of reasons people let themselves go. It could be getting too comfortable, but it could also be stress and depression.
Calum Tingham
Don Juan
I don't think a long relationship = a healthy relationship.
I've had very satisfying healthy relationships which lasted for one month.
And I've had an extremely painful unhealthy relationship which lasted for six months.
- I agree that if I did want to commit to a relationship, I'd seek advice from someone who has been married for over 10 years and not someone who sleeps around with many women.
I think it depends on your age, your past experience, your personal goals, your traveling goals, your work goals—what you want from the next period of your life. If you want different things than your partner, you'll have to end that relationship.
And it's healthy when you can understand that, and happily let each other travel their own journeys.
It's totally about your own individual preferences and your current methodology of life.
I've had very satisfying healthy relationships which lasted for one month.
And I've had an extremely painful unhealthy relationship which lasted for six months.
- I agree that if I did want to commit to a relationship, I'd seek advice from someone who has been married for over 10 years and not someone who sleeps around with many women.
I think it depends on your age, your past experience, your personal goals, your traveling goals, your work goals—what you want from the next period of your life. If you want different things than your partner, you'll have to end that relationship.
And it's healthy when you can understand that, and happily let each other travel their own journeys.
It's totally about your own individual preferences and your current methodology of life.
The concept of a LTR is not in itself the "problem" or necessarily the "cause" of the decline as many would like
to believe.
What I see here is that there are certain posters who have never had the experience of a LTR and will pontificate to all
and sundry that the LTR is the "woman's frame". Which is short sighted to say the least. Then there are those who have had
really bad experiences and instead of engaging in self-reflection and health analysis they will look at the aforementioned posters pontificating on their soapboxes and buy into their sermons concluding "yes, it's the fault of the LTR. It can't be me."
There's a quote from Sam Kean that I'm reminded of when certain posters rail on about frame:
"There are two questions a man must ask himself: the first is 'where am I going?' and the second one is 'who will go with me?' If you ever get
these questions in the reverse order, you are in trouble." Sam Kean, Fire in the Belly: On Being on a Man
In the case of @Infern0 's friend..........is it the LTR's fault that the man has gone into decline? Is it the LTR's fault that the man
has stopped going to the gym? Is it the LTR's fault that the man is chasing the woman all over town? No. It's his fvcking fault.
You fit women around your life, you don't fit your life around women.
Those that fit there life around women are left like broken shells stranded on a desert island when she decides to sail into
the sunset. For she will if you lose a sense of who you are. Broken with no sense of who you are any more. Damn LTR's really are the frame of the woman. Nah you just gave your ****e up man.
What constitutes if it will be "healthy or not.
Two codependent people entering into a relationship together will not make a healthy dynamic. It may last, it may even appear "successful" to
the outside world, but it will not be healthy. Two people who depend on each other for their emotional needs......eventually one will probably take advantage of the other. This is what happens with unhealthy or undefined boundaries.
One codependent person entering a relationship with and independent person will probably not make a healthy dynamic. The codependent person will probably suck the life out of the independent person and drag them down, or one of them will start taking advantage of the other.
Two independent people.........independent in the sense of they rely on their selves for their emotional needs, would be a healthy dynamic. However, they will need to have the ability to be interdependent if the dynamic is to truly work. A lot of people, possibly from bad experiences go from being codependent. i.e. former nice guys/doormats with no fvkcing boundaries (yes men, don't know how to say no), to the opposite extreme.........bad experiences make them throw the boundary wall so fvcking high that nobody stands a chance of getting in (fearful boundaries ). These are immature boundaries and those that state dogmatically "LTR's are the woman's frame" usually have immature fearful boundaries.....
Remember: The man is an island, the woman is the waves crashing up against you. You cannot fold, you cannot crumble. You cannot ever lose a sense of who you are. If an island crumbles because of the weight of the waves it crumbles and sinks to the bottom of the sea....
to believe.
What I see here is that there are certain posters who have never had the experience of a LTR and will pontificate to all
and sundry that the LTR is the "woman's frame". Which is short sighted to say the least. Then there are those who have had
really bad experiences and instead of engaging in self-reflection and health analysis they will look at the aforementioned posters pontificating on their soapboxes and buy into their sermons concluding "yes, it's the fault of the LTR. It can't be me."
There's a quote from Sam Kean that I'm reminded of when certain posters rail on about frame:
"There are two questions a man must ask himself: the first is 'where am I going?' and the second one is 'who will go with me?' If you ever get
these questions in the reverse order, you are in trouble." Sam Kean, Fire in the Belly: On Being on a Man
In the case of @Infern0 's friend..........is it the LTR's fault that the man has gone into decline? Is it the LTR's fault that the man
has stopped going to the gym? Is it the LTR's fault that the man is chasing the woman all over town? No. It's his fvcking fault.
You fit women around your life, you don't fit your life around women.
Those that fit there life around women are left like broken shells stranded on a desert island when she decides to sail into
the sunset. For she will if you lose a sense of who you are. Broken with no sense of who you are any more. Damn LTR's really are the frame of the woman. Nah you just gave your ****e up man.
What constitutes if it will be "healthy or not.
Two codependent people entering into a relationship together will not make a healthy dynamic. It may last, it may even appear "successful" to
the outside world, but it will not be healthy. Two people who depend on each other for their emotional needs......eventually one will probably take advantage of the other. This is what happens with unhealthy or undefined boundaries.
One codependent person entering a relationship with and independent person will probably not make a healthy dynamic. The codependent person will probably suck the life out of the independent person and drag them down, or one of them will start taking advantage of the other.
Two independent people.........independent in the sense of they rely on their selves for their emotional needs, would be a healthy dynamic. However, they will need to have the ability to be interdependent if the dynamic is to truly work. A lot of people, possibly from bad experiences go from being codependent. i.e. former nice guys/doormats with no fvkcing boundaries (yes men, don't know how to say no), to the opposite extreme.........bad experiences make them throw the boundary wall so fvcking high that nobody stands a chance of getting in (fearful boundaries ). These are immature boundaries and those that state dogmatically "LTR's are the woman's frame" usually have immature fearful boundaries.....
Remember: The man is an island, the woman is the waves crashing up against you. You cannot fold, you cannot crumble. You cannot ever lose a sense of who you are. If an island crumbles because of the weight of the waves it crumbles and sinks to the bottom of the sea....
Is any of this a fact?
If so, please show me proof (scientific research sources). I'm open to being wrong, but I'm not just going to take your word as fact.
devilkingx2
Master Don Juan
literally everything you enjoy releases pleasure chemicals in your brain tbh
That would mean once I stop enjoying a woman in a LTR the pleasure ends and the relationship is no longer healthy (for me). So even if that relationship lasted another two years, it would not necessarily be healthy. Yet, according to @bigneil that would make me more qualified to talk about healthy relationships.
@bigneil doesn't understand that a relationship is a decision and not an accomplishment. He doesn't understand because he is always very one dimensional in this thinking and acts like everything is black and white.
SteR
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The question is whether it's caused because of some issue with pair-bonding chemicals, or whether it's because the guy just gets comfortable/lazy and stops working out as much because he's got sex on tap..
usernamedox11
Master Don Juan
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You guys gotta stop looking at relationships as some competitive mind game. If you are dating a girl who puts you in that frame of mind, move on.
That's what I'm trying to say. This is what I've always done.
Being in a relationship is a decision two people make. It is not some kind of accomplishment that deserves bragging rights.
Guy's with low self-esteem like @bigneil think all their value comes from a woman staying in a relationship with them.
Not having a LTR last longer than a year for me was my decision as much as the women I dated. I knew what to do to make things last longer but I just refused.
Sure. Guys who are dating their HB9 21 year old dream girl (25 year their junior, who wants to run away together, who they saw last night, who they have a date with tonight) have low self esteem.
And guys who can't get a girl to stick around like @Urbanyst are always correct. Urbanyst chose dating futility over sexual bliss, reproduction and cosmic fulfillment. Give him credit.
And guys who can't get a girl to stick around like @Urbanyst are always correct. Urbanyst chose dating futility over sexual bliss, reproduction and cosmic fulfillment. Give him credit.
devilkingx2
Master Don Juan
I think his point is that most relationships don't end for no reason so in theory a series of short relationships means that all your relationships can only last for a few months before they fall apart, and the only common variable is you
sort of like how an employer would see someone who has a lot of jobs on their resume that they only worked for a few months as a red flag
of course, where bigneil's theory falls apart is assuming that all of your relationships were meant to be serious LTRs
ImTheDoubleGreatest!
Master Don Juan
Not always because the guy gets complacent. I know loads of situatiations where the chick gets complacent and gets fat too when the man continues to take care of himself. This characteristic isn't specific to just men, it can happen to women as well.
No, what I believe is that it is because women nag or complain in subtle ways. They take just a little bit at a time, just a small bit of you each time that changes you in the slightest way. But over time though, these changes add up until you are eventually a whole new person. Why do women do this? Because they don't want to compete for you against other women, so they sabotage a lot of your good qualities so that other women don't find you as attractive. This way, they keep you all for themselves. They don't realize that these very same qualities that they are destroying in you is what got them attracted to you in the first place though. All women naturally do this to men though. You guys call it a power struggle, but it's really just her establishing security with you because they don't want to lose you. But now that it's the 21st century, women don't need men to survive anymore like they used to so when they gain security with you, they are no longer attracted to you as a side effect of which causes them to leave you. Then the man is left broken and just a shell of his former self.
No, what I believe is that it is because women nag or complain in subtle ways. They take just a little bit at a time, just a small bit of you each time that changes you in the slightest way. But over time though, these changes add up until you are eventually a whole new person. Why do women do this? Because they don't want to compete for you against other women, so they sabotage a lot of your good qualities so that other women don't find you as attractive. This way, they keep you all for themselves. They don't realize that these very same qualities that they are destroying in you is what got them attracted to you in the first place though. All women naturally do this to men though. You guys call it a power struggle, but it's really just her establishing security with you because they don't want to lose you. But now that it's the 21st century, women don't need men to survive anymore like they used to so when they gain security with you, they are no longer attracted to you as a side effect of which causes them to leave you. Then the man is left broken and just a shell of his former self.
Sexual bliss has nothing to do with being in a LTR. For me the sex peaks 6 months in. After that I don't get as turned on because the girl becomes so familiar. Sure, I get more comfortable, but not as turned on.
Also, all the girls I dated monogamously were under 25, which is a very unstable age group. And last but not least, I dumped some of them. So had I not dumped them, it is very possible those relationships would still be in tact today.
What you keep doing is making it look like I had no choice or say in my relationships and all the women just rejected me after 1 year. That is not the case and I told you this already, But like I said before, you seem to have a mental block where new information confuses you.
But we are not women. Relationships are not supposed to be an accomplishment to us. Being able to have sex with very hot women is much more important because it ensures you can spread you seed with good genetics. I can do that having slept with over 60 women.
The fact that my LTR's don't last longer than a year is not something to judge me on. There a guys who have 10 year LTR's and only slept with one fat ugly woman there entire life. According to @bigneil that man would be higher value that me because his relationship with some fat whale lasted 10 years. That is how one dimensional his thinking is.
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devilkingx2
Master Don Juan
it might be reflective of your personality
in a theoretical universe where you need a decent personality to keep a woman.
how long do your friendships last? that's the real indicator
My friendships last very long.
