You guys realize that getting women as a man is the absolute hardest aspect of social interaction??

[Mike32ct]

I agree. I like to dress well too, but a guy can look too nice. There's something very masculine about throwing on a t-shirt and a pair of shorts, and if you're in good shape and can look good in it, all the better. Generally speaking, men aren't expected to fuss too much about their looks, that is a feminine quality.

Agree 100 percent.

But I love how women try to have it both ways on the men’s fashion topic. Allow me to explain....

1. “You’re dateless/incel because you don’t know how to dress. I’m gonna take you shopping.”

After you dress up...

2. “You’re dressed up too much. You need to dress down.”

You dress down and still don’t score...

3. <Crickets>

She will never come out and honestly say it was a looks issue.

(To be fair, the nurse chick likes my look. She just prefers a more rugged style. My example above was based on experiences with female friends, ie women NOT attracted to me.)

 

[MrJack]

At most bars and clubs, women go out in giant groups and approaching is crazy hard. Approaching during the day is crazy hard. Straight women are more selective and demanding in who they date than any other demographic of society.

I go to straight bars and the only women who show me obvious interest are 35 year old single moms. It's just not remotely comparable

You’re right, they are more selective and demanding in who they date. But dude...

“Approaching is crazy hard”
“Approaching during the day is crazy hard”

Nobody said it’d be easy! You’re stating obvious things.

The fact that you say doing nightlife group approaching and during the day approaching is super hard already tells us that you aren’t used to it or have any confidence doing it.

Yes it’s difficult, but it can become undifficult.

I’m definitely not saying I’m some master at it, far from it, but the point IMO is to do it enough times to where the approaching part doesn’t phase you anymore right? You could give two fvcks on the outcome because you’re an “alpha” who does wtf he wants and doesn’t let anyone get to him or affect his mood, no matter what his intentions initially were (which would be to pull a girl for the night or maybe number close during the day to set something up)

Believe me back in the day the thought of approaching women was scary af to me and I found out why...

I couldn’t handle the rejection that I knew would inevitably happen.

AKA- Zero confidence in myself and zero willingness to step outside my comfort zone to improve myself.

You haaaave to fail a lot before you see more consistent success.

How else are you going to change yourself for the better other than learning through experience. You can read a thousand books and read a thousand forum posts but they will only change you to a minimal extent. They will help facilitate the process and provide you knowledge but you have to take action.

Get out there with the mindset that it’s a hilarious game you’re playing with yourself and go get rejected 100 times.

I bet you won’t give a fvck eventually.

 

[MrJack]

the first guy is not good looking. Really bland looking facial features. he's about a 6/10

and correct I look horrendous in pics. I'm about a 5 to 6 in pics and a solid 7 to 7.5/10 in real life for real life standards.

Keep in mind I don't usually go for white girls. I go for women who look like me (Spanish, dark features)

Wait somethings not adding up.

If we consider looks as the only factor here:

You say you’re in the top 10-15% of males in the Chicago area, yet you openly consider yourself only a 7 out of 10. When someone is only 1 “point” lower than that, aka a 6, they are considered very average but just enough to maybe be fvckable. You are pretty much saying you are slightly above that so you do the math.

I used to be 180 pounds ripped and considered myself an 8.5

Currently I’m 155 pounds. Thankfully I don’t retain much fat at all so I’m still lean. But I don’t look nearly as powerful of a guy that I used to be and still consider myself an 8 because those are the types of women that still show initial interest in me regardless, aka 8’s and even some 9’s here and there I dare say.

You may just have to realize and accept the fact that you’re only going to be pulling 7.5’s or lower unless you have amazing game.

Honestly not trying to be a **** but maybe that’s why only 35 year olds are looking at you.

Btw I live in Chicago as well.

 

[zekko]

But I love how women try to have it both ways on the men’s fashion topic. Allow me to explain....

Well, you should have it both ways. You should be able to dress up well when the situation calls for it and be able to shamelessly dress down for comfort for other occasions. You ever hear a girl talk about how well a guy dresses and then wondering if he's gay? Because to some extent girls don't expect guys to dress that well. But again, it depends on the situation.

You always hear the advice "Dress one level above everyone else", but I'm not sure that's good advice. Dressing appropriately to the occasion is important, and shows social calibration IMO. Maybe as long as you don't dress above one level higher than everyone else, it's okay, because then you'll just be the best dressed there, but not conspicuously overdressed.

Whenever I see someone wearing a blazer or a casual jacket, it always reminds me of pickup artists, or PUA gurus. It seems to be their dress code, it strikes me as funny for some reason. And if they don't go for the blazer, it's the black leather jacket. Larry David wears a casual dress jacket on Curb Your Enthusiasm. It suits him since he's very wealthy, but I always wonder if he's going for a pickup vibe. He goes through a lot of women on that show.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

The younger babes are going to go for guys dressing around their age .

Your dress and style would hit mature 32-45 year olds .

 

[bigdave17]

The younger babes are going to go for guys dressing around their age .

Your dress and style would hit mature 32-45 year olds .

I like women my age who dress very upscale/classy the same way I do - I see it. There were a couple of beautiful 26 year olds last Friday who were wearing very nice dresses

 

[bigdave17]

Its difficult for you because youre insane.

I don't find attracting them difficult at all, outside of online dating and night clubs. I've had three LTRs with 8/10s. I was never wealthy during those times and all three were through social circle. I am probably a 7 in looks and shorter than you. I was never wealthy for any of those GFs. If you can not even attract them then you dont have high value, period, regardless what your sick mind and ego tell you. If you had high value you would get lucky once in a while. You are a boring guy with no game at all, zero, hence no women making it easy for you in social circles.

I don't meet women in social circle dude, that's the part you don't understand

I'm super picky anyways so the odds of meeting anybody I like randomly through a friend are 0% anyways. I have to cold approach - which you yourself admit you suck at

 

[bigdave17]

Do they find it easy to find "quality" mates though?

If they're good looking, in shape and successful/good head on their shoulders, absolutely. They have more dating options than you can imagine

I'm a good looking, in great shape, very successful male with a great lifestyle, very intelligent, great social circle and I still can't get a date with anybody anywhere near my league. The gay version of me is treated the same way as 9/10 HBBs are treated in the straight community

Why do you want to date a Spanish or Middle Eastern chick so badly? You're so preoccupied with how she's going to look 10 years down the line. Has it ever occurred to you that you might not even live past tomorrow? That's why we should appreciate each day we are given to the fullest.

By the way, I find women of all races attractive. An attractive girl is an attractive girl. I would not rule out dating anyone on the basis of race or ethnicity.


I agree. I like to dress well too, but a guy can look too nice. There's something very masculine about throwing on a t-shirt and a pair of shorts, and if you're in good shape and can look good in it, all the better. Generally speaking, men aren't expected to fuss too much about their looks, that is a feminine quality.

Spanish and Middle eastern women are much more beautiful up front anyways. Thick Black wavy hair >>>>>>>>>>>> thin light colored hair. Thick Olive skin >>>>>>>>>>>>> pasty white skin. More ass and tits on Spanish broads >>>>>>>>> Skinny white women

 

[bigdave17]

Why don't you have a social circle with women in it?

Your standards mean nothing fyi, a figment of your imagination.

BRB let me construct a social circle with 23-28 year old, single, childless, cute, nice body, quality women in it


yea that's super easy

 

[bigdave17]

How come I hav one? Join a sports league or jogging club or something. Have a life outside of clubs.

dude I make friends constantly, all the time. The problem is, the vast majority of the time, even if there is a cute quality girl in the group, the friend is going to be trying super hard to get with her

I'm not a douchebag or an *******. If I'm friends with someone and they're trying to get with a girl, I will do everything in my power to help them out. I don't compete or ****block with friends under any circumstance. I'm the ultimate team player

If I have a friend who gets laid 5000 times a year and he's trying hard to get with a girl and I'm a virgin, I don't say anything except do everything in my power to help him get laid

Friends and family loyalty to me is absolutely everything

 

[sazc]

How come I hav one? Join a sports league or jogging club or something. Have a life outside of clubs.

I think that's part of his issue, he's looking for 'high class'0 at a night club. You want high class and upscale and continue to admit you are not finding it where you are looking, and I can see why. Time to change your venue.

Wine bar
Wedding
Church
Live music jazz, etc venue (NOT a nightclub, those are meat markets)
Upscale hotel bar
Dog park
Charity balls/events
Join a club/donate your time to causes that specificically serve the ethnic culture you want to date
Art gallery openings, museum parties, esp if they cater museum or art to the ethnicity you want to date
Join a high end gym,c where the clientele is upscale
Golf/join a country club

Understand rubber band?

 

[bigdave17]

The women will actually chase you in the group if you have value...

even if that were to happen and my friend is trying to get with her, I wouldn't do it

Bros before hoes. Friends and family loyalty is everything

 

[RangerMIke]

@JonnyX Women do notice how you are dressed, and it does make a difference if you are dressed inappropriately depending on where you are or if you are dressed in clothes that you are not comfortable in. If you hate wearing a suit... and you show up at a party in a suit, there is a strong possibility that she will pick up on that. Women can smell out inauthenticity like a rotten egg.

She will notice if your clothes do not fit, or if your shoes are worn out. They notice little things.... she will notice if you are wearing an expensive watch or jewelry... she will know if you are wearing expensive shoes and if those shoes are clean and shined. She will notice if your tie does not match your suit.. she will notice if you have a button missing... that stain you thought was gone, if your shirt is laundered and pressed or if you just tossed it in the dryer to get out the wrinkles. She will notice all these things in the same time the average man has only notice her t!ts.

But I do agree in most cases it really doesn't matter WHAT you wear as long as you have a style that works for you, and what you are wearing fits and looks decent. A guy at a party in jeans and a polo shirt that fits his body, with no socks and deck shoes that are not worn out, will do better than a guy in a slightly wrinkled suit that doesn't fit him well... all other things being equal.

 

[sazc]

You either need to change your venue or dress down. You go to a night club dressed to the nine's and you look smarmy and out of place, no wonder the nicer ladies and ignoring you.

Dress like a bad boy. Women love a bad boy. You can still show off your physique but tone down the clothes.

How about a social experiment where you do this for a few weekends and see if you pull females that you feel are more in your league?

 

[bigdave17]

I think that's part of his issue, he's looking for 'high class'0 at a night club. You want high class and upscale and continue to admit you are not finding it where you are looking, and I can see why. Time to change your venue.

Wine bar
Wedding
Church
Live music jazz, etc venue (NOT a nightclub, those are meat markets)
Upscale hotel bar
Dog park
Charity balls/events
Join a club/donate your time to causes that specificically serve the ethnic culture you want to date
Art gallery openings, museum parties, esp if they cater museum or art to the ethnicity you want to date

Understand rubber band?

no I see women I like at lots of places

I saw this beautiful Spanish girl at my gym yesterday who was exactly my type. I talked to her for just a bit but it got awkward very quickly so I walked away immediately before she started to feel very uncomfortable. I hate making anybody feel uncomfortable

I saw these 2 super cute women wearing very nice dresses at a bar last week

I see women who are my type all the time but getting them interested is crazy difficult.

 

[bigdave17]

You either need to change your venue or dress down. You go to a night club dressed to the nine's and you look smarmy and out of place, no wonder the nicer ladies and ignoring you.

Dress like a bad boy. Women love a bad boy. You can still show off your physique but tone down the clothes.

How about a social experiment where you do this for a few weekends and see if you pull females that you feel are more in your league?

I don't have any garbage clothes, outside of maybe gym clothes. Everything I have is super upscale

and again, I want a woman my age who dresses like I do...the type to wear beautiful dresses and super nice high heels. That is so hot to me

 

[bigdave17]

@JonnyX Women do notice how you are dressed, and it does make a difference if you are dressed inappropriately depending on where you are or if you are dressed in clothes that you are not comfortable in. If you hate wearing a suit... and you show up at a party in a suit, there is a strong possibility that she will pick up on that. Women can smell out inauthenticity like a rotten egg.

She will notice if your clothes do not fit, or if your shoes are worn out. They notice little things.... she will notice if you are wearing an expensive watch or jewelry... she will know if you are wearing expensive shoes and if those shoes are clean and shined. She will notice if your tie does not match your suit.. she will notice if you have a button missing... that stain you thought was gone, if your shirt is laundered and pressed or if you just tossed it in the dryer to get out the wrinkles. She will notice all these things in the same time the average man has only notice her t!ts.

But I do agree in most cases it really doesn't matter WHAT you wear as long as you have a style that works for you, and what you are wearing fits and looks decent. A guy at a party in jeans and a polo shirt that fits his body, with no socks and deck shoes that are not worn out, will do better than a guy in a slightly wrinkled suit that doesn't fit him well... all other things being equal.

when I go out to bars or clubs, everything is completely perfect

hair
complexion/skin
shirt
jeans
shoes
belt
watch

everything matches perfectly
everything is super fitted and super upscale/high end to show off my great physique


the gay male version of me or the female version of me has 23850325802358258020583205023508235 suitors everywhere they go.

 

[bigdave17]

What if he's not? That will happen

has never happened to me

anytime I've ever met a cute girl in a social circle, all my friends in the group were trying desperately to get with her. Social circle pickups are ridiculously hard also

 

[mrgoodstuff]

has never happened to me

anytime I've ever met a cute girl in a social circle, all my friends in the group were trying desperately to get with her. Social circle pickups are ridiculously hard also

Monkeyshines

 

[sazc]

no I see women I like at lots of places

I saw this beautiful Spanish girl at my gym yesterday who was exactly my type. I talked to her for just a bit but it got awkward very quickly so I walked away immediately before she started to feel very uncomfortable. I hate making anybody feel uncomfortable

I saw these 2 super cute women wearing very nice dresses at a bar last week

I see women who are my type all the time but getting them interested is crazy difficult.

God you are so self-centered! I was not talking about whether or not you see women that you would like, I was talking about placing yourself in a venue where high quality women that you might be attracted to will also like your type!