Who is best Day Game pickup artist?

[Mahmudul Hasan]

some say it's roosh v, some say it's nick krauser and others choose either tom torero or paul janka. who is the best according to you?

 

[SW15]

It is likely Krauser or Janka in terms of their own performance.

Roosh's "Day Bang" (now out of print) was a solid manual for implementing daygame into your own life. I read "Day Bang" soon after it was published in 2011 and transitioned more of my practice from nightlife venues to non-bar. I was in my late 20s then and seeking a way out of the bars. I had been aware of daygame as early as my early 20s but never knew how to put daygame into practice in real life until "Day Bang".

Krauser has a book called "Daygame Mastery". With "Day Bang" out of print, "Daygame Mastery" is likely one of the better daygame manuals out there.

 

[Juanto]

I learned so much from Tom Torero, so personally I would have to say him

 

[Mahmudul Hasan]

It is likely Krauser or Janka in terms of their own performance.

Roosh's "Day Bang" (now out of print) was a solid manual for implementing daygame into your own life. I read "Day Bang" soon after it was published in 2011 and transitioned more of my practice from nightlife venues to non-bar. I was in my late 20s then and seeking a way out of the bars. I had been aware of daygame as early as my early 20s but never knew how to put daygame into practice in real life until "Day Bang".

Krauser has a book called "Daygame Mastery". With "Day Bang" out of print, "Daygame Mastery" is likely one of the better daygame manuals out there.

I have as well learned more from roosh than any other pickup artist out there. His elder opener works well especially compared to asking random girls about opinions. I don't know how it is in usa but I am sure I will be seen as crazy if I ask a random on street whether kissing is considered cheating or not

 

[YourGreatestFear]

Tom Torero and Krauser teach guys some weak outer game. The type of game that sounds good on paper, like DHV, but in practice is the opposite of what you should be doing. You can see how ineffective their approach is by their own data - their daygame stats are rather low, 2-3 lays per 100 approaches, and people who follow their methods have a similar stat. While there are many guys who don't consider themselves as "daygam pros" and still get 10+ women per 100 approaches. A guy from sosuave did an experiment where he appraoched girls and offered them to come to his place from the get-go.

Approach Data - You're Gonna Love This | SoSuave Discussion Forum

He slept with 14 girls out of 100, but beware that he was experienced, decent looking and had some solid inner game. There was also a research where men offered women to come to their place to have some wine as the opening line, and I think around 20-30% of the women said yes, though those were attractive guys and women weren't "filtered" by their looks. What I want to say is that their game is less effective than just offering girls to come to your place, at least if you're decently good-looking, so maybe their advice is somehow wrong?

As far as daygame / out game goes, I can only recommend Todd Valentine and Swinggcat.

 

[FlexpertHamilton]

This guy always seemed pretty good to me, he almost always does daygame only.

None of them, all scam artists.

Really? That seems like a common reductionist tactic to write off everything instead of examining it on a case by case basis.

Many of them are probably scam artists but I've seen some work in person (Owen Cook for instance), their skill is real.

 

[SW15]

Tom Torero and Krauser teach guys some weak outer game. The type of game that sounds good on paper, like DHV, but in practice is the opposite of what you should be doing. You can see how ineffective their approach is by their own data - their daygame stats are rather low, 2-3 lays per 100 approaches, and people who follow their methods have a similar stat.

2-3 lays per 100 approaches isn't a terrible statistic. There are men who have even worse results than that.

 

[BaronOfHair]

Be wary of anyone who calls themself a Pick Up Artist, or who encourages you to center your entire life around chasing tail

 

[oliver109]

Tom Torero and Krauser teach guys some weak outer game. The type of game that sounds good on paper, like DHV, but in practice is the opposite of what you should be doing. You can see how ineffective their approach is by their own data - their daygame stats are rather low, 2-3 lays per 100 approaches, and people who follow their methods have a similar stat. While there are many guys who don't consider themselves as "daygam pros" and still get 10+ women per 100 approaches. A guy from sosuave did an experiment where he appraoched girls and offered them to come to his place from the get-go.

Approach Data - You're Gonna Love This | SoSuave Discussion Forum

He slept with 14 girls out of 100, but beware that he was experienced, decent looking and had some solid inner game. There was also a research where men offered women to come to their place to have some wine as the opening line, and I think around 20-30% of the women said yes, though those were attractive guys and women weren't "filtered" by their looks. What I want to say is that their game is less effective than just offering girls to come to your place, at least if you're decently good-looking, so maybe their advice is somehow wrong?

As far as daygame / out game goes, I can only recommend Todd Valentine and Swinggcat.

I think their stats are impressive considering they were both picking up girls half their age, I do think that a lot of krausers material is probably out of date now that countries in Eastern Europe like Slovakia are now as wealthy as Spain and Portugal.

 

[pipeman84]

This guy always seemed pretty good to me, he almost always does daygame only.

Did we watch the same video? Because what I just watched was 5min of a guy making an ass out of himself.

His elder opener works well especially compared to asking random girls about opinions.

What do you mean 'works well'? How many non-drunk, non-retarded girls went out on a date with you after you cold approached them with an 'elder opener' ? What girl in her right mind is going to be fooled be a 20-30yrs old guy with horny/weird vibes acting like he's an innocent 80yrs old pensioner looking to make small talk.
Roosh is a grotesque, mentally deranged individual who hates women and actually wrote in his book Day Bang that he views them as 'lubricated holes that exist mostly for man's sexual pleasure'.

 

[SW15]

Did we watch the same video? Because what I just watched was 5min of a guy making an ass out of himself.

I don't think he was making an ass out of himself. It looks like he got some phone numbers and possibly arranged first dates. He did kiss that one woman near the 5 min point of that video. We would need to know more information about it.

What do you mean 'works well'? How many non-drunk, non-retarded girls went out on a date with you after you cold approached them with an 'elder opener' ? What girl in her right mind is going to be fooled be a 20-30yrs old guy with horny/weird vibes acting like he's an innocent 80yrs old pensioner looking to make small talk.

Most of those indirect, 'elderly' type openers lead to short conversations that go nowhere. These are perfectly forgettable conversations for the woman. They probably don't lead to conversations that last even long enough to go through the GALNUC framework to set up an ask out for a first date.

I think most daygamers have a lot of short, meaningless conversations that go nowhere.

 

[characternote]

some say it's roosh v, some say it's ... paul janka. who is the best according to you?

Roosh is absolutely woeful. Hard to come across as more awkward and socially inept as him, and he doesnt have the looks to get him out of trouble.
Paul Janka wins of course, but then can you really call it 'game'?
I mean, he walks up too a girl, asks her name, make a comment on the college she's at or something, tells her he thinks she's cute, and then asks for her number. And some say yes. He was a good looking, tall guy.
But then in terms of 'game', he's doing exactly what any other who understands basci social exchange would do! lol.
It's like needing to be taught to say 'bye' at teh end of a conversation and calling it 'game' lmao

2-3 lays per 100 approaches isn't a terrible statistic. There are men who have even worse results than that.

Agree. But it all depends on your age/looks, and more importantly, the age and looks of the girls you are going for!
If someone says 'It takes me about 400 approaches as a 44 year old average looking guy who goes for 18 year old hotties' I know people would say 'your game must suck dude!! Read mysterymethod or learn NLP to make anyone do waht you want or something!'.
But them people are NOT banging them sort of girls, or even going for them.
And if they are, AND they really are getting a large percentage of them, then I promise they are either very good looking, or they are running a form of sugar daddy game.

So many people imply that even if you are maybe an old, out of shape bald dude you should still be banging at least 1 out of 30 approaches or something, but then why don't they just go too a modelling convention in London full of 400 crazy-hot 18 year olds? They're surely guaranteed to get laid!! (when in reality they'd have more chance of winning the lottery than banging some gorgeous teenager. that applies for some members here who give the impression that they could bang them girls, when i've seen their pics and know that they'd literally have ZERO chance lol. They'd be invisible to them girls!!!

Many of them are probably scam artists but I've seen some work in person (Owen Cook for instance), their skill is real.

I'd agree Owen has some 'game', but then, lets not forget his 'hit rate' is very low. I've been through all of the rsd archives and seen all of their premium products over the years, and all i'll say is taht NONE of them are getting results that are surprising or especially impressive!
That probably goes for everyone i've ever met, really!
Everyone gets the results i'd expect, more or less!
I only need to glance at someone and i'll have a good idea of what sort of results he can expect. Owen banged some hot girls. But he got rejected a tonne. If you approach enough girls, you too will get laid with some very hot ones, most likely (basically due to variance in what girls think a 'hot' guy is. I think i'm proof of that lol.

This guy always seemed pretty good to me, he almost always does daygame only.

Agreed. One of the best i've probably seen. But just like Owen, he has a very low hit rate, despite scoring way out of his league from time to time.
AGAIN, that's why this is a numbers game lol. It's not really about 'skill'. Vadim has more skill than coach kyle or maxrsd, but they both get much better hit rates! Guess why?? lol
Nobody is using jedi mind control verbals to convert a girl from 'hell no!' to 'take me now!'. Fantasy.
The actual bar in terms of 'game' is really very low if you are her 'type'.
And the bar is completely out of reach, despite your 'game' if you are NOT her type (at all)

ps - krauser = painful to watch!! He likely had a successful patch for a while when he was exploiting his passport priveledge in broke countries, but as mentioned earlier, that game doesn't really fly so well anymore.
Roosh = painfully autistic. I wouldn't be amazed if i'd found out he was in fact a virgin.
Tom torrerro. A bit better, I guess. And as per the pattern that should be obvious by now, his hit rate is **** (no way is he banging 1 in 30 if he's going for much hotter, much younger girls!), but he HAS banged some hot girls. Say it with me... 'because he appraoches so so much! Put's the odds in his favour of finding the girls who actually like him. Not 'MAKING' them like him, which is every PUA's dream'

 

[YourGreatestFear]

2-3 lays per 100 approaches isn't a terrible statistic. There are men who have even worse results than that.

It's terrible for someone who teaches daygame, writes books, and considers himself as one of the best daygame PUA.

 

[characternote]

It's terrible for someone who teaches daygame, writes books, and considers himself as one of the best daygame PUA.

considering he does all those things (teaches, writes books, sells coaching and courses etc) I'd bet my house that he was inflating his numbers, and that his results are way worse than that.
But that's not even a dig at him.
He's not the best looking guy out there! (putting it nicely)
His skill level is irrelevant if he opens a girl who isn't attracted to him! (and that would be the case a lot of the time when opening hot 19 year old students as was his typical target)
All the negs amd DHV stories and pushpull lines (and everything else) is just white noise to her in that situation! Unwanted attention
He was searching for unicorns (young hot girls who thought he was hot) and in his defence, through sheer numbers game,. he found a fair few!

And I can relate to him in that respect, lol!

If I shared pics of all the girls i've banged, I know people would say 'you must be a chad!'. Lots of the girls are way hotter than me and aged like 17-22 and i'm very close to 40.
But i'm no chad at all.
But like Tom, I used to approach a LOT of girls and so I, too, was also able to find the very hot young girls who inexplicably thought I was very hot!
But I would never lie and I can tell you my rejection rate was HUGE!! And there's not a thing in terms of verbals/game that could have changed that. I've studied and tested it ALL, and anyone on here who knows me a little (and there's a few) can vouch for that.

 

[YourGreatestFear]

He's not the best looking guy out there! (putting it nicely)
His skill level is irrelevant if he opens a girl who isn't attracted to him! (and that would be the case a lot of the time when opening hot 19 year old students as was his typical target)
All the negs amd DHV stories and pushpull lines (and everything else) is just white noise to her in that situation! Unwanted attention
He was searching for unicorns (young hot girls who thought he was hot) and in his defence, through sheer numbers game,. he found a fair few!

And I can relate to him in that respect, lol!

Nah, man. You're absolutely wrong. Because you don't quite understand the social dynamics of men and women. Because you learned game from wrong people. DHV stories are such a bs. You see a woman as someone high up there and are trying to prove to her that you're at the same level. Instead of considering her to be far below your level and communicating it, then raising her to your level after she earned it. These are fundamentally different approaches at meeting women.

But I would never lie and I can tell you my rejection rate was HUGE!! And there's not a thing in terms of verbals/game that could have changed that. I've studied and tested it ALL, and anyone on here who knows me a little (and there's a few) can vouch for that.

Here's what I bet you never tested. Approach a girl and totally roast her for three minutes. Ignore whatever she throws back at you, just make fun of her, disqualify her, neg her, over and over again until she begs you to stop. Do it while having fun, using her existence for your amusement and having zero emotional response to her reactions even when she tells you to **** off and that her bf will kick your ass. After doing that, just give her some basic approval and see how she becomes a puppy in your hands. This works 100% of time with every woman, but you won't ever learn how to do it right without a good enough inner game. When you establish yourself as someone who can validate or invalidate her value (and she can't affect yours) she will chase it and will be attracted to you, to women sex is all about validation.

 

[characternote]

surely everyone has tested 'negs' and trying to roast girls.
She just looks at you like 'go away' and will move away (although of course she will laugh and give you $hit back in a friendly/flirty way OF you are her type and she thinks you're hot)

But it's generally this from a thread where a guy was asking why when he approaches girls and roasts them, they just look at him like he's on fire and walk away lol:


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it's a bit like people who promote the exact opposite as a holy grail (being super complimentary and telling her how hot she is etc. There's some posters here who advise that) It ALL works, and it all fails. It depends on the girls attraction to you

 

[crowolf]

It gotta be Tom Torerro.

Partly thanks to him I recently found my girl (through cold approach).

 

[CAPSLOCK BANDIT]

There would be a very easy way to find out this answer, however branding is at play here so it will never happen.

 

[SW15]

2-3 lays per 100 approaches isn't a terrible statistic. There are men who have even worse results than that.

It's terrible for someone who teaches daygame, writes books, and considers himself as one of the best daygame PUA.

There is a level of inefficiency that is a part of approaching strangers in a non-bar venue (daygame).

In non-bar venues, there are plenty of women in existing relationships who aren't open to new penis. Nightlife venues are in theory more of a targeted audience because women in relationships would have no need to go to bars.

As someone who has practiced non-bar approaching, I can tell you about its inefficiencies. There are a lot of conversations that go nowhere. I don't even bother to offer a 1st date because either the conversation is clearly going nowhere and/or the conversation fizzles out in less than 60 seconds, before it is even conceivable to offer a date.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

As someone who has practiced non-bar approaching, I can tell you about its inefficiencies. There are a lot of conversations that go nowhere. I don't even bother to offer a 1st date because either the conversation is clearly going nowhere and/or the conversation fizzles out in less than 60 seconds, before it is even conceivable to offer a date.

Daygame is difficult if you're not a good conversationalist. Doesn't make it inefficient, just not suitable for those who don't have the ability to strike up a conversation.