We've got to stop suggesting only protein on here.

[Omen]

I was reading through some of the recent posts on here, and while great advice on some things, we are NOT thorough enough on here when we are talking to people about their diet.

For instance a great start on the skinny topic by Punisha, but you see what ALL of the posts lack?

Carbs???
Fat???

If we are suggesting things to people that want to grow, we have GOT to list the other two as well. When we only tell people to eat protein and that is it, we are not doing them any good.

It becomes worthless without the other two to complete it, and you WILL NOT grow on protein alone. Let's not get in that mindset here because its not the best overall advice. If you suggest the other two along with protein, and give amounts, THEN it is fine.

Missing those two key nutrients are HUGE when it comes to well.... getting HUGE

So from now on, do me a favor by also listing the other two nutrients so I dont have to chime in and add them to the list when they should be added just like protein is. We all know overlooking these two is a huge mistake.

 

[Mad Manic]

Awesome post and I totally agree. But I've given up on the keyboard warriors with 13" arms thinking they know it all. Some of them consume too many calories with way too much protein for the muscle mass they have. They also spend too much money on pills and powders when it's unneeded. Carbs and Fats are very important and chugging down lots of protein is pointless, there is only so much needed.

MM

 

[shaunuk]

Well I usually suggest 'calories' in general as well as protein because chances are lots of new guys (or girls) aren't really gonna count all their carbs+fats, but instead (decently) estimate their overall calories. I did anyway..

Omen and MM are right tho, protein+carbs+fat = muscle over time Giving exact ratios is hard cause we're all different. I'd be getting fat on the amount of carbs some guys can get away with. I talk to a guy in my gym who is 5'6, 235lbs who does well with carbs. He only eats about 200g protein per day or maybe a bit more.

A decent thing to do is work out your protein, 1.5g-2g/lb, then work out your carbs and fat from there. Like for me

1.5*170 = 255g protein. Let's say I can gain on like...3200 cals a day.

255g protein = 255*4 cals = 1020cals

remaining cals = 3200 - 1020 ~= 2200cals

maybe make it 60% carbs and 40% fats?

carbs: 0.6*2200 ~= 1300cals
grams of this = 1300/4 = 320g

fats: 0.4*2200 = 880cals
grams of this: 880/9 = 100g

so it's P/C/F = 255/320/100

but then again, I'd get fat off this, so I keep my fats higher and carbs lower..

So it's hard to give decent numbers, just try what seems alright and see what happens, adjust when you need to.

Enough maths, lol. I definitely don't think I know it all, there's many guys who I learn new stuff from everyday, I simply don't know the half of it. But I've gained weight and strength since I was a 5'8 110lb weakling with zero strength so I just share what I've learnt from others along the way

 

[I-tallionStallion]

i completely understand Omen. But i disagree with eating a lot of carbs. But Quag pointed him in the right direction with his link to EFFORT's simple diet plan. Which provides all the information needed to get started.

Now MM...since when does arm size equate knowledge? Good advice is good advice, doesn't matter who it comes from.

 

[Omen]

True, we can have all sorts of ratios and what not, but i've always done about 30% fat, and I think for anyone bulking, under 30% is not enough. Personally I do about 55% carbs or so. My protein is in the 1g/lb or a hair over. Sometimes 1.2-1.5g.

The point I am trying to make is that we must not ignore the other two. I have no problem with people talking about protein as long as they cover Fats and Carbs as well.

Any skinny guy will appreciate getting a vast amount of both, along with protein as well.

And no, someones arm size doesn't determine their knowledge. If it did, we'd be screwed. I can walk into the gym and pick out a few high school kids with bigger arms who think carb loading is eating a bowl of pasta before they workout. :crackup:

 

[Mad Manic]

Now MM...since when does arm size equate knowledge? Good advice is good advice, doesn't matter who it comes from.

Because with gaining size and strength to higher and higher levels and developing your physique you learn lots of things along the way and what's required in diets, training etc. to get big and to have a proportioned physique. Not just repeating rubbish off the net like overtraining, you must squat and dead, don't train longer than an hour etc. like some 'gurus' do. That's why I listen more carefully to what big guys tell me than skinny guys, because I know they are wise words. Especially if they are big and natural, even better.

MM

 

[EFFORT]

I think diet in general is over looked here. People probably acknowledge it in there mind but don't really get it, they don't really know how to eat a lot of food. Training is talked/ argued about all the time here, but its worthless without the diet on point. We all see the guys in the gym 125-200lbs training there asses off and never looking different. I know there some terrible lifting routines out there but i'm positive if they added 3800-6000cals a day to whatever bs lifting routine there doing, in a years time we'd see a bigger person with a lot more muscle.

 

[Mad Manic]

Agreed Effort, but from looking at recent posts people are wasting their money on powders and pills and worrying about tablets of flaxseed oil and whatnot. When they should be talking about steak, tuna, chicken, eggs, beef, rice, pasta, potatoes, fruit, veg, nuts, olives, peanut butter etc. I've looked at a lot of the diets on here and they are not good bulking diets.

MM

 

[Omen]

I think diet in general is over looked here. People probably acknowledge it in there mind but don't really get it, they don't really know how to eat a lot of food. Training is talked/ argued about all the time here, but its worthless without the diet on point. We all see the guys in the gym 125-200lbs training there asses off and never looking different. I know there some terrible lifting routines out there but i'm positive if they added 3800-6000cals a day to whatever bs lifting routine there doing, in a years time we'd see a bigger person with a lot more muscle.

I'll agree, and the reason I can say this is totally TRUE is that i've seen, it and I have experienced it over the years. I myself have had a hard time getting SOLID calories and I mean LOTS in every single day. People always say... You are always eating. I have too. My metabolism is through the roof, and what 2500cal may do for some wont cut it for me.

I agree, that if around 3500-5000cal of the right things were done, people would be gaining size. It is VERY hard, and this is why we stress so much, that if you are just going to go about all of this in a so so way, it will take much longer.

I know how it feels to cram that much food down, and it isn't easy. Diet to me is MUCH more important than training. Diet is what makes you fail, or at least not get to your FULL potential.

 

[I-tallionStallion]

haha MM your so fvcking ignorant...you don't really know what works till you try it.

 

[EFFORT]

Agreed Effort, but from looking at recent posts people are wasting their money on powders and pills and worrying about tablets of flaxseed oil and whatnot. When they should be talking about steak, tuna, chicken, eggs, beef, rice, pasta, potatoes, fruit, veg, nuts, olives, peanut butter etc. I've looked at a lot of the diets on here and they are not good bulking diets.

MM

Yeah i agree with that

 

[EFFORT]

I'll agree, and the reason I can say this is totally TRUE is that i've seen, it and I have experienced it over the years. I myself have had a hard time getting SOLID calories and I mean LOTS in every single day. People always say... You are always eating. I have too. My metabolism is through the roof, and what 2500cal may do for some wont cut it for me.

I agree, that if around 3500-5000cal of the right things were done, people would be gaining size. It is VERY hard, and this is why we stress so much, that if you are just going to go about all of this in a so so way, it will take much longer.

I know how it feels to cram that much food down, and it isn't easy. Diet to me is MUCH more important than training. Diet is what makes you fail, or at least not get to your FULL potential.

Yeah, it really is hard, thats why i always stress planning your eating ahead of time. Something that can help is focusing on weekly cal totals instead of daily totals, so certain days you can have less cals and other days you can have more just depending on the circumstances. Maybe on the weekends you have more time to eat, so can take advantage and really get in a lot food. I know a bunch of guys that'll screw up 1 or 2 days eating and feel like they failed for the week. All you have to do in that situation is just up the cals for the next days. And i know some people will say stuff like you can only digest x amount of cals etc (wow that would actually be a good thing, a diet argument ) but i rather someone stuff down 5k+ cals in a day to hit there weekly total instead of missing it.

 

[Mad Manic]

haha MM your so fvcking ignorant...you don't really know what works till you try it.

Exactly, so I'd rather take/listen more carefully to the advice given by those that have excelled rather than listening to keyboard warriors who just have their 'knowledge' from articles off strength trainers off the net with mediocre physiques.

MM

 

[Throttle]

Agreed Effort, but from looking at recent posts people are wasting their money on powders and pills and worrying about tablets of flaxseed oil and whatnot. When they should be talking about steak, tuna, chicken, eggs, beef, rice, pasta, potatoes, fruit, veg, nuts, olives, peanut butter etc. I've looked at a lot of the diets on here and they are not good bulking diets.

it's always that way here, and that's why we're always having to repeat ourselves: eat whole foods.

 

[Quiksilver]

The thing about protein is that every lifter should be eating 1-2.5g of protein per lb of bodyweight.

Many people have either carb sensitivity or fat sensitivity, or have trouble digesting one or the other, so it makes it hard to suggest one or the other to somebody without really knowing their physiology. Sure everyone should be consuming some carbs and fats, but some are less tolerant of more of one than the other.

So it's easier and prudent to suggest protein at a good dosage, and then tailor carbs and fats to their particular needs and goals.

In other words, protein is the constant in the muscle building equation.

I agree though, Omen, and I'll make an effort to emphasize carbs and fats where necessary.

 

[KarmaSutra]

Agreed Effort, but from looking at recent posts people are wasting their money on powders and pills and worrying about tablets of flaxseed oil and whatnot. When they should be talking about steak, tuna, chicken, eggs, beef, rice, pasta, potatoes, fruit, veg, nuts, olives, peanut butter etc. I've looked at a lot of the diets on here and they are not good bulking diets.

MM

A-motherfvcking-men.

 

[Rampage1]

I have recently decided to cut down on some carbs because they have been giving me a gut..or so i thought! didnt realise their importance! whats the need for them anyway?

 

[Mad Manic]

I have recently decided to cut down on some carbs because they have been giving me a gut..or so i thought! didnt realise their importance! whats the need for them anyway?

You need them in the morning and around training to fuel growth, recovery and repair. But they need to be tailored to the individual and not over consumed else they are prone to fat storage when you are bulking. But when you're bulking you are going to have to accept fat gain, especially if you want to add muscle over a long period of time. That's one of the sacrifices I'm afraid.

MM

 

[Omen]

The thing about protein is that every lifter should be eating 1-2.5g of protein per lb of bodyweight.

Many people have either carb sensitivity or fat sensitivity, or have trouble digesting one or the other, so it makes it hard to suggest one or the other to somebody without really knowing their physiology. Sure everyone should be consuming some carbs and fats, but some are less tolerant of more of one than the other.

So it's easier and prudent to suggest protein at a good dosage, and then tailor carbs and fats to their particular needs and goals.

In other words, protein is the constant in the muscle building equation.

I agree though, Omen, and I'll make an effort to emphasize carbs and fats where necessary.

As far as protein goes, i've always suggested the 1-1.5g and you know as do others on here that's what i've always said, and never 2-2.5g. We each have our own reason, and that's fine. I base my off of a variety of things. And not only that, its like i've said before. NEVER had you seen 2g suggested before, and then it came out of know where. 2.5g IMHO is ridiculous, and again there is a reason for it. But if that is your thing, that is your thing. If I mentioned that amount to certain Exercise Physiologists (and yes one did bodybuilding and competed and the other has done triathlons, so they are VERY aware of all of this) I would get laughed at. My former professors would laugh at me.

I dont think the carb sensitivity or the fat sensitivity has anything to do with it. You cant say that people are sensitive to carbs and fat but not protein. In fact you can metabolize fats and carbs easier than you can protein.

Some people may be gluten intolerant, and that is mostly found in carbs because of the inability to break down gluten. BUT not all carbs have gluten in them. So carbs are not the issue.

Now to maximize the growth potential you NEED them, not just "some"

Protein may be the most important in the equation, but take the other two out, and you are doing no good. In fact you'd have to eat that much more, because that would be your source of fuel. There are hormonal processes too, that contribute to muscle growth, and fats are important. Protein does not have the same effect as fat does.

Suggesting the fats and carbs to people trying to gain size is CRUCIAL. So anytime we look at post about "i'm skinny, I need to gain weight" we need to make sure we talk about the other two. Protein alone never did anyone any good.

 

[Throttle]

you can get all the carbs you need to build muscle from fruits & vegetables, and not even the highest-GI varieties.

hunter gatherers didn't eat sandwiches.