The Zeitgeist

[hope7]

Complete dodge and non-sequitor to the question I asked. I'll ask it once again, what specifically do you guys propose that will allow us to fight any terrorist cells within our country yet not infringe on personal liberties?

Reorganize our intelligence agencies (CIA, FBI, ect). There were many warnings of 9/11.

Enhance our security. For example, many cargo imports comming into our country remain unchecked.

 

[speakeasy]

Reorganize our intelligence agencies (CIA, FBI, ect). There were many warnings of 9/11.

And how did the government get that information that they considered warnings? Probably had to invade someone's privacy. And securing the ports alone won't stop terror attacks. Timonthy McVeigh didn't import anything through the ports yet blew up an entire building with a fertilizer truck bomb.

 

[Last Man Standing]

Complete dodge and non-sequitor to the question I asked. I'll ask it once again, what specifically do you guys propose that will allow us to fight any terrorist cells within our country yet not infringe on personal liberties?

When you say "terrorists" you mean the Neocons. Charge them with treason - as the constitution allows for!

 

[Last Man Standing]

Deus, ricorico, and speakeasy are "Mockingbirds" - they say whatever the controlled media spews out!! Do you have any of your own ideas? Why are you and other fascist Americans so concerned with the over hyped "holocaust" of jews and Israel and have absolutely no concern for Americans?? This is treasonous boys!

What of the genocide and holocaust of Native Americans and Africans and Asians, Armenians, Arabs -- hundreds of millions have died and there is no outcry!! Hmmmmm, I wonder why the corrupt media only wants us to feel pain for Israel and jews? Ohhh yeah, I know why!

You fascists have to leave America not us Americans!!

 

[ricorico]

LMS,

I know there are genocides happening all over. but what have you done personally to help ? More lefties complain about the treatment of prisoners in Guantanomo bay then they do about the people of Sudan or around the world..
I guess you forgot Sadam ,Uday and Kusay killed more of their own people than we ever could. In ways like paper shredders and letting them get eaten alive by dogs. We can only go into those countries one at a time. The ones attacking us first or going against UN sanctions as Sadam so boldly did.

I have a lot of Iranian and Iraqi friends in this country who left because of their treatment as B'hai's or Catholics in middle Eastern countries. I remember when we went into Iraq I asked opinions of many middle Easterners here. The ones from Iran were saying they hope the U.S. goes into Iran next as there are many totured because of religious beliefs and the women live as basic slaves.

The president of Iran boldly stated there is no homosexuality in his culture because they don't have that epidemic. Sure they don't have homos there. He kills anyone who is known to be that way so they either haver to hide it or risk persecuation. what a great way to live.

As for the conspiracy theories and 9/11, no I don't believe the BS .You have the right to believe what you want to also "Mr. Freedom of speech".I don't call you or anyone who believes what they want names.Why do you? Should'nt I have the right to state my beliefs too?

Why were weapons of mass destruction not simply planted by our government as reason for war if we were easily able to influence 10's and thousands of conspirators? We surely could have convinced many to hide them for us and then knowing where they were simply gone to the UN 100% sure!

Why are some people(were they in on the conspiracy too??) saying the government was warned about 9/11 before it happened. Who did the warning, us? Why. So we could look bad that we did'nt react to those warnings since we were the ones behind it?


Why not simply bring down the White house and have so much less people involved in the conspiracy, but have the same outcome?

There can be a conspiracy theory for anything. I can say gum companies hate babies and have proof. How? many children under 3 die every year chocking on gum. Is there a warning on gum machines,packs of gum? No! So therfore they are conspiring to kills babies . I'm sure some guys working in a gum factory hates babies.Oh,further proof I'm right! So now I can say they hire people who purposely fit a certain profiles to accomplish what they want.

In the ghetto many people believe Popeyes Chicken had a conspiracy theory to sterilize black men. There were tons of "evidence" which looked believable to some who wanted to believe it,but the reality of it was ridiculous when you broke it down.
Same as many conspiracy theories I have heard.

 

[Last Man Standing]

Rico, if you want to know the truth I'm sure you can do research and come to it on your own - don't believe what others say - do your own research!

Why do I use the term "fascists"? Because you and others, who say you believe in free speech and the constitution, are telling people to leave the country because we care about America and our laws and know truth that America is under siege from the inside and not piss-poor arabs who produce nothing that are a threat to anyone - they get their weapons and technology from europe and america -- do research!!

Many of your statements are illogical and emotional, and micmick the media propaganda - think for yourself!! so I wont bother refuting them! You are un-American!

 

[Charm&Style]

I have a lot of Iranian and Iraqi friends in this country who left because of their treatment as B'hai's or Catholics in middle Eastern countries. I remember when we went into Iraq I asked opinions of many middle Easterners here. The ones from Iran were saying they hope the U.S. goes into Iran next as there are many totured because of religious beliefs and the women live as basic slaves.

The president of Iran boldly stated there is no homosexuality in his culture because they don't have that epidemic. Sure they don't have homos there. He kills anyone who is known to be that way so they either haver to hide it or risk persecuation. what a great way to live.

It's funny how the only people you mention who are pro-war in iran are the anti-revolution iranians, who in which some might possibly the evil mojaaheds

Secondly please bring me proof of iranians or whatever other nationality that resides in iran that has been tortured for not following islam (ofcourse it may happen if some other religon gets into the streets and starts yelling out anit-islamic slurs, but last time we all check iran is an islamic republic, yet i personally have never read an article of that happening).

I too have many iranian friends and they have told me about the jewish centers in iran, the bahais in iran, and the zorashtian head quarters in iran, in which they hold festivals in public without ANY prosecutions.

When it comes to the middle east, IMO, ppl need to read more or else dont give you 2 cents about it. G G G unit, i like your knowings, good job being an intellect and knowing a bit of Irans history. kudos.

One of the things that has truly annoyed me and others who follow international politics is this whole controversy of the president of Iran stating "Israel must be wiped off the map". Go google the actual documentation of what ahmadinejad said (which is in a farsi transcript) followed by the exact translation and compare the too.

So what did Ahmadinejad actually say? To quote his exact words in farsi:

"Imam ghoft een rezhim-e ishghalgar-e qods bayad az safheh-ye ruzgar mahv shavad."

That passage will mean nothing to most people, but one word might ring a bell: rezhim-e. It is the word "Regime", pronounced just like the English word with an extra "eh" sound at the end. Ahmadinejad did not refer to Israel the country or Israel the land mass, but the Israeli regime. This is a vastly significant distinction, as one cannot wipe a regime off the map. Ahmadinejad does not even refer to Israel by name, he instead uses the specific phrase "rezhim-e ishghalgar-e qods" (regime occupying Jerusalem).

So this raises the question.. what exactly did he want "wiped from the map"? The answer is: nothing. That's because the word "map" was never used. The Persian word for map, "nagsheh", is not contained anywhere in his original farsi quote, or, for that matter, anywhere in his entire speech. Nor was the western phrase "wipe out" ever said. Yet we are led to believe that Iran's President threatened to "wipe Israel off the map", despite never having uttered the words "map", "wipe out" or even "Israel."

Please just read the article (http://democracyrising.us/content/view/736/164/). We have been through this before. It is so easy to convince the people, when all we have to do is investigate and read. My God, we can not go to another war based on more lies.

 

[Last Man Standing]

It's funny how the only people you mention who are pro-war in iran are the anti-revolution iranians, who in which some might possibly the evil mojaaheds

Secondly please bring me proof of iranians or whatever other nationality that resides in iran that has been tortured for not following islam (ofcourse it may happen if some other religon gets into the streets and starts yelling out anit-islamic slurs, but last time we all check iran is an islamic republic, yet i personally have never read an article of that happening).

I too have many iranian friends and they have told me about the jewish centers in iran, the bahais in iran, and the zorashtian head quarters in iran, in which they hold festivals in public without ANY prosecutions.

When it comes to the middle east, IMO, ppl need to read more or else dont give you 2 cents about it. G G G unit, i like your knowings, good job being an intellect and knowing a bit of Irans history. kudos.

One of the things that has truly annoyed me and others who follow international politics is this whole controversy of the president of Iran stating "Israel must be wiped off the map". Go google the actual documentation of what ahmadinejad said (which is in a farsi transcript) followed by the exact translation and compare the too.

So what did Ahmadinejad actually say? To quote his exact words in farsi:

"Imam ghoft een rezhim-e ishghalgar-e qods bayad az safheh-ye ruzgar mahv shavad."

That passage will mean nothing to most people, but one word might ring a bell: rezhim-e. It is the word "Regime", pronounced just like the English word with an extra "eh" sound at the end. Ahmadinejad did not refer to Israel the country or Israel the land mass, but the Israeli regime. This is a vastly significant distinction, as one cannot wipe a regime off the map. Ahmadinejad does not even refer to Israel by name, he instead uses the specific phrase "rezhim-e ishghalgar-e qods" (regime occupying Jerusalem).

So this raises the question.. what exactly did he want "wiped from the map"? The answer is: nothing. That's because the word "map" was never used. The Persian word for map, "nagsheh", is not contained anywhere in his original farsi quote, or, for that matter, anywhere in his entire speech. Nor was the western phrase "wipe out" ever said. Yet we are led to believe that Iran's President threatened to "wipe Israel off the map", despite never having uttered the words "map", "wipe out" or even "Israel."

Please just read the article (http://democracyrising.us/content/view/736/164/). We have been through this before. It is so easy to convince the people, when all we have to do is investigate and read. My God, we can not go to another war based on more lies.

C&S,

Ahmadehadjad, as you stated, never said that --this is propaganda to make war with iran! Don't even answer to this mind game! This is the political Matrix! They know the truth - but don't care about humanity - they care for themselves!! Selfish wicked people!

 

[Ever onward]

More lefties

You can't classify everyone who believes that there are crooked people in the government as "lefties". I'm probably a lot closer to a Republican than I am to a Democrat however, I remain independent.

You mentioned something about free speech in there. Free speech is a great thing and you are entitled to say what you want just as I am. We have a great country with a exceptional form of government. All I'm saying is I'd like to keep it that way by not letting corruption soil it.

I won't convince you to change your opinions to reflect mine. All I ask is that you keep an OPEN mind and be weary of those in office.

 

[ricorico]

It's funny how the only people you mention who are pro-war in iran are the anti-revolution iranians, who in which some might possibly the evil mojaaheds

Secondly please bring me proof of iranians or whatever other nationality that resides in iran that has been tortured for not following islam (ofcourse it may happen if some other religon gets into the streets and starts yelling out anit-islamic slurs, but last time we all check iran is an islamic republic, yet i personally have never read an article of that happening).

I too have many iranian friends and they have told me about the jewish centers in iran, the bahais in iran, and the zorashtian head quarters in iran, in which they hold festivals in public without ANY prosecutions.

When it comes to the middle east, IMO, ppl need to read more or else dont give you 2 cents about it. G G G unit, i like your knowings, good job being an intellect and knowing a bit of Irans history. kudos.

One of the things that has truly annoyed me and others who follow international politics is this whole controversy of the president of Iran stating "Israel must be wiped off the map". Go google the actual documentation of what ahmadinejad said (which is in a farsi transcript) followed by the exact translation and compare the too.

So what did Ahmadinejad actually say? To quote his exact words in farsi:

"Imam ghoft een rezhim-e ishghalgar-e qods bayad az safheh-ye ruzgar mahv shavad."

That passage will mean nothing to most people, but one word might ring a bell: rezhim-e. It is the word "Regime", pronounced just like the English word with an extra "eh" sound at the end. Ahmadinejad did not refer to Israel the country or Israel the land mass, but the Israeli regime. This is a vastly significant distinction, as one cannot wipe a regime off the map. Ahmadinejad does not even refer to Israel by name, he instead uses the specific phrase "rezhim-e ishghalgar-e qods" (regime occupying Jerusalem).

So this raises the question.. what exactly did he want "wiped from the map"? The answer is: nothing. That's because the word "map" was never used. The Persian word for map, "nagsheh", is not contained anywhere in his original farsi quote, or, for that matter, anywhere in his entire speech. Nor was the western phrase "wipe out" ever said. Yet we are led to believe that Iran's President threatened to "wipe Israel off the map", despite never having uttered the words "map", "wipe out" or even "Israel."

Please just read the article (http://democracyrising.us/content/view/736/164/). We have been through this before. It is so easy to convince the people, when all we have to do is investigate and read. My God, we can not go to another war based on more lies.

Bahai’s:

Being a Bahai’ is illegal in Iran. Bahai’s have no rights and the law does not offer them any form of protection.
A 1993 report by the Special Representative to the United Nations Commission on Human Rights shed light on a secret official document containing specific instructions for gradual destruction of the Bahai’ community in Iran. This document was prepared by Iran’s Supreme Revolutionary Cultural Council at the request of the Islamic Republic’s Supreme Leader, Ayatollah Khamenei, and it was approved by him.
This document includes the following points: (UN Document E/CN.4/1993/41, Commission on Human Rights, 49th session, Jan. 28, 1993, Final report on the situation of human rights in the Islamic Republic of Iran by the Special Representative of the Commission on Human Rights Mr. Reynaldo Galindo Pohl. Paragraph 310)
-“They (Bahai’s) must be expelled from universities, either in the admission process or during the course of their studies, once it becomes known that they are Bahai’s.”
-“Deny them any position of influence such as in the educational sector, etc.”
- “A plan must be devised to confront and destroy their cultural roots outside the country.”
In Iran, the Bahai’ community has been ordered to dissolve all its administrative institutions. Bahai’ cemeteries, holy places, historical sites, and other assets were seized shortly after the 1979 revolution. According to the United Nations Working Group on Arbitrary Detention, Bahai’s were arbitrarily arrested and detained because of their religious beliefs and were subjected to humiliating interrogations.

 

[hope7]

And how did the government get that information that they considered warnings? Probably had to invade someone's privacy. And securing the ports alone won't stop terror attacks. Timonthy McVeigh didn't import anything through the ports yet blew up an entire building with a fertilizer truck bomb.

They obtained that info by intercepting messages from Al Queda. They were spying on the Al Queda camps in the middle east initially. In that case, it is perfectly reasonable to spy. If you're in contact with Al Queda, there is a good chance something must be up. This was also before the patriot acts.

"And securing the ports alone won't stop terror attacks"

Calm down and think before you post, that was horrible logic. No one aspect ALONE can stop terrorism. Spying on Al Queda ALONE can't stop terrorism, but its effective in stopping it.

 

[ricorico]

You can't classify everyone who believes that there are crooked people in the government as "lefties". I'm probably a lot closer to a Republican than I am to a Democrat however, I remain independent.

You mentioned something about free speech in there. Free speech is a great thing and you are entitled to say what you want just as I am. We have a great country with a exceptional form of government. All I'm saying is I'd like to keep it that way by not letting corruption soil it.

I won't convince you to change your opinions to reflect mine. All I ask is that you keep an OPEN mind and be weary of those in office.

I am keeping an open mind. That is why I have asked myself and others the very questions I have posted to the board countless times which noone will answer. I will not blindly believe what makes no sense to me.

When people can answer why we simply did'nt just hit the white house as it would have been a clear declaration of war.

Why are some government officials say there was a warning about 9/11. By who us? I thought we are responsible for 9/11 by some accounts here. Yet, we call and give a warning and noone responds? We purposely draw attention that we knew something was amiss? That makes us purposely look worse.

Besides,how can so many people keep such a big secret when there are people in goverment writting tell all books all the time in order to get a big payday and not one has been killed yet.Was everyone of the 10's and thousands of conspirators paid off with millions? Otherwise it is the best kept secret ever. Even mobsters snitch on each other and we expect folks working in the governmnet to have more ethics? Please!

Why not simply plant weapons of mass destruction and therefore guarentee the U.N. goes along with us. It would have been a LOT easier than to orchastrate the whole 9/11 conspiracy. A lot easier!

 

[Last Man Standing]

You kids don't know history - turn off your television!

Alqueda was created and formed by us in the carter administration under the lead of cia/Zbigniew Bryzenski to go against russians in afghanistan!

 

[Last Man Standing]

Rico - your questions don't make sense!!!!! You are a diversion!

 

[spesmilitis]

You kids don't know history - turn off your television!

Alqueda was created and formed by us in the carter administration under the aid of cia/Zbigniew Bryzenski to go against russians in afghanistan!

source?

 

[spesmilitis]

I am keeping an open mind. That is why I have asked myself and others the very questions I have posted to the board countless times which noone will answer. I will not blindly believe what makes no sense to me.

When people can answer why we simply did'nt just hit the white house as it would have been a clear declaration of war.

Why are some government officials say there was a warning about 9/11. By who us? I thought we are responsible for 9/11 by some accounts here. Yet, we call and give a warning and noone responds? We purposely draw attention that we knew something was amiss? That makes us purposely look worse.

Besides,how can so many people keep such a big secret when there are people in goverment writting tell all books all the time in order to get a big payday and not one has been killed yet.Was everyone of the 10's and thousands of conspirators paid off with millions? Otherwise it is the best kept secret ever. Even mobsters snitch on each other and we expect folks working in the governmnet to have more ethics? Please!

Why not simply plant weapons of mass destruction and therefore guarentee the U.N. goes along with us. It would have been a LOT easier than to orchastrate the whole 9/11 conspiracy. A lot easier!

Oh man, that was painful to read.

 

[Ever onward]

I am keeping an open mind. That is why I have asked myself and others the very questions I have posted to the board countless times which noone will answer. I will not blindly believe what makes no sense to me.

When people can answer why we simply did'nt just hit the white house as it would have been a clear declaration of war.

Why some governmnet officials say there was a warning about 9/11. By who us? I thought we are responsible for 9/11 by some accounts here. Yet, we call and give a awrning and noone responds? That makes us purpoely look worse. Besides,how can so many people keep such a big secret when there are people in goverment writting tell all books all the time in order to get a big payday and not one has been killed yet.Was everyone of the 10's and thousands of conspirators paid off with millions? Otherwise it is the best kept secret ever. Even mobsters snitch on each other and we expect folks working in the governmnet to have more ethics? Please!

Why not simply plant weapons of mass destruction and therefore guarentee the U.N. goes along with us. It would have been a LOT easier than to orchastrate the whole 9/11 conspiracy. A lot easier!

Well thanks for keeping your mind open.

Now what you're asking about is the 911 conspiracy. See I just found out about that two days ago when I saw the film Zeitgeist so I don't claim to be any kind of expert on that. I haven't done the research. I could speculate on answers to your questions but it would just be speculation.

What concerns me is the political stuff I've found out about that's going on behind the scenes. The ID Cards, the testing of the ID Chips, Bush trying to turn the USA into a satellite of the North American Union. All of that stuff is real, and doesn't need proving. The evidence is readily available.

 

[ricorico]

Personally,

I like ID cards and ID chips. Especially,with all the identity theft happening these days. Especially with the loads of illegals and thieves who thrive on that. What are your objections to them? Concerns. I'm really intereste in your reasons.

 

[spesmilitis]

It seems that the tracking chip is not a part of the national ID card. It also seems that the national ID card is virtually the same as a drivers license. Whats the difference???

 

[ricorico]

Rico - your questions don't make sense!!!!! You are a diversion!

Why don't they make sense? Because you don't think so??? I don't think the conspiracy theories of 9/11 make sense to me either as there are too many holes! If they make sense to you that's fine.

I happen to think there were much easier ways for our government to have accomplished their goals on 9/11 .Simplify all by just hitting the White House. Less conspirators,less complicated but the very same outcome. targeting the White House would have automatically meant an act of war!

I happen to think planting weapons of mass destruction (if we were so bent on framing Iraq) would have been what was done by the U.S. IF we were involved in 9/11 as it would have given us a very strong position.instead of facing the UN with specualtions of mass destruction which were never found..