The reason for living?
- Thread starter Oxide
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CadillacCTS
Don Juan
I thought about this question too for the longest time. I felt that life is pointless from a very young age, and that's partly to blame for my lack of action, my lack of desire to live life. At this point I would prefer the peace and nothingness of death rather than the ups and downs of life. Does this make me a coward? Am I afraid to live? Maybe so, but I am more afraid to die, not for myself but for my family and others who care about me, this is similar to what Oxide mentioned.
So what is the point of life? There was a point in my life where I ran after material things and money. I think the reason for living is to be happy, enjoy your life. This is not as simple as it sounds, because some people think money, status and other things make them happy, that is not happiness that is just excitement. happiness is more subtle, it's not the flashy things in life. I think life is about living your life the way YOU want to live it, not the standards of society. Do things for yourself, its not selfishness if you don't hurt others.
So what is the point of life? There was a point in my life where I ran after material things and money. I think the reason for living is to be happy, enjoy your life. This is not as simple as it sounds, because some people think money, status and other things make them happy, that is not happiness that is just excitement. happiness is more subtle, it's not the flashy things in life. I think life is about living your life the way YOU want to live it, not the standards of society. Do things for yourself, its not selfishness if you don't hurt others.
But what if the things I want are a fast boat, a speedy car, a mansion in every country, a space rocket, my own basketball team, my own harem? How do I know if these things are important to me versus these things seeming appealing because we are taught so?
comic_relief
Master Don Juan
The meaning of life is for you to create a purpose for it.
I believe you make your own purpose in life. I refuse to believe that everyone has an innate purpose in life.
comic_relief
I believe you make your own purpose in life. I refuse to believe that everyone has an innate purpose in life.
comic_relief
Don't always be the one putting yourself out for her. Don't always be the one putting all the effort and work into the relationship. Let her, and expect her, to treat you as well as you treat her, and to improve the quality of your life.
Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.
Quiksilver
Master Don Juan
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On that note: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0416449/
The purpose of life is to create another life. What you say, Oxide, is that life will end, but "technically'(can't think of a good word) you live to achieve, succeed, and built a future for yourself, which will carry on to your kids, your grandkids, and so on. Life will "never" end, as long as your kids and grandkids, and so on keep living and succeeding.
That is, Oxide, an extremely difficult question to answer directly, but I surely can give you some personal advice. It might a good idea to start with realising what kind of world we currently live in. What I am about to say will probably do no real justice to reality; but it will be better than nothing.Oxide said:
The Western world we live in is, what I think can rightfully be called, a Post-Industrial Revolution, Post-World War, Free Market, Capitalistic, Consumerist society. Whether this is good or bad, positive or negative, is not so easily answered, and it, no doubt, has much to do with someone's own beliefs, ideologies, and preferences.
We now live in a world filled with great material riches, wealth, and comfort; some 200 years ago, most of the Western world still laboured on the dirty soil on their knees, planting patatoes, dying young usually before the age of 40, not travelling farther from ones village than a mile or twenty, and paying taxes to, usually, corrupt kings, lords, or priests. This is not exactly my most ideal and romantic picture of life.
Also, without a powerful, unified, capitalist nation as America, it can be imagined that if Hitler had not crushed the world with his Nazi death legions, it would certainly have been Stalin with his iron fist of Communism dominating the world. The first scenario is even worse than the second; but both are fit for nightmares. In other words, to be against Capitalism, Consumerism, and America, is to forget two very important and crucial moments in history.
But maybe, by now, all this wealth, luxury, and comfort is starting to become somewhat excessive, and people, having never really changed in thousands of years, are beginning to realise that there is something more to life; something in the form of other goals, ideals, dreams, and visions.
When you look at history, there are usually long periods of religiousness and usually material scarcity, followed by periods of materialism and wealth. Whatever the nature of reality is, or whether some god exists, is not important or relevant; but I do think we are fully in a deeply materialistic period, full of wealth, comfort, and luxury.
You asked me, Oxide, in your previous post, how you can distinguish between that wich truly gives your life genuine meaning, and between that which is an illusion of society and other people? I think the secret resides in finding what you truly, deeply, honestly, and personally VALUE as a unique individual. The word "value" is a very general word: anything in this universe has some kind of value: clouds, couches, courage, girls, cars, money, generosity, and even disease and death have some kind of value. The key here, of course, is finding what your own most important values are. The values you now have are, I am quite certain, values you received, consciously or unconsciously, from society, parents, friends, television, and more of such sources. But where do you find your own values? Where do they hide? When will they show their faces? The best place to seek them are, I think, Books. Within books--good books--is contained the wisdom of all the ages. But maybe there are other places to discover these values: this is something you must explore by yourself.
In the end, all I can do is give you some tips and books to begin your quest.
Michel de Montaigne - The Complete Essays
Marcus Aurelius - Meditations
Francesco Guicciardini - Maxims and Reflections
Cicero - On Duties
Epictetus - Enchiridion
Balthasar Gracian - The Art of Worldy Wisdom
The Ancient Egyptian Wisdom Texts - ...
Some final tips:
1. Expand your vocabulary: it will Expand your mind
2. Learn grammar; learn an extra language
3. There is a natural tendency in humans to conform to others around them; this is the death to true personality and originality of thought
4. Devote yourself to Truth
5. Courage, Persistence, Patience, Intelligence, Vision--these will help you through dark periods.
6. Many people can be very wise; but, ultimately, listen to your own heart.
That is it: I have nothing more to say
Vulpine
Master Don Juan
Call me a simpleton, but I tend to reduce things down to the simplest factors. Who needs stress? I've spent days and days pondering man's exisrance, and I've got nothing to show for it but a busted brain.
Sure, there are all these "higher things" to strive for or consider... but it all boils down to simple things motivating someone to do anything in life. The more you think about it, the more circular it gets:
Food.
Shelter.
Pleasure.
Sex.
Sex being different than pleasure because sex implies social interaction/companionship/reproduction... those three things boil down to simply sex. You can twist your brain for hours and hours... "But why do we work?" To get money to buy food, shelter, pleasure, and sex. "Why was electricity created?" Because an inventor was an inventor as a job, a job to get money, money to pay for f, s, p, s. "What about god/spirituality?" People need something to explain why they are living - they have a hard time believing that life is so simple as to be to "achieve food, shelter, pleasure, sex".... so they complicate it.
The brain is a powerful thing. So powerful, that it tends to reject simplicity. Take this site and women. So much "stuff" is on here that really only makes the simple problem over-complicated. 1 + 1 = 2. Done. Part 4: Sex. Women's lives are no different then men's: "achieve food, shelter, pleasure, sex."
After being her a while, and looking back over the years... one situation pops up in my mind that stands out from all the others:
One night I met a woman, danced, rode home with her and her friend (my buddy's target), and fuxed her. What's so special about that? I said 4 words to her, ever. She only said 2 words to me, ever. TWO! It's magic. So simple, I'll never forget. On the car ride to her friends house:
V: "What's your name?"
HB: "Veronica. Yours?"
V: "Vulpine."
HB: *smiles*
She wouldn't have ever heard my voice if I didn't ask her name. Sometimes I wonder if she realizes she only ever said two words to me.
Ahh... there is beauty and splendor in the simplicity of life. Just as music can be beautiful, silence can be just as beautiful.
And really, you can knock food and shelter off the list because being hungry isn't pleasureable, and, being cold and wet isn't pleasureable.
Wonder why I mention "hedonism" before? The reason for living? Sex... lots and lots of good sex. Simple. Really, there is no arguing. Why? Consider dolphins. Dolphins can have sex for pleasure. What's their purpose for living? Sex. Pleasure. Now, consider aliens and ponder their reason for living... it might be different than ours. See, our anatomy is designed to accomodate sex: tab A, slot B. In any accounts of alien encounters, "witnesses" couldn't recall any genetalia. This leads one to believe that they don't have sex, or sex for pleasure. Sure, they must reproduce somehow... what's to say they don't exist through ongoing cloning? (See also: Aeon Flux) Perhaps they engineered themselves to be so perfect that they did away with the need to have sex. Maybe they are humans who have evolved 1000 years past where we have! Perhaps they had a Hitler, and their Hitler won and went crazy with genetics experiments!
You could think and think and think and think and think and think. You want to get theorhetical and philisophical, I can go for days with other "thinkers". But, it's so much easier if the answer is just given to you before you hurt yourself or go crazy (religion is some people's "answer").
Yeah, my theory is pretty Freudian, but it's not crazy.
Sure, there are all these "higher things" to strive for or consider... but it all boils down to simple things motivating someone to do anything in life. The more you think about it, the more circular it gets:
Food.
Shelter.
Pleasure.
Sex.
Sex being different than pleasure because sex implies social interaction/companionship/reproduction... those three things boil down to simply sex. You can twist your brain for hours and hours... "But why do we work?" To get money to buy food, shelter, pleasure, and sex. "Why was electricity created?" Because an inventor was an inventor as a job, a job to get money, money to pay for f, s, p, s. "What about god/spirituality?" People need something to explain why they are living - they have a hard time believing that life is so simple as to be to "achieve food, shelter, pleasure, sex".... so they complicate it.
The brain is a powerful thing. So powerful, that it tends to reject simplicity. Take this site and women. So much "stuff" is on here that really only makes the simple problem over-complicated. 1 + 1 = 2. Done. Part 4: Sex. Women's lives are no different then men's: "achieve food, shelter, pleasure, sex."
After being her a while, and looking back over the years... one situation pops up in my mind that stands out from all the others:
One night I met a woman, danced, rode home with her and her friend (my buddy's target), and fuxed her. What's so special about that? I said 4 words to her, ever. She only said 2 words to me, ever. TWO! It's magic. So simple, I'll never forget. On the car ride to her friends house:
V: "What's your name?"
HB: "Veronica. Yours?"
V: "Vulpine."
HB: *smiles*
She wouldn't have ever heard my voice if I didn't ask her name. Sometimes I wonder if she realizes she only ever said two words to me.
Ahh... there is beauty and splendor in the simplicity of life. Just as music can be beautiful, silence can be just as beautiful.
And really, you can knock food and shelter off the list because being hungry isn't pleasureable, and, being cold and wet isn't pleasureable.
Wonder why I mention "hedonism" before? The reason for living? Sex... lots and lots of good sex. Simple. Really, there is no arguing. Why? Consider dolphins. Dolphins can have sex for pleasure. What's their purpose for living? Sex. Pleasure. Now, consider aliens and ponder their reason for living... it might be different than ours. See, our anatomy is designed to accomodate sex: tab A, slot B. In any accounts of alien encounters, "witnesses" couldn't recall any genetalia. This leads one to believe that they don't have sex, or sex for pleasure. Sure, they must reproduce somehow... what's to say they don't exist through ongoing cloning? (See also: Aeon Flux) Perhaps they engineered themselves to be so perfect that they did away with the need to have sex. Maybe they are humans who have evolved 1000 years past where we have! Perhaps they had a Hitler, and their Hitler won and went crazy with genetics experiments!
You could think and think and think and think and think and think. You want to get theorhetical and philisophical, I can go for days with other "thinkers". But, it's so much easier if the answer is just given to you before you hurt yourself or go crazy (religion is some people's "answer").
Yeah, my theory is pretty Freudian, but it's not crazy.
Let me draw something up here:
Our goal, as species is to reproduce. Back in the day, people had no idea how to cure diseases. They had many wars. A lot of people were dying. So we needed people to start fukking like rabbits..or the Chinese. But do you make them? Well, you could make it very enjoyable, so they want to do it.
A man orgasms to pass the sperm to the woman. The woman orgasms to dip the part of the cervix into the pool of semen to get impregnated.
If the goal is reproduction and survival of the species, then I think it would be fair to say that we have reached that point. We have almost too many people around. May be the nuclear wars will fix that, and that's why we need to keep on fukking.
I don't think sex is the answer. I don't think it is the part of the four things you mentioned either. Reproduction... so what? That is our goal, to keep the population going? That goal sucks.
And I don't buy your simplicity for a second. Even if we are an accident... how is it that ALL human creatures eventually developed from the same basic cell. What do humans, hippos, birds, horses, ants and jellyfish have in common?
This does make the brain hurt, but I like it..I call it thinking
Our goal, as species is to reproduce. Back in the day, people had no idea how to cure diseases. They had many wars. A lot of people were dying. So we needed people to start fukking like rabbits..or the Chinese. But do you make them? Well, you could make it very enjoyable, so they want to do it.
A man orgasms to pass the sperm to the woman. The woman orgasms to dip the part of the cervix into the pool of semen to get impregnated.
If the goal is reproduction and survival of the species, then I think it would be fair to say that we have reached that point. We have almost too many people around. May be the nuclear wars will fix that, and that's why we need to keep on fukking.
I don't think sex is the answer. I don't think it is the part of the four things you mentioned either. Reproduction... so what? That is our goal, to keep the population going? That goal sucks.
And I don't buy your simplicity for a second. Even if we are an accident... how is it that ALL human creatures eventually developed from the same basic cell. What do humans, hippos, birds, horses, ants and jellyfish have in common?
This does make the brain hurt, but I like it..I call it thinking
The Juan and only
Master Don Juan
I agree. But this doesn't mean you should always do what you want to do -- off the wall, out of control and selfish pleasure seeking will come back to bite you in the ass.
Yeah, we are small and insignificant, but never did anyone make a bigger mistake than the man who did nothing because he could only do a little. If every cell in your body gave up because they thought they didn't matter, then you couldn't function. You'd die.
We're all members of a society and we have some responsibilty to each other, even if we should have as much fun as we can.
I do not wholly agree with this hierarchy of needs, but it is a good help, or a sort of useful detailed map of humans wants, that could send someone in the right direction.
http://www.omafra.gov.on.ca/english/rural/facts/96-001f1.gif
http://images.google.com/images?hl=...eds&btnG=Search&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi
"Before higher needs can be met, first lower needs need to be fullfilled." That is interesting concept, and probably true in most instances.
http://www.omafra.gov.on.ca/english/rural/facts/96-001f1.gif
http://images.google.com/images?hl=...eds&btnG=Search&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi
"Before higher needs can be met, first lower needs need to be fullfilled." That is interesting concept, and probably true in most instances.
I ponder this question from time to time. I, too, am an atheist.
I've approached this thinking that if I was never born, would it have mattered to the world? No.
We can all think back to a time where our memory can only go so far back, where we think our life began. Would I be extremely sad that I had never been born? No. Why should the end of me be so?
My presence in this world shouldn't make a difference to this world or myself at all.
I came as nothing, and I will leave as nothing. I'll try to live my life the way I want.
Do you play a game where you can not win (death)? I think most people answer yes, so long as they've had fun.
I've approached this thinking that if I was never born, would it have mattered to the world? No.
We can all think back to a time where our memory can only go so far back, where we think our life began. Would I be extremely sad that I had never been born? No. Why should the end of me be so?
My presence in this world shouldn't make a difference to this world or myself at all.
I came as nothing, and I will leave as nothing. I'll try to live my life the way I want.
Do you play a game where you can not win (death)? I think most people answer yes, so long as they've had fun.
DjDreamer
Master Don Juan
To understand the reason for living you should understand the reason for dying... so... what would you die for? I hope it's your freedom...
If you live to serve others then you've lost the game... if your fulfillment requires trying to make everyone think "maintaining" social order is eventually meaningless then you've lost the game... if you wish to make yourself and everyone else deeply depress by contemplating existential concepts with no positive outcome in sight... then you're unstable... you've lost the game...
Yet knowing all of this the talk of life's meaninglessness continues in a seemingly endless loop... misery loves company... however making all your employers miserable and nihilistic would make for one unproductive company...
Owners and creative thinkers try to make others productive...
But...
I guess you're like the coach that tells his players that it doesn't matter if you win a lose but how you play the game... you're either gonna win or lose... go up or down... and you're mostly definetly gonna return to the rollercoaster starting point... now... how do you play? Would you die for a fair game?
If you live to serve others then you've lost the game... if your fulfillment requires trying to make everyone think "maintaining" social order is eventually meaningless then you've lost the game... if you wish to make yourself and everyone else deeply depress by contemplating existential concepts with no positive outcome in sight... then you're unstable... you've lost the game...
Yet knowing all of this the talk of life's meaninglessness continues in a seemingly endless loop... misery loves company... however making all your employers miserable and nihilistic would make for one unproductive company...
Owners and creative thinkers try to make others productive...
But...
I guess you're like the coach that tells his players that it doesn't matter if you win a lose but how you play the game... you're either gonna win or lose... go up or down... and you're mostly definetly gonna return to the rollercoaster starting point... now... how do you play? Would you die for a fair game?
