The official Borderline Personality Disorder thread [Merged]

[WaterTiger]

DieHard~

You can get addicted to people just like you can a drug. It's "the rollercoaster effect". Amazing highs when she's working with you, horrifying lows when she's against you.

BPD people are hard to quit like heroin. You look forward & bask in the "good times" and you are crazy desperate to get those good times back when she's being evil to you. What you're going through right now is basiclly withdrawl. You miss the high so bad it hurts. You're telling yourself the lows weren't REALLY that bad. Your own brain is sucking you back in to her or a girl like her. You are CONDITIONED to like it.

No contact is one of the only ways to get clean from her influence.

Also be careful you aren't drawn to another BPD girl because it's familiar & what you're used to.

 

[jophil28]

DieHard~

You can get addicted to people just like you can a drug. It's "the rollercoaster effect". Amazing highs when she's working with you, horrifying lows when she's against you.

Exactly right WT, and therefore principles of addiction recovery apply.

Going back to an ex BPD g/f is the same as an alcoholic in early recovery stoping at a bar for "just one". That one feels so good...then the second drink 'appears' on the bar and ....we'll the inevitable happens and within a couple of days the addiction has been reactivated and he is back to the starting line.

Apparently DieHard needs to do this to ultimately get to the point of accepting that he is powerless whilever he engages her.

Power lies in abstinence, not in repeated attempts to prevail over someone who has proven to be destructive.

 

[bukowski_merit]

I think some people are a little too quick to place the blame on "cluster b" or "BPD" women...

I've read a lot of the stories on here. Done research, visited some of them "BPD" recovery sites/message boards.... and i cannot fathom how everyone can just be so quick to scream "Cluster B".... Like on one board a guy was saying he'd been with 4 straight Cluster B women! Do you know how unlikely that is? Could it be possible that he's just not good at maintaining relationships past a certain point? Has jealousy issues? Is insecure himself? Doesn't know how to handle high sex drive women???? (im a subscriber to the theory that women who act up are typically LSE/HSD.)

I do believe that SOME of you have legit encountered women with psychological diseases. But i agree with the OP that i think it gets pushed a little too much here on MM; mostly based on the fact that a lot of the regulars here have "encounters" with cluster B women.

In return - they're VERY fast to say "Cluster B", so that they can continue their healing process by bonding with another "victim".


I respect those who are survivors of any horrible relationship. And i think we should focus a lot more on what we could have done differently; and prepare ourselves for the next batch of yummies.


If i were a keyboard psychologist - i'd estimate that 50% of the women i've been with exhibit Cluster B traits. Lots of extreme love early... "soulmates"... "i love you sooo much, i just want you to hold me forever".... "you make me happier than i ever knew possible".... Followed by lots of extreme craziness later.... And finally lots of ex lovers left with broken hearts (and suicidal thoughts/attempts).... or perhaps... that's just the way a lot of relationships are....

 

[Jitterbug]

Personally as a keyboard shrink, I diagnose every woman as Cluster-F.

 

[katatonia]

I've read a lot of the stories on here. Done research, visited some of them "BPD" recovery sites/message boards.... and i cannot fathom how everyone can just be so quick to scream "Cluster B".... Like on one board a guy was saying he'd been with 4 straight Cluster B women! Do you know how unlikely that is?

Not really unlikely as you said yourself...

If i were a keyboard psychologist - i'd estimate that 50% of the women i've been with exhibit Cluster B traits. Lots of extreme love early... "soulmates"... "i love you sooo much, i just want you to hold me forever".... "you make me happier than i ever knew possible".... Followed by lots of extreme craziness later.... And finally lots of ex lovers left with broken hearts (and suicidal thoughts/attempts).... or perhaps... that's just the way a lot of relationships are....

Normal women don't do that type of sh1t (ie. build you up like crazy then devalue and go psycho on you shortly after).

 

[Jitterbug]

My Cluster B ex did almost everything on that list Danger just posted.

bukowski_merit, it's not that there are sooo many Cluster B women around, but usually among all the messed up women a guy runs into, Cluster B ones are those that send them, bewildered, to a forum like this asking for help. The rest you can kinda shrug it off as "bloody women, they're all crazy".

 

[jophil28]

Mine was great for the first 6-8 weeks but then the craziness finally started getting delivered as promised. If she was not a Cluster B then she was certainly ACoA.

She lied constantly,
hid the truth,
did not want commitment,
expected commitment from me,
used sex as a weapon,
had very low tolerance for frustration,
was angry constantly,
distorted everything,
deceived,
manipulated,
used other friends as a buffer to keep from getting too close to me,
had a drinking problem,
had alcoholic parents,
grew up in a household with constant fighting,
had uncountable health problems that could not be diagnosed,
broke her hand from punching walls too often,
flirted non-stop with men (when I wasn't around),
left a trail of destruction behind her,
was terrified of being abandoned,
had social anxiety,
antisocial disordered,
disrespectful of me constantly,
never-ending "$hit-tests"
and cheated on me with multiple men before I finally found out and dumped her ass.

That list of Danger's is almost exactly the same list that I could compile from my experience with a woman and her behavior in 2006.
There are 24 items above, and 22 of them were present in her actions.
Curiously, my nutjob also was also great for 6-8 weelks and then the craziness started.
The similarities make my spine tingle.

Whether these women are clinically CLuster B or even subclinical is not really important, what is significant is that their behavior is appallingly destructive .
Look at the list above- none of the behaviors fall withing the 'normal ' range.

Perhaps our experience, and our reports on this forum about our relationship with one of these toxic creatures will serve to enlighten and forewarn others before they too fall for Satan's daughter.

 

[bukowski_merit]

Normal women don't do that type of sh1t (ie. build you up like crazy then devalue and go psycho on you shortly after).

Well, i can place a good bit of it on myself because i am a HARDCORE lover (who's sometimes overly romantic). I do and say a lot of stuff that i'd ill advise anyone to ever repeat. My own fault. I wrap them up in me, and they wrap me up in them.... And then... it untangles... and it's not as pretty as it was planned to be... I am not saying that this is the same thing that happens with all guys... Just that... this is sometimes - all there is to it.

She lied constantly,
hid the truth,
did not want commitment,
expected commitment from me,
used sex as a weapon,
had very low tolerance for frustration,
was angry constantly,
distorted everything,
deceived,
manipulated,
used other friends as a buffer to keep from getting too close to me,
had a drinking problem,
had alcoholic parents,
grew up in a household with constant fighting,
had uncountable health problems that could not be diagnosed,
broke her hand from punching walls too often,
flirted non-stop with men (when I wasn't around),
left a trail of destruction behind her,
was terrified of being abandoned,
had social anxiety,
antisocial disordered,
disrespectful of me constantly,
never-ending "$hit-tests"
and cheated on me with multiple men before I finally found out and dumped her ass.

Well jesus man! As i said - i do have a soft spot for anyone who has been in a horrible relationship. I've been in tons, but i wouldn't say any that were as bad as this. Perhaps, some of them would have got that bad if i had let them continue down the path they were doing. You definitely were in a bad one; horrible. The things i bolded though, are really most women. And the ones i underlined are the ones that are REALLY concerning... if they weren't there - i'd say "this is modern society women".... but punching walls... social anxiety (for women)... etc. are a little beyond the norm... what's left over - are traits you can pick and chose from and find in women.... cheating? as bad as it sounds - didn't even register to me as something that sets off alarms of "there's something f'd up about this woman"... it has become such a common place for men and women.... that it's almost an accepted evil of relationships now...

but by laying it out in a laundry list style like this - it definitely looks worse... as do most of the things...

and as i said - im definitely not saying you or anyone else has not had a brush with BPD women... just that, it gets thrown around an awfully lot...

in the early 00's .... i used to frequent fast.seduction.relationships. ... i mentioned earlier that low self esteem/high sex drive women or hardcore freaks as some called them a little later - were always considered hard to handle. and back then - a woman with all the traits you listed would have just been called that.

maybe im just having a hard time transitioning a community term into a scientific one in my head.... i also have a hard time with the 2% being accurate. It seems a lot of women have a good number of the traits you listed. A LOT more than 2%.... although the one you specifically listed probably trumps most in her problems.

but most women have laundry lists of problems..... that blow most men out of the water.

 

[Julius_Seizeher]

No, most men blow THEMSELVES out of the water trying to solve women's problems, or to not cause them in the first place.

Don't be scared off by a BPD, just get a conceal-carry permit for the inevitable ex-con bfs in the parking lot, and go 100% A$$hole Game with NO softy-stuff.

Flip the script on these Succubuses.

 

[Stagger Lee]

I think I'll go into a thread and do to Bukowski what he does. From reading your post you are obviously a cap'n-save-a-ho. It's obvious you are dating trashy girls. Is it any wonder you see these problems?

 

[horaholic]

had uncountable health problems that could not be diagnosed

This one right here freaks me out. Anyone who read my story has heard about how she has some disease in her blood, and doc's gave her a year to live about three years before I met her. A couple of years ago (We weren't dating or anything) she gets a brain tumor, and convinces me she has two months to live. At first i didnt believe her at all, but she convinced me. Since then, she's almost died several times. The latest one is an irregular hearbeat, and fatigue, but it might be due to a pinched nerve. She tried to use that to get out of sex, but changed her mind a minute later, as long as I 'went slow.' I dont know what to believe. Its so hard to believe that someone would just make this shyt up, but its too hard to believe it to be true, too, so I pretend I believe it, unless we're fighting.

Anyway, its really weird that some of you other guys have encountered the same medical bullshyt with your BPD's as well.

I absolutely admit that I am addicted to my bpd ex. She's addicted to me too. We're both too smart to get in another relationship, but we both lust so hard after each other, we cant go more than a couple few months without being fvckbuddies for a week or two. We mutually tried to cut our FB thing a couple weeks ago, and it felt like a breakup for some reason. I got a late night drunk dial from her telling me how much of a loser I am, then a week later she was lonely and loved me. I caved, cuz I was horny.

Definitely addicted.

 

[boomerick]

Sorry to say that Danger's list is spot on. The best you can do is get away from the BPD ASAP. -- THEN take a real good look at yourself to see what YOU did to get involved with one. Some guys have personality issues that attract BPD women. If you've been involved with more than one YOU may be doing things that draw them to you.

 

[Slickster]

I find the references that a BPD woman is like a drug, very interesting.

When I watch drug addiction shows like Intervention you see people become completely consumed by the drug. They are no longer themselves and it seems quite common that the friends and family are the enablers. Even though they want the addict to quit they allow the addict to use by being weak. The addict is essentially the alpha and bullying everyone around.

Reading a bunch of these tales about relationships with BPD's doesn't it seem to be a simple case of guys (I won't say men) allowing these women to bully them or take them over like a drug?

I've dated lots of crazy chicks in the past. The only time they became a problem is when I let it happen.

Could you say that behind every great BPD woman is a weak man?

 

[Slickster]

Imagine if you would for a moment....you are sick and have to go to a hospital. Unbeknownst to you while you are in the hospital, you receive drugs for a period of time to assist in your recovery. The drugs work during your illness and have no lasting side-effects, however you were never informed that you were being given drugs.

That is, until it is discovered, anyone that has taken them for longer than two months has built a very slow incremental addiction to them. When you are finally released from the hospital, with everything seemingly fine in your life, you have an overwhelming addiction to this drug that was administered to you without your knowing it.

This is where I call bullsh!t!

I don't get how you can use that example. Unless it's the first time you've ever dated ANY woman before it's not like went into your BPD experience totally oblivious.

If things are SO unbelievably great in those first few weeks or months and you feel so euphoric you must be aware of it all happening. You must realize the ridiculously strong feelings you are forming. If you have ANY experience with women at all then you would know not to get too carried away with your feelings and to guard your heart. At least put the brakes on and be aware. You make it sound like a teenage boy falling in love for the first time and having his heart broken. I'm not trying to insult you personally but this is the talk of boys, not men.

Now, any chance you have to get this drug, you cannot help yourself. You must take it. Are alcoholics weak? Coke-addicts? Sex addicts? BPD daters? Smokers?

Possibly they are, possibly not.....but to me, the notion that you are weak if you cannot walk away from something eight weeks after you have already become addicted to it.....well, that is best judged by those who have been there.

I cannot call drug-addicts weak because I have never experienced the cravings they have. I can attest that those who have become entangled with BPD's require tremendous strength to pull themselves away. It is not as simple as walking away, because you are already addicted by the time the BPD behaviors start to manifest themselves.

Yes alcoholics, drug addicts, smokers are weak!! They are also big enough people to admit it once they recover. I don't see many BPD addicts here being big enough to take responsibility for their addictions at all. Some how the blame is being placed all on her. Is it an ego thing not wanting to admit you were weak?

The other thing that I think is bullsh!t is how it is described that these BPD behaviours suddenly manifest themselves so quickly. Almost like flicking a switch. There isn't a woman on the planet that doesn't display at least some of the behaviours listed above. That alone is enough to put the brakes on if you sense your feelings getting carried away.

The first sign of serious bs coming from her end should be a gigantic wake up call for the so called BPD addict. Allowing it to continue at all past that point is a form of weakness and it's pretty sad. You say it takes tremendous strength to pull away from a BPD woman well I say that lack of strength is weak.

I've dated tons of crazy chicks that I'm SURE many of you would throw the Cluster B label on. Sure some of them drove me nuts but I never let them get too deep under my skin because - THEY WERE CRAZY!!!

 

[jophil28]

So what did she do? She convinced me that she would change, and to prove it she actually went to therapy, changed her actions, mood, friends, everything to prove to me that she was better. This act continued for 4 months, until I was finally convinced. Call me gullible but at the time I had a hard time believing ANYBODY would fake their whole life for MONTHS just to get back an ex they had dumped, so I believed her.

What a mind **** it was when it turned out it was fake.

Stories like this are priceless in their potential to warn other men who find themselves involved with mentally ill women.
SmoothTalker, why not finish your story and tell us what happened after you 'believed her" ..(I assume that you took her back because her efforts to change were so convincing ?)

 

[Slickster]

SmoothTalker I am in no way trying to discount you or anyone's terrible experiences with BPD women. I'm sure it can be hell.

The point I take issue with is when she starts acting up and the guy allows it to happen. As you say you are telling your friends tales of her insanity and they don't even believe it because it is so ridiculous.

The fact that you continue to expose yourself to this type of behaviour knowing full well it is wrong is where I don't understand. Would you accept this type of behaviour from any other person in your life? What about a guy friend? What about a real ugly girl?

What about if during your relationship with a BPD girl you start seeing a REALLY great and beautiful normal girl on the side? She's level headed, smart, fun, super sexy, sexual, and pretty much perfect in every way possible. What happens to your BPD addiction then???

If you choose the normal girl then were you really addicted to the BPD? If you choose the BPD then are you anything but weak?

So that is why I say that you guys need to take some responsibility for your BPD addictions. It seems to me that you are choosing sex over your own sanity.

 

[Slickster]

Right on Smoothy it sounds like you've learned and are now better for the experience. Every guy makes mistakes with women along the line. Good on you for being honest and genuine.

 

[boomerick]

SmoothTalker wrote:
"Spend enough time with her and you start thinking you're the crazy one"


This is the danger of the BPD. You don't even realize as your self or identity is slowly distroyed. If you're an AFC Capt Sav-a-hor, you've been raised on woman-ese and Disney, and you've never been educated on BPD (many western males today) you won't even know whats wrong or when it started going wrong. But somehow it gets spun onto you. Strangely you end up buying into doubting everything good about yourself. You have to be in a relationship with one of these women and then escape to realize how subtly it works. And I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

 

[godofanxiety]

This thread makes my skin crawl, but nevertheless I thank you people for fighting a good fight for us inexperienced and/or naive guys. I'll have to make some difficult decisions in the near future. But yeah, it's a drug. And as with every drug there are no lows in the beginning.

 

[Die Hard]

Ducking , weaving and denial comes in many forms. Shooting the messenger is yours it seems.
You have been given first class advice here about abandoning your proposed last fukk with your ex BPD.
You insist that you can do that with immunity,so, just do it.
Don't bother to post any more huffing and chest beating.

Your intentions mean little at this stage - only results count.

Speaking of intentions and results...

Forcing your false truth on me seems to be your intention and the negative result seems to annoy you a lot. You seem to be overtaken by the need to be right... I guess the respect you get for the way you handle women is causing you to think you're always right?