Skillfully turning a boring convo with a woman towards a sexual direction

[Sebastian0001]

I'm not going to give away my DHV stories because they are unique, and they are mine.

I'll give the framework though. And it's pretty easy to build off of it because even Mystery talks about this. I haven't invented anything new here. It just so happens to work extremely well for a guy who is good with communication, body language and kino.

A DHV story can be any interesting, non-sexual story where you're doing something high value. The more unique and high value, the better. Within the story, something sexual happens, but it's not the point of the story. The story is about the high value, non-sexual thing you're doing.

So...you've just sexualised a conversation with plausible deniability. She gets her fantasy about you being sexual, under the cover of your DHV story.

What's important with this strategy is being a good communicator. You have to be an engaging talker. Delivery is everything.

I actually agree with the premise of what you are saying but ur contradicting urself by saying a "non-sexual story" and then "something sexual happens" - I think if someone is telling a DVH story and they want to include something sexual, it could attract a woman but then its not a non sexual story. Sure, it might be subtle but how subtle and what kind of subtle is the key details. But, of course, you don't do details.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Basically, you are saying that you wouldn't have sex with someone who is boring.

This is true of most women and has nothing to do with being a "sapiosexual". In fact, there is no such thing as a "sapiosexual". Women are attracted to men who are interesting, not men who are intelligent. Mark Zuckerberg is, by all accounts, highly intelligent (as a businessman). He is also about as interesting as a duffel bag full of old underwear. His lack success with women is proof that even copious amounts of money cannot overcome extreme lack of social skills. The same is true of many billionaires.

Conversely, many men who are interesting are not particularly intelligent. Put someone like George Clooney or Brad Pitt in charge of a multinational corporation and it will likely go bankrupt in a matter of weeks. But women go ga-ga over this type of men because they are charming, smooth talking, and generally have good social skills.

EXACTLY, very well said. The key point here is never to listen to what a woman says she is attracted to because she has no clue. It is far better to interpret their actions and draw your own observations and conclusions as you astutely did here. I don't think Zuckerberg's wife is even semi-attractive but no offense to her as I am sure she is a nice person.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Not saying you're wrong, I'll have to think about it, but I know plenty of men, plenty of people, who have great social skills, could charm the skin off a cat and who talk a good game but who know zero about human nature, human existence and the like.

Perhaps what I'm referring to is a certain intellectualism that I find attractive and respond positively to.

I'm not just saying this but that's why I like this forum even though I probably don't belong here lol, because I find many of you guys to be quite astute at understanding and accurately assessing certain situations which I relate to, having grown up with five very 'alpha' brothers.

I post on another forum, both women and men, and I get so frustrated because so much of what is said there is the biggest load of crap you could ever imagine hearing.

Many (not all) the people who post over there literally have no clue. I don't even know how they survived living this long, but whatever not my problem. I'm weaning myself away from it.

Just a vent.

See, here is the thing. Women are very complicated. They try to assess themselves but there is no real incentive for them to spend a lot of time self-assessing their attraction reasoning. Thus, their self-assessment is very superficial in nature. So, their conclusions are wrong. Women will say ridiculous things all the time like "i just want a nice guy" or "i just want a smart guy" or "i want friendship first" but its all a load of BS. I'm sure they are being honest that they really think they want that. But, the interpretation is a fail because ultimately they will want or not want based on how their body feels. So, what she says or thinks is almost completely irrelevant in attracting her because she will ultimately have no power when her emotions are strongly activated by a guy who knows what he is doing. Then, she will wonder why she likes him and come up with those same incorrect conclusions that she likes him because he is smart when really he has no clue on any intellectual matters but can talk slow and communicate in a way which makes him seem like he is smart. This is why men can so easily take advantage of women and why women are considered fragile and all. Now, a woman who knows what she is doing can also turn on a guy too if she knows what she is doing but if she is ugly and fat, she has no chance. Whereas a guy who is ugly and fat still has a chance.

 

[Atom Smasher]

Innuendo, innuendo, innuendo. The three elements that intrigue women.

You need to make an emotional connection or hook with a woman by being interesting, bold, light, and fun-loving. Once that is done, she will be most receptive to sexual innuendo. It will drive her wild.

 

[2Rocky]

I have taken women to bed and never said one sexual word in the process...Kino is Key...

 

[Sebastian0001]

What I mean is that the point of the story is non-sexual. A really generic example would be a travel story. The point of the story is that you saw a cool pyramid in a forest, but during the story something sexual happens. That way the sexual stuff just seems incidental to the story and you don’t seem thirsty or directing any sexual attention at her. She can fantasise while you’re telling the story.

The more subtle and well disguised the sexual stuff is, the better this works. It’s like leading her mind in the direction you want it to go - mind control of sorts.

fair enough but there are two goals right? Display high value and also direct her to a sexual direction? The challenge is to do both in one story. A high value might be lets say you are a very loyal person. So you tell a story about how your brother got into an accident at 3 am and you drove 5 hours to help him and be with him or something something because your family means the world to me. So now she respects the loyalty aspect. But then how to incorporate sexual? And loyalty might not even be the high value that a person wants to convey. It probably depends on the girl that one is trying to bang. If she is a gold digger, then showing her status might be a turn on and if its a woman that is turned on by intelligence, then that might be the subject of the story. All women like to be turned on but different things appeal more based on the woman, her age, her background etc. The woman I have been dating is in her 30s and LOVES intelligence and is a career woman, a scientist and physician. She loves to learn about other fields like finance for which she knows not as much. Whenever I say share something that shows my intellectual side, I can just see her look at me differently immediately. This might not be true for a younger girl in her mid 20s however.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Innuendo, innuendo, innuendo. The three elements that intrigue women.

You need to make an emotional connection or hook with a woman by being interesting, bold, light, and fun-loving. Once that is done, she will be most receptive to sexual innuendo. It will drive her wild.

so speaking of light and bold, today a pretty woman I know posted a picture in which she looked pretty. I told her that her picture really showed how big her ears look and that perhaps I should call her dumbo the elephant from now on. She got kind of mad but in a playful way. However, I didn't add anything sexual in that.

Was this a good response or a bad one? I imagine her other follows told her things like "wow so pretty" and "wow you are so beautiful"

 

[Sebastian0001]

>>The key point here is never to listen to what a woman says she is attracted to because she has no clue.<<

@Sebastian0001 et al, I actually agree with you. I have NO clue what attracts me, I own it.

Presented with two men, all things being equal - looks, status, job, money, intellect - I truly have no idea why I'm so attracted and enthralled with one man and not the other.

The reasons are intangible and exactly what you said - emotional.

With respect to intellect, I used that as an example because the men I typically go for have been somewhat intellectual but I doubt that's what attracted me.

Nor was it his looks, status, money etc as (for example) I've been asked out by models and a few actors (truth) when I worked in entertainment in NYC and they did nothing for me.

So those things on their own don't "do it" for me.

So again you are absolutely right, I have no idea what attracts me, nor do most women if she's being honest.

I only know when I meet him, either on line or off, I either feel that certain "somethin somthin" that cannot be explained or defined, or I don't.

It's emotional. An intangible force that drives my and most women's attractions.

That's why at the end of the day, all these different strategies you guys discuss and employ, ways to attract women, often fail.

This may sound hokey to some of you but imo and experience, a lot of it has to do with energy/chemisrty. Which cannot be created through employing strategy or "Game" (sorry Pan87 ), it simply exists between two people or it doesn't.

I will say once it's been determined that there IS a certain energy between you, you might be able to increase her attraction through Game and maintain it, but not create it.

Not in my experience cause I've had many men attempt to "get me" through Game and it didn't work.

Another man with whom mutual energy between us DID exist, his Game did work.

So you think, see, GAME works! No it wasn't game, it was your energy.

Some men DO possess that certain somethin that will naturally attract women, a swagger, confidence, a certain bravado, an edge. That's their energy and it WILL and does attract many women.

A few men on this forum have that great energy, that "edge," I can sense it in their posting style even when brash, THAT is why they're so successful. High notch count etc.

Anyway, I realize this is a ramble that may get ignored, but if I have any advice, work on improving yourself, your energy, how you present yourself to women and the outside world in general.

If/when you have great energy, combined with a confidence and certain swagger, you might discover you don't really have to "do" a damn thing or not much, the women will come to you, naturally and organically.

You may have to make the first move, but after that it's easy.

Not through Game or strategy but your energy. THAT'S the key.

Anyway, just my .02 as a woman who's done a lot of internal work, introspecting, learning, growing and evolving over the years.

Not a brag, but for context, I attract a lot of men wherever I go and have had my fair share of relationships, good and bad, long term short term.

I still have a long way to go though before I figure it all out or perhaps I never will which is OK too.

Carry on and have fun!

what does it mean "I only know when I meet him, either on line or off" - do you mean in person or online as in chatting on an app or something?

To the rest of your response, of course the game works. The game is what gets the woman to THINK there is "chemistry" - there is no such thing as chemistry. The only "chemistry" if you really want to call it that is whether the guy's game is able to activate the chemicals/compounds/elements/hormones etc. in a woman's body. The whole "chemistry" word is a myth that women believe because they are emotional and they like to think things like "aww we have such amazing chemistry" NOPE, it just means his game worked on you. EVERYTHING in dating is a game. Even women play the game. What do you think wearing makeup to cover blemishes in the face is? Or heels to make the butt look bigger? Or certain bras to make the breasts look more firm? These are all fake things and the woman is playing the game becuase it makes her APPEAR to be more fertile which then "activates" the same chemicals/compounds etc I mentioned above but for the guy becuase a guy has evolved over millions of millions of years to spread his seed with fertile women and fertile woman have big firm breasts, big butt, good waist to hip ration, nice skin, etc. Its all a game, there is no "romance" or no "chemistry" or none of that. But all of those things sound cool, make for good movies, and get women emotional and so it persists.

This is just truth and I don't expect you, or any woman, to really accept or understand this. Because the emotions deep down in a woman will ALWAYS win over the logic. ALWAYS.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Showing women that you’re loyal isn’t really high value to them dude. Men appreciate loyalty. Women, not so much (especially if you’re beta). You’re going to have to pick something else.

like I said - I can only give you the frameworks. High value, interesting story where something subtly sexual happens. Your storytelling abilities do the rest.

i don't want the story but i am interested to know what is something that you think women see as high value and its not a pyramid lol

 

[Sebastian0001]

I beg to differ because with one of my ex's, we both felt that energy/chemistry before speaking one word to each other, it was literally across a crowded room.

And it was not based on looks alone as although he was hot as hell, I've met men better looking and felt nothing.

So how could it have been his "game"? He didn't say or do anything. Nor did I. But we both still felt it

If you've never felt genuine chemistry or if you don't believe in energy between two human beings, then of course you will have no idea what I'm talking about and insist it's "GAME."

Thats fine, believe what you want, but I know through having experienced it myself before any words have been spoken, it's more than that.

Something intangible that cannot be described or explained.

Here is what you are missing in my opinion. Energy is part of game. Having a very positive optimistic confident energy is game. People do not have to "talk" for their to be game. It includes body language, style, and the way a guy looks at a woman. He may have told you that he felt chemistry and energy for you, but that is part of the game - to tell women this. He probably tells every woman that he wants to have sex with the same thing - "I don't know what it is, but I just feel this chemistry and energy between us" - its a great and perfectly repeatable line! Again, words is a small part of it so its not surprising that you felt his game working before he talked to you. It is the game that is the the something intangible that cannot be described or explained.

 

[DonJuanjr]

There was nothing special about the way he looked at me, nothing "gamey" about it.

What do you feel is a gamey look?

I know you guys place a lot of value on game and that's fine but for me and some other women, I seek something deeper and more genuine.

From what I've read on here with the obvious DJs, you couldn't tell it was game, and you'd think it was deep and genuine.

 

[Velasco]

I've had guys pull "game" on me before, and never fell for it. It's too contrived and calculated.

Because it wasn't smooth. When it is, you might even call it out after (or even IF) you realized after the fact, what he did. Like literally, "that was smooth."

 

[DonJuanjr]

Fair enough.

What do you feel is a gamey look?

 

[BDDazza]

So let's say you are on a date with a beautiful woman but she keeps bringing up boring topics like work, family and school. Then, there is a pause in the conversation and she prompts you with a general question like "what about you, what's important to you?" You have an opportunity to seize the conversation topic and take it in any direction. What would you say next? What topic would you bring up? How would you turn it towards a more sexual direction?

I know one method is to misinterpret things as sexual or to add sexual innuendos but let's say that kind of opportunity has yet to come up and now you have to steer the conversation away from the boring topics she keeps blabbing on.

To pull this off successfully depends on how you introduced yourself initially; for example if the conversation was very sexual and flirtatious online or when texting then it would feel more natural to continue this in real life. However, if your conversations were clinical or mundane it would feel disingenuous to suddenly start moving the conversation sexual. So the trick is to start the sexual conversations before you meet!

The fact she agreed to meet you in person means she is interested, when a girl likes you it almost doesn't matter what you say, it will take a lot to mess things up. If you're unable to turn the conversation sexual with words, then do it with action. Sit closer, invite her to sit closer, touch her arms, legs, waist as you talk and take it as far she is comfortable with.

 

[Sebastian0001]

o

Thanks for the response but no there was no body language or anything of the sort, like I said our attraction was literally across a crowded room.

I didn't know this but earlier he had spotted me at the office and asked our mutual friend (female) to introduce us when we arrived at the club.

To this day, I have no idea what initially drew me to him, like I said, he was across the room which was extremely crowded.

But he looked at me and I looked at him, he made his way over and our friend introduced us and that was IT, for the next SIX years.

We even got engaged, which I broke off for reasons I don't wish to get into here.

Now you're probably thinking the way he looked at me, that was his GAME? The way he made eye contact with me?

Not ruling the possibility out but I doubt it. There was nothing special about the way he looked at me, nothing "gamey" about it.

There was just an energy, and again if you've never experienced it, I can understand why you don't believe it and think it was game.

I've had guys pull "game" on me before, and never fell for it. It's too contrived and calculated.

That said, I know you guys place a lot of value on game and that's fine but for me and some other women, I seek something deeper and more genuine.

Game is too contrived for me but hey I get it works well with some women, so carry on!

of course I have experienced it! I have done this "across the room" thing to other women too and they say the exact same thing as you do and explain it exactly the way you do it. This is all just common woman speak. No offense, but as an emotional woman, you are not configured to be able to understand the game. You can only interpret it as "oooo I felt something." Energy is, of course, part of the game. It is part of the reason I am struggling right now because my energy is not up yet after a long failed relationship. Its not something one can just immediately turn a switch on. But, it is part of the game. Again, this is literally every woman's response upon which the game has worked so there is nothing surprising to me here about your responses. And what do you mean there was no body language? There is body language literally every second of a human's life. The only time there is no body language is when the human dies.

I understand your reluctance to accept the game though. Women prefer to think of it as magical and emotional and all. It can become magical and, as you said, yours lasted 6 years and led to engagement. The fact is that game is not gimmicky. Its just the laws of attraction and utilizing these laws to get the woman attracted. Its like a catalyst. In fact, everything in life is kind of like a game (or at least many things). Medications for example are utilizing the laws of the body to manipulate the body for a certain result (lower pain for example). There is nothing negative about using "game" and once the catalyst, or game, causes the spark it can lead to a wonderful relationship, marriage, kids and all of that. This is my purpose tbh of using the game and it is not to have a notch count, but to be able to land whichever woman I want to spend the rest of my life with.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Because it wasn't smooth. When it is, you might even call it out after (or even IF) you realized after the fact, what he did. Like literally, "that was smooth."

is it a good sign when a woman says "ooo smooth." I am not sure. I went on a date recently and we were having playful banter and she said "oh smooth" but then the night ended in just a short make-out and she didn't want to do more. It felt like the night was going well and we were jiving but I've been out of dating so long that I don't have good radar on these things right now.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Ok, this^ is good, I can actually buy that, the way you explained.

My idea of Game was something different, more contrived and calculated, manipulative.

I dunno, maybe it is those things, I'm probably guilty of it too. Female Game which I've become quite adept at.

Like I've said, a necessary evil. Or not so evil? Essential if one is to succeed (and survive) in today's dating environment.

i mean it can be an evil depending on the person and their intentions

 

[Sebastian0001]

Oh and @Sebastian0001 when I said no body language, I meant when he was across the room. I couldn't see his body or what language it was conveying, at that time.

The place was packed and only saw him from the neck up.

Once he came over, then yeah, there was plenty of very positive (and sexy) body language from both of us!

lol well the neck and face is part of the body, isn't it? Hence, body language. I once hooked up with a woman in Europe and we couldn't even talk because we didn't speak the same language. It was just making out though. Still, that's body language for you.

 

[Stuffnu]

So what did you like better? 50 Shades the book or the movie?".

Funny, I used a similar line via text but said “51 shades”.
Of course, her response was “isn’t It 50”?
“No cause I added one”

Plant a seed and if it grows, you might be able to pluck it.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Same happened to me with a Greek man while on the ferry from Athens to Crete.

There was this amazing vibe between us but he spoke no English and I spoke no Greek but we managed to connect through him doing card tricks! Lol

It was years ago but I remember it like yesterday, I really fell for him!

lol nice! I like your open-minded approach to discussion. Maybe you can give me advice. I'm a much older age at 39 and the woman is 38 and she wants to like me but I keep doing friend vibes. She's a great girl, plays no games, super smart, not really hot but very cute, and just a great person. We have spent a lot of time together but I cannot really drive it past making out which has never happened to me - usually the make-out quickly goes to the neck and beyond. Every time we make out for like 30 seconds, she laughs and then says "ok" We finally talked about it and she said "sometimes the feelings are slow and sometimes slow and both are ok" and "the romantic feelings have been slower so far for her." Obviously, I don't like those responses so I stopped spending time with her but she is still fine continuing to spend time with me.

I haven't hung out with her for a couple months but she still comments on my instagram stories/posts. I don't really know what to do next. I don't meet a lot of women at this age that are wife material. I don't think she is dating anyone else right now (partially bc older women are less hit on). She's not really like the women ppl describe on this forum but simple/nice and only has sex in serious relationships. The truth is my game just sucks and a few other women I dated before her said I give friend vibes too. What to do? We will probably hang out again at some point. One of my friends said just forget her and bang other women (not really what I'm looking for even though I'm on this forum). One said just keep hanging out while increasing sexual escalation (as if I can just turn the switch back on from 10 years ago). One said to just formally ask her to be my girlfriend in a "cute way" and see what she says and then just move on if she says no.