Pick from those who pick you

[BeExcellent]

I agree that interest level is everything. But a man generally needs to take the initiative because most women are totally passive and make almost zero effort to meet or speak to anyone.

Agreed. That’s a law of the jungle thing. The man makes the approach, the woman responds. Why do male birds have such colorful foliage & do complicated mating dances? Why do male deer rut and fight one another? To show off for a female. To stand out. To elicit a response and find a mate. It’s not unlike that in humans on a basic level. No I’m not suggesting you guys become dancing monkeys or something…not at all. The male birthright is to initiate; to take initiative, to approach.

Even physiologically this is true. The male connector approaches and penetrates. The female connector receives. That’s as true of sex as it is of wall sockets.

 

[Mike32ct]

Awesome thread.

I would say that one challenge is avoiding missed opportunities. You obviously can’t (and shouldn’t) ask out every chick you know socially (ie in social circle). So there may be some cute ones that fall through the cracks and start dating someone else because you didn’t know she liked you (that much).

 

[bat soup]

Agreed. That’s a law of the jungle thing. The man makes the approach, the woman responds. Why do male birds have such colorful foliage & do complicated mating dances? Why do male deer rut and fight one another? To show off for a female. To stand out. To elicit a response and find a mate. It’s not unlike that in humans on a basic level. No I’m not suggesting you guys become dancing monkeys or something…not at all. The male birthright is to initiate; to take initiative, to approach.

Even physiologically this is true. The male connector approaches and penetrates. The female connector receives. That’s as true of sex as it is of wall sockets.

It's certainly my experience that women are generally passive and very rarely initiate. I've always wondered why not but I think it's some kind of natural instinct, as you say. And also perhaps just because they don't need to initiate, given that the male sex drive is much stronger.

However, what I have noticed is that women have ways of putting themselves in proximity and making themselves available when they're interested (or not, as the case may be). That can be very obvious when you know what to look out for (e.g. proximity, finding excuses to be around you or alone together etc).

In this respect, the premise of this thread is very true in that a man is totally wasting his time if he is dealing with a woman that is unreceptive. Where a lot of pickup advice goes wrong is that it assumes that a man can convince a girl that doesn't like him to change her mind. If a girl is unreceptive, it's extremely unlikely that she'll ever change her mind.

 

[BadBoy89]

Men really like me when they meet me. REALLY like me. The more they get to know me the more attractive I become. So much so that I often become an exception to their typical criteria. My last Ex BF strongly prefers Latinas. He fell hard for me, a white girl. He talked about that all the time. My current BF is 45 and heads swivel when women see him walk into a room with his long hair & lean physique. He looks like a thinner Fabio, but his face is better looking. He didn’t want to date someone with kids. Yet here we are. He typically dates younger, but here we are. Why?

I have a friend exactly like this; single mom, current bf the same age as yours, and men REALLY like her. She has had alot of engagements, guys chasing her, was a former model. Heck. I like to talk to her.

And I think there is a word for this, don’t mean to offend you, but the word is “Vixen”.

What can a woman offer besides fertility @BadBoy89 ? A lot. Warmth, encouragement, positivity, insight, support, love, intimacy, respite, perspective, fun, laughter and mischief as examples. But she isn’t bringing all those desirable things to a man she doesn’t find appealing.

What’s your appeal? Figure that out and you’ll figure out who you appeal to.

This is good and a man should improve all the time.

Personally I think the most important thing a woman can do, that will make a man fall in love hard, is initiate. Her picking up the phone and calling or texting first, without “wanting” something, more important than sex in 2022.

 

[HaleyBaron]

"Pick from those who pick you."

No. I pick from those who I pick.

 

[bat soup]

"Pick from those who pick you."

No. I pick from those who I pick.

That's what Harvey Weinstein had on his wall.

 

[BeExcellent]

I have a friend exactly like this; single mom, current bf the same age as yours, and men REALLY like her. She has had alot of engagements, guys chasing her, was a former model. Heck. I like to talk to her.

And I think there is a word for this, don’t mean to offend you, but the word is “Vixen”.



This is good and a man should improve all the time.

Personally I think the most important thing a woman can do, that will make a man fall in love hard, is initiate. Her picking up the phone and calling or texting first, without “wanting” something, more important than sex in 2022.

No offense taken. In fact I find that to be a compliment. It’s funny. I have Pottery Barn Christmas china with Charactures of Santa’s reindeer. Guess which plate is always at my place on the table? Yup. Vixen. My exBF always sent me Jessica Rabbit memes. He saw me as that Jessica Rabbitt/Vixen persona.

Women like your female friend and I understand how to display sexiness without vulgarity. It’s edgy and sexy but also elegant in its restraint. It intrigues the hell out of men. Added to that is the fact that I adore men. She must as well. There is magnetic attraction in women who know how to wield sexual power with class and grace. It is a dichotomy that most any man desires in a woman. It’s rare. Therefore valuable.

Here’s the problem with a woman who initiates. It’s backwards. It robs the man of his natural desire to conquer. It lessens value. Think of it this way. Let’s say you are a hunter. What if your prey just simply walked out of the brush and laid down for you to slay? Yes you would have easy prey. But you’ll value the experience more if you have to go through the effort of preparing, waiting, finding the prey, being still and quiet, getting your aim right, making your shot, etc. The thrill of the hunt is where the value really lies. Easy prey is easy come, easy go. And men percieve women who initiate as easy come, easy go. Lacking value. Not requiring investment.

People fall in love with two things. How they feel and what they invest in. If as a woman I require a man’s investment (of time, money, effort) and I reward him for that investment by making him feel amazing about making that investment (sexually, emotionally, conversationally etc.) and throw in an appropriate amount of competition anxiety then guess what? He will fall and fall hard. He can’t help it. It’s a man hack of sorts. And as a highly desirable woman it is incumbent on ME to respect men enough to only garner that reaction in men I desire.

And that is a big part of why I only choose men who choose me. Out of respect for myself AND for men.

And to @bat soup ‘s point he is utterly correct. Women will create opportunities in subtle ways for men they are drawn to. It will be a glance, a proximity, a smile & look away…it’s fleeting but it’s there.

Women show indications of interest in subtle, covert ways. That is why social calibration and skill at social cues is so important in seduction. Often she will indicate that you are green lighted to approach if you pay attention & pick up the cues.

 

[Bingo-Player]

Agreed. That’s a law of the jungle thing. The man makes the approach, the woman responds. Why do male birds have such colorful foliage & do complicated mating dances? Why do male deer rut and fight one another? To show off for a female. To stand out. To elicit a response and find a mate. It’s not unlike that in humans on a basic level. No I’m not suggesting you guys become dancing monkeys or something…not at all. The male birthright is to initiate; to take initiative, to approach.

Even physiologically this is true. The male connector approaches and penetrates. The female connector receives. That’s as true of sex as it is of wall sockets.

Difference is in the animal kingdom the females instantly submit to the males who do this

Modern females do not , and are increasingly under appreciating the level of confidence and endurance it takes to approach a woman in real life that is what we are getting so pi$$ed and disenchanted about

Don't forget we have no idea

1) if you are single

2) if you are even interested

3) if you are fainting interest for the attention

If we manage to negotiate them first 3 hurdles we then need to make the conversation as stimulating and interesting as possible sometimes working with absolutely nothing , then we must move the conversation to a sexual level to actually be able to facilitate physical sex

Even if we do all this there is still the unknown quantity in regards to hidden competition which lets be honest most attractive women have on a ratio of 10:1

It's really not surprising to see why men struggle with women regardless of wether said woman likes him or not

Be excellent i like your content but honestly this thread made me chuckle you make it sound like its a case of just finding women that like you

In all my years and experience in the field from a males perspective i can assure you it is not

As a male if you want to exceed in dating you need to find a woman that likes you , then you must stimulate her , then fulfil her in bed and even after all that you must ensure she believes you could walk away at any minute

It is a tall order trust me.

 

[HaleyBaron]

That's what Harvey Weinstein had on his wall.

Harvey is a hero.

 

[BeExcellent]

Difference is in the animal kingdom the females instantly submit to the males who do this

Modern females do not , and are increasingly under appreciating the level of confidence and endurance it takes to approach a woman in real life that is what we are getting so pi$$ed and disenchanted about

Don't forget we have no idea

1) if you are single

2) if you are even interested

3) if you are fainting interest for the attention

If we manage to negotiate them first 3 hurdles we then need to make the conversation as stimulating and interesting as possible sometimes working with absolutely nothing , then we must move the conversation to a sexual level to actually be able to facilitate physical sex

Even if we do all this there is still the unknown quantity in regards to hidden competition which lets be honest most attractive women have on a ratio of 10:1

It's really not surprising to see why men struggle with women regardless of wether said woman likes him or not

Be excellent i like your content but honestly this thread made me chuckle you make it sound like its a case of just finding women that like you

In all my years and experience in the field from a males perspective i can assure you it is not

As a male if you want to exceed in dating you need to find a woman that likes you , then you must stimulate her , then fulfil her in bed and even after all that you must ensure she believes you could walk away at any minute

It is a tall order trust me.

Bingo I agree with you. What I’m saying is look through a lens to women who are receptive.

Unreceptive women are to kick rocks.

My playboy friend and I have had this discussion countless times. He is of the same mind as you. Furthermore he has told me in no uncertain terms that I’m a hot chick; therefore zero effort is required beyond choosing (talking about the initial interaction and the inherent responsibility of the man to carry that off.). He’s told me himself that I have no idea. I do have an idea. I’ve experimented with approaching when I was younger, it felt exactly like the prey example I gave above. I’ve been rejected. I tested to see if my grandmother’s wisdom was correct (ladies do not call men), and guess what? Every single relationship I’ve ever had the man approached. I was receptive and responsive mind you, but the man initiated.

Yes it’s effort, yes you risk rejection. But you get to control your ego and response to rejection. If you get shot down? Ok. So what. Not every job interview hires me. Or you. Do you boo hoo about that or do you simply move on to the next opportunity?

There is something confident and sexy about a person who can absorb rejection without flinching. If you aren’t in that headspace get there. You’ll screen for interested women that much more efficiently with the right attitude.

 

[Velasco]

On looking for warm signals (proximity, the "glance/smile")/picking from those who pick you

Sounds good in theory, but is far from reality

 

[Bingo-Player]

Bingo I agree with you. What I’m saying is look through a lens to women who are receptive.

Unreceptive women are to kick rocks.

My playboy friend and I have had this discussion countless times. He is of the same mind as you. Furthermore he has told me in no uncertain terms that I’m a hot chick; therefore zero effort is required beyond choosing (talking about the initial interaction and the inherent responsibility of the man to carry that off.). He’s told me himself that I have no idea. I do have an idea. I’ve experimented with approaching when I was younger, it felt exactly like the prey example I gave above. I’ve been rejected. I tested to see if my grandmother’s wisdom was correct (ladies do not call men), and guess what? Every single relationship I’ve ever had the man approached. I was receptive and responsive mind you, but the man initiated.

Yes it’s effort, yes you risk rejection. But you get to control your ego and response to rejection. If you get shot down? Ok. So what. Not every job interview hires me. Or you. Do you boo hoo about that or do you simply move on to the next opportunity?

There is something confident and sexy about a person who can absorb rejection without flinching. If you aren’t in that headspace get there. You’ll screen for interested women that much more efficiently with the right attitude.

Ok but rejection and initation is not what i am talking about

What i am talking about is the stages after where women constantly test boundaries and shift dynamics "because they can"

If it was case of boy meets girl and boy has too pluck up the courage to approach and girl drops at his feet we would have a simple solution and there would hardly be any single people anywhere

(To be fair in the 70's and prior i think this probably was a fair depcition )

But today it isn't ..... a lot of attractive modern single women are spoiled they WANT to test every single fibre of a mans being and if he fails at any moment he is discarded like a used playtoy who cares theres another 1,2 300 guys to choose from in the DM's ,swipe apps whatever

I am witnessing it in real time with a 21y/o i have spinning , she's attracted to me , she submisses to me, she sends me nudes, i cannot assert anymore dominance over her without becoming her actual father

But STILL i can almost see the little cogs in the back of her head whirring thinking " what else is available on instagram " because the temptation is just too much for these girls

It's the equivalent of me being put in a room everyday with 200 lingerie clad women and a box of viagra

 

[BeExcellent]

On looking for warm signals (proximity, the "glance/smile")/picking from those who pick you

Sounds good in theory, but is far from reality

It IS reality. Look I was just chatting with @Glassguy about an interaction he had yesterday. Early 20s chick. Cutie. Store clerk. He’s minding his own business making a small purchase.

She compliments his cologne.

That’s the “in”. He reads the signal, is light & flirty, gets the number. Banter ensues over text. Deal sealed same day.

Does he over think the situation like the excerpt provided by @Velasco? Nope.

Here’s the thing. If you are getting over wrought all up in your brain about approaching/rejection then women are taking up WAY too much mental bandwidth. Relax. Chill out. It is not a mortal injury if a girl says no. It is not a mortal injury if you misread a signal. That’s how we all learn.

Listen. I was awkward in high school. Not popular although I had some close friends. I realized I was attractive in college and that was even more awkward. I knew how to be buddies with men but really had no idea how to be the girlie girl the really desirable men wanted. So that was even MORE awkward. My sorority sisters took pity on me and helped me learn the social cues between men and women and how to navigate the social landscape. I already innately understood how men interact (which is a secret weapon of sorts now as I understand it effortlessly - Hats off to dear ol’ Dad), but I had to learn how women do. How women & men do. I became a student and I observed and I learned and I consciously decided Inwas going to develop the social skill that I now have.

But I didn’t always have that skillset. I was shy, socially awkward and too accommodating because I wanted people to like me. People liked me fine. I was all up in my head for nothing.

Nobody cared about all that over thinking going on in my head except me. I crippled myself with that thinking. For what? I and what I was doing was simply not on other people’s radar screen like *I* assumed it was. Once I quit thinking like that everything changed. I wasn’t awkward anymore. I didn’t over blow my expectations of my interactions with other people. My fear left. I realized others were just as worried about things as I had been. I saw people as the flawed humans they are; that we ALL are. It made me humble, grateful, relaxed. It calmed the silly chatter in my head.

It set me free. Free your mind goes the lyric. The rest will follow.

Calm the chatter in your mind. Ok. 3-5 IOI’s in a night and miss them all or get rejected by all? Big deal. Tomorrow is a new day and this will not kill you. Seriously.

 

[Velasco]

That’s the “in”. He reads the signal, is light & flirty, gets the number. Banter ensues over text. Deal sealed same day.

He was not in his head thinking about looking for indicators or whether she may or may not be interested in him.

The signal is automatic. You feel it upon looking at her face upon approach/her approaching you. This in my experience was always when I was not in my head looking for signals beforehand whether she might or might not be interested in me.

Did you read that last excerpt about "it will stop you from being mindful and in touch with you unconscious to help you know if something is there"?

 

[2Rocky]

I like the "Warm Signals" term. I notice them better now than I did as a younger man.

For me many times it is about eye contact. Just before Christmas, I met a client at a popular local bar. I walked across the street, past the smokers who were out on the side walk and I felt , and then saw the gaze of a woman watching me walk by. I greeted her with a "Good Evening" as I walked by to the front door. When she came into the bar she again locked eyes with me and put herself in my vicinity. it was a perfect example of a warm signal.​

​

I've made eye contact with women when I walked in the door. (and left later with them)​

​

I've had bartenders hook on my conversation topic, clock out and buy me a drink.​

​

I have had women "mistake me for their friend"​

​

I had a woman compliment my hat in an airport.​

​

And a couple times I've had women follow me out of a venue asking if I was single.​

My GF tells me it's because I'm attractive, but I think I have to be giving a vibe of approachableness to invite their warm signals. And the better I felt about my Fitness, and career, and place in life, the more of these warm signals I received from strangers who didn't know me from Adam.

You don't wait for Warm signals....You invite them with your Vibe/Attitude while living your life in the moment. And the ones who do...are higher probability than some cold approach. You invite their invitation so to speak..

 

[Velasco]

You don't wait for Warm signals....You invite them with your Vibe/Attitude while living your life in the moment.

Correct. Good social mood in the moment outside of your head.

 

[BeExcellent]

Ok but rejection and initation is not what i am talking about

What i am talking about is the stages after where women constantly test boundaries and shift dynamics "because they can"

If it was case of boy meets girl and boy has too pluck up the courage to approach and girl drops at his feet we would have a simple solution and there would hardly be any single people anywhere

(To be fair in the 70's and prior i think this probably was a fair depcition )

But today it isn't ..... a lot of attractive modern single women are spoiled they WANT to test every single fibre of a mans being and if he fails at any moment he is discarded like a used playtoy who cares theres another 1,2 300 guys to choose from in the DM's ,swipe apps whatever

I am witnessing it in real time with a 21y/o i have spinning , she's attracted to me , she submisses to me, she sends me nudes, i cannot assert anymore dominance over her without becoming her actual father

But STILL i can almost see the little cogs in the back of her head whirring thinking " what else is available on instagram " because the temptation is just too much for these girls

It's the equivalent of me being put in a room everyday with 200 lingerie clad women and a box of viagra

Ok. That’s fair. So in this case you have to decide what your individual goals are. If you want to simply spin plates and do the short term thing then who cares about attention w h o r I n g? If you desire something more meaningful then you are well served to filter those attention seekers out if you find a desirable girl in your stable who warrants further investment.

You have to also become oblivious to the 200 lingerie clad women and the Viagra so to speak.

I could go out for dinner and drinks and get a free meal every night if I want to. But then I would be using men and taking advantage. I could get laid every night by someone new too. That is not what I value so it’s not what I do. Even though I could. I’m not tempted by that.

Similarly I know a man who managed a huge strip club. Semi nude & nude women were normal for him all day every day. He wasn’t affected by that after a while.

Attention seekers are shallow women trying to gain validation. Looking to branch swing. Dismiss them for that behavior and keep screening.

Screen based on YOUR desires. Pay attention to women who indicate that they want YOU in particular. If you aren’t able to hold the interest of the women you desire, then you need to make whatever adjustments in yourself that up your appeal or you need to accept the situation for what it is…and you can do either or both while continuing to screen.

It’s not as complicated as some of you make it. It isn’t. My 19 yo son is not having these issues. He’s good looking but he’s only 5’8” and he’s a college student. He is happy in a LTR. And if it ends he knows he can replace her.

 

[Don Dark Horse]

You don't wait for Warm signals....You invite them with your Vibe/Attitude while living your life in the moment. And the ones who do...are higher probability than some cold approach. You invite their invitation so to speak..

Thanks for this nugget of wisdom.

 

[lost_blackbird]

The male birthright is to initiate; to take initiative, to approach.

Yeah, I'll pass. I've never approached a woman in my entire life. Not. Even. Once.
Fvck that!

 

[BeExcellent]

Correct. Good social mood in the moment outside of your head.

Agree. You create in large measure your own luck in this way.