Men are responsible for women's immorality

[Trader]

"The female is always following following following the male. Women might not like to hear it, and men might be unaware of it, but it is as true as rain.

If the male becomes a slut, the female becomes a slut. He defines her very slut-hood, by his OWN license. She may try to tempt him, but in the path society follows, the male is the point of the arrow that leads the way.

The female will always say: 'What's good for the goose is good for the gander.'

It goes as far as abortion, if men did not accept the destruction of their own children, it would be unthinkable for the female.

So the only way women can improve is when men improve, when men don't set the moral tone and establish a high benchmark for moral behavior, all is lost.

The female can't save him and lead him to higher ground - because her heart's desire is to serve and follow him.

Even when feminists insert ideas in her that to pursue self-adulation and vanity, even the vainglorious self-absorbed female does not find fulfillment without following and serving a good male.

This is at the kernel of the female heart.

Men need to rescue women from destruction, by rescuing THEMSELVES from destruction. Become a moral man, raise up higher standards in your culture for sex and your social atmosphere.

If enough men regenerate women will follow. Then women's places and men's places will be re-established.

Without male moral leadership, the world comes crumbling down. " ~ Julian Lee

 

[jophil28]

The essence of your post is very, very, right ( language aside) - men are designed to lead and women to follow.

When we stopped leading, and became followers of women's wants whims and feelings, we reversed natural law and the end result is the miserable discontent that many men experience . Disillusionment and bewilderment inevitable flows.

How deeply disturbing for a man to work diligently his whole lifetime only to be lost in the pain of divorce with a wife who took every advantage of his labors and repaid his commitment by cheating.

Choose wisely, men.

 

[Poonani Maker]

I agree. It's like letting the fish lead you. NO, you lead it, to your hook. Fish are stupid.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

So, to set a proper 'moral' example, should I expect my wife to cover herself head to toe in a burka or would a modest pair of jeans and blouse be acceptable? Should she walk 8 paces behind me, or would it be OK for us to walk together and hold hands? I'm a little concerned, should I go to jail for the honor killing of my daughter when she dates a man of another religion?


You see morality is great, when you're the one defining 'moral' behavior.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear ChildTrader,
Where are some of you guys coming from?"The female is always following following following the male".You must be on drugs.

 

[mrRuckus]

If this sort of thing is to be believed, does it follow that women shouldn't have equal rights?

It just seems that everyone thinks women are just biologically incapable of handling them. If it's going to be my fault for everything that women do, then provide me with the tools and stop shackling me from controlling them.

It's pretty difficult to set examples or even grab your balls and challenge a woman if you're married to her and fear that any false word is going to get everything you spent your life earning taken away, for example.

 

[STR8UP]

I haven't read too much from the great philosophers when it comes to women and the mating game, but a lot of the quotes that I have seen are congruent with what I myself have witnessed in real life.

The "mirror" thing is one of them. I truly believe that in order for a woman to be her "best", she has to seek out the best man for her, allow him to lead, and be a "reflection" of him.

Some of the stuff in your quote is utterly ridiculous though. He is implying that by a man cheating it is giving woman a license to cheat? Bollocks. If anything a man cheating (if he has enough value) will make his woman LESS likely to cheat.

It comes down to the fact that this "reflection" is more as seen through the eyes of society, and not that a woman directly copies everything a man does.

Don't think for one second that a woman mirrors a man's morals. No. Her morals are simply kept in check by his relative value and ability to lead.

 

[Trader]

If this sort of thing is to be believed, does it follow that women shouldn't have equal rights?

Women shouldn't have equal rights, and they themselves really didn't even care about having all those extra rights and privileges anyway. Just take a look at women's suffrage - at the time most women were totally indifferent to *wanting to be able to vote.* But of course, then the feminist brainwashing began and then women slowly demanded more and more rights.

It just seems that everyone thinks women are just biologically incapable of handling them. If it's going to be my fault for everything that women do, then provide me with the tools and stop shackling me from controlling them.

It's pretty difficult to set examples or even grab your balls and challenge a woman if you're married to her and fear that any false word is going to get everything you spent your life earning taken away, for example.

I agree. That's why I am very hesitant about getting married in the US - the laws are totally stacked against the male. If you get into any heated argument with a girl, she can call the police and report domestic violence and get you sent to jail without any evidence at all - all due to VAWA (violence against women act)

What's hillarious is I have a friend from South Korea, and he told me, yes it is true, you can hit girls there, and that is accepted by society. Though guys only do it when the girl is way out of line, to put her in her place. Marriage in their culture is a lot more stable than it is in the US.

 

[Trader]

Some of the stuff in your quote is utterly ridiculous though. He is implying that by a man cheating it is giving woman a license to cheat? Bollocks. If anything a man cheating (if he has enough value) will make his woman LESS likely to cheat.

I'm sure you have heard girls say this before: 'It's so unfair, if guys sleep around, they are players. But if we do it, then we are sluts!'

Then of course she always goes on to say: 'Well...if guys are doing it, then we girls should be able to do it too!'

Just another variation of the old saying: 'What's good for the goose, is good for the gander.'

If a man has high value and is cheating, the girl will probably STAY with him (because he has high value), but now the man is giving her license to cheat on the side, and she will sure as hell take advantage of that.

Don't think for one second that a woman mirrors a man's morals. Her morals are simply kept in check by his relative value and ability to lead.

This is where I disagree with you. If you are the high-value, Alpha Male BUT you have no morals, sure the girl is going to STAY with you, but she's not going to develop any morals herself. She might cheat on you on the side, or lie to your face, backstab you, etc. She sees you behaving that way, and again she thinks: 'what's good for the goose is good for the gander.'

If you want a girl to be attracted to you: all you need is value in some form or another (fame, money, masculinity, humor etc)

But if you want a girl to act moral, there is only ONE way - you are going to have to be moral yourself. No amount of DHV (demonstrating high value) on your part is going to do it. There is NO substitute for morality.

Scary thought for you - I know.

 

[Rogue]

STR8UP:
He is implying that by a man cheating it is giving woman a license to cheat? Bollocks.

Yes. You reap what you sow. Neither party has the right to cheat but if either party does cheat it does feed the rationalizations of cognitive dissonance in the mind of the other party that cheating is permissable. There was a thread not too long ago of a man admitting to his girl he had cheated on her -- what did she then do, she cheated on him in retaliation. It is often said women are like children and children look up to their parents to see what are behavioral norms. I wholeheartedly disagree with you that cheating increases the liklihood of fidelity; it increases the probability of being cheated on. Some men are moral, women are amoral, and the only thing you can do is be moral and ethical yourself.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

There is NO substitute for morality.

Who's morality?

 

[Trader]

Who's morality?

I'm not here to impose my morality on you. I have my own set of beliefs but every man must work out on his own what he will stand for.

The point is simple, and the point is this: 'Whatever morality you expect your girl to have (i.e. fidelity) - YOU must uphold that morality.' Your girl is looking to you to be the moral leader, she is looking to your actions to see what is permissible and what is not.

The kind of relationship you want and expect will be different from mine, to each his own.

 

[Colossus]

But if you want a girl to act moral, there is only ONE way - you are going to have to be moral yourself. No amount of DHV (demonstrating high value) on your part is going to do it.

Wrong. Find a girl whose own moral standards are congruent with your own. Dont think that your behavior is somehow going to magically align her moral compass with yours.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

What if my definition of 'morality' is defined by polygamy, while expecting my wives to remain faithful to me? There have been many cultures where, not only was this was the case, but was considered a 'moral' obligation for women.

 

[bukowski_merit]

If a man has high value and is cheating, the girl will probably STAY with him (because he has high value), but now the man is giving her license to cheat on the side, and she will sure as hell take advantage of that.

This is just not true...
As a man who sees it from the other end (often as the guy the girls are cheating with) - i find that the women who are cheating are with guys who #1 put them on a pedestal. and #2 have done nothing wrong to them (other than provide them with a boring common life).

I rarely find women who'll cheat because their bf is an a'hole or because he cheats on her.... the women who stick with men who do that stuff to them are not dedicating themselves to "getting back" at him - they're dedicating themselves to trying to make sure he doesn't cheat on them again. And they will keep failing which will only make them fall more and more for him.

you believe philosophers.... i'll believe social psychology (and personal experience).

 

[Trader]

This is just not true...
As a man who sees it from the other end (often as the guy the girls are cheating with) - i find that the women who are cheating are with guys who #1 put them on a pedestal. and #2 have done nothing wrong to them (other than provide them with a boring common life).

You did not contradict anything I said. Try to follow me logically here:

You are saying: 'Moral guys who put girls on a pedestal and/or are just plain boring (in other words guys with no value) - will have their gf cheat on them, and you have slept with those girls.'

Thank you for restating the obvious. If you are moral, but don't have any value, the girl might cheat on you. This is elementary. We are NOT talking about the case where the guy is low-value. The reason is because, if a guy is low-value, there is NO ATTRACTION to begin with, so then forget even talking about the girl being moral towards you.

What STR8UP was saying was that if you demonstrate high value (i.e. exciting life, dominance, money), you can *get away* with being immoral and still have the girl be moral towards you. This I disagree with.

I rarely find women who'll cheat because their bf is an a'hole or because he cheats on her.... the women who stick with men who do that stuff to them are not dedicating themselves to "getting back" at him - they're dedicating themselves to trying to make sure he doesn't cheat on them again. And they will keep failing which will only make them fall more and more for him.

you believe philosophers.... i'll believe social psychology.

Your 'exceptions' prove the rule. In fact I know a couple of 'exception' cases myself. I know a couple of girls where the bf cheated on her so many times, and she never left him or cheated on him. But the common thread is: they all had low-self esteem and had issues. I highly doubt say Rollo's wife - who I assume to be rather well-adjusted since Rollo knows how to choose women, I highly doubt she would let Rollo cheat on her over and over again. She has something called self-respect - I assume. Though I will let Rollo speak on that one.

Rollo, the more you cheat, the more she will fall in love with you?

Oh and I know another 'exception case' personally as well, the husband cheated on his wife. The wife didn't cheat on him. You're right. She killed him. And she is now in jail.

You can't escape the reality - you don't get what you want, you get what you ARE.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

Women would rather share a successful man than be attached to a faithful loser. - Pook

 

[SXS]

What if my definition of 'morality' is defined by polygamy, while expecting my wives to remain faithful to me? There have been many cultures where, not only was this was the case, but was considered a 'moral' obligation for women.

That's why I think the only value that is compatible with our capitalist society is individualism.

Religion doesn't dictates morals anymore, so where should it come from ? A guy who worships the devil have the same rights as a christian, as long he pays his taxes and does not break the law.

My girl is a fervorous catholic, and used to believe in marrying a virgin, having one man for life, having dozens of kids, just like her mother. But this is just not part of our reality anymore.

Rollo, the more you cheat, the more she will fall in love with you?

Ha, ha, according to some members of this board, not only that, but also cheating would make your girl respects you more...

I know some guys and girls, though, that let their girlfriend/boyfriend cheat on them and pretend not to see it.

 

[bukowski_merit]

What STR8UP was saying was that if you demonstrate high value (i.e. exciting life, dominance, money), you can *get away* with being immoral and still have the girl be moral towards you. This I disagree with.

I disagree with the notion that it's DHV that leads to this. I think simply being good with women (which includes to an extent being able to DHV) is your key to being able to get away with this.

Oh and I know another 'exception case' personally as well, the husband cheated on his wife. The wife didn't cheat on him. You're right. She killed him. And she is now in jail.

which is the alternative to cheating back on them.... another alternative is being a b!tchy mess.... another alternative is becoming extremely supplicant and giving the man anything and everything he wants (in and out of bed) to try to 'win' him back... another alternative is to just ignore it (which is what a lot of women do).

You can't escape the reality - you don't get what you want, you get what you ARE.

There's "some" truth to this. But there's many more exceptions. Lots of self-help gurus preach this stuff, so excuse me for not believing completely in marketing schemes that sound better than they exist.

 

[jophil28]

Trader, I think that the point that you are trying to make (against high odds here ) is being lost in the squabbling from polar opposite viewpoints.

The title of this thread is unfortunate too. It suggest strongly that we men have another unwanted or unintended burden in being responsible for womens' moral actions, or lack of them.
I would agree with you that part of leading a woman is setting a moral and ethical standard..."Leading by example" is what they used to call it back in the day.
Being clear about what you will do and won't do morally and ethically will INCREASE the chances of her aligning herself with your values if she shares some of your values in the first place.
HOWEVER,this is human behavior and there are NO guarantees .

The problem arises when men enter into an LTR with a woman purely because she is HOT, but who has adopted a set of values which are not similar ENOUGH to his own.

YOu may succeed in keeping her on the straight and narrow for a while, BUT if her conditioning is stronger than your ability or wiilingness to lead and assert influence, she will fukk up eventually.
I have been in that situation and it is a nightmare.

Better to chose a closer match in the first place .