Matrix is becoming more than the norm (wife cheating thread)...

[jophil28]

Its what you do when things go wrong that say the most about you. Without standards, values and expectations and the behavior that shows you they are real, you will simply be blown about by events and the whims of other people.

Tictac

Yep.

It is also what you do when you know that nobody is watching.

 

[Colossus]

TICTAC has made some great points.

As they say, a man who can't control his woman is amusing.

"Controlling" someone else is an illusion. You are NEVER responsible for the actions of others. Think about it.


I think the whole "for the kids" thing is the biggest load of irrational BS. People don't even think about this before they say it. Please explain to me how those young children are going to have a BETTER life and upbringing living with a mother and father who resent each other, and with a father who took back his wife that he caught red-handed fvcking another man. Unbelieveable.

You know what sucks? BOTH outcomes are sh!tty. Divorce sucks for kids, period. If the couple goes through with the divorce, the kids then have the now-typical American life to look forward to: splitting time between dad and mom, being introduced to whoever mommy or daddy is fvcking for the time being, maybe getting a little attached, then having the cycle start all over again. On the other hand, if they stayed together "for the kids", The see that their parents hate and dont respect each other, so this is what they know. This is what they will likely carry into THEIR future relationships.

 

[Tictac]

You know what sucks? BOTH outcomes are sh!tty. Divorce sucks for kids, period. If the couple goes through with the divorce, the kids then have the now-typical American life to look forward to: splitting time between dad and mom, being introduced to whoever mommy or daddy is fvcking for the time being, maybe getting a little attached, then having the cycle start all over again. On the other hand, if they stayed together "for the kids", The see that their parents hate and dont respect each other, so this is what they know. This is what they will likely carry into THEIR future relationships.

Colossus,

All true. And more.

Kids are excellent 'crap dectectors'. They know when s*** is being shovelled. So staying together 'for the kids' is in my judgement harmful. It just adds deception to deceit. And it does this to the most vulnerable.

I'd rather teach my children values, standards and expectations. You can't have that in an infidelity. And so you wreck your own kids for selfish reasons (what will the neighbors think, yada yada.)

It hurt like Hell to get my ex out of here! I offered her a chance to work on the marriage. She declined. I saw a lawyer and filed the same day I confronted her.

I'm no macho man. I cried like a baby (and for months) when no one was watching. But no one gets to do that to me. And no one gets to teach our kids that this kind of crap is okay, even their Mother.

As for the double bind the children end up in, true also. But I have found research that suggests that one strong parent can get children to a good place. Obviously two would be better. But if that cannot happen than somebody has to take it on. While I regret the circumstances, the task is mine and with pleasure. My children are the most interesting people I've ever met.

I have seen them getting stronger in recent months. They don't want to be in this situation. Who would? But they will make it if it is the only thing I accomplish in this life.

Courage, fidelity, strength,
Tictac

 

[STR8UP]

This is what happens when women have absolutely no fear of any consequences. No fear of losing the house. No fear of losing the kids. No fear of having the "lifestyle she's accustomed to" diminished in any way. Hell, no fear of physical harm. The only way to offset vag moistening from other men, these days, is with the fear of losing you- if she stops thinking that you're a catch, or dosent care for you anymore, then all bets are off.

This is what needs to be drilled into every man's head- the only thing that matters is RELATIVE VALUE.

With most men, their value drops the day they say "I do". To make matters worse, the woman has no incentive to make it work, and every incentive to leave as soon as the attraction begins to wane.

If you aren't prepared to be a STRONGER, MORE MASCULINE man who constantly works to increase his value AFTER you get married, DON'T EVEN THINK ABOUT IT.

What kind of s*** is that to have kids see? What kind of person would do that?

When you have to ask "what kind of person" is capable of this, you haven't yet realized that ANYONE is capable of this. Some more than others, obviously, but only a fool thinks that HIS girl is "above" that.

Listen up - any man who would take another man's wife is not a man at all. I don't care if she inserts you into her while singing 'God Save the Queen'. If you are a man, you will recognize a low quality woman (or one with mental issues) and walk away. My wife was a beautiful woman, great lover, fantastic mother, daughter, sister - all of it. She traded it in for cheap laughs.

It sounds to me like you are blaming the man for your wife's indiscretions.

It has been my experience and the experience of other men I know that in almost every case, it is the married woman who is the aggressor.

Chicks are the ones who blame the other party for ruining a relationship. Fact of the matter is, your wife was SOLELY responsible for the damage caused to your family.

I would even go so far as to say that he did you a favor. Now you KNOW your wife. Before, you didn't.

But that's not the reason men (or women) don't take another's spouse. Its because of the collateral damage to children, family and friends. No amount of or quality of sex is worth that. If your own short-term pleasure means that much, you've got problems. Unless you truly beleive that its all and only about you (that makes you a narcissist by the way), you walk.

I know it is comforting to think that the mating game should be a fair deal for everyone who puts forth the effort to "do their part", but nothing could be further from the truth. It is actually the highest stakes, most cut-throat form of human interaction that exists. There is a BIOLOGICAL REASON why people are motivated to cheat. Unfortunately in this situation you were the one who got the raw end of the deal.

Trent81,
If you didn't know because you were lied to that's different. No offense intended.

So the responsibility falls squarelyon the woman IF SHE LIES, but the man shares the blame if he is aware of the marriage?

Understand something- the man doesn't owe you ANYTHING. HE isn't wrecking a family, the WIFE is. HE has no accountability, and is not a "lesser" man for taking advantage of a sexual opportunity.

Jophil,
Her Mom and Dad were married 50 years before he died from cancer. It was a great marriage. I saw 25 years of it.

Tictac

Just goes to show that it isn't just the chicks who grew up in broken homes that engage in improper behavior. The floodgates are open for even "normal" women to partake of their carnal desires, despite a decent upbringing.

 

[Colossus]

When you have to ask "what kind of person" is capable of this, you haven't yet realized that ANYONE is capable of this. Some more than others, obviously, but only a fool thinks that HIS girl is "above" that.

I agree that no one is categorically 'above' cheating.

It sounds to me like you are blaming the man for your wife's indiscretions.

I dont think he is blaming the man, but rather expressing disgust that he took advantage of a married woman's advance. Fair response given the circumstance.

I would even go so far as to say that he did you a favor. Now you KNOW your wife. Before, you didn't.

This is where your fatalism starts to reek. You imply that his wife was, essentially, a ticking time bomb of infidelity that was waiting for the right moment to go off, to the complete ignorance of her husband. I venture to say he knew his wife as well as you could know a woman after 24 years, but things transpired in a way that fostered her cheating. In the end, she still made the choice. But, had his frame been managed differently, her infidelity may not have come to pass.

HE isn't wrecking a family, the WIFE is. HE has no accountability, and is not a "lesser" man for taking advantage of a sexual opportunity.

That man has the same accountabilty for what happed as Tictac's ex-wife. HER choice wrecked the family, but it takes two to tango. If he wasnt there she may have done it with someone else, but it doesnt change the fact he knew this was a married woman with a family and chose to do it anyway, which IMO makes him a d0uchebag. The difference is the consequences for the ex wife and for mr. bad boy are radically different.

Just goes to show that it isn't just the chicks who grew up in broken homes that engage in improper behavior. The floodgates are open for even "normal" women to partake of their carnal desires, despite a decent upbringing.

Again with your borderline defeatist attitude. Like Tictac said, no one is immune to these events, but you are significantly LESS likely to have this outcome if you select women who do come from good homes, provided other conditions are met. Your view is that they all can, and the vast majority of them will, so you may as well never get married or just mentally prepare yourself for the impending debauchery your wife will engage in. Are you at 7000 posts yet?

 

[KontrollerX]

"I feel like I'm by myself on this."

Thats one of life's test of a true man.

Can you stand alone and not back down on your convictions?

Be there for your buddy and help him make the right decision and get this piece of trash out of his life no matter how much whining lesser men and emotional women do.

"This is what happens when women have absolutely no fear of any consequences. No fear of losing the house. No fear of losing the kids. No fear of having the "lifestyle she's accustomed to" diminished in any way. Hell, no fear of physical harm. The only way to offset vag moistening from other men, these days, is with the fear of losing you- if she stops thinking that you're a catch, or dosent care for you anymore, then all bets are off."

Absolutely brilliant and something thats been on my mind for a long time as one of the roots of the current social problems between men and women.

Women's consequence for screwing a man over 50 years ago by cheating on him provoking divorce destroying her family and leaving her husband for Lorenzo the pool boy was to be socially ostracized and looked upon like the piece of sh!t she was.

Today women have practically unlimited power and absolute power as the saying goes corrupts absolutely.

Today when a woman does that she's greeted by a sickening chorus of "you go girl".

When society does not provide an environment where all forms of wrongdoing are punished society gets punished by vigilante's such as the Harris, Klebold, Cho, Bryant's and Sodini's of the world that are tired of waiting for society to do the right thing and create a just environment for them to live in.

"This is where your fatalism starts to reek. You imply that his wife was, essentially, a ticking time bomb of infidelity that was waiting for the right moment to go off, to the complete ignorance of her husband."

Actually he implied nothing.

The wife could have gone either way but when she chose infidelity over loyalty that moment is when the husband can understand in good confidence what his wife's character was made of all along and it turned out in her case biology trumped convictions.

"I venture to say he knew his wife as well as you could know a woman after 24 years"

You can never really know anyone but yourself.

Other people are always prone to be random.

The only thing we have to go on for some vague judging of character is actions and sure the woman held loyal for a long time but that doesn't mean it was because she was a loyal person.

Perhaps she only held loyal because her husband was still the best man she had yet encountered.

"but things transpired in a way that fostered her cheating. In the end, she still made the choice. But, had his frame been managed differently, her infidelity may not have come to pass."

Or it very well may of come to pass even had his frame been perfectly tailored to her perhaps because above all else maybe she was craving both a man with her husband's traits but something her husband could never be...

New.

A totally different and new person.

Newness.

The unexplored territory.

New validation of her attractiveness indicating its not just hubby going through the motions of complimenting the old bag of bones to keep the peace but new validation from a new man indicating for 110% certainty that she's still got it within her to attract a man.

"he knew this was a married woman with a family and chose to do it anyway, which IMO makes him a d0uchebag."

The woman has 110% of the blame for putting herself on the market.

Just about every guy on the planet save for the 0.5% jophil, interceptors and collossus's of the world are going to get down with her.

Rather I'd argue under that reality it makes a man a douchebag for turning down the prospect of easy p00n.

Rejecting her advances just leaves a guy with blue balls while another guy gets to hit it and the same moral evil is carried out anyway.

As Darth Vader would say "It is pointless to resist!"

"Again with your borderline defeatist attitude."

Its biology not defeatism.

"Like Tictac said, no one is immune to these events, but you are significantly LESS likely to have this outcome if you select women who do come from good homes, provided other conditions are met."

So the propaganda says.

In reality one side's opinion is just as good as the others on this issue.

In todays world I really don't believe the bar skank is anymore prone to cheat than the so called "quality woman" raised in a Christian home and beaten into morality submission daily by sadistic nuns.

"Your view is that they all can, and the vast majority of them will, so you may as well never get married or just mentally prepare yourself for the impending debauchery your wife will engage in. Are you at 7000 posts yet?"

He's got the statistics to back up his viewpoint.

What do you have other than hope and a dream to prove yours?

 

[ketostix]

Originally Posted by Aenigma
This is what happens when women have absolutely no fear of any consequences. No fear of losing the house. No fear of losing the kids. No fear of having the "lifestyle she's accustomed to" diminished in any way. Hell, no fear of physical harm. The only way to offset vag moistening from other men, these days, is with the fear of losing you- if she stops thinking that you're a catch, or dosent care for you anymore, then all bets are off.

This is what happens when women have absolutely no fear of any consequences. No fear of losing the house. No fear of losing the kids. No fear of having the "lifestyle she's accustomed to" diminished in any way. Hell, no fear of physical harm. The only way to offset vag moistening from other men, these days, is with the fear of losing you- if she stops thinking that you're a catch, or dosent care for you anymore, then all bets are off."[/b]

Absolutely brilliant and something thats been on my mind for a long time as one of the roots of the current social problems between men and women.

Women's consequence for screwing a man over 50 years ago by cheating on him provoking divorce destroying her family and leaving her husband for Lorenzo the pool boy was to be socially ostracized and looked upon like the piece of sh!t she was.

Today women have practically unlimited power and absolute power as the saying goes corrupts absolutely.

Today when a woman does that she's greeted by a sickening chorus of "you go girl".

When society does not provide an environment where all forms of wrongdoing are punished society gets punished by vigilante's such as the Harris, Klebold, Cho, Bryant's and Sodini's of the world that are tired of waiting for society to do the right thing and create a just environment for them to live in.

This is exactly how I see it as well. Anyone is capable of anything, but it's only women who are allowed and even encouraged to do most anything and everything and get away with it. Also I don't really buy the argument that a man who knowingly sleeps with a married woman is never in the wrong. Many times they are. If a person feels it's wrong to sleep with the buddy's wife than it's just as wrong to sleep with some other guy's wife.
And the truth is most of the guys would sleep with their buddy's wife in the right circumstances.If a married woman came on to me, I wouldn't say I'd neevr sleep with her, but I probably wouldn't. But if I did I sure wouldn't say what I did was the right move.

We can argue all day about whether a married woman cheating is right/wrong, and how probable it is a woman will cheat, but the bottom line is there has to be accountability and expectations. The fact that there's no accountability for women in marriage or for just sexual relationships in general is a really stupid thing IMO.

 

[amoka]

Does your friend have a photograph of them in action?

 

[STR8UP]

I dont think he is blaming the man, but rather expressing disgust that he took advantage of a married woman's advance. Fair response given the circumstance.

Here is a quote (although maybe slightly out of context) from today's blog post by roissy

Here’s a clue, chipmunk-cheeked conservatives: If you wish to change the behavior of men, you first must change the behavior of women. The penis parades to the ***** tune, not the other way around. Your chivalry and paeans to honor and duty do nothing but fuel the decline. Guys like me laugh at your sacrifice.

Honor and duty have no place in the mating game. It is dog eat dog. Honor and duty amongst FRIENDS is an entirely different story.

When I have sex with a married woman, I am simply playing a part in the natural order of things. I accept that this might carry SLIGHT risks, but I do not have even the slightest moral qualms with sexing a married woman.

Men espouse the importance of honor while perched on their high-horse, but most of this is out of FEAR that someone like me doesn't have a problem with giving a married woman what she is already asking for. Lowering the bar is wishful thinking, but it doesn't stop a lot of men from doing just that.

As roissy pointed out- it has nothing to do with men and EVERYTHING to do with women.

This is where your fatalism starts to reek. You imply that his wife was, essentially, a ticking time bomb of infidelity that was waiting for the right moment to go off, to the complete ignorance of her husband. I venture to say he knew his wife as well as you could know a woman after 24 years, but things transpired in a way that fostered her cheating. In the end, she still made the choice. But, had his frame been managed differently, her infidelity may not have come to pass.

Yea, usually the things that transpire to foster the cheating are:

• woman loses attraction for husband due to multiple reasons
• woman begins to take more care in her appearance
• woman gets attention from men
• woman accepts attention from men
• woman goes out and has a few drinks with friends/coworkers
• woman is attracted to a friend of a friend or a coworker, and proceeds to seduce him

Dude, I've watched this play out many times, and it's always the same. The married woman hunts for c0ck. Married chicks are the MOST aggressive and easiest to fukk, not the other way around.

That man has the same accountabilty for what happed as Tictac's ex-wife.

Accountable to who? God?

The difference is the consequences for the ex wife and for mr. bad boy are radically different.

Consequences?

What? The 1% chance that the husband does track you down and try to beat your ass?

I would venture to say that you are just as likely to get punched hitting on a random chick in a bar.

This is nothing but a rationalization.

Your view is that they all can, and the vast majority of them will, so you may as well never get married or just mentally prepare yourself for the impending debauchery your wife will engage in.

No, my view is to never get married, but if you do get married for whatever reason, you remain cognizant of the possibility and you MAINTAIN FRAME to minimize the chances of it happening. If it does, then you DUMP THE B!TCH and don't look back.

Are you at 7000 posts yet?

Why? Can't handle stuff that makes you uneasy?

If a person feels it's wrong to sleep with the buddy's wife than it's just as wrong to sleep with some other guy's wife.

Apples to oranges.

In the context of social dynamics in the mating game, morals and ethics are virtually useless. In the context of society in general, they are very useful. If I sleep with a buddy's girl, I stand to lose a lot. If I sleep with the wife of a stranger, I have little to lose.

And the truth is most of the guys would sleep with their buddy's wife in the right circumstances.

I agree. But THAT is treading dangerous waters.

If a married woman came on to me, I wouldn't say I'd neevr sleep with her, but I probably wouldn't. But if I did I sure wouldn't say what I did was the right move.

C'mon man. there is no right and wrong when it comes to this stuff. Society has brainwashed you into thinking there is so the game can be played ON you but not BY you. Think back to how many times you have been cheated on, lied to, etc. Who came out ahead? It wasn't you, aside from the fact that you learned who you were dealing with and were then able to act accordingly.

 

[Aenigma]

Congrats on filtering out over a thousand women to finally land a "Quality" woman.

Where are the moral crusaders now?



My cousin married a wonderful woman from a wonderful, stable family. Together they had 3 children. My cousin slaved like a dog for his family. He drove 88 miles each way to work; when he got home, he made his own dinner because the family couldn't "wait" for him, and then he went into the basement where he worked another 4 hours doing his second job so the family would have extra money. He went to bed at midnight and was up at 4am.

Low and behold, NONE of the children were his. His entire life of toil and sacrifice was one big giant joke on him. Three children, three different men. He got divorced and lived in a tiny apartment while his wife got the house, cars, kids, and 55% of his gross pay for the next 15 years. She partied it up with his money banging new guys every week while he was forced through threats of imprisonment to fund three other mens ejaculate and her partying while he survived on ramen noodles and cans of tuna.

Of course after all that time bonding with the children he fell in love with them. Now that they are all grown up, they treat him like dirt and only come around for money all the while looking up to their newly discovered and "cool" biological daddy's.

Like I said- I don't understand how guy's don't lose it and exact bloody retribution under circumstances like this.

What ever happened to men like Odysseus? He slaughtered men, by the dozen, for even having the audacity to COURT his woman and mistreat his family/servants while he was away... for 20 years!!

Maybe that's what it takes to make a woman loyal- being man enough to be violent when your own biological interests are on the line. Being man enough to say "I love you- but if you cross me: you, your progeny, and those you crossed me with are all dead." I think women are attracted to such types because in insuring that their own genes are passed on that they indicate to women that their sons will have the same genetic tenactiy as their fathers.

In other words- if you're the type who will continue to work and slave in a cuckhold situation- its more likely to happen to you. If you're the type who would slaughter your wife, her illicit partners, and her bastard children your less likely to be cheated on.

Even if this isn't the case I'd be damned before I spent my life as the slave to a lying w*****. Bloody retruibution and justice would be mine before I slipped off into the night to start a new life.

 

[Mr. Me]

I don't consider myself a moral crusader, but rather, pragmatic, a realist, but also I think that we're not helpless slaves to our biological urges. I also don't slam women 100% of the time because any relationship is simply a reflection of the two people in it. And god knows that we, as humans, tend to not accept criticism, not see the part we play in anything, minimize it away if anything, and it'sd much easier to blame others then acknowledge our part. So when a relationship goes south and the woman starts screwing around, you have to wonder, why did it go south? Why is this woman, who once was a devoted, loving wife, now f@cking strangers? Not to excuse her actions. A "quality woman" would opt for divorce first and then screw around, not the other way around.

So these guys who come home to find their wives in bed with another guy... you have to think that the woman lost respect and love for the dude way before she woke up that particular morning. It took a while to happen. They don't just decide one fine day to have an affair.

It starts with the guy either committing to a less then good person or they chipped away at whatever measure of love the woman had. C'mon! 80% of the divorces in this country are filed by women. Then who knows how many relationships are ended by women. They want out of the relationships. So, why? I mean, they go to another relationship so it's not that they don't want a man or a relationship. They just don't want the relationship anymore with the last man. Why? They did once.

I'm telling you, it's usually the guy's fault. He neglects her, he disrespects her, emotionally or verbally abuses her, these are the reasons women want out. Had a friend recently who got into being very negative and critical with his gal - couldn't help it, he said. Times are tough, he has stress. It's real life. Argued with her over any little thing - hey, she got tired of it and left. I'd do the same. In fact, I have. Guys let their guard down. they become complacent. They take the chick for granted. It ultimately has consequences. This is the way it is. You can argue why and you can debate scientific to philosophical stands on it, but it's still gonna be what it's gonna be.

So men, you really do have to figure out what part you played in having the relationship go south. By pointing this out, I'm not being a feminist, moralist or sympathizer, I'm just being real. Two people are in the relationship. One loses interest in the other. Do the math.

It's a frickin' game. It's called "relationships". Lots of people want one, yet few know how to keep it going. Don't blame the exes for falling out of love, that's your responsibility. How they decided to handle it, yeah, that's entirely their responsibility.

 

[Luthor Rex]

Congrats on filtering out over a thousand women to finally land a "Quality" woman.

Where are the moral crusaders now?



My cousin married a wonderful woman from a wonderful, stable family. Together they had 3 children. My cousin slaved like a dog for his family. He drove 88 miles each way to work; when he got home, he made his own dinner because the family couldn't "wait" for him, and then he went into the basement where he worked another 4 hours doing his second job so the family would have extra money. He went to bed at midnight and was up at 4am.

Low and behold, NONE of the children were his. His entire life of toil and sacrifice was one big giant joke on him. Three children, three different men. He got divorced and lived in a tiny apartment while his wife got the house, cars, kids, and 55% of his gross pay for the next 15 years. She partied it up with his money banging new guys every week while he was forced through threats of imprisonment to fund three other mens ejaculate and her partying while he survived on ramen noodles and cans of tuna.

Of course after all that time bonding with the children he fell in love with them. Now that they are all grown up, they treat him like dirt and only come around for money all the while looking up to their newly discovered and "cool" biological daddy's.

This post summarizes the fail of the anti-moral crowd: you people CAN'T tell the difference between decent people and sh!theads. The anti-moral crowd has spent so many years in the gutter, they don't realize that they are in the gutter. White-trash is as white trash does, stop hanging out with losers and you'll stop having losers in your life.

If you think strippers are hot -- then you are filled with FAIL.

If you think a woman who doesn't put out quickly is a prude -- then you are filled with FAIL.

If you think that being a belligerent azz really is the best strategy -- then you are filled with FAIL.

If you live in the white-trash culture -- then you are filled with FAIL.

Your lives are so screwed up because you are lost in that epic storm called the failstrom.

 

[Tazman]

I must admit, women are damn good at what they do.

I have 2 close friends who have LTRs, one is married the other is not. Both their women have flirted with me when we've gotten together for some event (birthdays, etc.).

They're so good at it that they can pull it off right in front of these guys and they're none the wiser. The touching where no one can see, the "coincidental" isolations where they try and take it up a notch because no one is around to witness anything. The more I resist the harder they try. I'll also admit it is damn hard to resist, but I do it because these are guys I've known for a long time and I consider them good friends.

I don't dare say anything to them though because the male ego can be hard to persuade sometimes, and honestly, nothing but covert flirting has gone on.

I wouldn't give any human being a static label such as "quality" or "altruistic", these terms describe behaviors more than anything else, which are always subject to change.

 

[Luthor Rex]

Like I said- I don't understand how guy's don't lose it and exact bloody retribution under circumstances like this.

What ever happened to men like Odysseus? He slaughtered men, by the dozen, for even having the audacity to COURT his woman and mistreat his family/servants while he was away... for 20 years!!

Thank you!

Like I've said over and over, people have embraced the WRONG morality. Odysseus was doing the MORALLY CORRECT thing by bringing the slaughter to his enemies.

Of course these days we'd go to jail, but there is more than one way to skin a feminist cat.

 

[Tazman]

It starts with the guy either committing to a less then good person or they chipped away at whatever measure of love the woman had. C'mon! 80% of the divorces in this country are filed by women. Then who knows how many relationships are ended by women. They want out of the relationships. So, why? I mean, they go to another relationship so it's not that they don't want a man or a relationship. They just don't want the relationship anymore with the last man. Why? They did once.

I'm telling you, it's usually the guy's fault. He neglects her, he disrespects her, emotionally or verbally abuses her, these are the reasons women want out. Had a friend recently who got into being very negative and critical with his gal - couldn't help it, he said. Times are tough, he has stress. It's real life. Argued with her over any little thing - hey, she got tired of it and left. I'd do the same. In fact, I have. Guys let their guard down. they become complacent. They take the chick for granted. It ultimately has consequences. This is the way it is. You can argue why and you can debate scientific to philosophical stands on it, but it's still gonna be what it's gonna be.

I can understand and believe this, but the problem with the way things are now, concerning societal pressures, laws, etc. is that women have no "incentive" to make things work. It's easy for them to get "tired" of things and just leave because there's almost no consequence, hell in some cases it's an advantage.

There's no shortage of men out there willing to bend over backwards to get p-ssy and keep it around, just as there's no shortage of women out there ready to get involved with multiple men to serve whatever purpose they deem necessary at any given time. If it means they have a kid with the guy that won't stick around and marry the provider, so be it, they have free reign to do that (in the U.S. anyway).

I do know that women aren't always to blame, but I see so many more men, including guys I know personally who do everything they're told to do is the "right" thing and get screwed for it.

I've seen the women in my own family do this stuff to guys (who continue to do so), it's a damn shame.

 

[ketostix]

C'mon man. there is no right and wrong when it comes to this stuff. Society has brainwashed you into thinking there is so the game can be played ON you but not BY you. Think back to how many times you have been cheated on, lied to, etc. Who came out ahead? It wasn't you, aside from the fact that you learned who you were dealing with and were then able to act accordingly.

It has nothing to do with societal brainwashing. Society now says it's OK to cheat for all intents and purposes. If me being hypothetically cheated on puts me behind, then cheating is a win-lose proposition. Next the cheater gets cheated on and so on.

What makes it right or wrong is whether it's a win-win proposition or not. I could say society said stealing was wrong, but who made out ahead me or the person who stole from me. Does that justify stealing? It's OK as long as you don't suffer any consequences? To say cheating is justifiable biologically is no different than saying theft is justifiable biologically. Every person is tempted to steal and every person is capable of stealing. The difference is one behavior has consequence and the other doesn't.

Your argument seem to be be there should be no standards for women, and since there's not any standards you can only get ahead by proceeding with no standards. I disagree with the first part but because the first part is a reality the second part is mostly true.

 

[Mr. Me]

>> women have no "incentive" to make things work. It's easy for them to get "tired" of things >>

Well, who has "incentive"? That was the stuff of prior generations when divorce wasn't an option. Aside from those who mistakenly think "we have to stick together for the kids" down to "we have to stick together for the medical insurance" down to the guy who needs to stick it out because it's gonna cost him a small fortune in the divorce, there is no incentive. What? An incentive would be trying to revive a formerly wayward wife to a life where you have to wonder - for the rest of your life - if she every time coming home late from the job or the grocery store was because of traffic or because she was blowing her latest lover? That blows, pun intended.

>> There's no shortage of men out there willing to bend over backwards to get p-ssy and keep it around>>

There's the cause of the goddamn problem right there. Guys have to grow a set and chuck these women to the curb, and not accept lower behavior in their dates either. But that won't happen until they can walk away from the power of puzzy. But look around this forum, there's so many guys that put up with this behavior, that rationalize this behavior, that accept this behavior as the norm, and that's the problem. These guys empower those women.

>> but I see so many more men, including guys I know personally who do everything they're told to do is the "right" thing and get screwed for it.>>

I think that's a whole 'nuther issue. That's more a matter of we guys tend to walk the walk and sincerely want to do the "right thing", because we have this sense of a code of honor that we want to do the right thing. It's noble, it's admirable, it's crazy. But it's why we can march into war. This is why we can stand up for what we believe in. This is why we rise ourselves up and confront even when we really would rather not. Haven't you ever in your life had to stand up for yourself even though it was uncomfortable, not popular, not what you'd want to do BUT you HAD to do it. WE men have that sense, it's what makes us men. Not to sound antiquated, but it's why we're attracted to the personas of a John Wayne, Clark Gable or Gary Cooper. And why women are. These qualities resonate and last through generations because they're universally masculine. It has that masculine quality to it that registers. Deeply. It doesn't always work for us, but we have it nonetheless. Those that don't are considered spineless, true?

 

[STR8UP]

double. damn, i just lost one of the final 100 of my precious few remaining posts......

 

[STR8UP]

What makes it right or wrong is whether it's a win-win proposition or not.

It IS win/win. You get your rocks off and she feels validated.

I approach every business transaction with the goal of win/win. I am working with a company now where we are both excited to do business together because we have similar goals in the same industry, but we aren't competing with each other.

For us to work together this is certainly a win/win, but by me taking my knowledge, expertise, and talent to work with this one company, they will likely gain market share from competitors. win/win/lose

In the case of competitors "losing", that is inconsequential to me. I have no obligation to them.

If a married woman is going to cheat she is going to do it with or without you. I have a married ex that was recently all over my sh!t on facebook, the phone, email, etc, talking about how much she wanted us to get together, but was afraid because she knew "we would be all over each other". I go overseas for a week, and when I come back contact has slowed to a trickle.

I GUARANTEE YOU that she is fukking another one of her exes she rounded up on facebook. She was DYING to cheat.

No big loss to me as I don't go looking for that sort of stuff, but it just goes to show how it works. 95% of the time or more a woman has made up her mind to do it and it's gonna happen, there is nothing you can do or say to "make it better" for her or her husband or her kids or whatever, so you might as well be the one getting a BJ in the parking lot.

I could say society said stealing was wrong, but who made out ahead me or the person who stole from me. Does that justify stealing? It's OK as long as you don't suffer any consequences? To say cheating is justifiable biologically is no different than saying theft is justifiable biologically. Every person is tempted to steal and every person is capable of stealing. The difference is one behavior has consequence and the other doesn't.

Stealing a man's money/watch/car/tv is taking away something that he owns, something that he can physically possess.

The problem with equating stealing to cheating is that you don't OWN a woman. You might be her husband, but you aren't her master in the absolute sense.

Your argument seem to be be there should be no standards for women, and since there's not any standards you can only get ahead by proceeding with no standards. I disagree with the first part but because the first part is a reality the second part is mostly true.

I believe that there should be standards for women, unfortunately the rest of the world doesn't care what I think.

 

[Vlad the Impaler]

What? An incentive would be trying to revive a formerly wayward wife to a life where you have to wonder - for the rest of your life - if she every time coming home late from the job or the grocery store was because of traffic or because she was blowing her latest lover? That blows, pun intended.

This is my new sig. Every time I think about going back to the BPD I will read this.

If I was ever to get into a relationship with that girl, this is EXACTLY how it would be every time she went somewhere.

Maybe that's why she has become cold towards me? Because she knows I have figured her out and she could never get away with her dirty behavior if she is with me. I guarantee she is the "settle and seek" type. She had no idea I knew the game so well she thought I was a fool like the others.