Martial Arts: Zui Quan

[userwhat?]

3. I know for sure that there are no Zui Quan Dojos here. There are some TKD and Kung Fu and Boxing but I dont want those.

hey! go with Kung Fu, what style are they teaching, because drunken style isnt very different than the other styles in terms of the foundation stances and moves, like Mabu (Horse back stance), Gungbu (bow or arrow stance), Pubu (low stance)..they might also help you with your zui quan as well..

 

[theory of knowledge]

zui quan isnt really an official martial art, u know, unlike shaolin, taiji, emei, and so on. its a variation of general kungfu done when drunk, popularized by chinese movies

 

[flippinfreak]

Jeet Kune Do IMO is the best for self defense.

So far my school has incorporated Wing Chun Kung Fu, Muay Thai, Boxing, Aikido, Jui-Jitsu, and some Krav Maga for weapon disarms such as knives/bats. Usually a JKD school teaches Filipino Kali (stick fighting). My school requires 1 year of hard work, and you have to be granted permission. Chances are you will, but at my school they want quality, to make sure you're ready. It's fast and dangerous, but they use body gear and rubber Kali sticks. It's great for learning range. This way you never wasted power in an attack.

I took Kenpo for 4 years when I was in high school. Not my cup of tea. This was like trying to write left handed if you're naturally right. The footwork and stance was the hardest thing to adjust. Right lead forward, it's also my power side. Kenpo was left lead forward and you use your rear attacks for the power. It messes with an attacker as well. Right lead forward, you'd think right hand up to protect your face. JKD teaches "RLF" with your left hand to protect your face, right hand to protect the body. Try the stance, it feels funny at first. Once the footwork is down, you can dance all around them keeping your most powerful attacks within hitting range. If needed, your rear attacks are just as powerful.

My speed and punches are so much stronger now. Little techniques that go a long way. It's like a pitchers mechanics. Small tweaks can improve to huge results. They stress no kicks to the head in a street fight. Totally worthless. Wasted power, you can be knocked off balance, and you leave yourself open for attack. Instead, just drill him in the ribs, thigh, shin, knee (stop kick). If he's some punk who throws ghetto hooks, chances are after a low shin kick, he's not getting back up without stumbling right back to the ground.

Once the punches are thrown, there so much you can do for defense. Trap, counter, clinch, throws, locks, etc. Of course in JKD, everything is simultaneous. Don't trap for defense. Trap for defense so you open up a spot on his body to drill him. Dont like punches? Fine, use elbows! The whole system is what you make of it. No belts, no uniforms, no tournaments. Live training and drills will boost your awareness like never before.

If you train at the right place, with the right people and enivornment, JKD really molds you into the jack of all trades. Dont like something? Dont use it. Most people disregard it because its not in UFC. Two totally different surroundings.

Well if we can't persuade you out of this highly specialized M.A. that was developed for very particular scenarios, and isn't the most effective outside of its illusory deception... hmm, lets see!?

If I were you, and fixated on this style and teaching myself. I would get several books on it, movies, etc. Read them, study them, internalize them. Then like in anything start w. the basics. Practice the fundamentals, the structure of Zui Quan. The drunken, liquid loose timing, to the movements. Then master the feel of that. Stretch yourself into the random extremes of the movement, feeling your body out. Studying where the energy moves, where your grounding is, where the power is, etc. From there; choose 1 Strike. Literally 1. And feel that out. Tie it into your drunken movements. Learn how to throw it most effectively, as well as when to throw it. Get the timing and feel down, until your body's cells naturally know it. Then stitch in another tactic.

Procede in that intuitive nature (since that will be your only guide), stitching in more and more tactics. Then from there, try out some combinations therof. Learn what combinations flow together, and where your openings are in between them.

Then I would even get slightly drunk, alone, for the sole purpose of bringing more authenticity and charisma into your routines. Feel it out... get to know it from a truer perspective to the form it was designed through and for.

From there I would utilize your friends. You mentioned their somewhat accomplished in Tae Kwon Do... use this. Spar w. them. Learn how this art that you've been practicing, and integrated into your body actually responds to real deal interaction. No need to go ape sh!t. Just feel it out. Build yourself into some good sparring through some time, etc. But first explore your body, and how it relates to someone through this art.

All the while when your doing this... start to finish. Try to visualize and mediate these patterns out. Model the masters you watch in the videos you get, in your mind. Play their roles out. Channel the mental frame of this art, feel it, breathe it, integrate it. Whats it trying to express? Find out by asking yourself this question, then mentally grabbing ahold of that feeling/essence and draw it in and through your body with your breathing. At first you'll feel the resistance of your mind through your body to this channeling. But the more you do it... you'll find out, and feel that this channel is expanding. And the feelings of this quality will be more and more integrated into who you are.
Grab ahold of this art as a thought, and keep drawing its quality through, with your concious intention and breath.

With all that said... when your nearing a sticking point and/or plateauing. Forget everything and become it. Your body and mind will have hooked onto this quality strong enough to just be led by it through feeling.

Then go back, and do it all over again... with the new depth of vision and awareness cultivated. Explore the art from start to finish, tasting the infinite subtleties that only reveal themselves to the trained eye.

(by no means am I a master in martial arts, this is just the totality of my experience translated into an offering of your request. Hope you gleamed some light)

Great stuff guys, great fvcking stuff!

 

[Brian20o2]

Thanks DarkLight. Thats what I was really looking for in terms of advice. Anybody else got any ideas?

 

[Shiftkey]

If all you want to get out of martial arts is fitness, buy a 200 lb punching bag. Mix some punching/kicking routines with standard cardio exercises (IE crunches, jumping jacks, etc). Sparring is always good for fitness too, so go ahead and spar with your TKD friends. It really doesn't matter what style you use if all you care about is fitness, so just beat on the punching bag.

Just don't get too confident if you get in a real fight, because you won't know how...

 

[DarkLight]

Cheers'

 

[zip]

You can't teach yourself a martial art.

So don't waste your time, not to mention you will be a total joke.

Look at something practical like Muay Thai classes. In Muay Thai you'll actually learn how to fight and get in GREAT shape while in the process.

Good Luck.

 

[Brian20o2]

Again. For the third time. I am doing this as a fun hobby. I am not (Repeat NOT) Doing this for self defence. NOR do I plan on taking another form of self defence. I dont want your opinion on which martial art kicks the most ass.
I just want to know if anyone could think of any specialty excercises, stretches, or training that would help me train myself in this form of martial art.
I know that alot of this will need me to be able to support my own body weight from many angles. Should I do alot of body weight excercises aside from gym lifting like Pushups, Situps, Dips, Chair Dips, and Leap Jumping when I practice? Also How much cardio? 5 min jog warmup? HIIT? No running just body weight excercises? That kind of info.

I hope this clears things up.

 

[Chillisauce]

I just want to know if anyone could think of any specialty excercises, stretches, or training that would help me train myself in this form of martial art.
I hope this clears things up.

Therein lies the problem, you can no more teach yourself martial arts than i can teach myself how to fly.

Have fun kid.

 

[Brian20o2]

Therein lies the problem, you can no more teach yourself martial arts than i can teach myself how to fly.

Have fun kid.

Well then I guess Ill just look like a drunken balette dancer who wants another round.

Please unless you have some honest advice, dont post on this thread. Simple, no?

 

[PRMoon]

If you're doing it just for I hobby, I recommend taking up a sword form of some kind. Since my fighting form was handed down to me from uncle sam, I took up Iado, which is of course a form of weapons combat. Not like I'll ever need to use it but it also involes the history and anotomy of the japanese sword style. It's interesting, fun, and makes a good conversational topic if you ever see a katana/wakizashi set on some posers mantle.

 

[DarkLight]

Iado is pretty bad ass.

But anyways... back to the man's overly stated intention here.

I understand the consensus opinion here of choose another style (cause that one is too specialized and just sorta sucks outside of its extremely random context... and I agree) but lets help the brutha out.

Also... its clear that nobody can effectively and efficiently learn any martial art thoroughly without a Skilled Teacher. But... considering he doesn't have a teacher in this art locally, and is not looking to train in another art... how bout we bring it back to the point at hand.

Where do you think Martial Arts styles were born from?

They were innovated by individuals. Whether the dynamics of the style were drawn from observation of a praying mantis, or the understanding of lifes energy and its flow between polarity (yin/yang). So open your mind's and draw upon yourself as a creative and intelligent source.

So Brian... dig the collective advice here, thats of value to you... and feel this art out, in a way that sincerely satisfies what your looking to accomplish with it.

Other my previous post and some other good advice, that would best set you on your way (in the limited specific context your after). I would reccomend...

-Losing weight
-Checking out some excercises in flexibility and balance. (cause Drunken boxing is seriously fluid random movements)

I would think a sincere effort in Yoga might bring all 3 of those aspects into your body/mind/life.

Not to mention the infinite other benefits as well as BabyDoll Ass in there
Hope this helps you more'

 

[Shiftkey]

I just want to know if anyone could think of any specialty excercises, stretches, or training that would help me train myself in this form of martial art.

You won't be learning that martial art no matter what you do. There's absolutely nothing we can tell you that will enable this.

Like I said, buy a punching bag and beat on it, because that's all you'll hope to be able to do without a qualified trainer.

 

[DarkLight]

You won't be learning that martial art no matter what you do. There's absolutely nothing we can tell you that will enable this.

Like I said, buy a punching bag and beat on it, because that's all you'll hope to be able to do without a qualified trainer.

If man's books and memory were lost... we'd be fvcked w. that perspective.
So much for the infinite forms of innovation thus far ay!?

 

[Chillisauce]

If man's books and memory were lost... we'd be fvcked w. that perspective.
So much for the infinite forms of innovation thus far ay!?

Knowledge is a cumulative process, if you wanted to invent your own style the best way would be to figure out what works (what body movement makes the bag hurt the most) and apply it to real fights - cutting out anything which doesnt work. Would take him years, people dont wake up one day and think 'hey, i've invented a martial arts style'.

By using books you cut out this trial and error stage, you miss little, crucial bits of the puzzle. Thats why this plan is flawed, i've seen it many times at my boxing gym. People coming in having learnt how to throw a jab, cross or hook off the internet and not being able to throw it hard, fast, accuratly or even get the rudimentary body movements (which diagrams usually miss) correct.

With that out of the way:

Well then I guess Ill just look like a drunken balette dancer who wants another round.

If you really must go through with this, it would definately make the concepts alot easier to grasp if you took a few months at the local kung fu school first, (figuring out the basic body movements and theories such as the centreline). The styles are very similar.

Thats the only real advice i can offer bar get a trainer . Good luck.

 

[DarkLight]

Do you honestly think I'm under the delusion that someone can "wake up one day and think 'hey I've invented a martial arts style?"

I'm merely suggesting the reality and possibility from which other forms have been created. The dude obviously is stuck on this style, and there is no teacher in this art available.

Now with that knowledge, and the intention to still help him out... what to do!? Ignowledge such levels of creation, and wish the chap well. It is up to him, what he wants to make out of it. Thats true even IF he had a teacher available.

I just don't see any use in trying to assist him with valueless advice, like... "your up sh!t's creek buddy... give it up, before you start."

So... you got the only open perspective and answer I could assist his goal with. Simple? ...Yes! But by no means ignorant.

 

[Egoist]

You won't be learning that martial art no matter what you do. There's absolutely nothing we can tell you that will enable this.

Like I said, buy a punching bag and beat on it, because that's all you'll hope to be able to do without a qualified trainer.

seriously!

I don't know how dumb people get thinking they can learn martial arts, especially something as complicated and subtle as kung fu (whether or not its effective in practice is another question) ON THEIR OWN. A fvcking book? YOU HAVE TO BE KIDDING ME.

OP: Seriously, don't waste your time. I mean just drop the whole idea, its BS. The only thing you really can do by yourself is good shadowboxing/heavy bag workout. And thats only if you know how to punch correctly, correct stances and so on.

But seriously, heavy bag + appropriate workouts aimed towards martial arts fitness would get you much further than 90% of martial arts out there, and definitely anything you learn from a book. Throw in some sparring/instruction and you're golden.

As far as kung fu and TKD sh!t being effective in a fight? hehehe.... Lets just say the only chinese art proven in fights against other combat arts was the freestyle kickboxing style similar to MT. I forgot the chinese name. Well and properly taught Wing Chun is good, but maybe 1 out of 100 WC instructors actually know their sh!t and it takes AGES to just get the proper mechanics of it.

A year of MT/kickboxing or BJJ will get you more than any traditional martial art will in 5 years.

 

[Shiftkey]

I'm merely suggesting the reality and possibility from which other forms have been created. The dude obviously is stuck on this style, and there is no teacher in this art available.

New martial arts are born by mastering pre-existing martial arts from a teacher and altering them after decades of fine tuning - not reading books.

But it's a moot point anyway because he's not trying to invent a new martial art. He's trying to learn one that already exists, and you can't do that without a teacher.

 

[DarkLight]

New martial arts are born by mastering pre-existing martial arts from a teacher and altering them after decades of fine tuning - not reading books.

So there is always a pre-existing martial art?!
Go tell that to the founding fathers of certain fighting styles. That were developed in the chinese temples, to keep the monks physically fit so they weren't falling asleep in their meditation practices. Or the ancient Rishis and Yogis of India who explored the bodies energy systems through inner subjective experience, and experiment.

I UNDERSTAND that to tell someone "yo... try to learn a martial arts style through some books, and self-teaching" is ridiculous. BUT... thats this dude's position! And he isn't listening to advice to go take up another style, which would enable him to maybe find a local teacher. Which, as I've said before would be my first advice to him. I think putting time and energy into the very specific and limited context art of Zui Quan is an absolutely foolish waste of time. But considering he's not having any of my opinion to that regard (nor anyone esles)... and wants to rock his way... why not open whatever remote windows of potential are still left. No matter how ridiculous, small and/or feasible.

Thats my only impetus. I see no reason to tear someone down, after they've heard your advice, and still adamantly have chosen otherwise. Thus... my stance is only a last bit of light to the brutha... in the little context he left possible.

Thats it.

 

[flippinfreak]

It's better to build on nothing, than to not build at all?