male-directed shaming tactics used in the dating game

[MatureDJ]

I believe this guy is one of the founders of the "Forced Loneliness Movement". Do you think he just an (obviously not average) frustrated chump?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QcW4jvGicLs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCLjUGtgwoA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYevD5ftA_s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcCwKk16aUs

 

[disgustipated]

Only half way through the 2nd vid but yeah definitely 100 percent frustrated. You can hear it in his tone and his brow is crinkled up as he's talking.

So far he's crapped on 6 "shaming tactics" and I assume he's going to continue with more. Some of these could be just observations from people that personally know him and actuallly see where the guy could improve without outright coming out and saying something like, "the way you talk man is awkward" or something.

And the confidence analogy is something I used to agree with verbatim when I was YOUNGER....it would miff me off that my own personal subset of skills that I never could show off in most social wouldn't be taken into account with women or just overall general respect/confidence. I'm sorry but you just can't expect to garner respect or have someone think of you as confident with something like marathoning(he says he trains for them) or the ability to rewire a house unless that's your profession and the girl actually gives a ****. As a runner you won't pull women unless you're have a good looking face. He's already diminished the pool of women who could be possibly interested in him by going with a hobby that makes you skinnier(most times at the expense of muscle) and less masculine. BUT, and here's the kicker that goes against his other points about game and confidence...I personally know runners who are equal or uglier to his looks with no masculine type bodies that have HOT girlfriends and or wives...not many, but a few. What's the difference? Must be something.

If you're trying to have success in social situations you need to be good at the things that make you good in social situations, period. The guy is not being very rational about it so far. I wouldn't say he's complaining because I hate doing that to men but he is definitely super frustrated. It's super hard to listen to a guy like that(especially in real life) without trying to give advice because I relate or have related.

 

[Mike32ct]

There is no question that he's frustrated and bitter.

But, I have to say that I agree with much of what he said:

1. It's mostly about looks. (See my signature thread.)

2. Hypergamy and the 90/10 rule as discussed here.

3. Confidence is overrated. It's meaningless if you don't have looks.

The only thing I don't agree with is the "90 percent of looks is from the neck up."
Height and build are a big component of a guy's looks.


As far as a guy's hobbies, they are filtered through his looks. If the guy is hot, women will be fascinated by his underwater basketweaving. If he's not good looking, she won't give a flying F about his hobbies.

 

[teacha]

3. Confidence is overrated. It's meaningless if you don't have looks.

WRONG!

Always remember, no hoe is out of your league...

 

[speed dawg]

3. Confidence is overrated. It's meaningless if you don't have looks.................As far as a guy's hobbies, they are filtered through his looks. If the guy is hot, women will be fascinated by his underwater basketweaving. If he's not good looking, she won't give a flying F about his hobbies.

Yeaaaaah, you're a little misguided.

Looks help, for sure. But it's all about adding up to the total package. I would most often rank confidence the #1 overall attraction generator. I do realize that confidence and looks aren't entirely mutually exclusive. Alot of times, things like looks are what generates natural confidence. For the not so fortunate looking, they have to work a little harder.

 

[Who Dares Win]

I can tell with no doubts that any small mistake from my part when I was average was punished in the heaviest way possible wheter it was being late or being boring.

With some more weight on arms and less on stomach I can do really bad things to girls and not only not be punished for that but in many cases even rewarded.

A confident ugly guy is creepy, a confident hot guy is attractive, I think confidence helps only when what you are selling is interesting,otherwise you are no different than those door to door sellers.

 

[Burroughs]

confidence comes into play only AFTER THE GIRL FINDS YOU HOT AND LETS YOU IN HER WORLD...

the answer.

get your azz to the gym!

 

[backbreaker]

The Looks argument often seems to be a false dichotomy. "Looks don't matter" vs. "Confidence without looks is useless." Neither is true.

Just control what you can and don't worry about what you cannot. You can't control your height, penis size, hair loss (usually), etc.

But you can control your weight, muscle tone, overall health, attire, hygiene, and posture. That's a lot to work with. And usually improving these things makes one more confident and happier.

this. this is why i don't think i have ever seriously gotten into a looks don't matter debate because it's based on the false premise that you can't control how you look when you can.

95% of guys on this forum have the ability to be HB 7.5's or better at the very least if they put some real effort into it. get in shape, learn how to dress, learn how groom yourself and keep yourself groomed at all times.

as far as shaming tactics some girls would try to shame me into stop seeing other women when i was single.


actually.. you know what.. being 100% honest. i got more **** from men than women. usually some white knight AFC super chump will and we will be around a woman or a group of women or at my house and some dude would make some snide remark about how i treat women is wrong and what not or that i don't care about women and how i don't deserve a woman or some **** like that. guys are actually from my experience much worse than women are about it. women for the most part don't like it but understand it. men don't understand it or like it.

 

[Mr.Positive]

confidence comes into play only AFTER THE GIRL FINDS YOU HOT AND LETS YOU IN HER WORLD...

the answer.

get your azz to the gym!

Bring her into your world, subtle difference. Lead her, don't follow her around her world.

Going to the gym builds confidence, and health, and it's not about caring what she thinks about how you look. Who cares what she thinks, either there's attraction with her or there is not. If there's not, move on to the next one.

 

[Burroughs]

Bring her into your world, subtle difference. Lead her, don't follow her around her world.

.

agree 100%

thing is most guys don't have a world to lead others into in any way shape or fashion.

and they probably never will

 

[Nutz]

AFC level 9000

 

[Warrior74]

I've seen these guys before. And I don't think this guy is a bad looking guy. Here's the deal. I get MGTOW (men going their own way). I get that. Hell I'm doing that right now. I have zero time for women. I'm focused on my own life which is in a shambles. A woman is the last thing I need besides as physical release. But I do see a negative, almost pleading weak vibe emitting from the name "True Forced Loneliness" its really a pathetic name. It's passive, it's a victims name. It's not a name that the average guy can't rally behind. I would rather you be in Al Bundy's "No Ma'am" and have the same ideals. The branding on this is terrible. MGTOW is a stronger handle. I'd be ashamed to tell anyone I was a member of True Forced Loneliness.

 

[Nutz]

I've seen these guys before. And I don't think this guy is a bad looking guy. Here's the deal. I get MGTOW (men going their own way). I get that. Hell I'm doing that right now. I have zero time for women. I'm focused on my own life which is in a shambles. A woman is the last thing I need besides as physical release. But I do see a negative, almost pleading weak vibe emitting from the name "True Forced Loneliness" its really a pathetic name. It's passive, it's a victims name. It's not a name that the average guy can't rally behind. I would rather you be in Al Bundy's "No Ma'am" and have the same ideals. The branding on this is terrible. MGTOW is a stronger handle. I'd be ashamed to tell anyone I was a member of True Forced Loneliness.

I believe you can be MGTOW and still date and even have relationships. They just happen to be on your own terms.

 

[zekko]

The Looks argument often seems to be a false dichotomy. "Looks don't matter" vs. "Confidence without looks is useless." Neither is true.

Right.

I work with a large number of people on a rotating basis. The tall, good looking guys with big body frames and a lot of muscle - these guys don't even have to try. As soon as they walk in, it's on. The girls are all over them, flirting. How could they not be confident?

I like to observe the behavior of the women and these alpha types when I see them. This one girl gave this guy about eight compliments throughout the day that I saw. Things like calling him "hunk" and making suggestive remarks. At one point he said something flirty back to her, I don't remember what. If you're getting girls flirting with you on an 8-1 basis, seriously how can you not be confident? This has to be how naturals are born, this guy simply doesn't have to try.

Like speed dawg said, looks and confidence are often related.

 

[Nutz]

Relevant:

http://rationalmale.wordpress.com/2012/02/23/looks-count/

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

Confidence is derived from actionable options and the proven capacity to successfully generate options.

If your looks, affluence, status or Game generate options, confidence will be the byproduct. While an internal component is important in self-confidence, a proven, evidentiary capacity to generate options is the only measurable means to validate a person's confidence.

 

[Who Dares Win]

Confidence is derived from actionable options and the proven capacity to successfully generate options.

If your looks, affluence, status or Game generate options, confidence will be the byproduct. While an internal component is important in self-confidence, a proven, evidentiary capacity to generate options is the only measurable means to validate a person's confidence.

This actually show how someone cannot just follow the advice of "being confident" to succeed.
A best advice to give to guys here would be "do something that would make you confident", anyway well said Rollo, right as usual.

 

[Lexington]

The Looks argument often seems to be a false dichotomy. "Looks don't matter" vs. "Confidence without looks is useless." Neither is true.

Just control what you can and don't worry about what you cannot. You can't control your height, penis size, hair loss (usually), etc.

But you can control your weight, muscle tone, overall health, attire, hygiene, and posture. That's a lot to work with. And usually improving these things makes one more confident and happier.

This man speaks the truth.

I'd like to add that looks will make it EASIER for you, but they're not everything.

Think about that kid you might have known in high school that didn't have to study and got straight As (hell, that might have even been you). You could have thrown your hands up and said "fvck it, grades are just all about intelligence." Your other option was to work a lot harder than him. You could study more, take better notes in class and go to the teacher for extra help.

A guy who is very good looking might have to only do 1 or 2 approaches to get laid. Or he might just have to sit around by the bar and wait to get approached by the girls. If you're average looking you might have to do 10 approaches. Or you might have to do 20. You simply have to work harder.

Unless you're somehow hideously deformed or you were just born with a face that only a mother can love (that's not the case for most people), you should be able to look at least "normal." If that's the case, you should have at least some chance with most girls. If your odds are greater than 0, then it's simply a matter of putting yourself out there enough so that you score.

 

[Burroughs]

However what he is saying is that average to ugly women have far more options than good looking and reasonably good looking men.

This is THE most irritating aspect of the game today...there is a nearly 3-4hb disparity between men and women ...in simple terms hb 6-7 women can and do land hb10 men frequently...this is because even hb 9-10 men have to put in some effort to fvck so if the hb 7 chick is open for business so to speak the man is in....then if she frys a good pair of eggs and 3 strips of bacon in the morning the dude might stick around

to counter this an hb6-7 guy is going to have an uphill battle bagging a 10 chick even for a quick fvck in the restroom. this creates the most problems with hb7-8 dudes who want a girl of THEIR LEVEL but find that she is out of his reach...and the hb7 dude doesn't want a fvckin' hb4 chick hosebeast.

so the hb8 guy with a $$ job, sixpack, german car, is still being jerked around by the receptionist at sephora who is a 100,000 grand in debt and lives with her parents who thinks tom brady is coming by any minute lol AND SHE ACTUALLY FVCKIN DESERVES HIM! BECAUSE OF HER FACEBOOK ORBITERS WHO PRAISE HER 7 TIMES AN HOUR...its beyond nuts

 

[Lexington]

This is THE most irritating aspect of the game today...there is a nearly 3-4hb disparity between men and women ...in simple terms hb 6-7 women can and do land hb10 men frequently...this is because even hb 9-10 men have to put in some effort to fvck so if the hb 7 chick is open for business so to speak the man is in....then if she frys a good pair of eggs and 3 strips of bacon in the morning the dude might stick around

to counter this an hb6-7 guy is going to have an uphill battle bagging a 10 chick even for a quick fvck in the restroom. this creates the most problems with hb7-8 dudes who want a girl of THEIR LEVEL but find that she is out of his reach...and the hb7 dude doesn't want a fvckin' hb4 chick hosebeast.

so the hb8 guy with a $$ job, sixpack, german car, is still being jerked around by the receptionist at sephora who is a 100,000 grand in debt and lives with her parents who thinks tom brady is coming by any minute lol AND SHE ACTUALLY FVCKIN DESERVES HIM! BECAUSE OF HER FACEBOOK ORBITERS WHO PRAISE HER 7 TIMES AN HOUR...its beyond nuts

I guess there are some 6 and 7 chicks "landing" guys who are 10s. But there is a very big difference between getting a rental car, leasing a car and buying it outright. A guy who is a 10 will surely have a large number of options, so a 6 or 7 is going to be a short term fvck at best....just something to get his d*ck wet.

A woman's attractiveness also declines far more rapidly than a man's (assuming the guy takes decent care of himself). So by her mid 20s, the receptionist is going to quickly realize that Tom Brady isn't going to sweep her off her feet any time soon. Why would he when there are literally millions of hot women that would drop their panties for him?

That's why ultimately, Tom Brady ended up marrying the world's richest supermodel (who actually makes more money than he does!). 6s tend to marry 6s and 10s tend to marry 10s.