It's no secret: "The Secret" and the "Law of Attraction" are BULLSH*T

[Holland]

With the most important points. keep being completely ignored, I'm leaving this thread.

1. Some of you still haven't read/listened to any work from Brian Tracy, Bob Proctor, James Ray, Napoleon Hill, W. Clement Stone, Wayne Dyer etc. and see how the Secrets talks about a fraction about all these universal principles
2. Some of you still haven't serieusly tried it out (not to surprising if you don't even understand something). So you also don't know if it can be beneficial to YOUR life.
3. Some of you keep posting about details that don't apply to YOUR life.


Last attempt to convice ricorico about the whole starvation thing. I doubt you even thought trough my previous point about it (do you honestly believe people in poor countries know about affirmative realisation?), but here is some more on the subject anyway.

Wayne Dyer was talking about these principles one time and he got a lot of resistance from people like: "How can you say these things to people in such worse circumstances? Don't you have any pity for them?"
This is what he said: "The people in those circumstances need to here the most of what I'm talking about. That if you keep your vision of a better life before you and NEVER lose sight of that, then you'll eventually start taking the right actions and you'll move out of those circumstances.

People in those poor countries don't need to hear hopelessness and that there is nothing they can do about it. They need to see: "These are the circumstances of my life now and if I want to transcend these circumstances I have to reveal myself as something other than a victim, who just follows the herd.""

Now who is being cruel?

You and all the other 'donaters' that say: "Aaaw, oow, poor you, little victim of the place you were born in. Here is some temporary funds for you to exist off for some x amount of time."

OR

People that share the 'secrets' to a better life.

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

With the most important points. keep being completely ignored, I'm leaving this thread.

1. Some of you still haven't read/listened to any work from Brian Tracy, Bob Proctor, James Ray, Napoleon Hill, W. Clement Stone, Wayne Dyer etc. and see how the Secrets talks about a fraction about all these universal principles...

It's easier to just make assumptions that to take the time to learn what any of these books are about. Few people make an effort to actually read anymore.

 

[ricorico]

Do you know some countries in Africa have droughts? Therefore things cannot grow there and the heat is excessive. So even if they decided to relocate, they could die because they would have to walk hundreds of miles in pure dessert heat,wild animals,NO WATER!!!!?

Do you understand some countries have Rebels that simply kill folks because they want to control something? Did you see Hotel Rowanda where more then 800 thousand people were being executed in Africa by their own government. The U.S. knew about it and did nothing? Do you know, they use some of these poor countries to test life saving medicines which they know can potentially kill even the kids?

Do you know there are people in this world born into slavery because their families are owned through generation after generation by a family an ancester owed a debt to? Do you understand in India, there is a caste system where once you are born poor, the you stay poor? There is no public education or welfare,free hosuing,shelters or anything.

Do you understand in China, there was a 1 baby policy and therefore your next baby was killed by the government. So you are saying whole countries bring on their misery because they do not know the "law of attraction". But ironically, the selfish folks using the slaves,being rebels,selling drugs and killing folks and basically keeping people down do? So they are rewarded by making heaps of money(they steal through the government,drugs,whatever) because they know the law of attraction,so therefore are worthy of not being into slavery,starving ect?

Have you heard of the Lost boys of Sudan. Talk about positive realization when you understand opputunity can bring that only to certain people in certain countries. The Lost Boys of Sudan are African boys who watched their whole family being killed in Sudan. Through their exodus to an AMERICAN refugee camps, hundreds and thousands more of their people were killed by rebels or eaten by Lions and Hyenna's. When they got to the refugee camps, only a few thousands had made it. But of those young boys who did, the U.S. government and some other European countries took many in. Those boys came here and took educational oppurtunities American people who speak the native language did not. All; finished college. Many are becoming doctors and lawyers. So to say they live the way they lived before because they had no realization is not true. They were very excited to come to the U.S. because now was oppurtunity. No more rebels, famine, poverty or wild animals to fend off.



Again, I believe in the power of positive thinking. Without it your life is nothing. But I don't believe some of the other stuff. Realistically, I got lucky in this lifetime. My parents are wealthy.What I have been able to achieve in investments in partly due to the fact #1. my father was willing to help me out. Most kids around here my age will be successful because their parents will make sure of that through having connections of friends and money. I know some of the biggest losers ever ,who will have draem lives because of mommy and daddy's money. Not because they are positive and know the laws of attraction.

I live in a priveledged area where I know the most negative,irresposible ,arrogant folks, living in Mansions who did NOTHING besides be damn lucky! to deserve what they have or to be born into the right family, or have the right friends.

Do you know how many parents are sacrificing everything they have to try to get their kids a careers? How many have suceeded? Not many. There was a 20/20 show about that. Hundreds and thousands of parents are taking their life savings and investing it into their kids because they think they have talent. You can't tell me these parents don't beleve enough, because why else use your life savings? Then you watch shows and notice the most popular new kids coming up are Britney Spears little sister, Julia Roberts niece,Billy Rae Cyrus's daughter. Bruce Willis's 3 daughters happen to be sooooo talented, they are in his movies beating out all other kids that auditioned. Sure they did!. You think they were the most talented out there? You think some other kids did'nt really envision themselves where those kids are? Kids envision all day long. But these little girls have something extra those other poor little girls don't. Family who have connnections in the business. How fair is that? they can will and believe all they want. But there are just a few spots available.If you really believe there is fairness in this sort of biz, you haven't heard the word nepotism.

I live in the mecca of the movie/tv world. most of my parents friends are big shots in the movie or tv biz. To really know what goes on in this biz shows how shallow and small minded the big guns really are.Why do you think American Idol is besides itself as the worst contestant ever is being pushed by radio shows and websites to be voted for? "VOte for the worst and Howard Stern are making a mockery of the show by encouraging the public to vote for some Indian kid named Sanjayja. Is it because Sanjaya is using the "law of attraction" he is staying? No. He has become a symbol of a joke.

Besides the power of positive thinking and setting a goal, visualizing and achieving it,what is there in "The Secret" you think I am not getting?

 

[Nighthawk]

Umm, who cares about what's rattling around in your head? It's this type of attitude that limits so many people and they don't even know it. It's as if they could learn how to succeed with women from some Internet forum...

The point of the magic beans analogy is that when faced with the argument 'why not try it and see for yourself ' is that there are millions of products and people vying for our time and money, so we have to be selective with both.

When I was younger I was open-minded about many pseudoscientific nonsense like astrology or mind-reading, but upon investigation their claims were unscientific and unprovable. I learnt that the burden of proof was on those making extraordinary claims, and without extraordinary evidence why would I believe something that contradicted those laws of physics that WERE testable and proven? Because believing in hogwash might make me FEEL better? I wanted truth, not a warm feeling based on nothing but hot air.

I have not seen the movie 'What The XXXX do we know?' because I read enough reviews to tell that it was another example of people preying on the public's ignorance of quantum physics (and A-Unit, this is one member who knows more than the lay-man about the subject) and willingness to believe in a karma-like LAW or FORCE that rewards or punishes human (why not animals btw) THOUGHT.

You know what I believe? That there are infinite number of parallel universes. Quantum physics points to such a conclusion, but there is no actual evidence so I (and the many scientists who share this view) cannot tout this belief as scientific fact.

I also have a lot of time for A-Unit's 'opposites' angle. We do need polarities or at least variation to measure and give meaning to things. Perhaps the only reason we exist is to define what we are, and the whole of the multi-verse is a giant index of possibilities that simply has to exist to define nothingness.

But without any evidence apart from my drug-addled imagination, these ideas are merely theories or science-fiction stories. The sellers of 'The Secret' and 'The Law Of Attraction' as quoted at the start of this thread (what the thread is concerned about - not 'positivity' in general) make bold claims about their LAW ALWAYS WORKING FOR EVERYBODY ALL THE TIME.

They come out with rubbish like -

"Our thoughts are magnetic and travel as energy and vibration for vast distances."

“It has been proven scientifically that an affirmative thought is hundreds of times more powerful than a negative thought.”

“Our physiology creates disease to give us feedback, to let us know we have an imbalanced perspective and we’re not loving and we’re not grateful."

And I know that even allowing for metaphors, I am dealing with new-age quackery that will conflict with what I have researched and studied is true about the universe.

As has been pointed out, their ideas are not new, and like previous claims of some universal wish force, can be easily refuted by countless examples of them not actually working in the real world.

Critics of this being portrayed as negative and closed minded is disingenuous. I am all about the positivity, the visualisation and realisation of your goals. It's worked for me.

Likewise I am positive that with the right promotion and marketing my magic beans could make me a very rich man. But it would be at the expense of understanding of the real truth and beauty of the chaotic yet ordered universe.

 

[Nighthawk]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Everett_many-worlds_interpretation

a poll of 72 leading physicists conducted by the American researcher David Raub in 1995 and published in the French periodical Sciences et Avenir in January 1998 recorded that nearly 60% thought many worlds interpretation was "true".

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

...Critics of this being portrayed as negative and closed minded is disingenuous. I am all about the positivity, the visualisation and realisation of your goals. It's worked for me. ..

I will give any critic credibility if they are knowledgeable of what they are critiquing. This doesn't mean that they have to agree with premise, just that they understand it.

 

[reset]

Well, it seems to be real. Been having a lot of experiences regarding this in the last few months. At first it freaked me out, being an atheist/hardcore skeptic. But, I can't deny what happens.

My opinion now is:

We don't understand everything, even though we think we do. We once thought the sun revolved around the earth.

Time isn't real. When you experince crazy coincidences/synchronicities, this is my conclusion. Time may exist, but it's not what we think it is. Time may be an opinion.

Skeptics come in two sorts: people who were very religious and got burned BADLY by it (myself included) and have completely written out even the possibility that there is more to reality than we realize, it's all been figured out.

People who are fascinated by things like science, probably never were religious or anything like that, but have become overly rigid in their thinking.

As far as the Secret and the LOA, the main factor seems to be, feel good. I don't think that's such a bad thing. When you feel good, you are in a state of allowance. Being in this state of allowance, well, allows you to receive the abundance of the universe, that was ALREADY THERE, and that YOU WERE ALREADY CREATING ANYWAY, JUST WITHOUT REALIZING IT.

Now when you're all worked up, and arguing over things like the validity of the Secret, you're probably not in that allowing state, and so you're creating... the absence of the LOA. Either way, you get what you think about.

Action: This is the self-sacrificing work ethic. I am going to bust my ass and slave away, for years, in torture, living quiet desparation, and HOPE that my stress, anxiety, and clinging to the future will produce something of value. And if you don't agree, you're a lazy bum. I am better than you. I work HARD. I SUFFER. Who the hell are you to just be happy and things go your way? After all the HARD WORK I've done?

Get into a positive state of mind.
Think in terms of abundance.
Get very passionate about what you desire.
Expect it to arrive.
When it does, it will knock on your door, or make itself known to you.
When you hear that knock, Get up off the couch, open the door, and receive (action).

Completely different than our puritanical work ethic, I think this is why there are so many detractors. Hell, I'm living in this mindset and even I have a hard time coming to terms with it.

After all, life is supposed to be a struggle. We are supposed to sweat and toil for everything, right?

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

...After all, life is supposed to be a struggle. We are supposed to sweat and toil for everything, right?

Only if you choose to.

 

[Holland]

Besides the power of positive thinking and setting a goal, visualizing and achieving it,what is there in "The Secret" you think I am not getting?

I think you're right on with that.
Maybe add to that that anything you can think and believe, you can achieve.

I won't deny the horrible circumstances that people live in. I just believe that those circumstances can be transcended by those people. And it is not up to me to solve ALL of the problems in this world. I decide to be an example of excellence. If you feel it is your purpose to help those people I think that's wonderful. Your setting your example and I'm setting mine.

Originally Posted by reset
...After all, life is supposed to be a struggle. We are supposed to sweat and toil for everything, right?

Only if you choose to.

Agreed. You define reality.

When you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change -Dyer

I want you to re evaluate the circumstances of your life. -Proctor

As a man thinketh, so is he

I used to have very strong beliefs about how the way things were, for instance, that you had to struggle in life.
I laugh about how wrong I was.
Now I live my life as an exciting and enjoyable adventure in which I choose the grounds where I want to live upon.

 

[Last Man Standing]

I think you're right on with that.
Maybe add to that that anything you can think and believe, you can achieve.

I won't deny the horrible circumstances that people live in. I just believe that those circumstances can be transcended by those people. And it is not up to me to solve ALL of the problems in this world. I decide to be an example of excellence. If you feel it is your purpose to help those people I think that's wonderful. Your setting your example and I'm setting mine.




Agreed. You define reality.





I used to have very strong beliefs about how the way things were, for instance, that you had to struggle in life.
I laugh about how wrong I was.
Now I live my life as an exciting and enjoyable adventure in which I choose the grounds where I want to live upon.

A perfect example of the "ME" "New Age" generation as prescribed by those who write the programs in "The Matrix"!! Wake up kid - The Matrix has you!!!!

 

[A-Unit]

Re:

Go back to all my posts within this thread. If anyone has stayed on topic, it's me.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Responding and clarifying the original post...

• Whatever is going on in your mind is what you are attracting.

Does this one befuddle anyone? Is this so difficult or outlandish a concept. Our minds, our thoughts are OUR reality. Not your's, not SoSuaves. Mine. A-Unit's. In SS terms, the reality of the AFC is that way because he has AFC thoughts. His past molded him into what he is because he had no thoughts prior to that to compare his thoughts to. The first instance of identity for the AFC was "AFCNESS". When he learns of a new way, it's his spirit, will, and determination that change him.

• Thought = creation. If these thoughts are attached to powerful emotions (good or bad) that speeds the creation.

Indisputable. All thoughts are the source of creation. The bible says as much. Bill Gates would say as much. Trump would say as much. Ghandi. Ali. Whoever. Tiger Woods. Their thoughts precede their actions. And yes, if you read any interview, it is the passion of the 'thinker' which makes something happen faster. Call it quantum mechanics, logic, or quantum-duh-just-hard-work, that's not a lie, or misleading.

• Those who speak most of illness have illness, those who speak most of prosperity have it, etc.

This probably can't be proven scientifically, but psychologists and doctors would agree, people who 'think' sick, are always sick. People who 'think' healthy are healthy. All people I've ever known were sick. I even had science teachers in HS who believed in MIND over MATTER Of course, this is another unprovable point but both sides, but experience has taught people who think sick and talk illness, are predominantly MORE sick. The more you reinforce what is, with emotion, the more it happens.

• It’s OK that thoughts don’t manifest into reality immediately (if we saw a picture of an elephant and it instantly appeared, that would be too soon).

This is partially true, too. We have so many thoughts daily, that what people REALLY want is different than what they think they want. It's like the story of 24 days of XMAS, and the kids get the same stuff day in, and day out. What they think they want, isn't really what they truly want. Having a delay on getting what you want FORCES you to put yourself out, there to be more than you are, to work for something, to raise your spirit, your confidence and your will power. Not working for anything makes it value completely WORTHLESS. To the degree we work for something, is to the degree we appreciate and value it.

• Everything in your life you have attracted. Accept that fact; it’s true. You get exactly what you are feeling. What you think and what you feel and what actually manifests is always a match — no exception.

Positive expectation vs negative expectation. The reality of an outcome is undefined, yet walking into a situation with certain assumptions almost guarantees THAT outcome. If you walk into an interview for a new job, how likely is it that you get the job AND like the job if you're totally down about getting it, or being qualified for it? Do you think you'll exude confidence that will convince the HR managers? If you used that same line of thinking with women, would it work? When you're hopeful, positive, and in YOUR reality, does a woman flow toward that or away from it? I do believe you get what you're thinking.

I've been situations with past gf's, who were not hopeful about us working out, and in turn that lack of hope created doubt in her...and then obviously she didn't want to be around me, or us, and then finally just let things fall away. What you want the outcome to be, is what will be, and your emotions have to be in alighnment for it.

• You don’t need to know how the universe is going to rearrange itself. How long??? No rules on time; the more aligned you are with positive feelings the quicker things happen. Size is nothing to the universe (unlimited abundance if that’s what you wish). We make the rules on size and time. If you turn it over to the universe, you will be surprised and dazzled by what is delivered. This is where magic and miracles happen.

Call it universe, call it energy, call it science, call it your ego. In general, if people aren't "big" enough to believe in themselves, they believe in something ultimately. Sometimes it is family. Sometimes we're motivated by revenge. Whatever it is...when we want to do something...we don't NEED to know the how. In all forms of plans, we can't account for the element of "chaos" that is inherently unpredictable and immeasurable. You can't account for the freak accident that makes you 2 hours late. Instability is present all around us. Just DOING something is good enough in that direction. If you want to be an Engineer via college, then you're first WHAT, NOT how...is to get into a good engineering college. Then ask...What will make me the best engineer? Well, join engineering groups. Read books on engineering outside of college curriculi. Meet with engineering firms early on. The how do I...is very open. You don't know that, because you're not THAT. It's like asking an AFC how to get his version of a 10. Since he's never been with a 10, he can't visual or see himself with his '10.' Nor does he presume to know the next level of thinking he needs to be HER 10. All guys can be some woman's 10...he's just not at his FULL potential. The how isn't needed. It's WHAT DO I DO....TO BE, TO DO...Etc.

Cont'd


A-Unit

 

[A-Unit]

Cont'd

• We are mass energy. Everything is energy. Everything.

Not really sure how you refute this either. Is anything NOT energy? All matter that appears solid is, in effect, moving, just at a different frequency or vibration. It happens to move at a frequency we perceive it to be solid, when in fact, there's alot of space in there, too. Any dissentors here? Please, clarify without taking ego-issues with me. When you die, how much energy is there? When you're alive, how much energy is actually present?

“Wise people have always known this … Why do you think that 1% of the population earns around 96% of all the money that’s being earned? Do you think that’s an accident? It’s no accident. It’s designed that way. They understand something. They understand The Secret.” (11) Ah, there it is then. It is the wise people who have the money and the BMWs. Are we to conclude that the Indian man and the Chinese woman are fools? The deeply offensive racial overtones are hard to ignore, as are the sexist slurs — for instance, during the delivery of the above quotation, the visual is of a boardroom full of white, cigar-smoking male executives. Evidently social inequality and injustice, a lack of resources, several thousand years of patriarchy, oppression and inequality between the sexes — all the usual explanations as to why people don’t have money are incorrect. Social factors are irrelevant in a world where “You are the only one who creates your reality. It is only you; every bit of it you.”

The first part...is poorly quoted. Does Tiger Woods understand the Secret? He probably wouldn't CALL it that, but we would agree with the concept? My own cousin, who at 10 years old can shoot par on an 18 hole golf course and is now traveling the country, competing and beating kids, must get it. On a logical level...people would just say "hard work, focus, and determination." The alternate believe, which is part of the same coin is simply LOA, or attraction. Both require work. Both use the same principles.

Putting aside those people BORN into a life of priviledge, the majority of the people in the US, get this, but don't necessarily call it THE SECRET or LOA. Given that the average income of a US citizen is 50k, and the news would have you believe most live in poverty and are getting screwed left and right, and that only 5% of the population actually the good life, those who raise themselves up MUST know something different.

Best line...Frenchie (The Departed)..."This is America, if you can't make money you're a Douche Bag. Now what are you going to do?" "Make more money!"

This doesn't apply ONLY to money, but all other things as well. Health, Friendships, Relationships, Work, Games. Yeah, fine you don't win this one, but maybe THIS loss is the loss that prepares you for the BIG win. Remember "Rounders" when Matt Damon lost the game vs the Russian which sent him to Law School and a life of clean living? Or the Loss he confesses he suffered at the hands of Johnny Chan? All preparation. The same thing here. An associate of mine plays poker professionally. It's his LOSSES that help him figure out ways to win BIGGER. Business owners put together elaborate marketing plans to test the waters to make even BIGGER money. Companies shell out millions hoping to make billions by partnering and offering test projects.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Clarifying YOUR REALITY...

The late night news puts on whatever it wants. When you watch it, you have to wonder...is this important to my life, to life itself, to society, or to my goals? Many people see different things and get different things back. Most news events are filled with things you won't remember even now, yet hours every day are wasted watching it, recording it, and reporting it. Why? Is someone trying to GIVE you their reality? Are they trying to MOLD your beliefs? In a way, we all are. The article that set this thread afire was attempting one path of molding reality. People for or on the same wavelength as the secret are trying to mold people's reality. All transmissions of thought are trying to mold reality. It's a very contaminated science experiment.

Does ignoring the nightly and local news make you...ignorant, or intelligent? Do you have to talk about the latest 4 alarm fire? Or the kids being kidnapped? Or the bad accident? Is that reality? What IS reality? It's your perception of the world we share. In my opinion. How people don't see this boggles my mind. You choose EVERYTHING. You choose to feel REALLY sick, when you are sick. Just because you've got the latest stomach virus, doesn't mean you have to moan and groan about it. It doesn't mean you have to even call out of work; there's lots of IRON men and women who don't, or can't. You also could have chosen to take better care of yourself so you wouldn't have gotten sick. Or maybe it was the girl you were making out with, or a co-worker who you shook hands with who committed the sickness crime. Whatever it was...there was choice, that led you down a path to experience in life.

Tossing aide net worth, perceived intelligent, looks; we all have a right to life. We are born on this planet without OUR choosing (though some religions would say you chose this existence are born again in this body and moment for purposes yet unknown). We all have a right to live as we see fit. We have coalesced into a society for the benefits of all, and some how, warped and mangled humanity into a competition of egos, over goods and services, that we can't possibly all use, but that the entire planet needs. We all choose. If one race, or one species stays subjugated, it's their own choosing. Mandela was imprisoned for decades, but he never gave up the fight, and he returned to lead a nation.

I've point out specifically in this post my views. What i feel I now see about people and the secret is that it's a new age religion or something. Where I've been coming from are sources like...The Master Key, Think and Grow Rich, Robert Collier's The Secret of All Ages, The Science of Getting Rich, and many, many more books. I've even begun reading Dawkins, Darwin, chaos theory, etc, just for pure pleasure. I've come from a SELF IMPROVEMENT back ground. Yet, I do read new age metaphysical material, too. I exclude nothing from my reading library. Guys may chuck this video and all my posts into the NEW AGE category, but that is YOUR CHOICE, not my intention, nor how I've written or explained anything.

Moreover, many of you have resorted to attacks, rather than discussion or debate. All people are tough when they can write a little better, or pick out works to nitpick, but they can't actually stay on topic and JUST debate the facts without throwing in their own over emotional ego. And if it came to an inperson situation, most would back down anyways. Inasfaras I can tell, I've only stayed as close to on topic, and never pointed out one person. Not my style. Not sure why there's a HUGE aversion to everything and if you want to remain defending antiquated stances, go right ahead misunderstanding me.

This thread is about as good and done as it can be.


A-Unit

 

[ricorico]

I think you're right on with that.
Maybe add to that that anything you can think and believe, you can achieve.

I won't deny the horrible circumstances that people live in. I just believe that those circumstances can be transcended by those people. And it is not up to me to solve ALL of the problems in this world. I decide to be an example of excellence. If you feel it is your purpose to help those people I think that's wonderful. Your setting your example and I'm setting mine.



Is'nt it ironic the many of the most successful people in America are immigrants from India,Asian countries and Africa. Areas that are really poor. For some reason these people were unable to succeed in their country. But come here and live the "American dream" How? Did they just begin "realization"when they got to America? Why were they so poor in their country? Or did they understand it is impossible to get ahead in their country because of how it is structured, or droughts, no food,jobs,corrupt government,communism,ect but have always had a will to make it.

We can't say all the people in poor countries do not understand "realization" because they would come here and fail too. But it's the total opposite.Many Indian doctors,Asians,Africans take advantage of oppurtunity here and do way better than their American counterparts.. Look it up.If the "Law of the universe" was really a law, why did it not work everywhere in the universe?

 

[whistler]

Let's look at some actual psychological factors.

1. Confirmation Bias -- Tendency to search for or interpret information in a way that confirms preconceptions.

2. Base Rate Fallacy -- Not taking overall correlation in a population into account; only focusing on instances where a specific outcome occurred.

3. False Cause (*** hoc ergo propter hoc) -- The old "drawing causal relationships from correlational relationships."

4. Attribution Errors -- (two relevant ones here) -- Tendency to attribute positive personal outcomes to personal (not situational) factors. Tendency to attribute outcomes for other people to personal (not situational) factors. Both of these suggest we underestimate the role of factors beyond a person's decisions or disposition (i.e., situational factors).


I see all of these cropping up here:

1. A tendency to interpret or search for cases where the Law of Attraction seemed to work.
2. Not taking cases into account where the Law of Attraction failed to work.
3. Assuming a causal relationship between prior thoughts and apparent manifestations in reality of those thoughts.
4. A tendency to focus on the impact of a person's individual qualities (thoughts in this case), while downplaying the impact of situational factors.

See how, together, these all might lead someone to believe the Law of Attraction works?

Take away number 4 and you have a big part of the explanation for superstition. (Superstition being where you assume a causal connection between two otherwise unconnected things.)

 

[DjDreamer]

Critical thinking skills is a nice mental faculty... it won't make you close your eyes and imagine anything is possible as long as you believe in it but at least you'll know gravity exists...

 

[Holland]

Ricorico,
I think I understand what you're saying, but I think that they 'used the Secret' to make it to America and take advantage and make his/her dream come true.

 

[ricorico]

Holland,

If the Secret is "The law of the universe" their realization should be able to happen anywhere. Not just the U.S. or rich democratic countries. The law should work in Africa or Communist China or North Korea.It's supposed to be a law of the "universe".

 

[A-Unit]

Re:

It seems apparent ricorico, you have a "grand vision" of what the world should be, and that the Law of Attraction should attract what it is you deem the world to be. In other words...you want on behalf of other people, while the rest of the world doesn't have the will power to do for themselves. Which begs the question...why should they get anything, if they don't want, or will, enough for it?

It also seems apparent you believe attraction or the LAW OF, to stand for some magic genie. Even Al Gore used simple analogies to convey a bigger idea; this is what the writer's did. They used Aladdin to convey an idea of people getting what it is they ask for.

Let me start with a very "basic" thought process here, putting LOA aside...

People are reality makers. When a child is born, each is born into a DIFFERENT reality. We don't know if this is of chance, or perhaps some choosing of our's on a cosmic or spiritual level. Unless someone has scientific proof to contradict or prove that wrong, don't drop the idea as bunk. Moving on...you're born. That's it. You, "ricorico." What is the world to you? What will it be? What should it be?

Is the world, or your life, the stuff you see on TV?
Is the world, or your life, the stuff you see in magazines, books, or video games?

What is REALITY?

Call_Me_Daddy already posted on gravity being something of a thin law, which isn't 100%. You can crack on the video all you like, but I doubt you can deny...people, humans are reality creators, because unlike animals, insofar as we know...we perceive, understand, and think consciously. The world is what we see through our belief structure.

If some AMOG, or some guy, belittles you at a party, there's numerous ways you can take that interaction...

A) You can fight him.
B) You can take it like a dog with your tail between your legs.
C) You can joke back, basically CNFing him to up your status.
D) You can debate him.
E) You can avoid him.

Different guys do different things because they believe different ideas.

Where the LAW of ATTRACTION comes into play, especially with find a woman is here...

Most guys spend the MAJORITY of their time on SoSuave grumbling about the state of femininity and women in this country, yet they never do anything to find a better woman, or believe a great one exists. Or a great many. Check the boards. Confirmation after confirmation of supposedly BAD women. Men, spewing forth their reality, through THEIR words, which indicate their current beliefs. Their current beliefs indicate WHAT THEY ATTRACT. In this case, BAD women. That's all they signal. The few women posters noted the abysmal level of pescimism here. YET...if these men believed differently, held a picture in their minds of WHO she would be, and actually kept an open mind to it, and just went about life knowing they'd find it...they would. I've never had woman problems because I understood this long ago. Even before I began dating, I knew who I wanted to date. I'd date her, and unfortunately, I wasn't specific enough to make her NOT crazy and we'd break up. Or maybe she was only a temporary fling? Thing is..not focusing on what you want will only put you further from it.

What would you have humanity do?

The world you believe isn't the one I see. It isn't the one I want. And it isn't the one I agree to. That's your world. Yes, there's problems, and mostly at a conscious or human level. For all the perceived advanced we've experienced, humanity hasn't really gotten anywhere personal, spiritually, or intellectually.

Yet...if our world leaders, business leaders, and others ignore it...are they confirming it? Are they confirming the Law of Attraction? Or are they culprits in the biggest scandal of? I mean...if the world is in such disarray...why don't the world powers, of which all the money we blow on military defense could erase povery, but it can't fix a mindset, just throw money at the problem? Maybe because money isn't the problem, and that isn't the problem? I'm speculating here. But as I've read it...your counter has been..."Well if LOA is true, then the world should be heaven." I believe the opposite. This place can only be heaven when the mindset of our planet is in better alignment or form.

If you strip away humanity, what do you have?
Just earth. Nothing but earth, animals, and natural resources.
Some might call THAT heaven.

The only thing causing problems here, or holding people down, or keeping them up is their consciousness. Are they evil, wicked or vindictive? Or they money hungry or generous? Are they mentally stable? Healthy?

The power of ANY system lies not in the system, but the thinking within that system. A bunch of monkeys couldn't run a mcdonalds. And strip away the system, and still, alot of people would behave the same. The buzz word for wealth these days is SYSTEM. Most late night pitched products espouse the virtues of USING A SYSTEM. In turn, we're all part of system. Interdependence. Straight to the top.

Other countries are subjects of other belief systems. No one her has changed one another's belief system. What belief do you have that we can do it for belief systems that have existed for centuries, until they understand the internal power they have? Moreover, observations of OTHER people's realities, only enforces their realities. I recall David D making a good point on dating and women...

He told a guy to bring the woman into HIS reality, and not the other way around. The girl in question, was some cali girl, who was supported by mommy and daddy in a rich way. The guy said..."I feel like I have to get her out of her reality, and take her to my place. We always go to her place, with her friends. If we don't, then we don't see each other." David D basically called him a pvssy for trying to move someone out of their reality (ie their beliefs in existence and action). And this guy was.

You're believing LOA should fix the world, when all of the world we see being played out on TV, in magazines, newspapers, books, movies, and before our eyes is the result of OTHER realities all parading and dancing before us. The reality THEY choose to experience is motivated by their beliefs, which are evidently quite convoluted, and not without much difficulty in understanding. HOWEVER, what Hill, what the Secret, what Esther Hicks, and Waitely, and Proctor, and PRETTY much every other SELF IMPROVEMENT guru known to man has tried to do...was introduce a modicum of humanity AND control, as well as understand the POWER human beings have to MAKE the planet BEFORE us into a HEAVEN we can ENJOY and appreciate.

We make the bombs, and planes that destroy us.
We teach or don't teach other countries on economic policy and fical responsibility.
We teach our children right from wrong.
We spend our money or invest money.

We as humans MAKE the choices that bring about the reality before our very eyes. And through RIGHT thinking or WRONG thinking, that world comes about. And yes...you thereby attract it. Not immediately, but it does accelerate as your belief and passion in its coming to pass does.


Good day to you gents,


A-Unit

 

[Holland]

Holland,

If the Secret is "The law of the universe" their realization should be able to happen anywhere. Not just the U.S. or rich democratic countries. The law should work in Africa or Communist China or North Korea.It's supposed to be a law of the "universe".

Changing an entire country is much more difficult to do than to move to a better country and become succesfull.
These people wanted a better life, moving to another country was the fastest way to do it.
Dedicating your life to alter the country for the better would've been an option as well, but that was not what they intended to do.
There are people who did such things though. Look at someone like Gandhi or Mandela for instance.
And what about people who gave the people in America hope during the financial crisis, described in Think and Grow Rich.

It would be absurd to say that it's just as easy to manifest prosperity in a poor country in afrika as it is here in the Western world, but that does not mean it is not possible and that 'the law' is malfunctioning.


If you don't believe you can create a beautiful, harmonious reality for yourself, than you probably haven't manifested much.

I used to be a thin, introverted boy who never had succes with women.
And now:
- I have a fit and healthy body
- I have a wonderful girlfriend
- I'm passing trough University with little effort
- Progress (in all areas) keeps going UP
- I rarely experience any negative emotions
- I love life

I don't mean to brag or something, but what I want to make VERY CLEAR is that the whole self-improvement movement (including the secret) dramaticly changed my life for the better.

Everyone seems to be concerned with details. All I want to do is learn to think like God thinks. -Albert Einstein

 

[John_Galt]

Holland,

If the Secret is "The law of the universe" their realization should be able to happen anywhere. Not just the U.S. or rich democratic countries. The law should work in Africa or Communist China or North Korea.It's supposed to be a law of the "universe".

The secret doesn't work for me. Because you're not coming back to the thread on fighting for a complete stranger. :moon: