Is it true very few men in the world are "naturals" with women? It's like these guys, men, never had to learn "game", it was always second nature

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

Its like these guys, men, they never needed to seek help from a dating coach or pick up artist, they never needed a mentor or a wingman, guidance on this, they likely never had to read a single book or blog post, forum, on seduction, "game", dating advice in their whole lives, they just knew how to successfully interact with and approach, talk to, attract, court, seduce, and take the lead from day one.

I get more angry and upset whenever people say "comparison is the thief of joy, or don't compare yourself to others", that only adds fuel to fire in terms of resentment, because i'm sure tons of people have always wondered the why or cause of mysteries. Another reason, and i'm sure tons of guys, men in the world, have feelings of envy and resentment towards these type of guys, men, is because they never had to struggle or never had to go through any pain or adversity, never dealt with any awkwardness or never got labeled creepy or weird, never once made a woman feel uncomfortable when approaching or interacting with them, never had to put in any blood sweat and tears, they got to grow up having a normal youth, got to experience being sexually active or being in love very young, in the prime of their lives

I'm referring to guys, men, who got to experience having a girlfriend and losing their virginity in their teenage years, they just seemed to figure it out very early in life, its like as if, knowing how to talk to and interact with girls, flirting with them, getting a girlfriend, has always been common sense for them, or they just somehow learned it right away, i don't know how else to describe it or put it into words, i guess thats what people describe or refer to as "naturals".

Meanwhile, tons of guys, men, go into their 20s or more, and are either still virgins or never had GF's before, and still just don't have the game or attracting women figured out yet, getting a girlfriend is still hard for them, they feel they still lack the correct and proper social skills or flirting and social behaviors, courting skills, guys need to know or learn in order to attract women, get a girlfriend, etc.

To sum it up, why do you think some or many guys are naturals at this, as in, they either learn or figure it out very early in life like i described or many guys, men, not until much later in life or never at all? Are guys supposed to learn this stuff from family members or friends, etc.?

Are very few men in the world naturals? did most guys have to go through a journey or training, practice, trial and error, or get help from a mentor or help from people in some way or form?

I'm sure for many people, such as this article by Girls Chase, its like for these guys, i'm assuming some, not most, they never had to learn it, they just knew how to ever since they started liking or being attracted to women:https://www.girlschase.com/article/males-every-species-must-learn-game-mate

Or do you think a guys childhood has an effect on his his "game", ability to relate and connect with women has an affect on this too? This article states that its amazing what a healthy childhood can do. https://goodmenproject.com/featured...-naturals-with-women-and-others-are-clueless/

Overall, would you say Naturals are a very few percentage of men in the world, very few men in the world are like that?

 

[Manure Spherian]

Uh yeah! I’m in my mid forties. The biggest womanizers I grew up with didn’t have to learn anything, and pre-Internet, no one had even heard of the jargon we discuss here.

One womanizer who worked for my uncle’s store, what did he have to do to get women? Simply exist and walk outside his home.

 

[SW15]

tons of guys, men, go into their 20s or more, and are either still virgins or never had GF's before, and still just don't have the game or attracting women figured out yet, getting a girlfriend is still hard for them, they feel they still lack the correct and proper social skills or flirting and social behaviors, courting skills, guys need to know or learn in order to attract women, get a girlfriend, etc.

To sum it up, why do you think some or many guys are naturals at this, as in, they either learn or figure it out very early in life like i described or many guys, men, not until much later in life or never at all? Are guys supposed to learn this stuff from family members or friends, etc.?

This happens a lot. It's become more common in both the Millennial and Gen Z generations. This wasn't that common for Gen X, Boomers, Silents, and the GI Generation.

Or do you think a guys childhood has an effect on his his "game", ability to relate and connect with women has an affect on this too? This article states that its amazing what a healthy childhood can do. https://goodmenproject.com/featured...-naturals-with-women-and-others-are-clueless/

Yes, a man's childhood experiences will affect his social skills and his ability to seduce women and/or form extended relationships with them.

Its like these guys, men, they never needed to seek help from a dating coach or pick up artist, they never needed a mentor or a wingman, guidance on this, they likely never had to read a single book or blog post, forum, on seduction, "game", dating advice in their whole lives, they just knew how to successfully interact with and approach, talk to, attract, court, seduce, and take the lead from day one.

The biggest womanizers I grew up with didn’t have to learn anything, and pre-Internet, no one had even heard of the jargon we discuss here.

One womanizer who worked for my uncle’s store, what did he have to do to get women? Simply exist and walk outside his home.

Two of my friends have notch counts in the triple digits. Neither one has spent time reading seduction manuals or watching YouTube content surrounding seduction.

 

[pipeman84]

OP reeks of 'grass is greener' syndrome.

Many guys who got a GF in high-school went on to marry her in their early - mid 20s ... not only did they have to face the challenges of a married life when still very young (considering men mature later than women and men are on a different timeframe anyway as far as reproductive capacity is concerned), but now they could only see other women naked by watching porn, while the other guys now in their 20s could have sex with various women (if nothing else, simply by paying directly).

Guys who you'd think would just cruise on the easy street, based on their looks and social status, such as the proverbial Brad Pitt or Johnny Depp still had their share of adversity.

Bottom line: every man is on his own unique life journey, envying others based on very superficial knowing of their situation is not constructive at all.

 

[Mike32ct]

Yes, a man's childhood experiences will affect his social skills and his ability to seduce women and/or form extended relationships with them.

This. I think childhood is probably the biggest factor.

 

[Manure Spherian]

Brad Pitt or Johnny Depp still had their share of adversity.

Yes, like being left and publicly punked by their women, along with Will Smith and Ben Affleck.

Another womanizer, a former close detests being married to a good woman and routinely said to me, “Why did I get married?” He knows why he did but regrets doing so.

The archetypes of Chad and Tyrone need to die, in my opinion.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

Are very few men in the world naturals? did most guys have to go through a journey or training, practice, trial and error, or get help from a mentor or help from people in some way or form?

The fool doesn't learn from his mistakes.
The smart learns from his mistakes.
The wise learn from other people's mistakes.

 

[SW15]

a man's childhood experiences will affect his social skills and his ability to seduce women and/or form extended relationships with them.

I think childhood is probably the biggest factor.

I don't know if it is the biggest factor but it is a relevant factor.

@MatureDJ has talked about how attending an all-male high school impacted him socially. The fact that @MatureDJ is discussing this at age 55+ shows how relevant a childhood/adolescence experience is. I have met males who went to all-male high schools and they felt it took years to unwind some of the damage from that experience.

As a man in my early 40s right now, I am still feeling the consequences of multiple relocations from childhood and in my 20s. That has had a lifelong impact on my ability to get dates from social circle connections, meaning that I had to make more effort with other forms of arranging dates (co-ed sports leagues, traditional daygame, nightlife venues, and swipe apps).

In addition, my parents were a terrible married couple with an unhealthy relational dynamic. If my parents had been healthier, it actually might not have served me well because I would have had more blue pill fantasies. My mother, who mainly raised me, raised me a 'nice guy' so I had to unwind the damage of being raised as a 'nice guy'. 'Nice guys' finish last.

 

[Manure Spherian]

@MatureDJ has talked about how attending an all-male high school impacted him socially. The fact that @MatureDJ is discussing this at age 55+ shows how relevant a childhood/adolescence experience is. I have met males who went to all-male high schools and they felt it took years to unwind some of the damage from that experience.

I believe what affected me at a young age was being far outcompeted by two types of young men: scumbags and rich boys. There were no stereotypical chads we speak of today, and I believe that archetype would not be able to compete either. We did not have much in the way of athletics in my HS and few cared about that anyway.

There was no way an ordinary middle-class kid was going to out-alpha HS students driving cars teachers couldn’t afford, or actual boys for attractive girls. No out-gaming and no out-confidencing and no out-aloofing either. Actually, the early 1990’s, my pre-teen years, was the start of my own red- and blackpilling.

 

[MatureDJ]

I don't know if it is the biggest factor but it is a relevant factor.

@MatureDJ has talked about how attending an all-male high school impacted him socially. The fact that @MatureDJ is discussing this at age 55+ shows how relevant a childhood/adolescence experience is. I have met males who went to all-male high schools and they felt it took years to unwind some of the damage from that experience.

As a man in my early 40s right now, I am still feeling the consequences of multiple relocations from childhood and in my 20s. That has had a lifelong impact on my ability to get dates from social circle connections, meaning that I had to make more effort with other forms of arranging dates (co-ed sports leagues, traditional daygame, nightlife venues, and swipe apps).

In addition, my parents were a terrible married couple with an unhealthy relational dynamic. If my parents had been healthier, it actually might not have served me well because I would have had more blue pill fantasies. My mother, who mainly raised me, raised me a 'nice guy' so I had to unwind the damage of being raised as a 'nice guy'. 'Nice guys' finish last.

While it certainly gave me a late start, the main thing it did was limit the possibilities (180 degrees away from "Fast Times at Ridgemont High") - really, it's felt like my whole life I've had to mack & approach (180 degrees away from "Fast Times at Ridgemont High") while going uphill. It had hardened me to "get inside the poon, ask questions later".

I suppose that always moving around has a similar impact of having such possibilities be limited.

I don't think I've had much of a "nice guy" component. I remember being 14, and my social circle being manipulated by 12 year-old teenyboppers. (About the only time I've ever felt like there was poontang abundance, LOL.)

 

[MatureDJ]

I believe what affected me at a young age was being far outcompeted by two types of young men: scumbags and rich boys. There were no stereotypical chads we speak of today, and I believe that archetype would not be able to compete either. We did not have much in the way of athletics in my HS and few cared about that anyway.

There was no way an ordinary middle-class kid was going to out-alpha HS students driving cars teachers couldn’t afford, or actual boys for attractive girls. No out-gaming and no out-confidencing and no out-aloofing either. Actually, the early 1990’s, my pre-teen years, was the start of my own red- and blackpilling.

It's OVER for CarlessCels.

 

[SW15]

It's OVER for CarlessCels.

Not in New York City, London, or other dense urban areas with solid public transportation.

 

[MatureDJ]

Not in New York City, London, or other dense urban areas with solid public transportation.

Hardly any Americans live in such places. Imagine dating in Dallas without a car.

 

[MatureDJ]

... why do you think some or many guys are naturals at this, as in, they either learn or figure it out very early in life like i described or many guys, men, not until much later in life or never at all? Are guys supposed to learn this stuff from family members or friends, etc.?

Are very few men in the world naturals? did most guys have to go through a journey or training, practice, trial and error, or get help from a mentor or help from people in some way or form?

Naturalness = ( - Aspiness ) * Chadness

 

[SW15]

Imagine dating in Dallas without a car.

I'm going to try this thought experiment.

In thinking about a man's general lifestyle in Dallas, it would be possible but difficult to exist without a car in the Dallas area. This is a man who would need to live close to a light rail station (DART) or some Dallas bus stops in order to get to some job 5 days a week. That doesn't sound pleasant. He would have to be walkable to certain grocery stores too. There are some Central Dallas areas where this could happen.

Riding a bicycle to work in Dallas also sounds like a bad idea. Dallas is hot for a good portion of the year. I can imagine some unpleasant bus rides.

I found some Reddit threads about carless life in Dallas.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Dallas/comments/4hv5x0
https://www.reddit.com/r/askdfw/comments/mtmj4r
https://www.reddit.com/r/askdfw/comments/w79fn6

I haven't even gotten to the topic of finding dates yet or going on dates as a carless man in the Dallas area.

I don't know how that would work. Getting to date venues carless would be difficult. A lot of Dallas area women would negatively judge a man for not having a car.

 

[CornbreadFed]

Guys with the largest lay count all had this one thing in common. In addition, they were not Chads or taller than 6ft either.

They all knew the type of women they attracted and went for it. This key that unlocks every door is complete bullshvt. There might be a key that unlocks every type of certain door, but not every door.

 

[BadBoy89]

@MatureDJ has talked about how attending an all-male high school impacted him socially. The fact that @MatureDJ is discussing this at age 55+ shows how relevant a childhood/adolescence experience is. I have met males who went to all-male high schools and they felt it took years to unwind some of the damage from that experience.

Thats hilarious. I actually wish I went to an all boys school,

It was junior high that messed me up. Why? Because I was new to the school and because of the girls. At that age the boy‘s hormones is going crazy for the girls and he will do anything. They tried to blind me, stab me, and I scarred up my face for life over the girls. So an all boys school is a actually a good thing,

In addition, my parents were a terrible married couple with an unhealthy relational dynamic. If my parents had been healthier, it actually might not have served me well because I would have had more blue pill fantasies. My mother, who mainly raised me, raised me a 'nice guy' so I had to unwind the damage of being raised as a 'nice guy'. 'Nice guys' finish last.

Same thing here.

Although my mom was more about emotional and physical abuse than about “being a nice guy.”

 

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

This happens a lot. It's become more common in both the Millennial and Gen Z generations. This wasn't that common for Gen X, Boomers, Silents, and the GI Generation.



Yes, a man's childhood experiences will affect his social skills and his ability to seduce women and/or form extended relationships with them.





Two of my friends have notch counts in the triple digits. Neither one has spent time reading seduction manuals or watching YouTube content surrounding seduction.

yeah a perfect example, these are the types of guys, men, not all, but many of them, are the ones who have always been naturals with women, the jocks in high school, athletes, for them, knowing how to talk to and attract women has always been common sense for them, they never needed a mentor or never needed help, guidance on this.

 

[Manure Spherian]

It's OVER for CarlessCels.

Well, I was speaking about my middle and high school experiences in the 1990s, not people aged 20 and up.

And I meant to say actual bad boys in my previous post. Actually the most violent psychos I grew up with got many women. And no, that’s not because they were aloof and confident. Lol.

 

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

and i remember i read this statement from a pretty well known dating/relationship, attraction coach for guys, men, he said this though:

"Talking to and attracting women isn't something that comes natural or instinctive, innate, to the vast majority of men. It's something you're taught. Men who are said to be "naturally" great with women usually learn from their father, an older brother, or some masculine figure in their family. Men who don't have that charismatic male figure, but consistently date gorgeous women, always have a lot of options, or have amazing girlfriends, seek out other men who are good, and learn directly from them."

You think he is right, correct?