intense 4 month relationship turns to LJBF... what to do?

[mintxx]

Hey guys,

If you glance over past posts of mine, I was having trouble with a LTR. It was finally resolved, as I expected, when a girl in my classes at law school started hitting on me. I knew she was intense and that it'd be a start-middle-end in a few months type scenario, but I let the LTR go and started a steamy entanglement with this girl. And, as I think Bible Belt or someone predicted in one of my threads, law school girls are quite something.

She'd made a few comments about my being inconsistent with things I say, the usual stuff, because I hadn't really expected it to go anywhere so I'd kind of let my guard down. So we talked it through, I gave her some space (went upstate for a week), and tonight she invited me round to her house, where I then went with some (again) expectation that things would be wrapped up/broken off in lieu of an escalation of 'relationship stuff', which neither of us wanted.

She tells me that she's got no energy to give to a relationship (valid point, she's starting a career as a lawyer and during clerkships the process is very stressful, she only has time to sleep) and that she hasn't got the feelings for me that she did a week or two earlier. We hadn't slept together for three weeks or more because of time apart, stress, and my being somewhat reticent because I could sense that things were drawing to a close (not good for performance anxiety). She also told me about several things that bothered her about me, all valid points, and I wasn't sure if this meant that she wanted me to change them for the future or if she was just rounding out her general reasons for ending it.

She then says she wants to have no contact for three weeks, except at her initiation if she wants to go out for dinner to celebrate her likely acceptance into a firm. In three weeks school resumes and we'll have to see each other; she says by this time she will have worked out whether she just wants to be friends or wants to try getting back together. She refuses to rule out getting back together even if we become friends first. And on it goes.

She cries a bit, says she'll miss me over the next few weeks, refers to her sister having a good relationship with an ex boyfriend. I'm not really upset though I'm sure I'll feel it down the line when I'm chucking her stuff so another girl can stake a claim on my bed, but obviously I'm motivated enough to examine the possibilities that I've posted this stuff.

SO:
In your experiences, in the break > LJBF/time to work one's sh!t out etc scenario, what are the good signs and bad signs? This has happened before with other girls and worked out later, but it also has not and no patterns are evident, and if I'm the one doing the breaking/LJBF it's usually because I'm running around town, so my opinions from that point of view are useless.

and:
What are good strategies to 'get her back'? Yes, there is another girl who I'm randomly seeing for dinner and late night fooling around, and my ex is also trying to get me back and looking very good doing it, but neither of these girls is more than a second choice and I am not leading them on to believing otherwise unless that changes.

obvously I haven't told the whole story and it's not very well explained, so ask for the details you want if you'd like to offer me advice. My current strategy is my failsafe one: walk away, do nothing, spin more plates. But I want to keep this plate spinning, and anything I can do to influence the situation will stop me feeling that I just let things slide off the pole with her. My strong feeling is that she's cutting ties gradually but this girl is unusual for a lot of reasons, very upfront and honest with everything, very generous and undemanding, emotional but very logical at the same time, so I don't want to jump the gun. I can't stand doing nothing and I want to work out what's up so that I can take some other opportunities ASAP (or not).

Thanks for reading. Any advice will be gratefully considered.

mintxx out

 

[jophil28]

Hey guys,


She then says she wants to have no contact for three weeks, except at her initiation if she wants to go out for dinner to celebrate her likely acceptance into a firm.

mintxx out

She told you that she has lowered IL and that she does not want contact for 3 weeks UNLESS it suits her.
And you still want advice on what to do next ?

Imagine this scenario-

In ten years you make partner in a top firm.
A junior lawyer who was hired by you and has been employed for a few months tells you that he has lost interest in the job and does not want to come into the office for three weeks and does not want you to call him. However HE wants the freedom to come back to the job if he feels like it.
What do you say to him ?

 

[Metro3pilot]

she does not want contact for 3 weeks UNLESS it suits her

Wow, what balls she has ! ! !

concentrate on school ...give her all the space she wants and then mulitply by 3 and add a new girl to your rotation.

when she comes back tell her she was right " space is good "


:rockon:

 

[Phyzzle]

In your experiences, in the break > LJBF/time to work one's sh!t out etc scenario, what are the good signs and bad signs?

The entire thing is an extremely bad sign. "We need a break" is slang for "it's over, and I am to wussy to say that it's over." I think everyone would agree with that experience.

But you've got other, more serious problems with decisiveness. It's nice to have options, but it's time to DECIDE WHAT YOU WANT AND GO GET IT. IN THAT ORDER.

I knew she was intense and that it'd be a start-middle-end in a few months type scenario, but I let the LTR go and started a steamy entanglement with this girl.

Well, it's been a few months. Sounds perfect to me!

But now you want to get her back? So now, after all these months of being distant, and keeping her at bay, she's suddenly good enough for a real LTR?

I'll tell you why you suddenly find her so "honest, undemanding, emotional, and logical" and awesome. It's because she dumped you. And getting dumped jacks up your interest every time. Show more decisiveness and self-control.

She'd made a few comments about my being inconsistent with things I say, the usual stuff, because I hadn't really expected it to go anywhere so I'd kind of let my guard down.

I'm not sure what that means, but again, you come off as indecisive. "You're the only one for me baby - BUT . . ." You want her to commit to you while you spend x amount of time deciding if she's good enough, where x is the rest of your lives.

With your old LTR, it was the same thing. With her for 2 years? It was an "open" relationship, yet you had to dump her for the new girl? So which is it? Make up your mind. Where do you WANT to stand with any of these girls, exactly?

 

[KontrollerX]

Dude its the same "breaks" bullsh!t that all chicks say when they're cutting ties but simply wrapped up in a more slick subtley manipulative package.

To go along with this you are allowing her to dictate the course of the relationship and your worth as a potential boyfriend.

In short she is the prize and you are lucky that she is considering you.

Destroy her power supply and take yourself out of this pitiful equation.

A man that believes in himself and loves himself fully will never allow a woman to judge his worth in a mean spirited cynical selfish way such as this.

Chick: Yeah in three weeks I'll decide if you're worth starting up with again.
AFC: Oh golly gosh I can't wait mistress!

Chick: same words said above.
Real Man ie the DJ: No in three weeks I'll be balls deep in someother hottie and you can just go find yourself some random loser who will put up with your blatant disrespect because I won't. Goodbye.

 

[DavenJuan]

i vital key is what response you gave her when she gave you this speech on what she wants from oou over the next three weeks

there is no changing you ( atleast not for her )

i would have thanked her for not wasting any more of your time.

the biggest question that i want you to answer is this....

If she gets back with you in three weeks on her terms... WHERE DO YOU THINK THIS RELATIONSHIP IS GOING ??

you will forever be in her eyes an AFC.

 

[drmeathead]

dude i agree with all the other guys. you need to just roll. no explanation or anything. she created the space. you go have fun with it. dont try to get her back. sure she says now that she will think about you and her getting back together right up until a BBD crosses her path. sorry but that is the way is.

hell if i were you id find a new woman and take her to the first social gathering you have as a law school class in the semester.

 

[CGE333]

She needs 3 weeks to figure out if the other man she has in her life is better. The whole need time/ space thing is all BS. You should have saved your manhood and told her that you were not waiting for 3 weeks and it was done and over with. That would have allowed you to move on w/ your life as the one in charge of your own life and not have it controlled by some attention *****- who I imagine bagged many man during her law school days.

 

[joekerr31]

Dude its the same "breaks" bullsh!t that all chicks say when they're cutting ties but simply wrapped up in a more slick subtley manipulative package.

To go along with this you are allowing her to dictate the course of the relationship and your worth as a potential boyfriend.

In short she is the prize and you are lucky that she is considering you.

Destroy her power supply and take yourself out of this pitiful equation.

A man that believes in himself and loves himself fully will never allow a woman to judge his worth in a mean spirited cynical selfish way such as this.

Chick: Yeah in three weeks I'll decide if you're worth starting up with again.
AFC: Oh golly gosh I can't wait mistress!

Chick: same words said above.
Real Man ie the DJ: No in three weeks I'll be balls deep in someother hottie and you can just go find yourself some random loser who will put up with your blatant disrespect because I won't. Goodbye.

bang on the money.

she wants to keep you around as an orbiter. a fail safe in case she doesnt meet anyone else. basically as a potential daddy.

women assess men on two levels. the first is 'am i attracted to him'. the second is 'would he make a good daddy'

she is no longer attracted to you, but probably thinks youd make a good daddy. so shed like to keep you on the side just in case she decides to give up on men / finding mr. right, and decides to just settle down and have some bambinos.

 

[mintxx]

hmm. so i told her to drop by my house and i gave her her stuff back. she cracked it, saying that i'd already said i'd 'wait for her' and that now i'd reneged on this. i said nothing and let her storm off. tonight after work she's calling me saying she wants to meet tomorrow. i figure this is because she's wanting to end it since she knows the break **** won't fly with me, so i tell her to do it on the phone. she refuses, so i say if we're gonna meet it will have to be somewhere convenient for me, i.e. the restaurant downstairs from my apartment which i never visit (so no losing face or bad memories should she throw a beer at me or something).

kind of funny guys... i woke up, went to the gym, watched the patriots lose (yes we even watch it in Oz) had a few beers with my 2 good mates, watched 'swingers' and did some paralegal applications... and now i don't even want to be with her, so my chief fear is that she'll somehow decide she wants to work things out. after this bullsh!t it's never going to work, so hopefully she's just doing the decent thing and wanting to end things completely rather than spinning me sh!t.

such a shame. she was growing on me. but it gets easier every time. thanks all for your sensible and entertaining replies.

mintxx out

 

[MacAvoy]

Why do you need to meet her one more time to officially break up? What will it accomplish except to feed her some validation?

 

[PhatE1vis]

so my chief fear is that she'll somehow decide she wants to work things out. after this bullsh!t it's never going to work, so hopefully she's just doing the decent thing and wanting to end things completely rather than spinning me sh!t.

You're still not taking control of this situation. At this point, she shouldn't be deciding anything about the situation...she already made her intentions clear. YOU should be the one doing the decision-making, namely that you're not going to let yourself be jerked around.

You need to lay down the law here. If you meet her (not a good idea), you have to be the aggressor from the get-go. Let her know that you're done with this, you're not waiting for three weeks, and are just meeting her to be courteous and respectful of what you once had.

 

[Mr. Me]

she cracked it, saying that i'd already said i'd 'wait for her' and that now i'd reneged on this.

Well, hey, she changed her mind about you, right? So, why aren't you permitted the luxury of changing your mind too?

It's such BS. Kind of funny when you consider she's the one that wants away from you, right? So what's the point of pulling you back in, except for that she wants to hold all the cards and be the Dumper?

so my chief fear is that she'll somehow decide she wants to work things out

To which you would then say, what?

She tells me that she's got no energy to give to a relationship (valid point, she's starting a career as a lawyer and during clerkships the process is very stressful, she only has time to sleep) and that she hasn't got the feelings for me that she did a week or two earlier. We hadn't slept together for three weeks or more because of time apart, stress, and my being somewhat reticent because I could sense that things were drawing to a close (not good for performance anxiety). She also told me about several things that bothered her about me, all valid points, and I wasn't sure if this meant that she wanted me to change them for the future or if she was just rounding out her general reasons for ending it.

This is a classic example of how guys buy into a woman's excuses for her disinterest. Not for nothing, but I think about the women who jump on planes to move cross country to be with the man they love, or break their arm but still keep the date, or defy their family to marry the guy they're enamored with, or go rob banks with the guy they're crazy for, give away their beloved pets they've had for years because the guy's allergic to them, even how they scheme and plan and contrive to meet their secret lovers outside of their primary relationship and stealthily cover their tracks. When I hear a woman say, "I don't go crosstown for a date, that's too much!" or any other excuse, I think about how women will jump over mountains to be with the guy they want to be with.

The women give a sometimes plausible explanation, but it usually is a repeat of what we've heard before. Nothing much new in their game book. "I'm not ready for a relationship", "I was hurt in my last relationship", "I'm confused", "My schedule's busy with school/career/family" - and the guy, rather than his ego accepting the blow that she's not into him, rationalizes and agrees with her excuses, blaming them as the fault.

So this "she's got no energy to give to a relationship (valid point, she's starting a career as a lawyer and during clerkships the process is very stressful, she only has time to sleep" strikes me like that. If Mr. Wow came along, she'd probably say, "You know what? I need a break from all this stress!" and she'd manage to find time for him rather than let him slip by.

A woman really interested but honestly pressed for time would still find some time during non-working hours to be with you. In fact, she'd be looking forward to it!

Your relationship has been in trouble for a while, you said, so it's not surprising that this is the outcome.

What are good strategies to 'get her back'? The best is to not focus on winning her back, but to move on. If you win her back, that's a side result, not the aim. Chances are though that the same stuff would happen again if you two reunited.

To go along with and accept her terms, however, means you've forever empowered her to dictate the balance of the relationship and she'll know that all she has to do to keep you in line is to threaten to end the relationship.

 

[joekerr31]

excellent post mr. me.

one of the toughest things for a guy to accept is that whether a woman is 'in' to him is mostly out of his control.

and i know, that goes against the sosuave mantra.

DJ tactics will get you laid, but they won't get you a healthy LTR.

the only way to have a healthy LTR is if the woman is head over heels for you.

lots of women 'settle'. trust me, ive met tons of them. they hit a point where they get scared they arent going to find a guy, so when one that they can 'live with' comes along they 'settle'.

you DO NOT want this.

any guy who has experienced a woman who was head over heels for him knows what settling is. but those guys who have never experienced a woman being into them that much have no reference. they think 'hesitation' on a womans part is normal.

well, it is normal in the sense that many guys experience this. but its not normal in terms of a relationship that has the potential to work long term.

like it or not a lot of finding 'love' is out of your hands. either you flip her switch just by being you, or you dont. yes, you can temporarily flip her switch and get laid, but long term its impossible to keep that switch flipped.

most marriages fall apart because both parties basically 'settled' when they shouldn't have.

 

[##17]

A lesson I have learned the hard way (and have seen friends learn the hard way): Whenever a woman starts dictating to you the terms of the relationship and you entertain that discussion, as she did with you and you with her, it's pretty much over.

When she originally brought up all that she did and went into her female drama, you should have said, "You know what? I don't have time for this. Let's just end it."

I know you think you laid down the law your last interaction, but I'm not sure why you've agreed to meet her again, period. When she called you, you should have demanded a good reason from her for you to spend an hour of your life (wich you did not) or forget it.

 

[KontrollerX]

"I know you think you laid down the law your last interaction, but I'm not sure why you've agreed to meet her again, period."

Its like an unconscious sleep walking leftover piece of AFC mindset.

Like how we all know most AFC's are nice guys to the point that they become pathetic doormats at a mean woman's whims.

So when a guy wakes up to his AFC status and starts changing into a DJ part of that AFC mindset can insidiously lay around dormant just waiting to be exploited.

In this man's situation for example his DJ mind is telling him yeah she disrespected me so its over I'm not waiting around for her to judge my worth you fellow DJ's are right etc, etc but that leftover AFC remnant of mind that is just under our consciousness is creeping up on him going hey you're a nice guy you might as well meet her. Nothing wrong with that after all. End things in an honorable face to face manner but the conscious well developed DJ mind would meet her disrespect by snubbing her and not showing up to the meeting or hanging up on her when she persisted to meet. The developed DJ mind and the mind of the natural born DJ react to massive disrespect from a woman with outright disgust and intolerance while the AFC mind is so overly kind it can be fooled into going along with something as seemingly benign as a dinner date with a disrespectful woman who doesn't deserve one iota of your time any longer.

Anyway this isn't meant to disrespect the original poster just so he knows but its to point out I think something we have all struggled with at times and been fooled by and didn't even know was still within us.

That latent behind the scenes AFC dwelling in our brain that can be insidiously hard to kill as easily as the conscious AFC which we recognize outright when reading the posts here on the forum.

 

[Mr. Me]

you can temporarily flip her switch and get laid, but long term its impossible to keep that switch flipped.

Last night, wasn't sleepy so I stayed up and tried to bore myself to sleep watching E! the Top 25 Hollywood Cougar Tales. Hey, there's only so much I wanna hear over again about Eli Manning, okay?

Though celebs are notorious for haphazard love lives, I tune in to the nuggets: Tim Robbins and Susan Sarandon, together for years, right? What do they say keeps it going? She says "We're still discovering things about each other". That stood out to me. What does that mean? That these people continue to explore their own self-interests and keep developing as people, so that there's always something new about them, some facet about them previously untapped? That they don't become predictable? They don't permit things to become mundane?

 

[joekerr31]

Last night, wasn't sleepy so I stayed up and tried to bore myself to sleep watching E! the Top 25 Hollywood Cougar Tales. Hey, there's only so much I wanna hear over again about Eli Manning, okay?

Though celebs are notorious for haphazard love lives, I tune in to the nuggets: Tim Robbins and Susan Sarandon, together for years, right? What do they say keeps it going? She says "We're still discovering things about each other". That stood out to me. What does that mean? That these people continue to explore their own self-interests and keep developing as people, so that there's always something new about them, some facet about them previously untapped? That they don't become predictable? They don't permit things to become mundane?

well i think a big reason they are still together is they seem to share the same values. they both have a similar deameanor, they both have similar views on life, etc.

its only when you have this compatibility that you can have a true partnership wherein you support each other through life.

most men and women do not have an overlap in beliefs. most men are with their woman for sex, most women are with their man to have kids and for his provider role. it just doesnt work long term - both parties feel used in the end.

the only time it works is when you both have a deep appreciation for each other and share similar views on the world, this allows you to both pretty much grow in the same direction.

without similar views, as the years go on, each person tends to evolve in a different direction than their spouse.

i've found that women who share my general views on life fall madly in love with me. meanwhile the ones where there is a clear divide in our views ultimately end up turning in to your typical whiny woman.

 

[joekerr31]

btw, susan saradon is a really good example of how a very average looking woman can command a lot of attention as the result of being mature.

i mean, she is by no means a hottie. she's got those bug eyes, shes old, tangly messy hair, etc. i mean, tim could have scored a much hotter woman than her for sure - but he obviously has the hots for her.

and there are tons of guys who think shes hot. and the reason is that despite being a star she seems like a low maintenance, down to earth woman.

if women only knew how sexy being low maintenance and low drama was!

 

[RedPill]

Thanks for reading. Any advice will be gratefully considered.

Go fukk ten other women.