In A Traditional Marriage, A Woman Don’t Need No Money

[Brother_Rapp]

PRM
You're wrong about this one. Like I always do I did legitamate studies on why the divorce rate has gone up so much. With women being in the work place comes addtional temptations (That were limited to men until the womens lib reveloution) that accounts partly for extramarital affairs. A lot of them do it for the thrill, the danger or whatever. True some of them have lost faith in their men but the other reasons (for cheating) are just as valid and for the most part more realistic.

Brother Rapp
Have you found a measurable difference in the following percentages? (Women who cheat due to working a job / women who work a job) & (men who cheat due to working a job / men who work a job )

Also, in your opinion, what is the major reason as to why men cheat and the major reason as to why women cheat.



PRM
Again you fail to see the broadness of people. You don't need to coach your spouse on anything if they're natrually better at it then you.

Brotherr Rapp
It wasn’t all about coaching someone. My point was, “as long as the gal does his job the guy won’t do his”. People whether consciously or not do only so much as they have to do to get what they want.

Also in situations where a gal makes more then a man, there’s little incentive for him to fully apply himself. Why work overtime? Hell,..she’s making more then me. It doesn’t make for a healthy relationship in my opinion. Kills the guys aggressiveness. When properly channeled, aggression is a good thing. Wouldn’t you agree?

In your opinion, do you feel that most guys want women that make more money then them or less money then them?


PRM
Like I said if your wife is a finacial WIZARD then you'll never be able to catch up to her knowledge just clutzing around with numbers, it just wont work out. She's been trained at a skill and if she's better at it then you there's no reason why she shouldn't handle that aspect of your lives reagardless

Brother Rapp
Did you seek out this type of situation and if so why?


PRM
if you think men should be the primary decison makers when it comes to money. Why would I ask my finacially brilliant wife to "stand back" if she's got a talent that would take me years upon years to learn?


Brother Rapp
Again, I would ask, did you seek out this type of situation and if so why?


PRM
Yes women are better nurturers because they give birth, men are more agressive because men are territorial and thus fight more often then not.


Brother Rapp
I’ll use your own words on this one.
“One of us is good at it, so my time would be better off learning something else that will do the both of us good”


PRM
This doesn't mean they have to be limited or restricted to these rolls.


Brother Rapp
Did you see “Jurassic Park”? The theme behind it was “nature will always find a way”. Men will turn to females and females will turn to males. Look at our prisons where there is an overwhelming lack of the opposite sex. I suppose you agree with that also? I kind of think that “GENERALLY SPEAKING”, they should fill their natural roles. Again I have to wonder if you sought out the particular type of marital situation that you’re in and if so why?

PRM
There are single father house holds where men have to become the nurturers, and there are female soldiers who hang out on the strip and try to pick up (and pick fights with guys). Better does not mean interchangeable, either sex is capable at being very good at the roles that the other fills natrually. Just because one or the other is better at it doesn't mean that things are right.

Brother Rapp
In such cases, do these single guys seek a woman to come in and do the job of nurturing for them? Do single women seek men to come in an do the job of provider and protector?


PRM
PS I think you called me a girl by accident some where in your post. "Try it with your guy" I am a guy and I'm not really into that.

Brother Rapp
Yeah, I think I did, but I tried to go back and clean it up with the titling of the grocery example. I’m fighting off a lot of people on this debate and I got a little mixed up. I apologize.I meant no disrespect.


PRM
*Sigh* do I really have to tell you why this is wrong? Come on cutting off an arm vs marriage? Marriage has evolved 10 folds over the course of the dawn of man. If we can move from having multiple wives to just one then you're not giving up so much in changing roles and positions in marriage over the course of a few years...Cutting of your arm give me a break.


Brother Rapp
I would submit that there is not a need for men to have more then one wife. Having more then one wife is proper when there is a need to increase the population of something. It’s a valid tactic. When the civilization of the world was young, men had many wives. There was a legitimate reason for that. The Mormons did it to spread there faith. The Chinese don’t do it in order to lower their population. If there were a nuclear war and the world was decimated, we’d do as was suggested in “Dr.Strangelove”. We’d go under ground and each man would have multiple wives.




PRM
I didn't ask you if these things WILL happen because they both do happen. I just showed you how in either situation one being a thesis your traditional marriage that you talk about vs a non traditional marriage that is your antithesis and both have failing and sucessful outcomes. So you see you can't be right because in either situation the outcomes were both right and wrong depending on the turn of events in the trials we call life. Neither one of them presents a winning outcome, how your marriage shapes up depends on many factors not just the roles of the players involved. That's check and checkmate my friend.

Brother Rapp
I don’t think that it is all that cut and dry.

 

[Climax]

How about cut it out?

This is getting sad.

 

[SheDevil]

Thank you!!

Brother Rapp

I am not going to hyper focus or respond to infinitesimal phrases that are taken out of context. Maybe I have a touch of adult ADHD because I simply can't grasp the framework of your logic or find ANY point you are trying to make in this epistle.

But, I want to thank you for something.

Last night, my lover came up to me and said, "Babydoll, what do you think of you and me going to......."

The poor man still doesn't know what hit him. I was on him like white on rice, drowning him in kisses (and beyond).

Here is this wonderful man, who wants my input, who values my opinions, who knows I can have a competent thought, who admires my drive and determination, God I am so blessed!

I am not being sassy, I took his trust and confidence in me for granted, until reading your post. I will never do that again.

I wish you the best with your thoughts and dreams, I feel you are selling yourself short and denying yourself real happiness, but that is your decision.

Thanks again

 

[Brother_Rapp]

Wyldfire
No, I can't EVER foresee a scenario where I would just give a guy my paycheck. Nor could I foresee a scenario where a guy would just give me HIS paycheck. No one should even ask or expect such a thing because it is INSULTING to the other person.

Brother Rapp
From your statement, can I surmise that you would not allow a husband of your’ to control the finances?

Demanding or asking? Let’s not play with words like that. Going beyond that, would you feel that it is insulting to the wife for the guy to be the only one controlling the finances and why? We’re talking about a situation that already exist and we’re past the demanding or asking part.

 

[PRMoon]

Re: How about cut it out?

Originally posted by ~ªêQµïTª$~
This is getting sad.

Ugh you're right aequitas, it's an endless waltz.
Brother_Rapp, as you can see I like to play devils advocate, one of my hobbies, but even I can't play for ever. If you want to delve more into the evolutions of marriage i suggest you do your own study. You seem to have enough questions about it, so you should go to people who spend their lives studying the subject.

 

[Brother_Rapp]

SheDevil
Last night, my lover came up to me and said, "Babydoll, what do you think of you and me going to......."
Here is this wonderful man, who wants my input, who values my opinions, who knows I can have a competent thought, who admires my drive and determination, God I am so blessed!

Brother Rapp
If you feel blessed behind a single instance where he asked your opinion on some entertainment for the two of you, then that’s wonderful.

SheDevil
I am not being sassy, I took his trust and confidence in me for granted, until reading your post. I will never do that again.


Brother Rapp
Sleeping with someone requires a lot of trust and faith and all that good shyt. That person could have screwed somebody else and brought a deadly disease to your bed. While you’re asleep, you’re very defenseless. That other person could pull at a pistol from a drawer and blow your brains out. Sleeping with someone requires a lot of trust and faith. How is it that you can trust your guy with your life but not with your money finances? Do you believe that he is too stupid? Please explain the way you have arranged your priorities. He can hold your life in his hands, but not your money?

 

[SheDevil]

Brother Rapp:
"If you feel blessed behind a single instance where he asked your opinion on some entertainment for the two of you, then that’s wonderful."

SD: No, I am blessed because he does it ALL THE TIME, B_R, in every area of our realtionship. Your text has really opened my eyes to how much that means to me, how grateful I am that he IN NO WAY shares your views!






Brother Rapp:
Sleeping with someone requires a lot of trust and faith and all that good shyt. That person could have screwed somebody else and brought a deadly disease to your bed. While you’re asleep, you’re very defenseless. That other person could pull at a pistol from a drawer and blow your brains out. Sleeping with someone requires a lot of trust and faith. How is it that you can trust your guy with your life but not with your money finances? Do you believe that he is too stupid? Please explain the way you have arranged your priorities. He can hold your life in his hands, but not your money?

SD: You dont know how hard I have been giggling while reading this.

My lover was raised mennonite, B_R, he was raised in the beliefs that you speak of - times 10!!!

Woman had no say, they served their man only, walked 3 steps behind and kept downcast eyes. The woman he tried to share a life with followed all the rules, obeyed his every command and left him feeling empty and unfulfilled.

But my lover 'woke up', he found that a woman can be a partner, and an asset to his life.

A union can be the joining of two equals, not one leader and one follower, just simply blended.

I trust him with my life, as he trust me with his.

I trust him with my finances, as he trust me with his.

We are partners, we are together, we are one.

We have lived together since January.

I decided, not him, I decided to blend our banking. We have a joint accounts, savings, checking, IRA's, everything.

I never said I didnt trust him with my finances, but he and I do all things together, there is no cause for concern. He never demand I "render my power" to him. He would never find that kind of life fulfilling.

Why are you so hung up on money and power anyway, have you been hung out to dry before?

You have positioned yourself really high on the alter, my friend, in your over stuffed throne, why? Did someone put you there or was this all self-inflicted?

 

[Brother_Rapp]

To PRM
You put forth what I feel is an unusual situation, a marriage in which the woman makes more then the man. I asked if you sought out a relationship like that and if so why? Is it that you feel incapable of managing money so you wanted someone who could? Is it that you want an easier and quicker way to wealth so you looked for someone with more money then you? If so, I would submit that it’s not the norm. These reasons have some implications. I don’t ask questions just to ask questions. My argument is in terms of “Generally Speaking” & “For The Most Part”, if followed there will be a long and strong marriage. If “Generally Speaking” & “For The Most Part” men thought as you, then I would have to re-evaluate my beliefs. I would like to know if you feel that you are the norm or a deviation from the norm. Then I would like to know the “why” of you seeking a marriage like the one you are in..

 

[Brother_Rapp]

I put forth a belief. That belief was that in a traditional marriage, a woman don’t need no money. By definition in a traditional marriage a woman don’t need no money. She is not the one that manages money in a traditional marriage anyway. In a traditional marriage, the woman is the primary caregiver, manages the home while the guy goes out and works to support his family. I won the argument when I first started the topic. It was the same as saying 1 + 1 = 2 , Agree 100%, Agree over 50%, Disagree 100%, Disagree over 50%. The argument then went in the direction of the merits of the Traditional Marriage” and it’s relevance in today’s society. Is a traditional marriage the best type of marriage?. One shoe don’t fit all, I’ll admit that. “Generally Speaking” & “ For The Most Part”, I feel that the traditional marriage is the best. It depends on the “who of” and the “why’s of” that marriage and the result upon society in general.

There has been a marked decline in the amount of “Traditional Marriages” since the rise of feminism. Then that decline in the amount of “Traditional Marriages” was accelerated by the decline in the economy. Since the decline of the amount of “Traditional Marriages”, there has been a marked rise in the amounts of divorces, single parent homes (mostly with the woman and the kids being together), crime rate, and poverty among minorities. These are undeniable facts. Is one the direct or indirect cause of the others? Some of you have said that marriage has evolved. If today’s “Modern Marriage” is the direct or indirect cause of the rise in the amounts of divorces, single parent homes (mostly with the woman and the kids being together), crime rate, and poverty among minorities, then I would say that it’s going in the wrong direction. The “why’s “ and the “justifications” of the direction towards the “Modern Marriage” are where we are now in this debate that actually ended from jump street.

Different individuals have posed different marital scenarios. If those individuals are not willing to discuss the “why” of what they did in those marital scenarios, then credible arguments for the justification of either the “Traditional Marriage” and it’s relevance in today’s society as apposed to the “Modern Marriage” and it’s relevance in today’s society cannot be made. People can always fall back on “I feel that I should do what’s right for me”. But if “what’s right for you results in a rise in the amounts of divorces, single parent homes (mostly with the woman and the kids being together), crime rate, and poverty among minorities, and you still feel that it’s right for you, then you are truly inconsiderate of others and society in general. It’s like shooting up with heroin and not giving a shyt about the effect that it will have on your loved ones around you. Certainly you are not giving a shyt about the judicial system that has to deal with the ripple effects of your action of shooting up. That causes everybody extra tax dollars. The justification of either the “Traditional Marriage” and it’s relevance in today’s society as apposed to the “Modern Marriage” and it’s relevance in today’s society is dependent upon the “why’s”. Those that wish to discuss and debate the “why’s “ please stay.

I still intend to follow that poll. The voting will be interesting. It is the same as saying 1 + 1 = 2 , Agree 100%, Agree over 50%, Disagree 100%, Disagree over 50%.

 

[PRMoon]

Brother_Rapp
The relationship I'm in is not unique to me. My friend dated a girl whos father was the president of Wells Fargo in Vegas at one point. On top of that, she's an airline captian for a major airline so she makes way more money then him.
We didn't actively seek these girls. Although I did persue the one i'm trying to be with for some time but it has nothing to do with her or my finacial situation. She's going to have more money then I am there's no two ways about it. Did I seek this sitation out? No, I'm attracted to her physically and more importantly I like how she thinks and acts. I didn't even find out her backround or her carrer plans till I was already interested in her. Regardless there are tons upon tons of hot wealthy girls where I am and it's hit or miss as to if you're making more money then they are. I do doubt however any of them would let their b/f or husband make all the finacial decisons for them. They're very selfminded modern girls who really don't need anyone, especially their significant other telling them what to do with what they have.
If I tried to tell sarah to stand back and let me handle our money situations she'd kick the sh*t out of me out like no other, and I wouldn't blame her. At the same time I wouldn't expect her to try to take control of my finaces. Of course we're both open to each others advice but what's mine is mine and what's hers is hers.
The norm is for people to be in different situations and know how to cope with what's in front of them, not mold it to your own design.

 

[Wyldfire]

Originally posted by Brother_Rapp
Wyldfire
No, I can't EVER foresee a scenario where I would just give a guy my paycheck. Nor could I foresee a scenario where a guy would just give me HIS paycheck. No one should even ask or expect such a thing because it is INSULTING to the other person.

Brother Rapp
From your statement, can I surmise that you would not allow a husband of your’ to control the finances?

Demanding or asking? Let’s not play with words like that. Going beyond that, would you feel that it is insulting to the wife for the guy to be the only one controlling the finances and why? We’re talking about a situation that already exist and we’re past the demanding or asking part.

First of all...I have NO interest in getting married again. It would take one hell of an amazing man, rope, duct tape and chloroform to even GET me to the altar and I'd be kicking and screaming the whole time.

Secondly..."traditional marriage" is dead and gone for the most part. No amount of preaching and praying on here or elsewhere is going to bring it back. You can't seem to grasp the reality that women do NOT want a traditional marriage. If they did, there would be hundreds of thousands of women who embraced and adored "AFCs" as is and there would be no purpose for this site.

And for the LAST time...NO...I would NOT agree to or "let" a man be in control of my finances on his own. Again...I tried that once and ended up having to clean up one hell of a mess made by a totally irresponsible man who sucked at handling the money. And while we're on the subject...paying the bills and handling the money falls under the management and running of the home, which in a traditional marriage was the responsibility of the woman to deal with. The most the "traditional" husband did was sign the checks.

I'm not responding to you anymore...and you post like a troll...repeating the same stuff over and over again. I've made essentially the same comments 3 or more times and you still keep asking the same stupid a$$ questions as if you think by rewording them the answer will change. It won't. I would NEVER accept the kind of relationship you are talking about, period. I don't care if the man is perfect in every other way...I demand respect and anything less is simply unacceptable.

 

[Brother_Rapp]

PRM
Are there people there with multiple divorces? Would you consider there being a high rate of cheating on one another in this group of yours. How are children taken care of by the married couples that you have come across? Would you also comment on the drug usage amongst the circle. Do you have any idea as to the possibility of her doing a background check on you? Have you two discussed failed relationships of the past?

 

[PRMoon]

Nevada is one of the easiet cities in america to get a divorce, so obviously the divorce rate in my state is high, hell people from other states come here to get divorces, so that inflates the numbers greatly.
No most of the people in my circle of friends (even the ones where women have more income) don't cheat on each other more then anyone else.
My friends who do have children take care of them like any other family. One of the parents takes the child to school or day care, and one or the other pickes them up after work and takes them home where they have as much of a normal family life as anyone else.
Drug use is here in nevada just like any where else. I've lived in three states and I'd say it's just about as easy to get any drug in any metropolitan city as it is here if you know the right people or are into that sort of thing. Some of my friends use delta 9 tetrahycanibol and a select few have freaquented cocaine, but similar situations existed in the other states i've lived in as well.
I don't see my girl doing a backround check on me anytime soon because I'm truthful to her and her and my friends back up my stories, so I highly doubt the thought has crossed her mind especially since she really likes me.
Oddly enough I met her just after she and her ex broke up, which kinda made me weary, I didn't want to be the rebound guy, so I played it carefully and took my time with her. I knew right when i met her that she was very special to me so I made it my job to put myself past her anger (she was not happy about breaking up with her ex) and worked my way into her mind and I'm hoping to touch her heart in the not too distant future. We discuss relationships all the time, her room mate tells me that I'm the only person she's met, (including her ex) that can get her to quit yapping and preaching and actually sit and listen. So I think I'm on the right track with what I've got going for me, despite the fact that she's a very dominat strong (don't forget tall) woman. I like her becasue she's a person I want to be my partner not just my lacky,

 

[Brother_Rapp]

Wyldfire
First of all...I have NO interest in getting married again. It would take one hell of an amazing man, rope, duct tape and chloroform to even GET me to the altar and I'd be kicking and screaming the whole time.


Brother Rapp
Your feelings are understandable. You had a very bad experience. But you used your past history of marriage in your argument against the “Traditional Marriage” concept and I have every right to challenge it as far as it being the general results of the “Modern Marriage” or just an anomaly. A one time event does not make the “Traditional Marriage” totally invalid.

Wyldfire
Secondly..."traditional marriage" is dead and gone for the most part. No amount of preaching and praying on here or elsewhere is going to bring it back. You can't seem to grasp the reality that women do NOT want a traditional marriage.

Brother Rapp
I think it is you who don’t want a “Traditional Marriage” and it is you who it is dead with. You haven’t made a case for all women, only yourself. That case is weak due to your poor choice of men and / or you’re poor ability to relate to his needs.

Wyldfire
If they did, there would be hundreds of thousands of women who embraced and adored "AFCs" as is and there would be no purpose for this site.

Brother Rapp
There are over 260 million people in the U.S. Your “hundreds of thousands number” would appear to put those women in a minority wouldn’t you think?

There has been a shift away from the “Traditional Marriage” towards the “Modern Marriage”. I have stated earlier why this has happened. I have yet to hear a challenge to that “why”. I can only assume that it has been accepted by those reading the posts on this topic else they would have said something.

I have yet to hear a challenge to the results of the shifting away from the “Traditional Marriage” towards the “Modern Marriage”. {Since the decline of the amount of “Traditional Marriages”, there has been a marked rise in the amounts of divorces, single parent homes (mostly with the woman and the kids being together), crime rate, and poverty among minorities.}. I have continually heard individuals applaud the “Modern Marriage”. Isn't that the same as applauding suicide for our society?

Then there are those that say that there is no way back even if we wanted to go back. To that I say bullshyt.

The scenarios brought forth here to date, can be proven to be a misinterpretation of an individual’s situation. The causes of the results of their individual situations will prove the case for the value of the “Traditional Marriage “ over the “Modern Marriage”. But I can’t do that if you don’t allow this discussion to go in that direction can I?


Wyldfire
And for the LAST time...NO...I would NOT agree to or "let" a man be in control of my finances on his own. Again...I tried that once and ended up having to clean up one hell of a mess made by a totally irresponsible man who sucked at handling the money.

Brother Rapp
We already got past what you won’t do. I’m trying to move it past that to the “why” of it all. What were the underling causes of his actions and the underling causes of your reactions in an effort to prove the value of the “Traditional Marriage “ over the “Modern Marriage”



Wyldfire
And while we're on the subject...paying the bills and handling the money falls under the management and running of the home, which in a traditional marriage was the responsibility of the woman to deal with. The most the "traditional" husband did was sign the checks.

Brother Rapp
That may have been one of the misconceptions that lead you to where you are today. When it comes to the home, the traditional wife just says what she wants. It’s up to the guy to figure out how to make it happen in order to keep his wife happy. But in order to do that, he most have full control of all the assets. He can't be doing one thing with part of the money while she's doing something else with another part of the money and be expected to make her wishes come true.If she were to do that, she'd be dooming him to failure. If she’s not happy, then he’s not going to be happy.

If the guy is smart, all he needs for her to do is say it won’t. That’s because a smart husband pays attention to his wife’s desires. If the wife is smart, she will acknowledge all his efforts in making her happy and will not nag him. Nagging kills off the good sex for her in the bedroom.
A smart woman looks for a guy that has or will have the ability to make her happy.
You may disagree with me, but in order to be happy you have to be willing to be selfish.

Generally speaking, no one puts a gun to a woman’s head and makes her choose a particular guy to be her husband. So I’m assuming that you are willing to admit that if a woman marries a guy and it doesn’t turn out like she thought it would, then it’s basically her own damn fault. After having made her choice for a husband, it’s up to her to decide at each point in their marriage, whether or not she has made a bad choice in the picking of a husband. If she has, it’s time to get a divorce. There’s this old saying about getting as much milk out of a cow as you can in one sitting and killing it or talking some every day over an extended period of time. A smart woman never pushes her husband beyond his limits in his ability to make her happy.

Wyldfire
I'm not responding to you anymore...and you post like a troll...repeating the same stuff over and over again. I've made essentially the same comments 3 or more times and you still keep asking the same stupid a$$ questions as if you think by rewording them the answer will change. It won't. I would NEVER accept the kind of relationship you are talking about, period. I don't care if the man is perfect in every other way...I demand respect and anything less is simply unacceptable.

Brother Rapp
I’m sorry that I won’t be hearing from you any more. I wish you the best of luck in your life

 

[PRMoon]

If my really wealthy girlfriend becomes my wife do I necesarily have to work just to reatain my status of man? Not saying i wouldn't work i get really fussy when i'm not doing something constructive. But if I were to get hitched to my rich girlfriend, I might not feel too inclined to work hard all the time. I might want to go yachting with her pops from time with her pops to the caymenens (he's a swell guy, family buisness so he was borne into wealth), or I might just want to travel around a bit finding interesting things in the world. I don't think i'm apt to cheating on my wife because i'm not too up on cheating on people I love. I've NEVER cheated on a girl that I've had deep feelings for like I do with Sarah.

Still though the bulk of the money for my adventures may or may not be mine (most likely not if I end up with sarah) but If we're both happy what difference does it make?

 

[Brother_Rapp]

PRM
Nevada is one of the easiet cities in america to get a divorce, so obviously the divorce rate in my state is high, hell people from other states come here to get divorces, so that inflates the numbers greatly.

Brother Rapp
The big difference between just going “steady” with someone and marriage is that it’s easier to break up “steady”. The more difficult it is to get a divorce, the more that couple is inclined to work things out once they are married and think long and hard before they get married. I would think that easy divorce laws are not good for our society in the long run. If that is true, being in a state that has liberal divorce laws says something about the people that live there. The situation is made to order for people who are tentative about entering a long time relationship. It’s like they want an easy way out as to apposed to being made to work things out. It’s easy to break up a family. Strong families strengthen our society and give our children a better chance of growing up in a healthy environment. This cuts down on overall crime and allows our society to evolve. It’s all about the survivability of the human race. There really is a bigger issue here then most people would imagine.

PRM
My friends who do have children take care of them like any other family. One of the parents takes the child to school or day care, and one or the other pickes them up after work and takes them home where they have as much of a normal family life as anyone else.

Brother Rapp
When you take about “normal life as any one”, you’re making a pretty broad statement. I think that you should back off of that statement. I don’t think that it’s a good idea to delegate parenting to strangers during preschool years. The brain of a kid during the preschool years is easily influenced. Mistakes not caught then become ingrained in the kid’s head and are harder to fix on down the line as time passes. If your kids are your future, is it best for you to work a job and leave them in day care or to not work a job and have them with you (or at least with one parent)? If the kid could speak, what do you think that the kid would say? That kid at the day care center wants it’s momma. They don’t understand stuff like portfolio, parental vacations off on fishing trips or beauty spas. The easier it is to delegate something the easier it will be considered and probably done. Having a lot of day cares is not a good idea. If it’s difficult to find a day care, you will think more about whether it is the right time financially for you to have kids in the first place. Having kids and then complaining about there not being enough day cares is like putting the horse before the carriage. Having said that, consider the problem they posed for low and middle-income families. If the wife works and drives, the day care expenses eats up most it if not all the money she makes. Those families living below the poverty level get their food stamps cut. I don’t want to go into how this produces more crime. Suffice it to say that it will affect you even in your higher then most tax bracket. That’s because your tax dollars is proportional to the size of our government and the government is proportional to the need of the citizens it governs. If the poor folks can’t pay, you will.

PRM
So I think I'm on the right track with what I've got going for me, despite the fact that she's a very dominat strong (don't forget tall) woman. I like her becasue she's a person I want to be my partner not just my lacky,

Brother Rapp
Let’s get down to it. Do you feel that such a dominant woman will yield to all your sexual fantasies in bed? If she won’t, then she will leave you unfulfilled. Can you live with that and not cheat on her? If you like her for her dominance, could it be that it also extends to sex between you? Some people want to be whipped, beaten, handcuffed and all around dominated in the act of sex. Please do not get me wrong. I’m not saying here and now that such acts are somehow morally this or that. I am saying that such acts are not generally practiced. You can also tell a lot about a person from the way they screw. A giving person will think about the needs of others before themselves (they will try to get you off before they get themselves off). A selfish person will think about their own needs before that of another (they will get themselves off and damn what you want).

PRM
If my really wealthy girlfriend becomes my wife do I necesarily have to work just to reatain my status of man? Not saying i wouldn't work i get really fussy when i'm not doing something constructive. But if I were to get hitched to my rich girlfriend, I might not feel too inclined to work hard all the time. I might want to go yachting with her pops from time with her pops to the caymenens (he's a swell guy, family buisness so he was borne into wealth), or I might just want to travel around a bit finding interesting things in the world.

Brother Rapp
You’ve just laid out your life with her very actually. You can’t make her happy by making money. So how else do you do that assuming that you do want to make her happy? Guess it has to be in the bedroom with that domineering person. You mentioned things that you might want to do. You could have talked about anything. No where in there were things that the two of you would do together. Marriage is supposed to be about the two of you and insuring the survivability of the human race. If you have all of this money that you can **** it off, couldn’t one of you give up the money and take care of some kids? Don’t you want kids? Your name will live on in your son. Your blood will live on in your daughter. Anything coming out of your daughter you know is your blood. Anything coming out of another woman might be your son’s.




PRM
Still though the bulk of the money for my adventures may or may not be mine (most likely not if I end up with sarah) but If we're both happy what difference does it make?



Brother Rapp
However the situation goes with you and your girlfriend, you cannot say that it generally fits the description of most marriages in the U.S. If you can’t do that, then you can’t use it to weight in on the value of either the “Traditional Marriage” over the “Modern Marriage” or vies versa. Both these terms are meant as “Generally Speaking” & “For The Most Part” for married couples. Even if your relationship fell within the bounds of “General” relationship, I believe that I’ve pointed out some flaws that are not conducive to the survivability of the human race. And certainly a questionable sex life for you with her.

 

[Brother_Rapp]

PRM
I didn't ask you if these things WILL happen because they both do happen. I just showed you how in either situation one being a thesis your traditional marriage that you talk about vs a non traditional marriage that is your antithesis and both have failing and sucessful outcomes. So you see you can't be right because in either situation the outcomes were both right and wrong depending on the turn of events in the trials we call life. Neither one of them presents a winning outcome, how your marriage shapes up depends on many factors not just the roles of the players involved. That's check and checkmate my friend.


Brother Rapp
You said these things on an earlier post. Do you still feel that it's check and checkmate?

 

[PRMoon]

I'm not really going to seperate the issues anymore cause it seems it's really just you and me having this discussion at this point. It's like old school vs new school kinda.
Yup i'm still right. First off because i am a product of two parents who both worked fulltime jobs in order for me to have a better life. I actually valued my time with my parents more and learned to be independant. My parents both still work and are both still married, I guess they had what you would view as a "modern marriage" and it worked out fine. I'm seeking a similar marriage and I know it can work. Just because I'm independant and want to do things apart from my wife (like my parents did) does not mean that things will be miserable for the two of us or won't work out (my parents are still married and still happy) I'll be doing lots of things with my future wife, wheather or not she has the bulk of the money or not.
I went to preschool when I was very young and all it did was make me value my time with my parents more because they weren't around me all the time. It also groomed me to be very independant and well versed in terms of socialization (I learned not to be shy at a very young age because I had to make friends) . For lack of a better term I wasn't as sheltered as some of the children I know who spend a lot of time at home with mom (one of them now has a serious gambling problem and always goes home to mom to bail him out). So when I say "normal" up bringing I'm saying that people who both work can raise "normal" well adjusted children, because I myself am a normal well adjusted citizen. If anything my upbringing didn't hinder me it made me stronger and more exceptional. Would I have turned out this way if I'd spent a few more years at home with mom? We'll never know for sure but I'm going to say no because my mother worked alot and when she came home she gave me additinoal views on the world because she faced a working enviroment different from my fathers so I ended up getting a better picture of the world becaue I had data streaming from two sources rather then one. Love em both just as much as some one would love a house mom. Plus the level of teamwork that my parents displayed in raising me is nothing short of incredible. They both worked together in rasing me (as equal partners) always consulting one another, compromising, collaborating, timing, things you do when you're in a functioning team.
As far as your views on the bed room, I've been with well over 50 women in my short 24 years which isn't bad. I've had girls do all kinds of crazy things in bed, I know how to "suggest" things that I would like to try in the bed room as well as encourage my partner to be more courageous in expressing her ideas. I'm very well versed in terms of intamacy and the arts that surround it. So
Yes I think sarah would be able ot fulfill what ever fantasies I have concernng her because she'll want to make me happy just as much as I want to please her.
Besides you make it sound as if sex is the ONLY thing we'll be doing while married. Sure I'll be doing a certain amount of things by myself but I already know I'm thrilled just spending time talking, debating and what not with sarah. We're both great minds and when we're not playing social games with one another or getting all cute and close, we're talking about world relations, current events, and our opinions on life in general, while having a beer together. People often try to jump into our conversations but find they are very wanting when it comes to our depth and understanding. Like I said she's like my partner not my subordant. We are equal in just about every sense. Physically, mentally and emotionally we're amatch. I don't have to decribe what I'll do in our marriage (if it ever comes) becuase it'll pretty much be like how it is now. Great minds colliding and colaborating. I've seen it before, I see it now, and It can and will happen for me if I so choose it....so yes I think this type of modern marriage can work but you have to want it to work like any thing else in life.

I do think you're right about the divorce thing though. But the divorce laws were enacted in Vegas a long long time ago. Las Vegas is the largest city built after 1900 so we're literally saying it came from a shanty town to a serious metroplitian area over 100 years. The laws didn't really have time to evolve as quickly as the town grew. I don't think it should be as easy as it is to get a divorce in this state but hey if you look at the history of the state in itself, you'll see that nothing about it is ordinary.

 

[Brother_Rapp]

These are the words from the earlier post.

Brother Rapp
However the situation goes with you and your girlfriend, you cannot say that it generally fits the description of most marriages in the U.S. If you can’t do that, then you can’t use it to weight in on the value of either the “Traditional Marriage” over the “Modern Marriage” or vies versa. Both these terms are meant as “Generally Speaking” & “For The Most Part” for married couples.

Would you make a comment on them?

 

[Brother_Rapp]

Earlier I said
Brother_Rapp
Women entering the workplace causes them to have an extramarital affair and leads to divorce? I don’t buy that. A job is not an automatic excuse for having an affair. I would submit that a woman has an affair when she looses faith in her husband’s ability to be a man. A guy can bring in an unemployment check or a top notch salary and it shouldn’t matter. For richer or poorer is part of the promise made in the marriage ceremony.


Then you said
PRM
You're wrong about this one. Like I always do I did legitamate studies on why the divorce rate has gone up so much. With women being in the work place comes addtional temptations (That were limited to men until the womens lib reveloution) that accounts partly for extramarital affairs. A lot of them do it for the thrill, the danger or whatever. True some of them have lost faith in their men but the other reasons (for cheating) are just as valid and for the most part more realistic.

PRM
Yup i'm still right. First off because i am a product of two parents who both worked fulltime jobs in order for me to have a better life. I actually valued my time with my parents more and learned to be independant. My parents both still work and are both still married, I guess they had what you would view as a "modern marriage" and it worked out fine. I'm seeking a similar marriage and I know it can work. Just because I'm independant and want to do things apart from my wife (like my parents did) does not mean that things will be miserable for the two of us or won't work out (my parents are still married and still happy) I'll be doing lots of things with my future wife, wheather or not she has the bulk of the money or not.



Brother Rapp
If you are going to compare your parent’s marriage to a probable marriage between you and your girlfriend, then questions have to be answered as to the similarity of the two. Let's not compare apples to oranges. How much are you and your dad alike? The same should be asked of your mother and your girlfriend. Is your mother as domineering as your girlfriend? Who made the most money between your dad and mom? What were your parent’s individual financial status before they got married? How long did your parents know each other before they got married? How many sisters and brothers do you have? How is the birth of each of them spread out? How long after they were married was the first child born? You also said that behind their relationship you turned out okay (you’re okay with the way you turned out). Who knows what lies in the dark corners of another person’s brain? Although you sound like it, we have only your word that you’re a pretty stable and sane individual. And last, did either of your parents cheat on the other and to what extent can you be sure of your answer?