I'm I off-base here?

[PokerInTheRear]

Gents,

It's been a while... This is a bit long, but I would really appreciate your advice!

I've been dating a woman for about a year now and things have been going well for the most part. When we first started dating, I was spinning other plates, but it became clear that things were leading more to my current gf. She brought up being exclusive after some time, to which I agreed.

At the time, she had been spinning plates as well and had some residual orbiters in the periphery, as well as some male friends. I told her I didn't buy into the idea of girls having male friends, and that that would need to change if we were to be exclusive.

She had some guy friends that go back to high-school that I took no issue with at all - they were always friends and nothing more. However, one of the guys she was dating just prior to us, became a friend of hers. She swears it's nothing more and I've made no major deal about it. I believe her in this case (she truly isn't like many women I have known or dated previously).

Their friendship has been a sporadic one mainly consisting of occasional messages and phone conversations (this guy is waaay AFC, like one of the girls).

My gf wants to go out with him alone (as friends - he's been having some very tough times due to a recent death). I expressed that I wasn't comfortable with it and didn't like the idea, but it was her life and I wasn't going to interfere with what she wanted to do.

Admittedly, I have some insecurities in this area; I have been cheated on by a past gf and had a marriage end under similar experience as well. I am of the mindset that guys & girls cannot just be friends (when the girl is attractive as my gf is).

I have not met this guy in person yet, nor will I have the chance prior to their in-person meeting... The guy is a bit of a tool and I believe my gf has no ill intentions here...

How do you feel about this? Would this be a deal-breaker for you? I do feel a bit disrespected, but am objective enough to see my own insecurities too. Is this an okay situation?

 

[Die Hard]

He's a tool and her intentions are innocent, so there's nothing to worried about...

Except for the fact they DATED in the past! Dude, I would never let my girl go out with a guy she dated in the past. People don't date to be FRIENDS, you know...

 

[SecondHalf]

If he's got a crush on your gf and just waiting for an opportunity, I would expect your gf to get rid of him. Not fair to you or he.

I this gauge this on the health of your relationship.
If the woman is not slutty or constantly seeking male approval and in to you, I wouldn't worry about it at all.

SH

 

[PokerInTheRear]

He's a tool and her intentions are innocent, so there's nothing to worried about...

Except for the fact they DATED in the past! Dude, I would never let my girl go out with a guy she dated in the past. People don't date to be FRIENDS, you know...

Yep, this is what bothers me too.

 

[PokerInTheRear]

If he's got a crush on your gf and just waiting for an opportunity, I would expect your gf to get rid of him. Not fair to you or he.

I this gauge this on the health of your relationship.
If the woman is not slutty or constantly seeking male approval and in to you, I wouldn't worry about it at all.

SH

He has a gf too, and apparently she's okay with it. She tells me she only wants me, and her actions indicate that is true as well. She's done nothing to make me distrust her yet.

I would have slept with an of my girl "friends" who were hot if given the opportunity. Perhaps this is what makes me uncomfortable...

 

[scrouds]

You know what. Societies inthe past held a very restrictive and protective view of women. Because they knew as we know now: women have trouble controlling impulse and emotion.

Given the right opportunity, mistakes can be made on her part. One way to control that is to control opportunities to cheat.

The other way is value / consequences. Be high value and let her know there is no second chance, no going back.

So on a scale of 1-10, 1 being she's looking for a branch swing, 10 meaning she'd join your new cult religion no questions asked, how much is she in to you?

If its not high enough, you either need to increase that, be successful in your demands to limit her opportunities to cheat. The third option which is default if the others don't work out, is to understand the relationship isn't stable, and eventually will devolve. Whether someone cheats or someone leaves

 

[Slickster]

Actions speak louder than words.

She can tell you whatever she wants about this guy. Fact is your gf is dating another dude if this goes down.

Her story sucks too. A sporadic guy "friend" who suddenly needs her due to a death in the family? Usually when you have a death in the family you want to talk to people you are REALLY close to. Maybe their "friendship" is a lot deeper than you know about. Or it is all just an excuse to get you to allow them to hang out.

You obviously don't want to look like the jealous type but you need to nip this stuff in the bud. If you let it go this once you will be fighting this for a long time.

Whenever I started a new relationship with a girl who wanted to keep guy "friends" I would tell her directly:

"I always believe that actions speak louder than words. So if you want to keep hanging out or dating other guys that is TOTALLY fine with me. We can still hang out and have fun and that's great but I'll be doing the same. I'm totally cool that situation but you have to be honest with me because I won't be sitting around waiting for you if you are seeing other guys."

You need to convey to her that you are taking a big step back in terms of being exclusive with her (without actually saying it).

She will comeback insisting it's all just "friends" and not dating but you have to be calm, cool, and strong. Make her believe that you are perfectly fine with the new situation. Just let her know that it's a two way street. In most cases you set the tone for the relationship going forward by doing this. Getting this out of the way early on will save you heaps of frustration and problems.

 

[DavenJuan]

Gents,

It's been a while... This is a bit long, but I would really appreciate your advice!

I've been dating a woman for about a year now and things have been going well for the most part. When we first started dating, I was spinning other plates, but it became clear that things were leading more to my current gf. She brought up being exclusive after some time, to which I agreed.

At the time, she had been spinning plates as well and had some residual orbiters in the periphery, as well as some male friends. I told her I didn't buy into the idea of girls having male friends, and that that would need to change if we were to be exclusive.

She had some guy friends that go back to high-school that I took no issue with at all - they were always friends and nothing more. However, one of the guys she was dating just prior to us, became a friend of hers. She swears it's nothing more and I've made no major deal about it. I believe her in this case (she truly isn't like many women I have known or dated previously).

Their friendship has been a sporadic one mainly consisting of occasional messages and phone conversations (this guy is waaay AFC, like one of the girls).

My gf wants to go out with him alone (as friends - he's been having some very tough times due to a recent death). I expressed that I wasn't comfortable with it and didn't like the idea, but it was her life and I wasn't going to interfere with what she wanted to do.

Admittedly, I have some insecurities in this area; I have been cheated on by a past gf and had a marriage end under similar experience as well. I am of the mindset that guys & girls cannot just be friends (when the girl is attractive as my gf is).

I have not met this guy in person yet, nor will I have the chance prior to their in-person meeting... The guy is a bit of a tool and I believe my gf has no ill intentions here...

How do you feel about this? Would this be a deal-breaker for you? I do feel a bit disrespected, but am objective enough to see my own insecurities too. Is this an okay situation?

If it were me, I wouldnt have a problem with this scenerio. I, unlike a lot of posters here, believe men and women CAN be friends.

However, me and my female friends would never go out alone. Not because we arent "allowed", but there really isnt a reason to. Also, all of my female friends know my girlriend, and have built a relationship with her as well.

the reality is, the fact it bothers you, is the only concern. Dont let this manifest into something bigger.

At the end of the day, you can only be responsible for your own actions, and she is responsible for hers. You cant micromanage your relationship, just make the best choices for YOU.

 

[zekko]

At the time, she had been spinning plates as well and had some residual orbiters in the periphery, as well as some male friends. I told her I didn't buy into the idea of girls having male friends, and that that would need to change if we were to be exclusive.

Here's the main problem as I see it. You two have already agreed to be exclusive, and you have already told her what your boundaries are. And she is breaking them.

I lean toward Slickster's post here. If you let this go, what will it be next?
"A guy I know just lost his job and needs some comforting"? Fvck that.

Personally, I wouldn't find this acceptable. YMMV.

I would have slept with an of my girl "friends" who were hot if given the opportunity. Perhaps this is what makes me uncomfortable...

Right, that's the way guys are. If you are forced to start seeing other girls you're practically obliged to have sex with them, fool around at least. At that point you may as well dump your girlfriend.

That's not to say I disagree with DavenJuan - I do believe that guys and girls can be friends innocently.

But once you say you're okay with this, any sort of male/female relationship can be spun as "just friends". She might agree to go out with the PUA who's been kinoing and hitting on her at work - just as friends. Or a simple friendship can become something more. Or she may go out with some guy she has a crush on - all in friendship, as far as you're concerned. Meanwhile, you're doing the same. At the end of the day, it makes more sense to just nip it all in the bud and make it clear it's off limits. Rather than invite temptation.

If she goes through with this I my interest in her would drop like a stone. Again, YMMV. You have to do what you think's right for you.

 

[SecondHalf]

He has a gf too, and apparently she's okay with it. She tells me she only wants me, and her actions indicate that is true as well. She's done nothing to make me distrust her yet.

I would have slept with an of my girl "friends" who were hot if given the opportunity. Perhaps this is what makes me uncomfortable...

Smell a rat.
If the fellow has a GF, he doesn't need yours.

What does your gut tell you?
Believe in your gut!

Is your gut telling you something you don't want to hear and seek denial supporters on this site?

Hard questions, potential hard reality.

SH

 

[guru1000]

Any rational girl who respects, or holds high interest, in her exclusive partner, would not take the risk of "visiting a friend" while engaged in an exclusive relationship. Accordingly, she either (1) lacks "common sense," (2) fails to respect you, or (3) holds a low interest level in you.

If you have overtly expressed your boundary, thereby eliminating the probability of Option (1), then you have grounds to walk away permanently, as she clearly falls into (2) or (3) above (which are often intertwined).

Therefore, the real question is, do you have enough self-respect to walk away?
Your move, soldier.

 

[sodbuster]

HIS girlfriend can't comfort him? He needs yours? Sounds like he's trying for a sympathy f8ck....what is she going to kiss to make him feel better?

 

[penkitten]

He has a gf too

prolly doesn't

She tells me she only wants me

then why does she want to go out alone with him?

and her actions indicate that is true as well. She's done nothing to make me distrust her yet.

except for this wanting to go out with an ex boyfriend all alone.

 

[PokerInTheRear]

Thanks all. Yeah, I think this is a done deal. I was second guessing myself on this, but now I'm just pissed off.

I truly don't think she has any romantic feelings for this guy, and the guy is a bit of squirly puss, but regardless, I'm not cool with it.

Her interest level for me seems high-enough... I don't give a 5hit what she says, I've been noting her actions from day one, and they clearly show high-interest in me. This is the first glaring red flag that has come into view in a year. I don't really get it.

She called me up a bit earlier wanting for us to get together tomorrow afternoon (as was previously planned), I made no commitments to that. Not a word was mentioned about her plans to go out with her friend tonight by either of us. I'm trying to play it off cool with her, but I ain't cool at all right now. My gf is out with some other dude...

She's always had more guy friends than girls - she's that type I suppose, but I don't dig.

My plan for tomorrow is to make it very clear to her that her going out with her friend pushed my level of trust in her way back, and that if she wants to go down this path again, she can just keep on going...

She knows very clearly how I feel about this crap, yet showed me a complete lack of regard/respect tonight and if she really is into me as much as she puts on, than she wouldn't risk it.

I don't get it.

 

[zekko]

Smell a rat.
If the fellow has a GF, he doesn't need yours.

Good point.

Any rational girl who respects, or holds high interest, in her exclusive partner, would not take the risk of "visiting a friend" while engaged in an exclusive relationship

Actually, I think most girls these days take it for granted that they can go out with male friends, exclusive or not. It's all part of the feminist message to them that they can have it all. And that men are evil, jealous, possessive, controlling monsters if they try to deny them their male friends. And that their former boyfriends were too pvssified to call them on their BS. Or their former boyfriends wanted to screw around too, and appreciated having the latitude themselves.

I think these days you have to pretty much make it clear you're not cool with it, or else they will run with it.

She's always had more guy friends than girls - she's that type I suppose, but I don't dig

If she is that type, maybe you deserve better. It's hard to face, but maybe she's not a good match for you if that's what she wants. Despite her supposed exclusivity agreement, she seems to have defaulted back to hanging around her male friends. And the one on one makes it practically a date, especially considering they're exes.

My plan for tomorrow is to make it very clear to her that her going out with her friend pushed my level of trust in her way back, and that if she wants to go down this path again, she can just keep on going...

Outside of dumping her straight out, that's probably the best thing you can do. I definitely wouldn't let her get by with this again.
If it were me, as soon as she made clear her intention to go through with this, I would have withdrawn all interest and gone on with my life. At that point, the burden would have been up to her to convince me otherwise. In a case like this, you have to be willing to lose her though.


I feel for you, best of luck in whatever happens.

 

[PokerInTheRear]

Thanks Zekko - appreciate it. Yeah - I'm at a point in my life where I really don't give a 5hit either way. Women have only taught me that if you trust them, you lose.

 

[guru1000]

Actually, I think most girls these days take it for granted that they can go out with male friends, exclusive or not.

I have yet to meet a girl who would entertain such an idea while engaged in exclusivity. Either I had screened or sieved through them perspicaciously, or each of them intrinsically knew such an act (towards me) would trigger an instantaneous NEXT.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Poker,
Your Ladies behaviour is off....It is really out of order,tell her that, and cut down on the time you spend with her..While she continues with these stupid Female games,you spin plates....To condemn her is a no win situation....Just do your own thing,let her either come around,or go off with him.

 

[zekko]

I have yet to meet a girl who would entertain such an idea while engaged in exclusivity. Either I had screened or sieved through them perspicaciously, or each of them intrinsically knew such an act (towards me) would trigger an instantaneous NEXT.

That's how it should be IMO.

But most girls around here take it as a default that they can have male friends. I know plenty of married women who have male friends they hang around with. I just heard a married woman the other day talking about her "best friend" who was a guy.

The husbands are cool with it, or so they say. Look at all the guys on this forum who say they would have no problem with it. They've been brainwashed into thinking they will be labeled as "uncool, possessive, jealous, controlling, and insecure" if they object. An "alpha" would not be threatened by some AFC dude. All that nonsense.

 

[Nutz]

Actions speak louder than words.

She can tell you whatever she wants about this guy. Fact is your gf is dating another dude if this goes down.

Her story sucks too. A sporadic guy "friend" who suddenly needs her due to a death in the family? Usually when you have a death in the family you want to talk to people you are REALLY close to. Maybe their "friendship" is a lot deeper than you know about. Or it is all just an excuse to get you to allow them to hang out.

You obviously don't want to look like the jealous type but you need to nip this stuff in the bud. If you let it go this once you will be fighting this for a long time.

Whenever I started a new relationship with a girl who wanted to keep guy "friends" I would tell her directly:

"I always believe that actions speak louder than words. So if you want to keep hanging out or dating other guys that is TOTALLY fine with me. We can still hang out and have fun and that's great but I'll be doing the same. I'm totally cool that situation but you have to be honest with me because I won't be sitting around waiting for you if you are seeing other guys."

You need to convey to her that you are taking a big step back in terms of being exclusive with her (without actually saying it).

She will comeback insisting it's all just "friends" and not dating but you have to be calm, cool, and strong. Make her believe that you are perfectly fine with the new situation. Just let her know that it's a two way street. In most cases you set the tone for the relationship going forward by doing this. Getting this out of the way early on will save you heaps of frustration and problems.

Wise words.

Here's the main problem as I see it. You two have already agreed to be exclusive, and you have already told her what your boundaries are. And she is breaking them.

I think that's a good way of putting it, that she's going out with him, even if she doesn't see it as a date, that you do, so to you she's breaking the exclusivity deal.

Thanks all. Yeah, I think this is a done deal. I was second guessing myself on this, but now I'm just pissed off.

I truly don't think she has any romantic feelings for this guy, and the guy is a bit of squirly puss, but regardless, I'm not cool with it.

...

She's always had more guy friends than girls - she's that type I suppose, but I don't dig.

...

She knows very clearly how I feel about this crap, yet showed me a complete lack of regard/respect tonight and if she really is into me as much as she puts on, than she wouldn't risk it.

:le sigh:

1. She did have romantic feelings for this guy as they've already dated. Stands to reason they can resurface. Happens sometimes.

2. Going out..alone...makes it possible for "one thing led to another" or "it just happened".

3. Chicks with lots of guy friends are trouble because they tend to be attention sluts. When women say they don't get along with other females, that often translates to women not putting up with their bs whereas men do simply because they're female and want to sleep with her. See also: orbiters.

4. She knows how you feel and ignored it. This is THE MOST IMPORTANT aspect of the entire situation. It says all you need to know. This is the "actions speak louder than words" moment of your relationship. She's essentially ditching you for the other guy.