I'm 28 and girlfriend wants to get engaged...

DJDamage

Master Don Juan
Joined
Sep 6, 2004
Messages
5,661
Reaction score
103
Location
Canada
Mr. Me said:
Maybe she's great? Is she? I mean, she doesn't boss you around, doesn't nag, she respects you, she's considerate of you, doesn't deny you sex, enjoys it with you, is a giver, flexible, has a great sense of humor no big temper, is crazy about you, doesn't have weight issues, medical issues, doesn't overspend or buy needless junk, pays her bills on time, no car problems, no psychotic episodes, doesn't hit you, yell at you, curse at you, call you names or insult you, loves her family, has no bad influencing girlfriends, no drug problems, no alcohol problems, is not on psychiatric medication, her ex doesn't keep in contact with her nor are there any calls from overseas strangers named Raul whom she met while she was abroad, no gut feelings that anything's amiss, she doesn't tell you things that don't ring true, doesn't flirt with other guys? Then maybe she is marriage material. But you'd still be wise to wait until you've been with her fully for a couple of years, and then get engaged maybe, but not married.
That was a great list Mr. Me. If I ever even think of marrying some broad, I am going to defer to this list with a check mark and she better score 100% on it. Hell if I ever meet the crazy laundry list she has for me then now I got a list of my own hehe. I think that is the reason why many marriages end so badley, men tend to look beyond a woman's other flaws and hope for the best especially if she is really hot.

Although at this stage in my life, I don't see myself ever getting married due to the whole entrapment issue that comes with signing that marriage contract/licence.
 

STR8UP

Master Don Juan
Joined
Aug 10, 2002
Messages
6,911
Reaction score
123
If this is your first real relationship, there is a 99% chance that this will fall apart anyway. And it will probably happen sooner rather than later.

You need to sow your oats.

Just being honest.
 

VictorK

Don Juan
Joined
Nov 20, 2003
Messages
198
Reaction score
0
Age
44
Location
Canada
Gentlemen,

Thank you all for you valuable feedback. It is a great feeling to know there are like minded individuals out there...who i can leverage from their experiences and knowledge.

To answer a few questions:

1. We have lived together for about 3 months off & on throughout our relationship (currently we do not live together)

2. She has an excellent job and is financially independent.

3. I've heard of people say they 'just know' when they meet their partner & my g/f says the same in comparing me to her last relationship, i think for me, because of my lack of experience...despite my age its just hard for me to say ok i'll get married in 6 months. I think everyone here seems to understand that here. She is a wonderful girl, and i think most guys would indeed settle down with her type, but after dating for pratically 7 months because she was away...I can't give in to that.

4. She is actually extremely easy to get along with, always does what i want to do (present scenerio excluded), respects me, not the bossy or type A personality. She seems to be the passive aggressive type (i.e. this whole engagement situation.


Gentlemen, I don't plan on caving in to her demands, I guess I am just doing a little soul searching...I care for her and love her, but I just can't do it right now...it sometimes feels the whole world is pressuring me (given most of my social network is always asking and wanting to know when its gonna happen).

There have been times where (possibly unfairly) i have told her that she brought on this situation herself because of her choice to a) go off to school for a year and b) decide to be just friends first for 2 years beacuse she couldn't leave her ex.

Everyone here is giving me the motivation to remain strong though, I am very grateful to all of you.

cheers
 

sodbuster

Master Don Juan
Joined
Jun 11, 2008
Messages
2,572
Reaction score
377
Age
65
Location
South Dakota
Back in the old days, women fell for the feminazi line they could have it all. So at age 40 or 45 they'd start looking for a sperm donor. Since MY kids are 16 and 13, I have no big desire to start over with a squalling baby. SO the women who "could have it all" find out there are few men "worthy of" being the father of thier kids at age 40 or so. It's been written about ad nauseum lately in all the womens rags, so women are looking to corral a sperm donor earlier than they did in the 70's and 80's.
 

Colossus

Master Don Juan
Joined
Jan 22, 2005
Messages
3,505
Reaction score
547
VictorK said:
Shes a great girl, totally giving, sincere...the type of girl you would be happy to take home to meet the parents...but she can be manipulative at times. She tells me that if she doesn't get married soon, by the time I am ready for marriage she will be in her early 30s, and then by the time she has kids (mid 30s), they're are lots of chances for complications to the babys health and her health...so she says if i cared for her, i wouldn't put her or our 'unborn' children at risk......after writing that...i admit...women logic is sometimes crazy.

VictorK--

This is classic female manipulation--illogical, directed towards you, and playing on your own guilt.

First of all, I hear a LOT of women these days using the "biological clock" argument. This is valid--to a point. They mainly pull this out when it will serve their agenda of getting married before you are ready. Women can safely have children into their 40's (really), but the risk of some birth defects goes up as they age. Mid-thirties is a good guideline, but it's by no means ironclad.

This doesn't necessarily mean she is a bad girl, but you have to ask yourself why you think she is pushing the issue. Is it pressure from her friends? Parents? Your girl obviously has an agenda, my man. And agenda's don't ever bode well in relationships, unless its a mutually-agreed upon agenda; which this isn't.

So you might want to directly ask her, face to face, why she is so intent on getting married before 30. And don't take some b.s. "baby's health" guilt trip. Cut through that with a diamond knife and get to the REAL reason. Marriage is no joke, as you know.
 

You essentially upped your VALUE in her eyes by showing her that, if she wants you, she has to at times do things that you like to do. You are SOMETHING after all. You are NOT FREE. If she wants to hang with you, it's going to cost her something — time, effort, money.

Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.

squirrels

Master Don Juan
Joined
Apr 15, 2003
Messages
6,627
Reaction score
178
Age
45
Location
A universe...where heartbreak and sadness have bee
You say she hasn't laid down an ultimatum, but in a way, she has. Even if she doesn't leave you, she is going to make your life miserable over this stuff until you concede, and she'll never forgive you for it. Also don't be surprised if she starts "putting out feelers" for other men if you linger in no-decision-land for a while.

This is unclear territory. The concerns about age are valid and, despite what the forum says, probably are the primary motivator for her wanting to rush into marriage.

This does not, however, constitute an obligation on your part. But it may force a decision sooner than you would like.

But you really haven't given this forum enough information for us to advise you on a course of action. The default is to say, "Go get you some more plates...NEXT!!". That may be fair advice. It may not be. You need to give more information.

You say this is your "first serious girlfriend". How many other women have you dated? Slept with? Is this the first girl you've had the balls to talk to? Did she choose YOU, or did you choose HER?

How did you meet her? How did the relationship develop? Be honest.
 

speed dawg

Master Don Juan
Joined
Jun 9, 2006
Messages
4,766
Reaction score
1,235
Location
The Dirty South
STR8UP said:
If this is your first real relationship, there is a 99% chance that this will fall apart anyway. And it will probably happen sooner rather than later.

You need to sow your oats.

Just being honest.
I agree. I think that is the real issue here. And in acting like it, you're keeping her IL up and probably don't even know it. I'd say the girl is probably right this time. How often does that get said on this forum?

I'm sure she doesn't want to waste time with you if you want something different. The original poster is the one wanting to have your cake and eat it too this time around.
 

NewMan

Master Don Juan
Joined
Jul 29, 2003
Messages
2,406
Reaction score
16
Location
Los Angeles
keep on telling her its not that something is wrong with her (she is the type of girl that i wouldnt have had the balls in approaching in my single days), but its me and because i dont have the same experiences as you, im not ready to settle down yet.

I have a few friends my age who are engaged/married, and they bug me about it to, saying that im so lucky to have an amazing girl that most guys would snatch up if she was single. I guess the pressure from her, friends, family is getting to me and no one seems to understand me...hence why i came here to see if some guys out here would.
What are you doing here really?

Seems like you are just hanging on, for the sake of hanging on.

I believe, you know deep down that this girl is not the one. Your looking for excuses and reasons to stall....

Dude, your not ready to get married - bottom line.

You know what you need to do - you just don't have the b@lls to do it.
 

Mr. Me

Master Don Juan
Joined
Dec 19, 2007
Messages
1,357
Reaction score
84
I was in a LTR a girl for a few years, she was 33 I was hitting 40, and she kept mentioning wanting a baby. I didn't want a baby. I told her so. When she got a new apartment, she wanted me to move in with her. I didn't want to move in with her. These were just my personal preferences, it wasn't about levels of commitment. I'm the one that finally ended the relationship, and I ended it because of other reasons and not because she wanted a baby.

My point is, I stood my ground as to what I wanted, and she hung around. That's what I'm advising you do. If she leaves, she leaves, if she stays, she stays. Either way, it's on your terms. It's been some 14 years since, she got married and never did have that baby she wanted. Last I heard, she wasn't happy and her husband had become more like an insufferable roommate.

That leads me to this: "She'll be happy when..."

"She'll be happy when she gets married"
"She'll be happy when she has a baby"

No sir. She has to be happy without these things happening, because them happening doesn't guarantee anyone's happiness.
 

Colossus

Master Don Juan
Joined
Jan 22, 2005
Messages
3,505
Reaction score
547
Mr. Me said:
"She'll be happy when she gets married"
"She'll be happy when she has a baby"

No sir. She has to be happy without these things happening, because them happening doesn't guarantee anyone's happiness.
That's exactly right.

MOST women have agenda; usually implicit. The problem isnt necessarily the agenda itself, but when she makes the fulfilment of her agenda a condition of your realtionship.

My concern with the OP's girl is her pushing the marriage issue. This is a possible foreshadowing of an otherwise good girl changing after the marriage happens. Her sense of urgency here suggests she isnt content in some respect...which is even MORE reason for the OP to hold his ground and not give in to her impetuous push for marriage. If she is truly into HIM, and not just the idea of getting married, she will stay and this frankly shouldnt be an issue.

Also, I think VictorK is correct in being cautious because of the relatively short length of their relationship.
 

What happens, IN HER MIND, is that she comes to see you as WORTHLESS simply because she hasn't had to INVEST anything in you in order to get you or to keep you.

You were an interesting diversion while she had nothing else to do. But now that someone a little more valuable has come along, someone who expects her to treat him very well, she'll have no problem at all dropping you or demoting you to lowly "friendship" status.

Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.

VictorK

Don Juan
Joined
Nov 20, 2003
Messages
198
Reaction score
0
Age
44
Location
Canada
Colossus,

Thanks my man, your words are so true. When we get into this arguement, she blames me for not being ready because she claims we are both in our late 20s and she wants us to experience the 'joy' of being married..yada yada yada. When i tell her im not ready because of the way our situation (she wasted 2 years with her ex while we were friends and now thinks those years count as getting to know eachother BS)....she gets defensive and says i am holding it against her and thats not what relationships are about. (i believe she uses my lack of experience to tell me this is not the way I should be acting and if i would have been in more relationships then I would have known this).

To give squirrels some background,

1. Saw her at a chairty event 3 1/2 years ago, I approached her an got her contact info.

2. She had a b/f, but we stayed in touch through emails once a month & occassional seeing eachother but rarely.

3. She broke up with her b/f 15 months after i met her 6 more months to 'get over him', and i ignored her for almost a year ( I focused on other girls)

4. I eventually asked her out, made all the first moves and things moved very fast (it was basically a green light all the way through although shes a shy one so I was doing all the leading)...and things were off the charts (first time i really felt this is a great girl who i want to attempt a relationship with.

5. She claimed she always had 'feelings for me' even though she was with her ex. but felt stuck and her ex would use emotional blackmail to keep her in the relationship. My stance is don't expect me to rush into marriage now just because you made a mistake that cost you 3 years.

6. She left for school a few months later, we decided to try the LDR and we visited eachother a few times. She came back 7 months ago.

My dating history is pretty bleak. I've dated probably a dozen girls and out of all of that, shes my first LTR. She keeps telling me she knows 'im the one' i guess because shes had 3 previous ex boyfriends, yet i don't have that much experience so I think thats why I am not as gunhoe about this. (the whole soe your wild oats things perhaps) At the same time, like any guy who is emotionally invested into his first LTR, I do love having her in my life and who she is deep down. That doesnt change just because im not ready for marriage.





Colossus said:
VictorK--

This is classic female manipulation--illogical, directed towards you, and playing on your own guilt.

First of all, I hear a LOT of women these days using the "biological clock" argument. This is valid--to a point. They mainly pull this out when it will serve their agenda of getting married before you are ready. Women can safely have children into their 40's (really), but the risk of some birth defects goes up as they age. Mid-thirties is a good guideline, but it's by no means ironclad.

This doesn't necessarily mean she is a bad girl, but you have to ask yourself why you think she is pushing the issue. Is it pressure from her friends? Parents? Your girl obviously has an agenda, my man. And agenda's don't ever bode well in relationships, unless its a mutually-agreed upon agenda; which this isn't.

So you might want to directly ask her, face to face, why she is so intent on getting married before 30. And don't take some b.s. "baby's health" guilt trip. Cut through that with a diamond knife and get to the REAL reason. Marriage is no joke, as you know.
 

VictorK

Don Juan
Joined
Nov 20, 2003
Messages
198
Reaction score
0
Age
44
Location
Canada
speed dawg said:
I agree. I think that is the real issue here. And in acting like it, you're keeping her IL up and probably don't even know it. I'd say the girl is probably right this time. How often does that get said on this forum?

I'm sure she doesn't want to waste time with you if you want something different. The original poster is the one wanting to have your cake and eat it too this time around.
if she wants marriage right now more then she wants to be with me...then i am not the right guy for her, and i agree with that. Just because im not ready for marriage now though, doesnt mean i wont be ready in a few years
 

VictorK

Don Juan
Joined
Nov 20, 2003
Messages
198
Reaction score
0
Age
44
Location
Canada
NewMan said:
What are you doing here really?

Seems like you are just hanging on, for the sake of hanging on.

I believe, you know deep down that this girl is not the one. Your looking for excuses and reasons to stall....

Dude, your not ready to get married - bottom line.

You know what you need to do - you just don't have the b@lls to do it.
i know i am not ready for marriage, but i do enjoy what her and i have currently. I like the advice of other posters that i have noticed....i will stand my ground, and if she decides that this situation isnt what she wants at this moment, then so be it
 

VictorK

Don Juan
Joined
Nov 20, 2003
Messages
198
Reaction score
0
Age
44
Location
Canada
Mr. Me said:
I was in a LTR a girl for a few years, she was 33 I was hitting 40, and she kept mentioning wanting a baby. I didn't want a baby. I told her so. When she got a new apartment, she wanted me to move in with her. I didn't want to move in with her. These were just my personal preferences, it wasn't about levels of commitment. I'm the one that finally ended the relationship, and I ended it because of other reasons and not because she wanted a baby.

My point is, I stood my ground as to what I wanted, and she hung around. That's what I'm advising you do. If she leaves, she leaves, if she stays, she stays. Either way, it's on your terms. It's been some 14 years since, she got married and never did have that baby she wanted. Last I heard, she wasn't happy and her husband had become more like an insufferable roommate.

That leads me to this: "She'll be happy when..."

"She'll be happy when she gets married"
"She'll be happy when she has a baby"

No sir. She has to be happy without these things happening, because them happening doesn't guarantee anyone's happiness.

Thanks Mr. Me for the insight,

You are indeed right, if one settles on someone elses terms they will never be happy. There has to be a common source of happiness for any partnership to work or its doomed. I really appreciate some of the life lessons you have provided here.

cheers
 

VictorK

Don Juan
Joined
Nov 20, 2003
Messages
198
Reaction score
0
Age
44
Location
Canada
Colossus said:
That's exactly right.

MOST women have agenda; usually implicit. The problem isnt necessarily the agenda itself, but when she makes the fulfilment of her agenda a condition of your realtionship.

My concern with the OP's girl is her pushing the marriage issue. This is a possible foreshadowing of an otherwise good girl changing after the marriage happens. Her sense of urgency here suggests she isnt content in some respect...which is even MORE reason for the OP to hold his ground and not give in to her impetuous push for marriage. If she is truly into HIM, and not just the idea of getting married, she will stay and this frankly shouldnt be an issue.

Also, I think VictorK is correct in being cautious because of the relatively short length of their relationship.
excellent insight,

she has mentioned in the past that she just knows 'im the one' and thats why she doesnt need to wait 2/3 years to confirm what she already knows. sounds like womaneze to me. She is a good girl, but i think as she gets older she is getting more urgent, and when she looks back at her life, she probably invisioned her life differently then how its turned out. I care for her more then i have for any girl... i may be 28 and a mature guy, but i think my dating age is much younger because of the lack of experience, and i just cant go from barely any relationship experience one day to going on a honeymoon.
 

Mr. Me

Master Don Juan
Joined
Dec 19, 2007
Messages
1,357
Reaction score
84
she gets defensive and says i am holding it against her and thats not what relationships are about. (i believe she uses my lack of experience to tell me this is not the way I should be acting and if i would have been in more relationships then I would have known this)
Well, she's right that you don't "hold things against" your relationship partner and bring up grudges. But her saying "you're holding that against me" can also be used as a way to get you to not bring a valid point up. I'd suggest that if she's always going to react by saying that, that you don't bring it up the way you have.

Say, "I don't feel like those two years we spent as friends while you were with your ex gave me the type of relationship with you that really counts" instead of saying, "the two years you were with your ex don't count". There's a difference: I'm shifting from the latter, which is a statement that she can argue with, to the former, a self-reflection of your own personal feelings. And she can't tell you how you ought to feel.

Bear with me as I answer this: If it's a matter of you being off-course or ignorant about making the relationship work, it's fine and wonderful for a partner to lovingly get you on track and tell you where you're off. But you have to see if she's telling you for the sake of the relationship, if she's doing it out of love for you.

In The Art of Loving, pyschologist Erich Fromm defined love as "the active concern for the life and growth of that which we love".

That means, in a love relationship, two people create an environment in which each helps the other to grow, in which they are free to be themselves without judgment.

IOW, it's about *caring* for the other person, not about *needing* something from the other person.

In a love relationship, each partner cares and gives 100%.

So here's my question:

When she makes her case for why you should hurry up and get married soon before waiting longer runs the risk of having unhealthy children, and tells you how you should act in this regard, and what the relationship should be in this regard,

HOW is she showing 100% care and love for YOU? How does this take into account what YOU, her partner, wants?

It seems to me she's totally ignoring what you want and making an argument for what she wants.

In which case she's not asking for a love relationship. She's asking to breed.

This is not about love. This is about her goals.

Lots of relationships go that way ("let's get married so we can start a family! I want to have children!"), but what happens when the goals are reached, vis a vis, the children are born?

Now you've got a wife (and you're tied to her for a LONG time with a kid or two), a wife who doesn't care 100% for you, nor your personal happiness. What happens then?

Something to think about.
 

jophil28

Master Don Juan
Joined
Nov 18, 2006
Messages
5,216
Reaction score
276
Location
Gold Coast. Aust.
Mr. Me said:
..... a self-reflection of your own personal feelings. And she can't tell you how you ought to feel.
It is true that nobody can tell you HOW you should or should not feel, BUT...
I have had several g/fs who tried to do exactly that.

She, "You shouldn't feel annoyed because I was an hour late..."

...or even more bizarre is when they "correct" your feelings by telling you that what you are saying is NOT how you really feel.

Jophil, " You are late again...an hour this time. I am pissed.."

She replies, "NO you're not, you are just tired and hungry. YOu will FEEL better after we eat."

I swear - it does not get any saner as they get older.
 

Nutz

Master Don Juan
Joined
Jul 22, 2008
Messages
1,584
Reaction score
72
Tazman said:
The only way to alleviate this is to "compromise" your own feelings or walk away. She isn't going to stop nagging you about it. No one cares about men's feelings about marriage, so you will be shamed by everyone, even some men.

I'm not religious so marriage means absolutely nothing to me, but if you do go through with it because you were pressured into it you won't be happy.

Nothing changes after getting married except "legal obligations involving money". The pressure to keep things going "smooth" after a marriage is almost entirely placed on men, it's a free ride for women, when they aren't "happy" it's your fault and you better watch your back (finances).
OMFG is this post 100% dead on!!!!! You nailed exactly my take on marriage as well.


The only thing I'd quibble with is that once upon a time relationship management was a role of the wife. However, since the 70's less and less women have been taking on that role and that's part of why marriages and serious relationships fail so much nowadays.
 

Da Realist

Master Don Juan
Joined
Sep 1, 2005
Messages
799
Reaction score
23
Location
Memphis, TN
I know I'm going to sound like a hipocrite since I've already given my opinion, but I'll say it anyway: are you really going to base a major life decision on what some guys on the internet are saying?
 

amoka

Master Don Juan
Joined
Jan 18, 2006
Messages
1,933
Reaction score
63
I was in similar position up to three weeks ago. Although my girl only brought up the idea once and I told her I'm not ready and that the idea of "marriage" does not sink well with. I know she was hurt by this but she still wanted to continue the relationship with me. I know deep down she wanted to get marriage someday but for me I do not see myself getting marriage "anytime soon" so three weeks ago, I cut her loose. She is a great girl but for her own good and my good, I just had to break it off. The best thing you can do now is cut things loose with her. She is 28 (so is my ex-girlfriend) let her find someone else while you explore your options.

-Best regard... Amoka
 

Peace and Quiet

If you currently have too many women chasing you, calling you, harassing you, knocking on your door at 2 o'clock in the morning... then I have the simple solution for you.

Just read my free ebook 22 Rules for Massive Success With Women and do the opposite of what I recommend.

This will quickly drive all women away from you.

And you will be able to relax and to live your life in peace and quiet.

Top