Help me decipher this ******** email

[Ronin I]

Last installment...

OK - this is my last installment on this thread - I thought those of you that have posted and given advice might care to hear the latest part of it.

Anyway, my guilt got the best of me tonight so I emailed her the following:

"HBtooflakey,

Look, first off I want to apologize for the harshness of my last email. Sometimes I can be quite the *******, so if my email served to hurt you or whatever, I am sorry.

But, I do stand behind the crux of my email, which is that you are or have been unreliable. This certainly wasn't the first time I've heard "thanks for understanding" and it just reaches a point where it goes from maybe a legitimate excuse to a PATTERN of behavior. Generally, it really wouldn't bother me, but like I said if I see a pattern I do get pissed - plain and simple. And I am the type of person that tells somebody when I am unhappy with them. I can be quite blunt and unforgiving at times.

Anyway, I think (actually I know) I could have handled the situation better. I think you know that slappy doesn't endeavor to hurt his sweetpea. Given all of the talks we've had the past eight months and that we had a genuinely nice time together last Saturday, this argument seems kind of idiotic.

Ronin I" -

Basically, I was feeling a little bad about how what a d!ck I was in my email to her. I mean, yes she did flake on me, but I'm not the kind of person that enjoys hurting other people and I knew that's what I did in that email.

*****As a side note, you'll notice I employed a little technique I learned from managing people - Build em, Burn em, Build em.
First paragraph - I build her (I apologize, lower her defenses), second paragraph I burn her (reiterate what she did wrong and that I am upset about it) third paragraph I build her back up (allude to how we've "bonded" and better times).

Anyway her response (almost immediate):

"Ronin I

It took me off guard to see that side of you with me. You attacked me personally, and I felt like you were mean. I'm really really sorry about not going out on Thursday night. No excuses, even if I have them. I'm just really sorry that I let you down, that's the bottom line. I guess I could be offering more chances to hang out with you too, to see if you can work around my schedule. Maybe the tables will turn some day so that you can let me down and I'll see how it feels. Just so you know, I really didn't think I was going to change your evening in the slightest. I thought that the *school* events are planned and that you'd be going with or without my company anyway, and that you know who'll you'll see there and hang with. That's pointless I guess, other than the fact that now I feel like I have a consequence or punishment..."relegated" to certain invites. I don't blame you. I've been careless with your feelings about this, and that's not who I am. I am sorry that my LAZINESS caught up with me.

I think you meant what you said. And I tried to respond the best I could. In fact, I had to focus in order to make sure you weren't joking. But then again, I've never felt like that from your words, so I knew you were serious. I'm really going to miss our bond if you think I'm not worthy of your time and energy. I am really sorry I pissed you off and I hope you can learn to trust my word again. Seriously, I don't blame you. You've been great to me these past months and for some reason, I've gotten into a habit that I don't like.

Maybe I need to go to a meeting. F. F. A.

anyways, i still be your sweatpea, if you'll have me?

HBtooflakey?"

- So I actually wound up calling her and she was crying on the phone - she said it was the first time she's cried for doing something wrong in a long time (I thought this was kind of a strange statement in that I felt like I was her father reprimanding her or something). She then went on to take responsibility again and that she realizes that I'm the only decent thing in her life right now and she's been fvcking it up, falling into a bad habit, etc. She then talked a little about her "feelings" for me, etc, etc.

-At that point not wanting to get caught up in a long-winded phone call I just reassured her that everything's alright, told her to stop crying and to smile for me and got off the phone.

- a few other observations -
1) I will give her credit for admitting that she was wrong and taking responsibitly for it - a common theme on this board lately is that women rarely if ever take responsibility for their actions - so it was refreshing to actually have a woman admit that she was wrong
2) there was talk about how my expressing anger amounted to me surrendering power(control) to her and while I still believe that is true to a degree I will tell you that that email and the phone conversation didnt give me the impression that she was in control - quite the opposite. Notice how she talked about how my words made her feel - seems I have more "power" than I thought.
3) emotional roller-coaster theory - assuming that (some/all) women are "addicted" to guys that keep them on emotional rollercoasters by me chewing her out and sending her on an emotional rollercoaster the past 48 hours, presumably this should raise IL.

 

[Jake Steed]

Ronin,

My take on this from the beginning is that she WAS interested in you. The guys on this board who think she was speaking ******** or playing some game are just bitter virgins, like you said. Here's a direct quote from her in her email:

"physically i don't want there to be any boundaries"

You'd have to be mentally retarded to miss this one, dude. She was clearly telling you to step up to the plate and assert yourself. You made two major mistakes.

1. You didn't ACT.

2. You wrote her those two weak a$$ emails. The first one was bitter and childish. The second one made you look twice as weak because basically you went back on your scolding and took it all back because you were afraid you hurt her. That was weak.

The best way to show a girl (who you haven't fvcked) that she screwed up is to ignore her. She flaked, so you should have just maintained radio silence with her and see if she came to you on her own.

As it is, you made her feel guilty. So basically you are cultivating feelings of obligation in her rather than feelings of attraction--as Deepblue used to say. She is going to subconsiously associate you with those feelings of guilt and obligation. Talk about a turn off.

Also, in the end of your last post, you gave her credit for owning up to her actions and apologizing. Wrong. She only apologized because you whined at her. Otherwise, she never would have cared. She doesn't deserve credit for that.

I really think this girl did like you, but you were overanalyzing everything. What you should do now is really up to you, but next time stay away from sending angry emails and just act on what you want.

Good luck.

Jake

 

[Ronin I]

Hmmmm, all good points Jake. The guilt vs. attraction point especially.

As far as me not acting, that's not exactly correct though. After the email that started this thread I made plans to hang out with her (which she wound up flaking on). I also pushed the issue in the past and met resistance (this is when I would go "radio silent").

I can understand why you might label my first email childish, but to me at this point with this girl, just ignoring her would've seemed childish (and like game playing). I've known her for quite a long time (long enough where to me, some of the usual DJ stuff doesn't apply - ie been there done that). As for my second email, I don't have any problem admitting when I am wrong (I didn't feel wrong about calling her out but I did feel wrong about HOW I did it).

I also agree with you on the overanalyzing part which is why this thread ends here as I have decided to just take sh!t as it comes.

 

[echo1212]

Ronin, I'd like to add a few things after reading through this thread, and really hope you take the time to digest this.

First off, as far as her feelings for you. I tried to put myself in her shoes and pretend as to what would cause me to write the email she did and to also cancel so many of your dates, while at the same time enjoying your company and still wanting to hang out with you. My impression is she likes you. But, she WANTS to like you more in a physcial sense, and for whatever reason-doesn't. In other words she really likes hanging out with you and talking to you, and she would like something more to come from that, but that "extra something" that makes a person go crazy just thinking about the other isn't there for her. Hence, that is why she has flaked so many times as far as dates go. She likes you and wants to go out with you. She likes the idea of hanging out with you, but when push comes to shove, unless shes totally free and in the mood to go out, she'll just cancel instead because she knows deep in her heart that that extra feeling just isnt there. Theres no extra incentive (sex or that deep physical attraction) for her to make the effort to go out with you unless shes really in the mood.

Thats also why she wrote you that first email. It was her way of expressing her feelings towards you, which are strong in the sense she really cares for you, and of trying to talk herself into making this relationship more physical-to get you to make the moves. Because she doesnt have the inclination or the energy or the interest level to do it herself. So she wants you to start initiating more so that MAYBE she'll get that extra spark she's looking for and missing with you.

I know this may seem a little strange to you but I've actually done things like this myself. It's like you meet someone and you KNOW how nice of a person they are, how they would make a great bf or gf and everything that you would want in a mate is there, except for whatever reason that physcial spark isn't there 100% like it should be, and you keep hoping and wishing that it will come in time.

As far as the woman herself. Just judging from her emails it sounds like she's a well-thought, nice, caring person. I mean I've met alot of other women in the world that don't have half the intellect she does. However, I really think she's tried and tried with this and as far as a ltr, I just dont think its gonna happen, as much as BOTH of you would like it too. She is attracted to you physically, just not enough. Which means this probably wont turn out like you want it to, on her behalf because the physical part just isnt there for her like it should be 100%, and you because of her thought process regarding that physcial aspect and her actions as a result of that.

It is up to you whether you decide to persue this further, if you have strong feelings for her, I would advise a break for a while until you meet someone else or you can talk to her as a friend without wanting to get in her pants all the time-which is a whole other subject since I always say that can never happen lol.

 

[PuertoRican_Lover]

echo - pretty much summed this thread up - good job!

Call me crazy...If a girl wanted u physically she would never never never blow u off and she will b at your beck and call. you r the prize - remember that! Guys, how many times did u blow a girl off that u really really wanted - ZERO!!! (unless she is a wacko - but who wants a wacko anyway)

 

[myfriendblu]

Ronin,
I will just tell you this - your NEVER ever gonna get a solid, stable high amount of IL with this girl over a period of time. EVER. Every minute spent talking,seeing, im'ing, email, etc. is a minute wasted for nothing. Trust me on this, been there done that. NEXT this whole situation ASAP, cause its all dramatic and, well, isn't gonna lead anywere.

Bottom line.

 

[Ronin I]

Hey echo - thanks for the insightful post. A lot of what you said rings true to home -

Here is pretty much how I view the situation at this point:

Question: Why was her IL seemingly low IL when we first met?

Possible answers:
A) she was still hung up on some other dude at the time

B) lack of physical spark

C) A & B


Question: Why does she obviously feel conflicted about her "feelings" for me now?

Possible answers:
A) she wonders if her feelings for me can be genuine given the nature of our relationship the past 5 months. meaning she's asking herself "can I reallly feel this strongly for this guy just from talking to him over the internet?".(She made a comment to me yesterday that she wants "more out of life than to laugh and cry in front of a computer screen".)

B) lack of physical spark

C) A & B


Now the only consistent answer to the questions at hand is B) but that doesn't discount the possibility of A) in each instance (or least C)

Blu, I completely understand what you are saying - and I don't discount that you probably are right - but truth is, I like this girl enough to give it a shot. I'm fully aware that I am probably setting myself up to get burned, but frankly I'm willing to take the chance. Besides, recent events have definitely led me believe that it's time to turn up the heat and see what happens. Nothing ventured nothing gained.

I really hope that I'm not here posting a "blu, you were right after all" post again.

In the meantime though I will continue to pursue other women as I have learned all too well not to put all of my eggs in one basket.

 

[smooth_as_silk]

What's all this ? U're doing a PhD on ur "relationship" with this girl ? She's not interested and it's blatant. A girl truly interested in u makes it very clear that she wants to spend time with u: anytime u call her to hang out she says yes, no games, no flakiness...
What's all this overanalyzing? There are no rational explanations for any girl's behaviour except the fact that making u think abt her actions and manipulating ur mind is her goal. Stop overanalyzing everything and tagging along with this girls'****ty attitude. At least, u can get out of this with a little bit of respect from her side.

 

[myfriendblu]

Originally posted by Ronin I


Now the only consistent answer to the questions at hand is B) but that doesn't discount the possibility of A) in each instance (or least C)

Blu, I completely understand what you are saying - and I don't discount that you probably are right - but truth is, I like this girl enough to give it a shot. I'm fully aware that I am probably setting myself up to get burned, but frankly I'm willing to take the chance. Besides, recent events have definitely led me believe that it's time to turn up the heat and see what happens. Nothing ventured nothing gained.

I really hope that I'm not here posting a "blu, you were right after all" post again.

Mark my words - your gonna get burned. Trust me. I will keep a look out for that "Blu you were right" post.

Your IL in this girl is much more higher than hers in yours. Been in them shoes before. You can never raise a girls IL. You can only re-spark what the IL may have been in the first place. What I think happened? She has probably 6-7 IL in you. Of course when you went all AFC on her, it dropped. When you got your balls back, it re-sparked to its previous level, which isn't really all that high to begin with. It will drop again, mark my words.

 

[Femme_Fatale]

being a woman, i thought i could help out decifer...

unfortunatley, i don't think even she knows what she was trying to say!

it almost seemed to me like she was trying to profess her undying love for you, which seems totally out of the question since you haven't even known each other long at all

but you have to rememeber, women are emotional 'creatures' and what you want out of your friendship might not be the same as what she wants

looks like she thought she could communicate her feelings in a way you'd understand - it looked to me like she threw up on the computer and hit send...