Have you ever gone AFC on your LTR?

TheDoctor

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Just curious if many guys deal with this or not. Is this a big problem with LTRs? I went AFC on my girl and am fighting like hell to get back to solid ground. I'm doing a decent job but it's tough.

Thoughts? Stories?
 

decades

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It's almost impossible not to. Primarily because she knows you have given up your options in exchange for her being there for you. iow, she has you by the cajones in a way she couldn't have before you gave in and made the commitment.
 

TheDoctor

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AGBourne said:
What exactly did you do?
Just basically being pvssy whipped so to say. When she asked, I did. When she needed, I provided. I had basically gone from a tough guy who didn't need her to a wuss who was comfortable having her integrated into every facet of my life. I got too comfortable and stopped trying to be suave, cool and sexy because I already had what I wanted (her). Through this website, I have realized that once you have them where you want them, you still need to work to keep them there (i.e. being sexy, suave and cool. Seduce them, Doing the little things that were so natural in the begining to keep things random and interesting).

My girl was a hugh driving factor in my ongoing recovery. She let me know that I was turning soft and she didn't like it. She commented that I "used" to be sexy and confident.

It was a snowball effect. I wasn't being a strong, tough man (take charge kinda guy) anymore. As a result, she started losing interest. The sex declined to once a week and as a result, I got pissed and would start arguments with her to try to get to the bottom of her behavior (which was a direct result of me {and birthcontrol}). She would be mad that I was mad and would say that sex was the last thing on her mind after we fought for a week. I would lose confidence after being rejected constantly by my girl. It just kept going and going.

I've realized the problem and am working on being that cool guy that I have been my whole life (that's why this is so confusing and difficult for me to understand, I've never had this problem, I'm the one that never gave a sh*t). I somehow went from a suave mofo to a supplicating, pvssy whipped wuss. I guess that's what love does to you, it makes you soft. Anyway, I'm tightening up my behavior. No more needyness, no more b*tching and whining when she pisses me off. I don't hold on to sh*t anymore. I let her know she fvcked up (angered/upset me) and then I forget about it.

I had fallen into such a level of comfortability that I had stopped trying at all, thus my value hit rock bottom. We love each other very much and I'm working on getting us back on track and she stopped taking her birth control so she won't be a raging lunatic/emotional wreck/total b*tch anymore.

Before coming here, I had no idea what AFC was nor did I know that I had a bad case of it.

Thanks guys.
 

TheDoctor

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Any suggestions or practices that anyone has used in the past to prevent turning AFC on your girl?

Suggestions / Advice Welcome.

Rollo??
KontrollerX??
WC2??
 

BillyT

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Wow man, sounds familiar. My last LTR went about the same way. In the beginning I would check her behavior with a quickness. In that time she was the best girlfriend ever. At some point I fell in love with her and started being soft. I began supplicating and basically lost myself to her. I was AFC all the way. It was very co-dependent and dysfunctional. That is the key thing for me to learn. How to be in love, in a LTR, but still not place their needs above mine. I have a tendency to want to be needed and to be needy myself in a LTR. I can get them, now I need to learn how to keep myself together once I have them.
 

STR8UP

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Even back in the day I was usually fairly good IN relationships, aside from becoming very complacent. My issue was after. I would always fall apart after the breakup.
 

TheDoctor

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STR8UP said:
I would always fall apart after the breakup.
Yea, I guess that's the worst time to go AFC, after the break up. If you want her back anyway. Sorry I didn't put your name on that previous post STR8UP. You always have good words and points.

BillyT
I'm with you. I did the same things. I wanted to be needed and was very needy at times myself, too. I'm working to be a confident, masculine man and I'm slowly getting back to myself. Caring about myself and not putting ALL her needs in front of mine. I'm just a giver and when I love someone, I give them my all.

The funny thing is, a while back, we went out to meet some friends and I was in super chill mode, so I just kind of sat back in the shadows and had some beers, wasn't very social and was basically giving off the vibe of "I'm too cool to be at this bar with these people." Not intentionally, just because I was in chill mode, listening to the live music, etc. Next thing I know, my girl sits down, ask me if I'm ok, I tell her I'm fine and then five minutes later we are in the back seat of my SUV getting down and dirty. We used to do this every now and again back in the day, but it hasn't happended in a long long time.

I don't know if it was just the timing or a coincidence but I started to think that me being aloof and sitting in the back confident and cool led to her arousal and the events that followed. I could be putting too much thought into it, but never-the-less, I am getting back to my roots as a confident masculine dude desired by women.

Also, her friends all want a piece of me b/c they only see the "ME" that is calm, collected and cool, and they know the way I treat my girlfriend. They don't see the needyness and the stupid fights that got us on shaky ground. It's sad that I let a woman take my manhood from me so to speak.

Don't worry, I'm getting it back (I'd say over halfway there at this point).


REMEMBER: When you become needy and a "yes" man to your girl, SHE WILL LOSE RESPECT AND/OR INTEREST! I know this for a fact. Keep on keeping on with the behavior that landed the girl to begin with. That is why it is so important to not FAKE your game and personality, because your true self will shine through eventually and if she doesn't like what she's got, she'll go get another. Believe That.
 

BillyT

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Hey TheDoctor,
Part of it was that when I met my girl, I was seeing a few others on a casual basis. Once I fell for her I dumped and went no contact with all the others. Not even friends. I told them I had a serious relationship and couldn't be with them anymore. Then I became needy because she was my only option. Losing her suddenly became a big deal. I was so AFC I even told her I had dumped every one else and she was my only one. I guess I was trying to prove myself to her. Looking back I can just see her thinking....Sucker. She behaved much better when she knew I had options. Anyway, live and learn.
 

Bible_Belt

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TheDoctor said:
Just curious if many guys deal with this or not. ...Thoughts? Stories?
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=126708

I still talk to the girl on facebook; we are friends. She has a dorky new boyfriend, but I can tell still has feelings for me. Too bad, though, because my current girlfriend is about twice as hot.

These are the things you don't see in your future at the time. Turning AFC involves worrying about things not turning out like they did for me.

Relationships end, and when that happens, it is simply a chance to trade for a more attractive woman. That's what I learned from the experience in that thread.
 

I.A.F.Y.B.

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I've went from DJ to AFC before in a LTR.. Just get back to your DJ skills and move on.
 

darkstarrr

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TheDoctor said:
That is why it is so important to not FAKE your game and personality, because your true self will shine through eventually and if she doesn't like what she's got, she'll go get another. Believe That.
That's what I am trying to learn about right now. Improving myself in such a way that I become the man I want to be right down to my soul. It takes time and effort, and the ability to stand up for yourself. It also takes the ability to rid yourself of fear of them leaving. No Fear.
 

jophil28

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darkstarrr said:
That's what I am trying to learn about right now. Improving myself in such a way that I become the man I want to be right down to my soul. It takes time and effort, and the ability to stand up for yourself. It also takes the ability to rid yourself of fear of them leaving. No Fear.
I always remember this- the guy that she 'fell' for was difficult to pin down, a little mysterious and ****y in a fun way. HE was what chicks call "a challenge" ..but still chivalrous on the occasion.
THose qualities stirred her emotions, and made them swirl and tumble, and she came back for more ...
I think it was SRT8uP who once said wisely , " Women do not fall in love with YOU as a person, they fall for the way that you make them feel."

And that is what it is all about.
 

KontrollerX

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"I guess that's what love does to you, it makes you soft."

Thats only what happens to us guys who grow up and into AFC's and then have to work our way out of it.

You should read about the relationships of natural DJ alpha male types such as Sean Connery.

Love didn't make him soft, it made him stern yet fair.

In anycase though the overrall answer to your post is a combination of what both Rollo and squirrelz have said.

For Rollo's part he used to often make a point to us that the way to keep a relationship alive and exciting and probably the only way to do so is to keep up the competition anxiety within it meaning you both covertly and overtly find ways to let your woman know that if she were to leave you or cheat on you or decide to let herself go (get fat, dress sloppy, etc) that you are such a high quality man you'll have no problem moving on and cutting her loose.

You let her know that you will not be begging her like a dog for his treats or for his master to stay. You are the master but you don't need to control her to be the master, rather what makes you the master is you control yourself and walk right out that door if she decides to act in an unacceptable manner to you.

Anyway what Rollo said he did to acheive the competition anxiety was he worked out and kept his body in shape and still carries himself in such a commanding way that other women notice and in turn his wife notices and she too stays ontop of her game so as to keep him with her and not one of them.

To do this right you probably should tell any girl you start a relationship with about how much work you do on yourself to keep yourself in top condition for your woman so you expect the same and if you don't get the same committment to physical fitness that is alright as you and that particular girl just weren't meant to be together thats all.

Anyway now what squirrelz famous topic "The sh!t test that everyone fails" has said is that once the girl gives herself to you what happens to a lot of former AFC's is they lose their way and revert to AFC status as you have said you have done. The way to beat this and stop it from happening isn't to use more DJ techniques and get yourself back on track that way with your girl.

The real way is to literally become the DJ type of man so much so that you do DJ type of things unconsciously.

The DJ style of living and being is not a PUA tactic.

To be a DJ is to literally remake yourself in the cool guy mode and then live it 24/7.

Its not a tactic its who you are.

Fake it till you make it or practice, practice, practice!!!

Until you literally become a Don Juan to where it is your second nature like AFC used to be you will always in every relationship you have revert to AFC status and like squirrelz topic is titled you'll become the guy who is yet another casualty of "The sh!t test that everyone fails".
 

Riviera Paradise

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Hey guys, I am a newbie to this forum, but if I may...I read this thread, and it enraged me because I have made the same mistake, more than once. But I guess a pattern that I noticed from reading this (and I realized within myself) is that we are missing the target. If you make whats between her legs, the target, and you achieve that goal, then we get soft. However, if instead we make the target: whats between her ears (which are conveniently somehow attached to what is between her legs) then, we can focus on the games that they play to stay one step ahead of them.
In other words:
Short term goal: focus on her genitalia,
Long term goal: focus on her mind.

Now, if I could remind myself of this mistake I keep repeating, then I think things would be easier...

One thing that has helped me is reading "Great Female Con", google it & let me know what you think.

BTW absolutely GREAT forum.
 

BillyT

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Riviera Paradise said:
Hey guys, I am a newbie to this forum, but if I may...I read this thread, and it enraged me because I have made the same mistake, more than once. But I guess a pattern that I noticed from reading this (and I realized within myself) is that we are missing the target. If you make whats between her legs, the target, and you achieve that goal, then we get soft. However, if instead we make the target: whats between her ears (which are conveniently somehow attached to what is between her legs) then, we can focus on the games that they play to stay one step ahead of them.
In other words:
Short term goal: focus on her genitalia,
Long term goal: focus on her mind.

Now, if I could remind myself of this mistake I keep repeating, then I think things would be easier...

One thing that has helped me is reading "Great Female Con", google it & let me know what you think.

BTW absolutely GREAT forum.
I guess I am a little different in that getting laid has never made me soft. There have been plenty of women I laid and never felt a thing for. I went AFC when I started focusing on winning her mind and heart. As long as it was purely sexual, I was able to stay in control. Once I began to know her as a person and on a deeper level is when I go soft. In my last one once I began to know her better I saw this poor damaged little soul and it brought out my rescuer in a big way. I just wanted to make everything better. She was the fragile waif that I was to rescue. These feelings did not come about when we were screwing, only when the relationship developed.

BTW, I am brand new here too. Referred here and in a few weeks of reading here have learned more than years of study elsewhere. This place rocks.
 

Colossus

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This site, among others, essentially got it’s start from pickup artistry and has developed into something more practical and substantive than a bag of clever hat tricks to seduce women. Pickup artistry is, at it’s core, manipulation. It is a set of tricks, illusions, and triggers that are designed to temporarily augment a woman’s interest to the point you can sleep with her, without addressing any of the root issues that gave you problems with women and life in the first place. A chump is a chump regardless of the external validations he has cajoled into coming his way.

It’s easy to come to this site and get lost in the dogma without addressing your core problem---being an AFC. I did for a long time. I had all of this theoretical knowledge but negligible experience...like an expert diver who had never been in the pool. In the past year or so I have obtained a lot of real-time experience that has not only cemented some of the tenets I already learned, but shattered others. A good foundation is built on the basics. All the rest is fine tuning.

But back to the question of your original post---yes, I have. I think most men have, or were AFC's to begin with and never leave.

If you allow them, women will slowly seep into every nook and crevice of your life. This is how men get sucked back into their old AFC ways---they slowly allow their comfort to reach a level where she becomes the centerpiece of his life. If you think about it, this IS the problem. She has slowly and ever so subtly become the focus of your life. Now you may say "no way...I have a great job, hobbies, friends, etc. She's just my girlfriend." Really? If she were just your girlfriend, would you have yourself to regress into a supplicating ball of mush?

When men regress into AFCism during the course of an LTR, that IS the reason--they have lost their hand. When you got with her you were cool, calm, funny, and masculine. You did what you wanted and didn't really put too much care into the outcome---you were just enjoying her and going about your life. This is what attracted her to you--your masculine independence. You ever notice how women don't want men who REALLY want them? This is the cardinal tenet of relationships: the one who wants the most is at the mercy of the other.

That's not to say that you shouldn't be with a woman you genuinely DO desire, but you shouldn't let your desire for her supersede your own self-respect. Not one beating female heart on this planet is worth compromising your self-respect for, and this is what happens in many LTR's. You lose your other options, she becomes central to you, and your fear of losing her and her pussie smothers your manhood like a wet blanket.

As DJ's we cannot allow this to happen. And just as importantly, we cannot blame women when it does happen. The motto of the DJ is, and ever should be, VIGILANCE.

You must keep moving forward with your life, even if that means leaving her.

You must maintain a balance between yourself, your friends, and your woman.

You must choose women that choose YOU.

You must constantly take inventory of your faculties and emotions; and be wary that they are not spent disproportionately.

You must be true to what YOU want, not what she wants.

You must have like-minded men in your life; to keep each other in check. Iron will sharpen iron.

You must never, ever, EVER place a woman up on a pedestal. They don't want it, and you don't need it. You may find a woman who is your equal, but you are never her subordinate.

You must have boundaries, and hold them like a fortress.

You must never tolerate disrespect, and this starts with SELF-respect.


Follow these basic tenets and you will by and large be successful with women.
 

Unbridled_Phoenix

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STR8UP said:
Even back in the day I was usually fairly good IN relationships, aside from becoming very complacent. My issue was after. I would always fall apart after the breakup.
To a Texas T

Lots of great insight in this one, and it all serves to remind us that with all the tricks and tactics that are out there it could be easy to get lost in that and lose sight of the fundamentals. A fundamentalist, I would think, does not carry a mental toolbag of tricks but rather he just is what he is. An inordinate amount of concentration on these tactics is actually indicative of attachment to outcome and unsound fundamentals, they become smoke and mirrors.
 
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