Hard Truth: There is no decent alternative to OLD

[wifehunter]

I do food delivery, so I meet girls regularly.

Not, that my broke self can do anything about it, though.

It's only practice, at this point. 49 and still attracting prime 18-25s. : )

 

[Alvafe]

Lol is that aimed at me? I literally spent a few months fvcking a wife in an open marriage. I’m not a cuck bro

not at you, you asked what will be the next hence I pointed out what will be the way things are going, then a rant of mine on some people here.

and who didn't **** someone else wife once? I didn't know at the time though, and keep distance after, didn't want the hassle

 

[SargeMaximus]

not at you, you asked what will be the next hence I pointed out what will be the way things are going, then a rant of mine on some people here.

and who didn't **** someone else wife once? I didn't know at the time though, and keep distance after, didn't want the hassle

Ah cool. Yeah I was fortunate to find a poly couple so didn’t have to worry about backlash. Her husband died last year tho. Rip. He was actually a cool dude

 

[corsica]

At 6'2, good looking and a salesman... OLD might be the best option.

For the rest of the guys who are not above average, OLD is a nightmare.

 

[Murk]

A former member made a point about social scenes vs circles. Social circles have somewhat dried up due to women not wanting to risk blowing up their circle by dating in it. So places like church are not what they used to be. However, social scenes that don't have really close group supervision blow online dating out of the water.

Also, since OLD literally flat out does not work for most men, your post makes no sense. It's not even a comparable option.

I agree with this

Also OLD is full of h0es. Even the most chaste saintly virgins like the Mexican poster who believes his girl from Tinder is a virgin who he’s just got engaged to, get turned out by Chad, Tyrone and Enrique.

If you find your ltr/wife on OLD - more fool you.

As a handsome man with game OLD was easy. As a man trying to find a quality girl there are much better options than OLD.

OP aren’t you in an LTR with a girl you’ve known 8 weeks anyway? What do you know.

 

[pipeman84]

Also OLD is full of h0es. Even the most chaste saintly virgins like the Mexican poster who believes his girl from Tinder is a virgin who he’s just got engaged to, get turned out by Chad, Tyrone and Enrique.

If you find your ltr/wife on OLD - more fool you.

Man, I agree with you on principle, but then there are exceptions to most anything. What are you saying, that @Dr.Suave fiancee has been playing a role for a year and has had him fooled all this time?

 

[SW15]

In our time, the sense of community has gone away, so there’s no more meeting your future wife at church, a city event, work, etc.

A former member made a point about social scenes vs circles. Social circles have somewhat dried up due to women not wanting to risk blowing up their circle by dating in it. So places like church are not what they used to be. However, social scenes that don't have really close group supervision blow online dating out of the water.

I agree that there's less of a scene of community. Church has been declining for decades as a way of meeting women for LTRs for a variety reasons. Meeting people through friends/acquaintances has been declining since the 1980s, but still represents a sizable portion of how relationships form. The path of meeting through friends/acquaintances is still an easier path than swipe apps or approaching strangers if there's already a good social network in place. I've never had that social network for a variety of reasons, including frequent relocations prior to my late 20s.

What's the difference between a social scene and social circle? I'm not quite following.

Even in my main social group in my current city, 2 couples formed through social circle. There were multiple men competing for them in the circle. These are women who would have rated in the 5.5 - 6.5 rating range for most men. Both have rather dull personalities and one had a prudish reputation. They both got men from my social circle to compete intensely for them and had their choice of men in the circle. Additionally, the men in my circle did make marriage proposals to them.

One friend who I met in my current city arrived in my current city with a girlfriend from college. In college, their meeting story was a combination of having a class together + a social circle competition.

I agree that in general a social scene/social circle without what @LARaiders85 calls close group supervision is an easier path. Even with that, what I said about social circles below still applies.

Social circle is great for getting a girlfriend. Pay close attention to the words "a girlfriend". That means one girlfriend. If you're looking for an extended relationship (2-5 years or more), your best bet for getting that with the least amount of grief and frustration is social circle. Many men who get social circle girlfriends tend to retain those girlfriends for a long time and often beyond the useful life of the relationship. A lot of the social circle girlfriend guys are beta males and beta males operate from a scarcity mindset. It's common to see a 10 year relationship (and counting) relationship from social circle which does lead to a marriage proposal.

A social circle introduction is a higher percentage play than a swipe app interaction or approaching a stranger (either in a bar or non-bar setting). It's a more difficult path and it's not a path I recommend highly. Social circle is better in the shorter to medium term. You can get a solid, medium term (1-4 years) girlfriend via social circles more easily than through approaches or swiping more easily.

The problem with social circles becomes sustainability over a longer period of time (5+ years). Social circles have a way of getting pissed off at men who continually exchange girlfriends without marriage or babies, even if the relationships are semi-long (1-4 years). After 2 or so instances of medium term relationships, the social circle will run dry. Social circle is not likely ideal for a serial monogamist who does have extended relationships but doesn't commit or the player type who tends to have relationships of less than 1 year.

The other options either have too much friction or too much investment with a high rate of failure.

Earlier in this thread, I covered the potential high rates of failure with other methods. I didn't discuss the friction concept.

I think friction is a good thing for men but might not be as good for women.

Environments with greater friction lead to women treating men worse at the beginning of the interaction. Women have no issues with ghosting men or flaking on agreed upon plans with men when they have met these men through a swipe app, social media DM, or a stranger approach in many of the venues discussed in the first post of the thread. In a situation with greater social friction like a social sphere/social circle introduction, women will behave a little bit better. Even when a relationship doesn't form, the woman will treat the man better in the early stages. She won't ghost or flake because she doesn't want to hear about her ghosting or flaking from her friends or acquaintances.

In app swiping or stranger approaches, women's social circles are never informed when she ghosts or flakes. In those cases, she has no motivation to treat a man in a decent manner. In most cases, her treatment of a man will be worse than if she initially started an interaction with a man in a frictional environment.

At 6'2, good looking and a salesman... OLD might be the best option.

Swipe apps are worth doing for men 6'0" + and good looking. Is it the best option? It depends on what the man wants out of his interactions with women.

For a 6'0"+ guy with a solid physique and decent volleyball skills, I'd recommend volleyball for pickup. I'd recommend sand over indoor. However, for the 6'0"+ guy with a good physique, I don't think that sand volleyball is any more efficient than swipe apps or randoming approaching at bars. That type of guy is going to have success in all formats. It's a matter of how much screen time he wants to put in on his smartphone vs. how much real life approaching he wants to do. I think it would be more fun for a 6'0"+ guy with sand volleyball skill to pick up women through volleyball than to sit on Tinder/Bumble/Hinge and swipe. It'd be a better use of time for that guy to play volleyball in terms of getting longer term relationships. That'd be the use case where I'd recommend volleyball over the swipe apps. It's a realistic scenario for a 6'2" guy to a get a 5'9"-6'0" volleyball playing girlfriend and that scenario has a better chance of lasting longer than flings with Tinderellas, most of whom are 5'6" and under.

While a 6'0"+ guy can achieve sex through the swipe apps, I still think that a 6'0"+ guy has a better chance finding something with greater long term potential through some real life method.

For the rest of the guys who are not above average, OLD is a nightmare.

Also, since OLD literally flat out does not work for most men, your post makes no sense. It's not even a comparable option.

The swipe apps are very difficult if you're not in the Top 20% of men. That means a rating an 8 or higher usually on looks. Let's remember that Game is a combination of looks, money, status, and personality. Personality isn't going to come across on apps. Looks are the most obvious thing on apps. Money/status can be shown on apps, but you'd have to have really obvious displays of wealth. You'd have to own an top tier boat or car.

Even men with looks in the 6-7.9 range aren't positioned to have a great time on apps. 6-7.9 are reasonably good looks. I have had my photos rated online and I've been in the high 6's/low 7's range. It gets worse if the man rates in the 5-5.9 range and even worse for sub 5 men.

Social media DMing is also dependent upon your looks (more true on Instagram than Twitter), your Follower count, and your ratio of Followers to Following. You need more Followers than Following and you need to be somewhere in the thousands on Followers. Otherwise, Instagram/Twitter DM game is a waste of time.

 

[SmoothHendrixPS2]

OLD and IRL bring different challenges. Just because you have success with one doesn't mean you should totally discontinue the other. It's all an opportunity to improve your overall game and mindset. @Howiestern brings up a great point: It's not supposed to be easy, or feel good. If there was no risk of getting their ego bruised, all men would be successful with women. You keep getting curved online? then you need to get better. You can't get over approach anxiety? then you need to get better. It's never the women, it's YOU!

 

[Dr.Suave]

Man, I agree with you on principle, but then there are exceptions to most anything. What are you saying, that @Dr.Suave fiancee has been playing a role for a year and has had him fooled all this time?

@Murk should stop bringing up my fiance´s virginity. Its getting weird now. Imagine someone going on about the sexual history of other member´s SO and they keep bringing it up. It´s just f0cking weird. It´s also f0cking inappropiate.

Maybe @Murk is one of "those guys":

"Virgins who are 18 years old or older simply dont exist" or "If they exist, they are not on OLD" or some variation of that.

We know the type. At least I do. They have always been here in SoSuave. They will always be here.

You dont have to be a psychologist to see that hey are projecting and/or that they are talking from their particular experience. The thing about talking from experience is this: Your experience can be very different from my experience.

But by God, not in my lowest lows have I been as pessimistic as these type of guys. Its gonna be harder for them to pull any gf/wife material with that mentality. Maybe they dont want to settle down and they prefer to spin plates for life, and that´s ok. I wish them well.

And you are right @pipeman84 exceptions make the rule

 

[Jake_Gyllenhaal69]

OLD and IRL bring different challenges. Just because you have success with one doesn't mean you should totally discontinue the other. It's all an opportunity to improve your overall game and mindset. @Howiestern brings up a great point: It's not supposed to be easy, or feel good. If there was no risk of getting their ego bruised, all men would be successful with women. You keep getting curved online? then you need to get better. You can't get over approach anxiety? then you need to get better. It's never the women, it's YOU!

I get it, but the same men telling me this think OLD is the devil and get their ego's bruised when a match doesn't respond back to them on Tinder. I just do not get how you can get so butthurt about an app if you are taking face to face rejection in person apparently.

 

[SmoothHendrixPS2]

I get it, but the same men telling me this think OLD is the devil and get their ego's bruised when a match doesn't respond back to them on Tinder. I just do not get how you can get so butthurt about an app if you are taking face to face rejection in person apparently.

@Jake_Gyllenhaal69
That's a great point. The sting of rejection is way worse in person (especially if it's prolonged) so guys who can handle approach rejection shouldn't ***** about the OLD algorithm/results. I just believe backbone is backbone. Either you are egotistically indifferent to rejection or you're not, regardless of whether it's online or in person. It will only help you in the long run by trying your hand in both.

 

[Glassguy]

The only real alternative to OLD is School. Other than that, I cannot think of anything remotely close and this is why OLD isn’t going anywhere soon. The other options either have too much friction or too much investment with a high rate of failure. In our time, the sense of community has gone away, so there’s no more meeting your future wife at church, a city event, work, etc.

Work: The workplace has become too competitive to meet your spouse. Flirting with the wrong women can potentially cost you your job. It’s just not worth it todays age.

Bars: Too much investment for high risk. You don’t know if the bar is going to have a decent ratio or not. In addition, you score, but most bar girls are 304s anyways. Some guys like gaming at bars, but it’s not for most guys.

Gym: Combination of shvtting where you eat combined with an unfriendly approach vibe in general. Plus, I go to the gym to workout, not find a girl.

Social Events/Activities- You don’t know if this event is going to have single & attractive women. Plus, you are more than likely going to be doing something that you don’t care about anyway.

Grocery Store/Outside- If you can pull this off then that’s great, but this is extremely difficult for the vast majority of men. No, it’s not this just be a Chad and it’s easy. Cold approaching in these environments takes a special type of person and it’s not easy. This is coming from a guy that’s 6ft 2, in sales, and good looking lol.

In Summary, OLD provides the least friction and requires the lowest investment compared to the other methods except a school environment. Im
Sorry OLD haters, but it’s not going anywhere anytime soon!

You're wrong. You need to meet people through your social groups in real life. If you don't have social groups, you need to figure that out first.

The stronger your social groups, the more interaction to build upon those social groups and expand them. Meeting more women is just a by product.

Social media, if used correctly, is an easy way to expand social groups and interact with more women. But that needs to be transitioned to real life as well.

 

[Jake_Gyllenhaal69]

You're wrong. You need to meet people through your social groups in real life. If you don't have social groups, you need to figure that out first.

The stronger your social groups, the more interaction to build upon those social groups and expand them. Meeting more women is just a by product.

Social media, if used correctly, is an easy way to expand social groups and interact with more women. But that needs to be transitioned to real life as well.

At this point in my life, the only social groups I am interested in are whatever benefits me in financial success. I am not in the market of looking for some "Friends"/"How I met your mother" bro squad that's going to drain my precious free time and resources. Calling them productive because they are "social" is also a massive cope because most of these groups just do nothing but drink and blow money & time on stupid shvt.

 

[patb]

Just have to rot away since I cant meet anyone. Nice thread. At leaat it enourages me to continue doing nothing because you will be wasting your time and feeling bad when chad scoops your date at the last minute and you end up spending new years eve night alone after wasting time investing on that chick. Some things are worst than rotting.

I think that the Chad factor is a bit overblown, for the simple reason that there aren’t enough of them. The college social circle lottery is what I’ve really grown to bitterly resent. It’s totally unmeritocratic, and there’s not a thing you can do about it after your early twenties (or really, your late teens).

 

[bat soup]

I do food delivery, so I meet girls regularly.

Not, that my broke self can do anything about it, though.

It's only practice, at this point. 49 and still attracting prime 18-25s. : )

Just make sure their pepperoni arrives hot and fresh.

 

[ThisIsSparta]

Jeez ........ maintaining social circles is a pain in the ass. Even compared to OLD social circles are REAL work, eating up precious time and nerves when dealing with people you wouldnt give the time of the day if it werent for the one or two available chicks floating in that circle.

And as others allready mentioned, once you ran through 1-2 girls in that group, the women in that circle will make sure your cut out quickly.

Of all the other sub-optimal possibilities to get *****, social circles is the most time consuming one and id rather try my luck on the streets.

 

[Murk]

@Murk should stop bringing up my fiance´s virginity. Its getting weird now. Imagine someone going on about the sexual history of other member´s SO and they keep bringing it up. It´s just f0cking weird. It´s also f0cking inappropiate.

Maybe @Murk is one of "those guys":

"Virgins who are 18 years old or older simply dont exist" or "If they exist, they are not on OLD" or some variation of that.

We know the type. At least I do. They have always been here in SoSuave. They will always be here.

You dont have to be a psychologist to see that hey are projecting and/or that they are talking from their particular experience. The thing about talking from experience is this: Your experience can be very different from my experience.

But by God, not in my lowest lows have I been as pessimistic as these type of guys. Its gonna be harder for them to pull any gf/wife material with that mentality. Maybe they dont want to settle down and they prefer to spin plates for life, and that´s ok. I wish them well.

And you are right @pipeman84 exceptions make the rule

Im not one of any guys, i’m me, completely different from anyone else. Yes virgins exist, but after a year on tinder it’s unlikely. I made 2 posts, TWO, saying I think your girlfriend is lying as she was on tinder. Please post evidence of my “going on about it” or stop crying. Unless you are insecure why do you care I mentioned your girlfriend possibly not being a virgin, twice. Honestly some posters here show a very fragile mindset which is no surprise considering how beta and feminine the average man is.

Please put me on ignore you tampon or I’ll fly to Mexico again and take your girl to Tulum for a week.

 

[Jake_Gyllenhaal69]

Jeez ........ maintaining social circles is a pain in the ass. Even compared to OLD social circles are REAL work, eating up precious time and nerves when dealing with people you wouldnt give the time of the day if it werent for the one or two available chicks floating in that circle.

And as others allready mentioned, once you ran through 1-2 girls in that group, the women in that circle will make sure your cut out quickly.

Of all the other sub-optimal possibilities to get *****, social circles is the most time consuming one and id rather try my luck on the streets.

Exactly, and it's not like those 1-2 floating girls aren't getting their back blown out by Chad's on OLD, exes, or at bars. They are still single for a reason too. Congrats, you got the sloppy fourths by wasting so much money and time drinking with them to get her lol.

 

[Dr.Suave]

Im not one of any guys, i’m me, completely different from anyone else. I made 2 posts saying I think your girlfriend is lying as she was on tinder, you freak. Please post evidence of my “going on about it”. Honestly some posters here show a very fragile mindset which is no surprise considering how beta and feminine the average man is.

Please put me on ignore you tampon or I’ll fly to Mexico again and take your girl to Tulum for a week.

And that´s too many. And Im the freak? That´s rich coming from you.

Nah, I dont wanna put you on ignore. But you are welcome to come back to Mexico so we can talk about my girlfriends sexual history in person and see how that goes.

 

[Murk]

And that´s too many. And Im the freak? That´s rich coming from you.

Nah, I dont wanna put you on ignore. But you are welcome to come back to Mexico so we can talk about my girlfriends sexual history in person and see how that goes.

Your girl was on tinder for a year and you so proudly boast in multiple threads she’s a virgin, and you get upset when someone mentions it?

Work on your mental strength my guy. There will be tougher battles than this in your life.