Going out with girl tomorrow

[becker]

UPDATE:

Ok, guys who have been following this thread. The lunch with this girl DID happen today, without any problems. She was ready to go and was dressed quite unbelievably. Her body is an absolute 10, and coupled with her face, it's amazing.

I basically just took her somewhere that I had in mind already, but I asked her if she had any ideas, and once she didn't I just told her that I was going to take us somewhere then. This date, I guess you might call it, was pretty enlightening, and gave me a really good chance to get to know this girl better. Boy, has she gone through some pretty crazy sh!t. Sort of red flag ridden if you ask me, and I have to say that as much as I'm attracted to her physically, at the same time I sort of actually lost a little interest after learning all this stuff about her that I didn't know.

First of all, she tells me that she doesn't have many girl friends, and most of her friends are guys. Red flag. Girls of this caliber never have many girl friends because she's so damn hot that other girls resent her for being as hot as she is. Girls a petty jealous creatures in that way. Anyways, I'm almost positive these guys who are her "friends" are all AFCs who are probably all after her. No big deal in my mind, nothing I can't handle.

Next, I sort of got talking with her about her ex-BF (I know, you guys are probably thinking emotional tampon time, but it wasn't like that). Actually, she didn't get that into telling me all this stuff, but she just mentioned that the guy is totally crazy about her still and just won't leave her alone. She told me stories of how he had to always be holding her hand or whatever when they were together and how insecure he was, and how annoyed she got when he did that. The guy was totally AFC and still is. He also was taken to a mental institution or something because he threatened to kill himself once when they separated. Funny thing is, he was the one who broke them up because he wanted to see other women, then supposedly he wanted her back after having his fun. She apparently didn't want anything to do with him, but who the heck knows. I told her that I have been through similar situations where the girl was all psycho and obsessed with me too, and it seemed to bring her closer to me. Personally, being that I'm not a jealous or insecure guy, I told her I don't understand guys who are like that, who want to be so controlling and possessive. She then stated that she doesn't get that attached or throw her feelings out there so easily. I guess it comes from her difficult home life. Issue city, I tell you.

With all these issues, she's not totally my type, except for the fact that she's a 10 in looks bar none. One of the most beautiful women I've ever seen in my life hands down. It was absolutely amazing what a girl like this does for you in the social proof department. All eyes were on me the entire time, and the waitress at the restaurant was totally flirting with me, and kino and stuff.

Anyways, we only had about an hour or so for lunch, and I sort of cut it short. I paid, but it cost me a little over $20 total for both of us (we went to a nice place too, but ate salads and shared a main course) so it wasn't too bad. She didn't even offer to pay though, and I'm sure she's totally used to guys paying for her. At the same time, I didn't make a fuss at all about paying because to me, we were too busy talking to deal with money. I want to take this girl out this weekend for a day and just find out a little more about her. She is actually nice to talk to, and I feel bad that she has had such a tough life. Looking beautiful can be as much a curse as a blessing, because I'm sure she never hears the end of it from guys.

I will probably take her out this weekend to spend just a little more time with her getting to know her before I decide whether to even pursue this girl. Lookswise, she's totally worth it, but I'm not sure about everything else. I'm asking for trouble probably, but I want to make sure I'm reading her right. We didn't have enough time today. Either way, there's no way I'm going to drop this girl as social proof. She's about as good as it gets as far as that goes.

 

[becker]

ANOTHER UPDATE:

Ok, not getting too many replies here, so it seems like I'm having a dialogue with myself. Nevertheless, here's what happened, and I'll try to keep it short.

I saw this girl today, she told me she really liked lunch yesterday. Bantered a little, and I asked her if she had plans Saturday (supposedly this is not supposed to be a good thing to do, but then again, I don't play by the rules, remember?) She said she didn't have plans and she was just finishing her Xmas shopping, and I told her to save Saturday for me. She said ok, so I guess we're going to be going out on Saturday. Then I said bye, and I'll see her tomorrow.

It's pretty amusing for me because I expected this to be a little harder given that she is so crazy hot, but I think that what has helped is that I just happen to be sort of interested, but not totally interested in this girl. The main thing that I can see gets guys in trouble with girls like this is the total AFC falling head over heels in love with her at first sight situation. I've kept things at arms length, and haven't made any moves on her that would be too much too early, such as trying to kiss her or anything like that. It would be pretty stupid to go for that after an hour lunch. I don't know about you guys, but I tend to let things happen when it comes to kissing. Most people here seem to think that kissing should occur at a certain time, while I'm more inclined to just let it happen when the time and mood is right. If that doesn't happen, then making it happen is going to seem contrived and forced, which is not good.

I'll be spending the entire Saturday with her and I have a great day planned.

 

[jakethasnake]

becker,

rules are made to be broken. Gigalo has a point, but if your game is tight enough so that you can break the rules, do it. You're your own master of your destiny.

 

[becker]

Gigalo,

How's that ex-GF of yours, the cute brunette? I'm still game if she's looking for any dates. j/k.

I'm taking her to several places that she told me that she has never been to, but only sort of mentioned in passing. One of them is a zoo that she told me she hasn't been to. This girl is an animal FANATIC, and has dogs, cats, chickens, whatever all around her house. She absolutely LOVES animals more than anything. The reason why this is so great is because I'm planning stuff that I would only know she'd like to do if I listened to her earlier. It's even better since it was just small details from conversations we had that she probably wouldn't think anyone would remember.

BTW, what are the rules about second dates? You're right, I basically don't follow too many rules, but you've sparked my curiosity. I never really read the DJ Bible in any great detail either. Too much structure for me to be honest.

 

[Jake Steed]

Thanks for the update, becker.

Here's my take on some of this:

"First of all, she tells me that she doesn't have many girl friends, and most of her friends are guys."--becker

Did you ask her why SHE thinks she doesn't have girl friends? It would have been very important to find out what SHE thinks about it. It can give you a lot of insight into her personality. For example, I could ask her that question, knowing the answer, but what she THINKS the answer is actually tells me more about her than the answer itself. Get it?

This "not having girl friends" is actually so common, it's cliche. There can be many reasons for it. You mentioned you think it's because she's hot and other girls are jealous of her. Yes, that could be the reason.

Another reason could be that she just has a "guy" type of personality. My current gf is like that--she jokes like a guy and doesn't really act prissy, so many girls don't know how to take her.

ANOTHER, and more likely reason your girl doesn't get along with other women is because SHE is insecure and can't stand having competition around. I've dated girls like that with tons of guys clinging on and their only gfs were ugly war pigs. That was because they were insecure and hated having to compete.

Remember--even though YOU see her as gorgeous, most girls think they are flawed and ugly. I bet your girl doesn't think she's near as pretty as you think she is. Therefore, she is insecure and can't stand other girls around as competition. Only you will know for sure about this after you get to know her.

So the ex-bf is totally crazy. I wonder how many of her other exes were crazy as well. I agree this is a big red flag because it means she attracts and is attracted to DRAMA. It is a subconscious thing, and she doesn't even know she's doing it, but she's drawn to drama like a moth to a flame and if you can't provide her with some drama, she will either create it, or get bored of you real quick. You mentioned her family life was fvcked up. If so, her love life and family life are eternally intertwined. Just keep that in mind. Don't try to be Captain Save-A-Ho.

Good luck on your weekend date. Let us know how it goes.

Jake

 

[becker]

Gigalo, if things don't work out with this girl right now, I'm coming to you for that girl's number!

Here's the thing, one rule I'm a little cautious about is paying for everything. The thing is, I can say I'm doing pretty well financially at the moment and I know this girl is not making that much money doing what she's doing right now. Because of this, if we both pay our own ways, we probably won't be going out that often because she needs to watch what she spends.

I'm also a little concerned that she didn't even offer to pay last time, but at the same time, I think she treated it like it was a date, and not just two "friends" going out to lunch.

This next date, is sort of to me the official first date with this girl. That lunch was just too short on time and we really didn't get enough time together. I'm glad we'll be able to do something this weekend. I feel as though I can really come out on top with this girl because there has been a lot things that she has not gotten to do, and I can be the first to do it with her, thus anchoring myself to all these good times. It seems to me based on what she has told me, that her past BF(s) have been the type that have been so insecure that they wouldn't take her anywhere for fear that other guys will look at her. I'm sure I'm a breath of fresh air to her since I'm totally opposite of that. I see her talking to other guys and hanging with them, I walk up, say hi to her, give the guy a what's up, and walk off. I'm sickeningly nice too, so I become a guy that these guys hate, but at the same time, I'm too cool with them for them to ever do anything. It's funny.

 

[becker]

Originally posted by Jake Steed
Thanks for the update, becker.

Here's my take on some of this:

"First of all, she tells me that she doesn't have many girl friends, and most of her friends are guys."--becker

Did you ask her why SHE thinks she doesn't have girl friends? It would have been very important to find out what SHE thinks about it. It can give you a lot of insight into her personality. For example, I could ask her that question, knowing the answer, but what she THINKS the answer is actually tells me more about her than the answer itself. Get it?

This "not having girl friends" is actually so common, it's cliche. There can be many reasons for it. You mentioned you think it's because she's hot and other girls are jealous of her. Yes, that could be the reason.

Another reason could be that she just has a "guy" type of personality. My current gf is like that--she jokes like a guy and doesn't really act prissy, so many girls don't know how to take her.

ANOTHER, and more likely reason your girl doesn't get along with other women is because SHE is insecure and can't stand having competition around. I've dated girls like that with tons of guys clinging on and their only gfs were ugly war pigs. That was because they were insecure and hated having to compete.

Remember--even though YOU see her as gorgeous, most girls think they are flawed and ugly. I bet your girl doesn't think she's near as pretty as you think she is. Therefore, she is insecure and can't stand other girls around as competition. Only you will know for sure about this after you get to know her.

So the ex-bf is totally crazy. I wonder how many of her other exes were crazy as well. I agree this is a big red flag because it means she attracts and is attracted to DRAMA. It is a subconscious thing, and she doesn't even know she's doing it, but she's drawn to drama like a moth to a flame and if you can't provide her with some drama, she will either create it, or get bored of you real quick. You mentioned her family life was fvcked up. If so, her love life and family life are eternally intertwined. Just keep that in mind. Don't try to be Captain Save-A-Ho.

Good luck on your weekend date. Let us know how it goes.

Jake

Jake, you have good insight and bring up great points. I did talk to this girl about why she has more guy friends then girls, and she said that it was usually because any girls who she was friends with who had BFs always ended up liking her, which obviously caused tension. I feel bad for her though, because she told me this not in a snobby "I'm so much prettier than the world" type of tone, but rather in a tone that expressed that she didn't try to cause any tension, it just happened. If you saw how gorgeous this girl was, you'll understand that she is probably beating guys off with a stick sometimes, and probably gets a lot of unwanted attention. She really is a sweetheart inside.

Your last paragraph was essentially spot-on, and it's probably what's preventing me from getting overly attached. If I saw this girl across the room and she didn't say a word, I'd be smitten, but now that I know a little more about her, my guard is definitely up. This is the reason for the weekend date that I set up. It's so that I get to know her much better, and being that we finished lunch and we had more to say to each other, I'd say that a day may not even be enough time. She certainly can talk, and unlike some guys here, I love a girl who isn't afraid to say what's on her mind. She tells me everything without much reservation, and I love that. I can see her possibly getting bored with people quick who can't keep her life somewhat exciting, but I guess that applies to most people.

 

[drixsa]

if this girl was a 6 or a 7 would all your interest still be there?

becuase if the answer is NO you will get over how "amazingly hot" she is.

KISSing on the dates: you sound as if you are trying to plan out too much, enjoy the date my man, don't worry about this stuff its soo much better when its all spontaneous.

Paying: the best dates don't cost money (in my experience). But it seems as if you are still trying to persue her interest instead of it being a 50/50 battle.

So if you didn't make another date offer would she be calling YOU?
this is something that i think you will have to deal with in the future.

keep us posted

 

[becker]

drixsa,

To answer your questions, I'll be honest, the only reason why I'm pursuing this girl is that she's a 10. I know it seems shallow, but call it an experiment that I'm doing. I'm just steering away from the ordinary and mundane right now. Whether it works out in the end or not, I'm not going to be dramatically affected. I'm not investing as much time or emotion in this as it seems. I got her to go to lunch with me without a ton of effort, and this next outing this weekend I only had to ask. I didn't tell her what we'd be doing, I just told her to save Saturday for me. As I said in an earlier post, I've lost a little interest in the mere fact that she just got out of a jealous and possessive relationship that lasted 3 years and is experiencing some freedom now, and will likely be seeing other guys besides myself. I have no problem with that, because I'm getting my time with her too. I mean, come on, you can't expect the girl to jump into anything serious after being shielded for so long, do you? I think part of the reason she's drawn to me is that I'm NOT possessive and don't get jealous if she's with other guys. It's just dating, and not anything more than that, and it's my understanding that dating means that there are no real commitments on either side.

As for kissing, I said that I'm the one that keeps it spontaneous, and I've never planned a kiss before. It has usually gone with the flow. You'll know when a girl wants to kiss you, because she'll look at you a certain way, sort of like she's waiting for it. Kissing before then is just forcing the issue. I really pushed it when I had my first serious GF, because she actually was the one that grabbed me and planted a kiss on me since I was just sitting there acting totally innocent. From then on, I learned that you have to make a girl feel like they want to kiss you first, before you go in for one. There will undoubtedly be good opportunities this weekend for kissing, but at the same time, I think it's best to not make any moves like that until you're getting enough signals. Patience and a keen intuition is key here.

I think that you need to at least spend a little money on dates, but I agree that you can do a lot of things that don't cost a lot of money. Too much money spent in the beginning just makes you look like you're trying too hard.

As for calling me, I can't say I know her well enough for her to just call me, which is fine with me because I hate talking on the phone. It's still so early in the game for that. I also don't see her doing it that much anyways, since I'm sure she has other things to do. I don't believe a girl will call you that often unless she sees you as a "friend" who she can call and talk to for hours about her problems. Either that, or else she's your official GF. In between, I've never really seen it happen that much.

 

[NewMan]

On paying for dates...

Ok - on the whole paying for dates...

Becker asked her out - and has all this great stuff planned for her - so he should foot the bill plain and simple.

She's not suggesting where they go - he's arranging things, so he should pay.


Now how he handles it from here is the key.

After This weekend, he should sit back and wait for her to approach him - Adn when she suggests to do something, that's when she comes up with the $$$'s.

Thats the way I play it - if I aks her out, I pay. If she asks me, she pays

 

[becker]

NewMan,

I'm wondering how often you've had women ask you out after the second date or so. I've found that that's a tough standard to go by because girls tend to not ask guys out that much, unless they're just asking them to hang out. For this reason, I'll probably end up paying, especially since this girl most definitely gets asked out more often than she'd probably like. Furthermore, this girl doesn't make that much money, so she's not as able to splurge like I may have some luxury to do, so that's another reason I may feel bad about making her pay for me.

I didn't get to see her today, I was actually too busy. I'll talk to her tomorrow because I still need to get her address and stuff. I'll definitely be footing the bill though, that's for sure, I don't think I have a choice this time. Small price to pay anyways.

 

[becker]

Oh, another thing about this girl, I'm getting a feeling that she won't be super receptive to kino since she said her last BF just got plain annoying by trying to hold onto her all the time. I think that I'll have to be a little more sparing with the kino in the beginning with her, and I'm going to try to keep things sort of light for a while. I'm guessing that most of the guys that aren't too successful with her are the type that sort of smother her too much. I think the date this weekend will be based on fun pretty much for the whole time. I have to ease into this one slowly.

I'm also going to confirm tomorrow. I'm still a little hesitant with this girl since I don't know her well enough to gauge her level of flakiness. Girls with a lot of stuff going on tend to flake more, so if things don't go down this weekend, I will have to be prepared.

 

[Kineti[C]harm]

I guess I'm a major rulebreaker extraordinaire when it comes to girls but I like your style somewhat becker. You go with your gut and use retrospective thinking alot, that's good.

I've never EVER spent a single dime on girls I've been doing, never EVER but I have no problem giving some girl I know a drink or give her money if she needs change or whatever stuff like that. I don't care about money, I just out of principle never pay for girls in that way. I've never gotten into a situation where I've been forced to either. I have though been given drinks etc by girls and I've also several times been invited home to girls for dates where THEY have served wine etc THEY bought. This is how I like it.

I don't follow any rules when it comes to WHEN to call, how LONG to talk or anything. I just talk and have fun oh and whenever I talk with a girl if it's someone I'm interested in the conversation will 90% of the time always have sexual undertone which she plays into and plays with. See, this girl I used to fvck she called me over an hour every day just to talk and have fun. The girl that asked me out sunday I talked to like 40 minutes when she called to ask me over to her. Stuff like that, don't care... I'm very extrovert, sexual.

See... I get THEM to call, THEM to pay for stuff, I get the sex, I get great social proof (I've been to parties, introduced myself and they'll go "oh YOU'RE xxx so cool, i've heard lots about you" and the other day a girl I know was like "oh we gotta party after newyears, I've told all my girlfriends about you" etc. I follow NO RULES and I'm JUST myself....

This is what I like about you brecker, you seem to follow your gut and be yourself... You're also following advice good...

I think a good man (I'm saying man and not Don Juan because I think they are rather interchangable) can be summed up in two sayings
Carpe Diem and Cogito Ergo Sum...
Why exactly? Carpe Diem is the reason to live imo, seize the day, Be spontaneous, Do what YOU WANT AND WHEN YOU WANT IT and Cogito Ergo Sum? Well because you think you exist, and because you exist you think. But that doesn't mean you exist more if you think more or less if you think less thus think less and live more =)

See someone attractive? Go talk to her, be yourself.... Got someones number and sitting around being bored and thinking of calling but *GASP* ONLY 1 DAY PASSED, call her. Have fun, see what she thinks.

If I can sit on a train talking with two girls I've known for 1 hour on the train and use a liquidfilled gooball and have a competition on making most sexual toys/forms out of it and having a blast for 5 hours without caring and them having real fun, hugging me when we part and ask to meet me when we all get back to university you can sure as hell get the fvckall attitude to not overthink a date or a kiss or a happening into obsession....

Have Fun EL NATUREL!

 

[becker]

Kinetic,

Thanks, I'm glad to see the support here that I'm getting. Usually I'm more the blunt of criticism around here. Seems like you're doing pretty well yourself though. I certainly have a tougher time not paying for a girl, but it's more a habit for me than anything else. Plus, I hate to have money be an issue if I'm taking the girl out. I'd rather concentrate on her more. Not to say I wouldn't mind if a girl insisted on paying for me. I won't complain.

I basically got this girl to go out with me without really following any rules, and she is the only 10 that I've ever seen. I think I would not have been able to do it by sticking to all these rules. Too much thinking and not enough doing, like you said. I don't like to live by all these boundaries, especially since based on experience, I've never gotten dates based on following strict guidelines. To me, in the end it's all about how you carry yourself. If you're adhering to rules, it will show, and you'll probably come off sort of unnatural.

 

[Kineti[C]harm]

Yepp it's all about being yourself and living live as you want to =)

 

[becker]

UPDATE:

Another update on my developments with HB10. Saw her today, talked to her for a little while, and confirmed Saturday. She said it was still on (but she sort of slipped in a "as long as I get my Christmas shopping done", although it was sort of jokingly, and did not seem like a way to weasel out of it).

I got her home address, and I asked her how early she could wake up, and she said to call her in the morning on her cell so that it will wake her up. That made me slightly suspicious, but the fact that she didn't find some excuse to bail at least was a good sign. She didn't seem super receptive today, and didn't really give me much attention. She was pretty busy with work though, so I guess it was understandable. This girl is slightly on the colder side and no doubt moody (aren't all females?); she's nice when you're alone with her, but you can see that all the issues are probably getting on her nerves constantly. She has some MAJOR drama going on in her life.

In the afternoon, the older lady who was sort of c0ckbl0cking me before (not really though, because I found that she is like that to everyone) came into my room looking asking me if I saw the girl because her boyfriend was on the phone. The EX-BF, that is. I said "I thought she didn't have a BF?", and she told me "she does, she's never going to get rid of this guy" (it's difficult to describe this on a message board, but see, this lady is all into breaking them up permanently as in totally out of her life, so she said this with a roll of her eyes). My impression is that she really wants this guy to be in her life but not as a BF, because she wants her freedom. RED FLAG CITY. More suspect is the fact that she told me that he was buying her all these Christmas gifts, so she had to reciprocate and give him the same. Yikes, not good.

I saw her on the phone later sort of b*tching someone out, no doubt the ex-BF, who calls her incessantly. This is one area that's still a little too ambiguous for me, and I plan to get to the bottom of it on Saturday. It's either proceed or NEXT for this girl. I'm already a little tired of the drama to be honest. I'm just giving her the benefit of the doubt, and I promise by the end of the weekend, I'll know the full story if it kills me. Either way though, serious doubts in my mind as to whether this will ever work anyways. She and I don't have a ton in common it seems, and I'm not feeling that much chemistry, because as most people here have said, sometimes these super-hot women are plain and simple boring and wait for you to entertain them. I'll do that this weekend, but I find myself losing a little energy sometimes when I see her because she's so damn unreceptive at times. Seems like she just gets so much attention that she sort of takes it for granted.

Well, anyways, the main thing here is that the girl sort of gave me a slight cold shoulder today, more than before. Part of the problem I have to say, is that I shouldn't be doing any relationship stuff during working hours anyways I guess. Not a good time for it. I think she was having a pretty bad day with the ex-BF bugging her. All I can say is, he's either out of the picture or it's going to be me. Whatever happens, I will learn what I set out to learn, and that's pretty key for me.

 

[MickoZ]

She is maybe just a nice girl and act too gentlely with her ex-BF, remember it was a 3 years relationship.

You always go on and say you are only in for the HB10... ok. But still seem like you are [very?] interested in knowing more... you are curious doh. But seem like you won't dislike it works and be all good.

You act all cool about NEXTING, but be sure, she won't just dish out this EX-BF in 1 hour... and you know that!

Maybe a cool strategy (bah for strategy) is to talk to her about this issue, even if in other hand... she mights not even WANT to hear about it. But if you go shopping with her for the xmas gift, hrmmmmm. Maybe suggest her to buy something for that guy that involve prison/insecurity/etc. Who know!?

Seem like when you think too much (like I maybe do now), you end up thinking about the "YES" and the "NO" for everything. Anyway you do not play by the rule... I would say... just enjoy it If it goes further cool!

I make a prediction that sooner or later, if all go well and you don't fall into the drama or over-thinking (retrospective is good, but overanalysing is bad, especially if you over-analyse on the field!), she will get hooked to you. As a Friend or MORE... but who know.

The reaction of that old lady is pretty interesting. You should exploit that one... but never involve you want to control or "own" the HBREDALARM10 or call her REDHOT heh.

 

[becker]

Thanks for the input, MickoZ. I'm well aware that the girl will not be letting go of the ex-BF that quick whether she wants to or not, given that he's so much in love with her still. She told me the last time we were out that her dad told her that the BF probably would not move on until he found someone else. The key here anyways with her is to give her space. Lack of space is sort of what killed her last 3 year relationship, so I'd be an idiot to follow in those footsteps.

The challenge here is to make her feel unrestricted and free to do whatever she wants (that's the easy part, because I don't need to do anything) but at the same time, develop enough attraction towards me so that she'll want to be around me more. A tough call, that's for damn sure, and any suggestions are welcomed. I know this has to be where most guys have failed with her because I know most of them likely tried to restrain her, and she seems to hate that. Maybe a product of her broken home life where she has a fear of intimacy because she doesn't want to get hurt. She already told me that she doesn't get "attached" and doesn't "put herself out there". She's the type who will like you but ignore you too out of fear, sort of like feeling that if she never gets involved in the first place, then she'll never get hurt.

So far what I've done is not hang around her all the time, and at the same time get in good with everyone else so that my reputation spreads by word of mouth (usually a good tactic in my experience, and probably why I even got her to want to go with me in the first place). I've never had to do anything like this before because usually girls like this I've sort of just blown off because I didn't feel like dealing with the high maintenance that usually follows these women. I'm definitely curious about this one though.

She's just a very independent girl who isn't all needy. I don't think she gets that jealous either, so it's tough, because we are similar. In situations like this, it becomes a tug-of-war, and eventually one side will give in, but not after a ton of resistance. It's usually easier to do all the stuff mentioned on this board when you have something to work with, like a girl's jealousy or insecurity. In the case of this girl, I don't really have that luxury. That's what I'm looking at now. It's pretty interesting nevertheless, and I'm sort of intrigued by the whole experience. If I don't end up with her, no hard feelings. She's unbelievable social proof, so I'm going to keep doing what I'm doing and see what happens.

 

[Jake Steed]

"She's just a very independent girl who isn't all needy."--becker

But she is. Becker, I think you've got this girl pegged all wrong. I think she IS needy and is far from independent. An independent girl would tell her ex to FVCK OFF. And would never talk to him again. Yet, even though she supposedly doesn't like him anymore, she still does this twisted little dance with him to keep him in her life. That's fvcking needy if I've ever heard of it. You are listening to her words but not her actions.

"The challenge here is to make her feel unrestricted and free to do whatever she wants"--becker

Even though it's right in your face, you still can't see what this girl is really like. Her "ex" was controlling. What did that get him--3 years of plowing her puzzy raw. What have you got? Nothing. No matter what bad things she says about him, she was with him, fvcking him, for a long time and STILL has him in her life. She's the kind of girl who loves to be controlled. She loves a man who takes control and makes all the decisions for her. In reality, she is the opposite of what you think she is.

She came from the drama of a broken home and just like all people who come from that, she subconsciously gravitates towards this drama in her love life now. THAT's why she was with that guy for 3 years and will most definately get back together with him or with a guy like him. That's the little dance she does.

And I'm not saying she's a bad person or that you should next her. I'm just telling you how she ticks and that you need to know this to understand what turns her on and what attracts her.

Jake

 

[MickoZ]

Just to clarify everyone mind (I do not try to be a prophet but try to share how I think it is)

When you say someone is "independant", it can be interpreted as not that much dependant, or totally not dependant, etc.

I believe that for everything you say, people are all those (dependant/independant, lazy/worker, beautiful/ugly, etc.) We do not have a scale of reference for all this, nor do we have it with HB rating. (or do we? may we create one one day. DJ Engeenering... that will be like computer science where the domain/field are infinite)

So keep that in mind, people are independant and dependant. They are both yes, but at different degrees/volume/...; I am sure you all know this but sometime get to remind it HELPS.

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I also like what Jake is saying about she likes being controlled, while I won't do such an easy comment, what he is expressing is INTERESTING, why? Because I believe people (women... and even men I guess), like to show the side they want to be.

If that women philosophically believe she is independant, do not like control. Chance are it is true or not. But a lot of people try to express something they think is ideal (and it might be what they are but they DO NOT APPLY it 100%... like we know how to act sometime or we just know how to act after... but still we do not apply it!)

So in that way it is interesting... it is like one of my female friend, she goes nut each time we call her SUPERFICIAL... it is her soft topic... she does not like it, and claim she is so much not superficial, we joke about it, but in the other hand she is doing a lot of superficial judgement and does not like the word, even if it relates to her action. She will try to spread a non superficial apparence, while in fact if you remember my first comments... she is a little superficial and also non-superficial. ;-) [wow now there is a link about the two topic I talk in this thread!]

Have fun with the balance... using one word without talk about his weight is risky... but we all do it ;-)