Doesn't Marriage go Completely against Nature?

[blueguy]

Understandable.

 

[Jariel]

Walking round in clothes, driving cars and wearing condoms goes against nature, but it works out ok.

Marriage is neither right or wrong. It all depends on how you feel about it and whether you see any advantage to it. Personally, I have no desire to get married as I can see it being a disaster, yet some people are very happily married, faithful and take their vows seriously.

 

[hyperactive]

Exclusive relationships, monogamy, is rife with problems, not the least of which includes unopen marriages. Why do you think Muslims keep their women veiled and away from other men? All you people that mentioned marriage going against men's nature...what about the women too? Women will cheat if given the chance. It is biological. They want sissies to be married to but will cheat with the best player that comes along. This only worsens as they age because their estrogen levels begin to drop and their testosterone begins to raise, increasing their sex drive as they enter their middle years.

Marriage is giving up. It is for the insecure. It is a contract of property on behalf of both sex. Men gain patrilineal security, so that they may know with less doubt that certain progeny are his own, women gain resources for them and their unborn children. This is an archaic process that has been going on in every civilization in some form or another. Where can we expect to go as a species if we are obsessed with which children and women are our OWN, our possessions.

Then there is the fear factor. Yes, we are afraid of being alone. Is that a good reason to enter a LTR with someone? Sounds like something doomed for failure or at the least mediocrity to me.

Then there's the problem with nuclear families. Again, the reptilian obsession with passing our genetic legacy along. We might better service our fellow humans were we to instead focus on caring for everyone regardless of familial ties and obligations.

Anyone who claims that they are able, by natural means, to only have eyes for one person until they die is fooling themselves. Thus the institution remains a transaction rather than a fabled love.

Observe our closest relatives, the chimpanzee. Both sub species, the regular and the bonobo, do not practice lifetime monogamy. Among th bonobos this frivolous behaviour serves a very important purpose, it keeps the peace. Bonobos are rarely prone to violence.

 

[jtrain 289]

Exclusive relationships, monogamy, is rife with problems, not the least of which includes unopen marriages. Why do you think Muslims keep their women veiled and away from other men? All you people that mentioned marriage going against men's nature...what about the women too? Women will cheat if given the chance. It is biological. They want sissies to be married to but will cheat with the best player that comes along. This only worsens as they age because their estrogen levels begin to drop and their testosterone begins to raise, increasing their sex drive as they enter their middle years.

Marriage is giving up. It is for the insecure. It is a contract of property on behalf of both sex. Men gain patrilineal security, so that they may know with less doubt that certain progeny are his own, women gain resources for them and their unborn children. This is an archaic process that has been going on in every civilization in some form or another. Where can we expect to go as a species if we are obsessed with which children and women are our OWN, our possessions.

Then there is the fear factor. Yes, we are afraid of being alone. Is that a good reason to enter a LTR with someone? Sounds like something doomed for failure or at the least mediocrity to me.

Then there's the problem with nuclear families. Again, the reptilian obsession with passing our genetic legacy along. We might better service our fellow humans were we to instead focus on caring for everyone regardless of familial ties and obligations.

Anyone who claims that they are able, by natural means, to only have eyes for one person until they die is fooling themselves. Thus the institution remains a transaction rather than a fabled love.

Observe our closest relatives, the chimpanzee. Both sub species, the regular and the bonobo, do not practice lifetime monogamy. Among th bonobos this frivolous behaviour serves a very important purpose, it keeps the peace. Bonobos are rarely prone to violence.

The only reason marriage is giving up is because men arent following nature those women go for the jerks because they are following nature but the jerk doesnt go for the women because she isnt following nature just because she can **** good doesnt mean she is womenly. A womens nature is to be submissive caring and nurturingand loyal the fact that she cheats on the husband means she isnt a real women she's a ***** if she was a real women the player would marry her he wouldnt be able to resist. Just like if the man was a real man instead of a sissy the women wouldnt cheat on him.

OO yea and to the guy that says waering clothes and using condoms and riving cars are going against nature lol are u retarded this has nothing to do with nature. Natures laws cannot be broken once they break the the world would end very shortly after think im lying. If Evryone was homosexual the human race would be wiped out in the next 50 years. If men were sissies we wouldnt be having all these breakthroughs that we have nowand we would die out. If women werent women and tried to be independent their race would die out . Women need men to survive. Lol isnt it a shame that plants and animals follow nature better than us this is why theyve been around for millions of years. We've been around for only a short time and this way we are going Thier truly is no hope for the future.

 

[bigjohnson]

Yeah, we're not very successful, that's why we're at 7 billion units and counting.

 

[Obsidian]

Why do you think Muslims keep their women veiled and away from other men? All you people that mentioned marriage going against men's nature...what about the women too?

They're kept veiled so men won't be tempted by them, not because the veil endows the female with virtue or somehow inhibits female horishness.

 

[Last Man Standing]

They're kept veiled so men won't be tempted by them, not because the veil endows the female with virtue or somehow inhibits female horishness.

This is true! I was at Walmart on two separate days this week and on both days I saw women wearing white see-through dresses with black thongs on - guess what I was thinking about???? What man would not think such - this is our nature - Muslims know this!!

Hors have no shame!!!

 

[azanon]

This is true! I was at Walmart on two separate days this week and on both days I saw women wearing white see-through dresses with black thongs on - guess what I was thinking about???? What man would not think such - this is our nature - Muslims know this!!

Hors have no shame!!!

So you think one should be ashamed of one's own body. Now that's pretty sad.

They should be ashamed of the poor "style", but not because you can see their bodies. The human body is (when taken care of) beautiful.

 

[Obsidian]

Hence the reason we where clothes, azanon.

In fact, there are two reasons:
1. Some humans are too beautiful for everyone to lay eyes on without morals breaking down.
2. Other humans are too ugly.

Two contradictory reasons, with one solution.

 

[NickBe]

Most people want to settle down because it is what society enforces on us. In reality humans do not just settle down in civilizations untouched by ours such as Papua New Guinean tribes monogamy is no existent. Same if you look over to Africa, the idea of monogamy and marriage is relatively new in human existence. I do not see how any smart, educated person can argue that marriage is in our nature. Marriage is not in human nature nor is monogamy it is just the spawn of organized religion just another tool to control the masses.

I look around me and I rarely if ever see a happily married couple. I am not talking about 70 year olds who just do not have the energy to hate each other any more. I am talking 20-40 year old married couples how many of them are happy? We know 50% of marriages end in divorce then add to that the people who do not get divorced because of children, religion, social pressure or money. Most people that are married want out. After a few years of fu*king the same woman over and over and over it becomes dull and all you have left is the idealistic notion of love that you delude yourself into having to replace the emptiness in your relationship. Happy marriages only exist on television.

Divorce rate 50%, 50%-65% of married men cheat and 40% of married women cheat and 57% of married people have used the Internet to flirt. It is estimated that in 80% of all marriages atleast one of the spouses is going to cheat. The online porn industry is growing at an unprecedented rate. It is in human nature to have multiple partners constraining yourself to one goes against nature.

 

[Falcon]

Most people want to settle down because it is what society enforces on us. In reality humans do not just settle down in civilizations untouched by ours such as Papua New Guinean tribes monogamy is no existent. Same if you look over to Africa, the idea of monogamy and marriage is relatively new in human existence. I do not see how any smart, educated person can argue that marriage is in our nature. Marriage is not in human nature nor is monogamy it is just the spawn of organized religion just another tool to control the masses.

I look around me and I rarely if ever see a happily married couple. I am not talking about 70 year olds who just do not have the energy to hate each other any more. I am talking 20-40 year old married couples how many of them are happy? We know 50% of marriages end in divorce then add to that the people who do not get divorced because of children, religion, social pressure or money. Most people that are married want out. After a few years of fu*king the same woman over and over and over it becomes dull and all you have left is the idealistic notion of love that you delude yourself into having to replace the emptiness in your relationship. Happy marriages only exist on television.

Divorce rate 50%, 50%-65% of married men cheat and 40% of married women cheat and 57% of married people have used the Internet to flirt. It is estimated that in 80% of all marriages atleast one of the spouses is going to cheat. The online porn industry is growing at an unprecedented rate. It is in human nature to have multiple partners constraining yourself to one goes against nature.

The thing I don't like about this view is that if you actually look at history, it shows the exact opposite. If monogamy is so bad, how come all the great advances in human civilization happened when monogamy was dominant? Why are we as a human race trying to revert back to a more primal behavior at this time? You realize that you listed primitive tribes as examples? Why would we want to revert back to a primitive form? We should be looking at the stars for inspiration and guidance, not more primitive societies.

I really believe that the reason why you see such grim statistics is because we really are living in the most self-centered age. Everything is me me me, I have to spread my seed, etc. The reason why ****ing the same girl over and over gets dull like you said is because we are so self-centered. It's sad and I'm ashamed because I'm a part of this generation. We think we are progressing by seeing everything in a dry Darwinian way but we are really just shooting ourselves in the foot.

 

[Luthor Rex]

I think marriage goes against most men's nature, but jibes with most women's nature.

Marriage was simply the legal recognition of what people were already doing.

That being said, it was MEN who created marriage. It was a truce declared between men.

In a 'natural' environment 1/2 of the babies will be boys and 1/2 girls. Under polygamy you will have all the women trying to fukk the top 10% of the men. This will leave a large underclass of men who don't have wives.

Guess what has happened historically when there weren't enough wives to go around? War and rape.

The Roman rape of the Sabine’s and several stories in the Bible give a storytelling flair to what was already historically happening: the abduction of women to become wives for men who had no other alternative means to get them

Rape or extinction was the choices they had, and Mother Nature (read: selfish-genes) took her course and the result is that we don't remember the great "Sabine Empire" but rather the Romans.

If you want to destroy a civilization then eliminate monogamous marriage.

Unless of course you'd like to reduce the entire male population to just 10% of the overall population... that might work...

 

[Luthor Rex]

Sometimes I wondered if any of you has ever been truly loved, ever. Even by your mother. Because if you have to rely on studies to chose wether or not to believe in love, it looks pretty much hopeless...

Well.. um... I thought eveyone here knew we were all raised by a pack of wolves...

It was a nice pack...

really...

 

[PeterNorthisawesome]

oh please... this thread reeks of AFC and p'ssy emoness. The only people who love you are your parents, love is MADE UP ok? It's just chemical reaction. Humans are ANIMALS, we are MAMMALS with just a bigger brain to think about all this useless sh't. Seriously I don't see the point of marriage at all... if you really "loved" each other why do you need to go through a ceremony and pledge on a ring? You can just live together and be happy with each others company without worrying what other ppl think.

I don't see the point of a wife either, she's gonna get older and uglier.

 

[PeterNorthisawesome]

If I happened to be single at 47 and all of my friends looked down upon me because I was single then I would simply get new friends/acquittances and have an array of women to keep me company if i ever felt "lonely". A single 47 year old man with a decent job will have a nice house, nice car(s) and an abundance of expendable cash. He can travel the world and pick up women anywhere he goes. I hardly doubt he would be lonely with a variety of women on his arm.

What's his job?

 

[PeterNorthisawesome]

If I happened to be single at 47 and all of my friends looked down upon me because I was single then I would simply get new friends/acquittances and have an array of women to keep me company if i ever felt "lonely". A single 47 year old man with a decent job will have a nice house, nice car(s) and an abundance of expendable cash. He can travel the world and pick up women anywhere he goes. I hardly doubt he would be lonely with a variety of women on his arm.

What's his job?

 

[NickBe]

The thing I don't like about this view is that if you actually look at history, it shows the exact opposite. If monogamy is so bad, how come all the great advances in human civilization happened when monogamy was dominant? Why are we as a human race trying to revert back to a more primal behavior at this time? You realize that you listed primitive tribes as examples? Why would we want to revert back to a primitive form? We should be looking at the stars for inspiration and guidance, not more primitive societies.

I really believe that the reason why you see such grim statistics is because we really are living in the most self-centered age. Everything is me me me, I have to spread my seed, etc. The reason why ****ing the same girl over and over gets dull like you said is because we are so self-centered. It's sad and I'm ashamed because I'm a part of this generation. We think we are progressing by seeing everything in a dry Darwinian way but we are really just shooting ourselves in the foot.

Because primitive tribes are the only true display of human nature left in the world. It is also idiotic to attribute advances in human civilization to monogamy and/or marriage. If anything the idealistic notion of love, marriage and family holds the average human back from his/her true potential.

It is useless arguing this crap in todays world people are brainwashed from a young age to single mindedly believe and endlessly pursue this romanticized notion of love and marriage. A notion spawned by years of Hollywood love movies and advertisements. So these little people get it into their head that love is the most important thing in life and that they need to get married. So they sacrifice their potential to lead a good life just so they can marry. 20 years down the track they become bored, sad, depressed and eventually cheat. Then people have the balls to argue that the Africans are primitive and monogamy is the reason for civilizations advancements. The African tribes might be primitive but they die happy. No mid-life crisis for a primitive tribesman...

The thing is I can not argue with you, monogamy isn't in your nature but it has been imprinted onto your brain. So nothing anybody says will change your mind you are destined to end up a unhappy 40 something guy who once upon a time was in love.

 

[Falcon]

Because primitive tribes are the only true display of human nature left in the world. It is also idiotic to attribute advances in human civilization to monogamy and/or marriage. If anything the idealistic notion of love, marriage and family holds the average human back from his/her true potential.

It is useless arguing this crap in todays world people are brainwashed from a young age to single mindedly believe and endlessly pursue this romanticized notion of love and marriage. A notion spawned by years of Hollywood love movies and advertisements. So these little people get it into their head that love is the most important thing in life and that they need to get married. So they sacrifice their potential to lead a good life just so they can marry. 20 years down the track they become bored, sad, depressed and eventually cheat. Then people have the balls to argue that the Africans are primitive and monogamy is the reason for civilizations advancements. The African tribes might be primitive but they die happy. No mid-life crisis for a primitive tribesman...

The thing is I can not argue with you, monogamy isn't in your nature but it has been imprinted onto your brain. So nothing anybody says will change your mind you are destined to end up a unhappy 40 something guy who once upon a time was in love.

Alright let's not make this personal. I see this not as an argument, but merely as a discussion.

The thing is, we already have the world you say we should have today. Marriage is dieing. Cheating is done like it's almost acceptable. Sex has become more primal. But where are the improvements? You say people are more happy unmarried, but tell me, where are these happy people? Look at the new generation of youngsters raised by single parents. It may be more primal (and by your view, more natural), but how is it improving things?

This is a broad topic and I would love to see more discussion on it.

 

[Last Man Standing]

Falcon, don't even attempt to go against these kids nonsensical arguments - they make shyt up - it's part of their "new age" religion!! Oh yeah, we are not humans either - we are animals, why? Because someone put it in a book and it's taught in our public schools!

 

[Last Man Standing]

Read this to know that a man is naturally ordained to commit to his wife (wives) and offspring... http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=50480

Hence the reason we where clothes, azanon.

In fact, there are two reasons:
1. Some humans are too beautiful for everyone to lay eyes on without morals breaking down.
2. Other humans are too ugly.

Two contradictory reasons, with one solution.

Correct - and damn near 100% of the women I see in public are not good for my eyes when clothed, let alone naked!!!

And now it makes 4 girls this week (just saw two today in pants) who had see-through white dresses/pants with thongs!! These hors have no shame!! We need a war for a cleansing!!